Autopsy 2023 Rd 10 Blues lose game in first quarter

[Milsome]

Possibly rhetorical question:

How is it that with SOS in the ruck against Cameron, with Pies getting on a roll in Q1….that we have our slow mids set up in an offensive position at the centre bounces as if we are some hope to win the hitout forward? Of course leads to de Goey bursting out the front alone. And then Doc has to leave his man (WHE) who then kicks it to a leading Mihocek against the afls slowest full back. Game over. How did we set up that way????

Windows1 - You are spot on! I watched every centre stoppage prior to the last quarter and what you have described happened each and every time. No movement, no run and certainly poor chasing as soon as the Maggies got the ball.

 

[MightyMighties]

Yeah, i was pretty ho,hum myself today. The atmosphere wasn't great.

We were right next to the cheer squad which usually fires right up with the drummer guy, like a party atmosphere. Today it was like we were all resigned to the fact we were going to lose and we were all a bit flat, especially after that first Q.

I honestly don‘t know if it’s a player thing or a coaching thing, but what happened to the exciting brand we were playing early last year? We have the same playing group, in fact have some improvements on last year, but seem to have gone backwards. If we‘re going to turn the bloody thing over, which we have a tendency to do, i wouldn’t mind so much if we did so whilst taking the game on through the guts but this faffing around the boundary and kicking backwards is prophetic as to where the team is going at the moment.

 

[myblueroan]

Eat humble pie, delete our egos.
Admit that we aren't anywhere near where we need to be to challenge. Our system doesn't work, and won't work. Instead of trying to play a "finals brand" from a decade and a half ago, attempt to make changes and encourage the players to take the game on.
We look like a team that is so afraid of making mistakes, so rigid in where we play and where we are allowed to play that everyone is terrified of breaking a team rule by changing thing up. We'd prefer to lose in a battle than attempt to win and it not work. Fear of failure. We've seen this with Carlton sides far to often. Once they lose confidence we turn inwards and each player wants to make sure they aren't the one highlighted during a game review the following Monday.
Show some integrity, starting with integrity at selection, and then integrity at a board level at the end of the year.
The world has changed, the game has changed. Reward creativity, encourage risk taking. Play a style of football that is to our strengths, rather than a defeatist game style that is about mitigation of the opponents strength. It's almost admitting defeat before the game starts.
Let the players rediscover some enjoyment in their football. Realise that the fans would prefer to see us develop and improve as a team and as individual players more than they would prefer to see us grind out wins with a style that clearly won't stack up (talking about the North and GWS games.)

I personally cannot accept that the players we have are not good enough for us to be a far better team than we are. To much talent has come into our club over the last 20 years, and to many times we've seen them improve and then slowly deteriorate. It simply has to be systemic, and to continue banging our head against the same brick wall year on year is the very definition of insanity. Yes we need a hard edge and we need discipline, but not at the cost of everything else.
Someone said it earlier and I tend to agree with them. We are playing like Collingwood in 2021. Its amazing how quickly a talented group of players can turn it around when they are embraced and encouraged rather than drilled and disciplined, especially as it becomes increasingly more obvious that what they are being taught isn't going to cut it.

Yes.
But who will convey this to Voss?

 

[myblueroan]

I was sitting on Level 2 pretty much behind the goals (Punt Rd end) and from that vantage point it is plainly obvious that when we take possession of the ball in our defensive half there is basically ZERO MOVEMENT from any Carlton player. No one is providing a lead, no one is running past for a handball (in the very few cases they do it is almost ignored 100% of the time).

In contrast the Pies were busting a gut to provide a lead. They ran in waves, in fact they SPRINTED in waves.

It is obvious our work rate is dramatically behind what the elite teams are putting out.

It isn't our game plan to run in waves.
More to sort of emulate
running in quicksand.

 

[smashbox gill]

Voss - no tactical sense at all. No plan B. Each week we get massacred with this slow ball movement and yet each week he keeps backing the system. I at least thought he would set some standards akin to the one of the games greatest ever captains. But no he’s this new age ‘woke’ coach who’s afraid to look players in the eye.

Ash Hansen - has the last 2 Coleman medalists at his disposal, yet we are constantly double teamed and have no forward tactic what so ever. Why is there no one ever crumbing when the ball hits the ground?

Aaron Hamill

Aaron Hamill

Age

47

Ht

184cm

Wt

95kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

14.1

4star

K

8.5

3star

HB

5.5

4star

M

4.5

4star

T

2.8

4star

G

1.3

5star

No current season stats available

D

11.4

3star

K

7.2

3star

HB

4.2

4star

M

3.2

4star

T

2.0

4star

G

0.4

3star

- what had happened to our backline? Aaron Hamill

Aaron Hamill

Age

47

Ht

184cm

Wt

95kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

14.1

4star

K

8.5

3star

HB

5.5

4star

M

4.5

4star

T

2.8

4star

G

1.3

5star

No current season stats available

D

11.4

3star

K

7.2

3star

HB

4.2

4star

M

3.2

4star

T

2.0

4star

G

0.4

3star

so called team defence. It is an absolute horror show. Where had the intercept marking gone? At least in years past we’d get caught out the back but we’d be an intercepting force.

Tim Clark - besides Cerra everyone has gone backward. Besides the contest where this year we aren’t even winning, what else do our midfields excel at?

Aaron Greaves - coaching director? What does he even do. Absolutely useless! Get rid of him.

Andrew Russell - taking up half the soft cap. Our players can’t run out game, nor are they strong enough. Well past it and needs to be moved on.

Brad Lloyd - been absolutely horrible since he came in. Our football department has continuously underperformed. How has he survived this long?

 

[Accidental genius]

Yes.
But who will convey this to Voss?

I nominate windows1

 

[BlueBlood15]

Really grim day at the footy as has been the case most of year. I’m at the point of acceptance - acceptance that we’re a poor team and that it’s unlikely to improve in the short term. So many times we’ve been here over the last 20 years. It’s demoralising.

 

[BlueVision]

I hear being mates with the captain is a big help.

I would hope that is not true !!!!

 

[windows1]

Can anyone help me understand why our backline zones off when they don’t play a spare? It’s just a total lottery as to where the ball goes and therefore whether we can stop the oppo. I don’t get it.

 

[The Fantom]

I'd ask why SOS was rucking then at all.

Same and when was the last time we had a ruckman that could take a mark?

 

[windows1]

Got an example of our backwards olay that drives me nuts. 8’23” to go we actually won the Centre clearance. Walsh goes all the way back to McGovern who then goes wide. It took

30 seconds! To get the ball back to the half forward flank!!!

They go backwards because they’re slow. They have no choice. Depressing really.

 

[windows1]

I nominate windows1

He would want to punch the shit out of me if I had the chance to tell him what I thought for 10 minutes.

Mainly because he wouldn’t understand me and he would get angry. Like Lenny in of Mice and men angry.

 

[Blue1980]

I hear being mates with the captain is a big help.

Hasn't kept his spot in the side...

 

[The Dochs in]

I’m as frustrated as any. But I must admit I do like that we at least tried some things after half time today positionally and even suspect Ed was given a rev up to be more physics on Daicos.

Voss in the press conference (I know people have given him stick) was a lot more forthright and clearly frustrated.

The end of the day we just have to sit and hope we can turn it around and get our confidence back

 

[Doro]

I was sitting on Level 2 pretty much behind the goals (Punt Rd end) and from that vantage point it is plainly obvious that when we take possession of the ball in our defensive half there is basically ZERO MOVEMENT from any Carlton player. No one is providing a lead, no one is running past for a handball (in the very few cases they do it is almost ignored 100% of the time).

In contrast the Pies were busting a gut to provide a lead. They ran in waves, in fact they SPRINTED in waves.

It is obvious our work rate is dramatically behind what the elite teams are putting out.

Our work rate was actually higher overall and we ran further (281km to 276). Where they smashed us was in total sprints 267- 228. That's the running in waves you are referring to.

 

[windows1]

Need to play quicker giys like Cincotta who can bring some energy. Chase down a tackle. Shake the game up.

Fine bring in Kemp but play him forward. TDk.

These one dimensional slow arsed mids who don’t kick goals are useless. Just stop it Voss.

 

[Blue1980]

Eat humble pie, delete our egos.
Admit that we aren't anywhere near where we need to be to challenge. Our system doesn't work, and won't work. Instead of trying to play a "finals brand" from a decade and a half ago, attempt to make changes and encourage the players to take the game on.
We look like a team that is so afraid of making mistakes, so rigid in where we play and where we are allowed to play that everyone is terrified of breaking a team rule by changing thing up. We'd prefer to lose in a battle than attempt to win and it not work. Fear of failure. We've seen this with Carlton sides far to often. Once they lose confidence we turn inwards and each player wants to make sure they aren't the one highlighted during a game review the following Monday.
Show some integrity, starting with integrity at selection, and then integrity at a board level at the end of the year.
The world has changed, the game has changed. Reward creativity, encourage risk taking. Play a style of football that is to our strengths, rather than a defeatist game style that is about mitigation of the opponents strength. It's almost admitting defeat before the game starts.
Let the players rediscover some enjoyment in their football. Realise that the fans would prefer to see us develop and improve as a team and as individual players more than they would prefer to see us grind out wins with a style that clearly won't stack up (talking about the North and GWS games.)

I personally cannot accept that the players we have are not good enough for us to be a far better team than we are. To much talent has come into our club over the last 20 years, and to many times we've seen them improve and then slowly deteriorate. It simply has to be systemic, and to continue banging our head against the same brick wall year on year is the very definition of insanity. Yes we need a hard edge and we need discipline, but not at the cost of everything else.
Someone said it earlier and I tend to agree with them. We are playing like Collingwood in 2021. Its amazing how quickly a talented group of players can turn it around when they are embraced and encouraged rather than drilled and disciplined, especially as it becomes increasingly more obvious that what they are being taught isn't going to cut it.

Very good post. I think I have mentioned it before, but we play like a bottom premier league side travelling away to Man City, but against every bloody side we play. We are playing scared to lose and make mistakes, which makes no sense, as we are losing and making mistakes as it is with no upside.

Watching us has become a turgid cluster ****. Playing not to lose with this joyless brand of football isn't going to get us where we need to be.

I am not absolving the playing group either, I think its both coaching and somewhat playing group.

 

[Blue1980]

Need to play quicker giys like Cincotta who can bring some energy. Chase down a tackle. Shake the game up.

Fine bring in Kemp but play him forward. TDk.

These one dimensional slow arsed mids who don’t kick goals are useless. Just stop it Voss.

If Dow is on a never to play again list, JSOS should be added to it.

 

[Milsome]

U have my vote for post of the year

Can you put your resume forward for the top job please? You've made too much sense to not be a contender for the position.

 

[BM123]

I thought Voss's presser was okay. He's been consistent in what he expects from the team and he isn't giving anyone easy outs. Voss's main priority is getting our team defense up to modern standards for once. Considering what a shell of a forward line we have and our midfielders threat level going forward I guess that's a good place to work around. People want the flashy Teague stuff (our players certainly do) but if he manages to make a Carlton side hard to play against without needing 3-4 taggers this time around I'll be amazed.

People nit picking buzz words seems to be our main complaint from the pressers.

He uses a lot of modern sporting language (sports science/psychology terms) and I guess that upsets people who aren't used to that.

 

[NewDarkNavyBlues]

Our work rate was actually higher overall and we ran further (281km to 276). Where they smashed us was in total sprints 267- 228. That's the running in waves you are referring to.

That was kind of his point.

 

[BM123]

I was sitting on Level 2 pretty much behind the goals (Punt Rd end) and from that vantage point it is plainly obvious that when we take possession of the ball in our defensive half there is basically ZERO MOVEMENT from any Carlton player. No one is providing a lead, no one is running past for a handball (in the very few cases they do it is almost ignored 100% of the time).

In contrast the Pies were busting a gut to provide a lead. They ran in waves, in fact they SPRINTED in waves.

It is obvious our work rate is dramatically behind what the elite teams are putting out.

Consistent issue at Carlton for decades now.

Hell even in 2011 ordinary sides like the Bulldogs at the time could just out work us time after time and we'd fall apart. Big reason why Hawthorn and St Kilda had such insane win streaks against us back then too.

 

[Milsome]

Young was our best KP defender. WTF?

Agreed, Young was solid in defense all night.

 

[mjtim1]

His best presser imo

Looks like he finally snapped

Agree but slightly concerned he thinks our defense is the issue... I'm not the most strategic game watcher, but to me our poor kicking forward and inability to hit a target consistently in fwd 50, is a pretty big issue. When we do we kick to fwds in a hard position who kick a point and we get little reward for effort and fail to capitalise on any momentum we have. Can someone break down for me why defense would be an issue and the focus not offense ?

 

[KIMON]

Agree but slightly concerned he thinks our defense is the issue... I'm not the most strategic game watcher, but to me our poor kicking forward and inability to hit a target consistently in fwd 50, is a pretty big issue. When we do we kick to fwds in a hard position who kick a point and we get little reward for effort and fail to capitalise on any momentum we have. Can someone break down for me why defense would be an issue and the focus not offense ?

If we are all baffled, imagine the players?