Expansion 20th AFL team location

[Foreign Legion]

That's exactly what I think. If we keep bringing new teams in, some existing ones should merge/relocate. That's just my opinion obviously. I think 20 teams is definitely too many.

I would forget about Darwin - population growth too low and hazardous weather conditions in the AFL season.

 

[Bjo187]

I think minimum 500k population within a reasonable driving distance, anything below that is too little for a team.

 

[Bjo187]

You'll be happy with Jack Steele

9

Jack Steele

Age

28

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187cm

Wt

90kg

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Mid

Career

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Last 5

D

20.9

5star

K

8.7

3star

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12.2

5star

M

3.7

4star

T

6.8

5star

CL

3.6

5star

D

21.3

5star

K

10.0

4star

HB

11.3

5star

M

4.0

4star

T

5.8

5star

CL

4.6

5star

D

16.8

4star

K

5.0

2star

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11.8

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M

2.6

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T

6.4

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3.6

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here Canberra Pear.

I also agree with cripps and merret's suggestions.

It's funny Darcy Moore

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Darcy Moore

Age

28

Ht

203cm

Wt

100kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

11.1

3star

K

7.0

3star

HB

4.1

3star

M

4.8

5star

T

1.6

4star

MG

169.1

3star

D

13.9

3star

K

7.3

3star

HB

6.6

4star

M

4.9

5star

T

0.7

1star

MG

182.0

3star

D

6.8

2star

K

4.2

2star

HB

2.6

3star

M

2.6

3star

T

1.8

4star

MG

87.4

2star

is so fashion concious, yet has the worst most feminine hair style in the competition.

What would AFL captains change if they were CEO for a day?

What the skippers would alter.

www.sen.com.au

 

[Canberra Pear]

You'll be happy with Jack Steele here Canberra Pear.

I also agree with cripps and merret's suggestions.

It's funny Darcy Moore is so fashion concious, yet has the worst most feminine hair style in the competition.

What would AFL captains change if they were CEO for a day?

What the skippers would alter.

www.sen.com.au

Jack's got my vote!

 

[Coolangatta]

If this is anything to go by from 9 months ago, a 20th team is something they "may look at" further down the line but not until Tasmania are confirmed.



So Walshawk is probably on the mark here, they aren't thinking about a 20th team yet.

I don't think anything is going on secretly behind the scenes yet, the focus would just be on Tassie and trying to get them up.

Once the stadium is confirmed and construction gets underway they'll probably take a closer look at it, but a 20th doesn't sound so definite yet.

I really do hope it's Canberra if there is. There'll never be a better opportunity for them to have a team than by 2033.

 

[Roylion]

If we keep bringing new teams in, some existing ones should merge/relocate.

Who's going to volunteer to do that?

 

[Coolangatta]

Who's going to volunteer to do that?

No one. Once Tasmania are in, they'll probably remain the smallest, weakest club, so no one will get scrapped, because no one would dare do that to Tassie, but if you're gonna take an ax to an AFL club, you start with the weakest link. Suns and Giants are safe, too, they'll never let go of 2 teams each in NSW and QLD.

I think Canberra should get a team for sure.

I still don't know about Perth 3. The numbers are there but there's no guarantee the people who can't get to Eagles games are gonna watch the new boys in town. Also, it doesn't sound like WA3 will add anything to the TV rights money other than the time zone of being able to schedule Friday night double headers, though I could be underestimating that value potential.

Brisbane 2, the numbers aren't there yet but they're tracking nicely for the 2050s but they'll need a new stadium.

So somewhere around 20-22 teams seems about right to me, with the rest being way too speculative or fanciful.

Darwin and Cairns are a long way off, Newcastle and NZ are untried, 3rd Sydney is out of the question until the Giants can go big and that's if they can. I don't think the numbers are there for a 3rd Adelaide yet either. The Crows aren't an Eagles sized club where someone like Norwood could come in and swoop.

 

[Walshawk]

No one. Once Tasmania are in, they'll probably remain the smallest, weakest club, so no one will get scrapped, because no one would dare do that to Tassie, but if you're gonna take an ax to an AFL club, you start with the weakest link. Suns and Giants are safe, too, they'll never let go of 2 teams each in NSW and QLD.

I think Canberra should get a team for sure.

I still don't know about Perth 3. The numbers are there but there's no guarantee the people who can't get to Eagles games are gonna watch the new boys in town. Also, it doesn't sound like WA3 will add anything to the TV rights money other than the time zone of being able to schedule Friday night double headers, though I could be underestimating that value potential.

Brisbane 2, the numbers aren't there yet but they're tracking nicely for the 2050s but they'll need a new stadium.

So somewhere around 20-22 teams seems about right to me, with the rest being way too speculative or fanciful.

Darwin and Cairns are a long way off, Newcastle and NZ are untried, 3rd Sydney is out of the question until the Giants can go big and that's if they can. I don't think the numbers are there for a 3rd Adelaide yet either. The Crows aren't an Eagles sized club where someone like Norwood could come in and swoop.

Tasmania will be bigger than GWS and GC the instant that they are confirmed. Unless GWS is rejigged, they will remain the smallest club for the next 50+ years. GC not far behind.

 

[Coolangatta]

Tasmania will be bigger than GWS and GC the instant that they are confirmed. Unless GWS is rejigged, they will remain the smallest club for the next 50+ years. GC not far behind.

Nah, Tasmania's population growth is low. Even if the Giants and Suns struggle for the next 50 years, they'll pass Tasmania eventually because of the sheer numbers they have. Tassie will do better on a per capita basis. I suppose GWS and GC having more members than Tassie won't matter much though if the crowds and ratings are shit.

 

[peetoo]

Nah, Tasmania's population growth is low. Even if the Giants and Suns struggle for the next 50 years, they'll pass Tasmania eventually because of the sheer numbers they have. Tassie will do better on a per capita basis. I suppose GWS and GC having more members than Tassie won't matter much though if the crowds and ratings are s**t.

‘Eventually’. How many decades? It’s coming up to two now. Tassie will immediately be on a stronger footing than those teams now

 

[Coolangatta]

‘Eventually’. How many decades? It’s coming up to two now. Tassie will immediately be on a stronger footing than those teams now

Gold Coast 2011
GWS 2012

Let's not jump the gun yet, we'll see how they're going by 2032.

I think they're going okay for clubs that haven't been around for 150 years like some have.

 

[Cubs2Lions]

No one. Once Tasmania are in, they'll probably remain the smallest, weakest club, so no one will get scrapped, because no one would dare do that to Tassie, but if you're gonna take an ax to an AFL club, you start with the weakest link. Suns and Giants are safe, too, they'll never let go of 2 teams each in NSW and QLD.

I think Canberra should get a team for sure.

I still don't know about Perth 3. The numbers are there but there's no guarantee the people who can't get to Eagles games are gonna watch the new boys in town. Also, it doesn't sound like WA3 will add anything to the TV rights money other than the time zone of being able to schedule Friday night double headers, though I could be underestimating that value potential.

Brisbane 2, the numbers aren't there yet but they're tracking nicely for the 2050s but they'll need a new stadium.

So somewhere around 20-22 teams seems about right to me, with the rest being way too speculative or fanciful.

Darwin and Cairns are a long way off, Newcastle and NZ are untried, 3rd Sydney is out of the question until the Giants can go big and that's if they can. I don't think the numbers are there for a 3rd Adelaide yet either. The Crows aren't an Eagles sized club where someone like Norwood could come in and swoop.

If it was up to me, Team 20 would be obviously Canberra with Darwin/NT having a joint-venture with the Kangaroos (smallest Victorian club) and then THAT WOULD BE IT for the next 20-30 years at minimum to let the newly clubs have their own time to build their fan-base with all states and territories then having some form of club representation in the AFL/AFLW competitions.

HOWEVER, this is the AFL we are talking about and just have that really bad feeling they will choose the wrong decision for that 20th team’s location and beyond such as a NT/NQ/Northern WA combined entry that would fail on the spot.

 

[Coolangatta]

If it was up to me, Team 20 would be obviously Canberra with Darwin/NT having a joint-venture with the Kangaroos (smallest Victorian club) and then THAT WOULD BE IT for the next 20-30 years at minimum to let the newly clubs have their own time to build their fan-base with all states and territories then having some form of club representation in the AFL/AFLW competitions.

HOWEVER, this is the AFL we are talking about and just have that really bad feeling they will choose the wrong decision for that 20th team’s location and beyond such as a NT/NQ/Northern WA combined entry that would fail on the spot.

Only problem with that is getting North to actually agree to it.

If 8 games a year are good enough for western Sydney for 20 years then yes, if somehow possible, the Roos playing 7 in Darwin, 1 in Alice, 3 home in Melbourne, 8 away in Melbourne would give them 11 Melbourne games per year, 1 less than what they're getting now.

If the AFL did scrap the preseason games and go to 25 per year (though I think that's too many, but who cares about the preseason, right), they could even give North an extra game in Melbourne, so they'd get 12 games... exactly the same as they're getting now. Throw in free Kayo, extra access to away games for members and that sounds like a pretty good deal to me.

 

[Canberra Pear]

If it was up to me, Team 20 would be obviously Canberra with Darwin/NT having a joint-venture with the Kangaroos (smallest Victorian club) and then THAT WOULD BE IT for the next 20-30 years at minimum to let the newly clubs have their own time to build their fan-base with all states and territories then having some form of club representation in the AFL/AFLW competitions.

HOWEVER, this is the AFL we are talking about and just have that really bad feeling they will choose the wrong decision for that 20th team’s location and beyond such as a NT/NQ/Northern WA combined entry that would fail on the spot.

Three games would be enough to cover Darwin, and one enough for Alice Springs, so North could transition its four games from Hobart to the NT without much disruption.

 

[Coolangatta]

Three games would be enough to cover Darwin, and one enough for Alice Springs, so North could transition its four games from Hobart to the NT without much disruption.

A 7 game deal would be pretty cool for Darwin, though, with Melbourne keeping its Alice Springs game.

4 home Melbourne games + 7-8 away Melbourne games for a total of 11-12 Melbourne games. If they went to 25 games per year, they could add an 8th to Darwin or 5th to Melbourne taking the Roos up to 12-13 Melbourne games.

But I don't see that happening, the Roos will probably play in Bendigo after Hobart.

 

[PaythePerryman]

Gold Coast 2011
GWS 2012

Let's not jump the gun yet, we'll see how they're going by 2032.

I think they're going okay for clubs that haven't been around for 150 years like some have.

2.65 million people in Western Sydney alone. Keep winning and keep doing community outreach and they have the biggest potential of pretty much any population base in Australia.
Tassie has a pop of 571 (understood it's heartland afl and that will be massive initially).
They are different ventures. One is a heritage play....one on a competitor brand.

 

[Bjo187]

I was reading the other day something interesting. As part of the new CBA the aflpa signed off on a potential extra round. Others have pointed out that 19 teams only goes into 24 rounds not 23, so if Tasmania comes in, one extra round will be added. Hopefully the afl actually get paid for the extra games this time, different to the missing $20 mill for gather round that we never heard anything about from fox or 7.

Now anyway, I like the sound of this extra round, the season should start on the labor day weekend anyway, it's a no brainer, but the extra round I would love to see as regional round.

9 games across places like:
Cairns
McKay
Sunshine coast
Coffs harbour
Newcastle
Central coast
Illawarra
Albury
Mildura
Broome
Bathurst
Darwin
Canberra
Wellington
Wagga etc..

The opportunity to completely dominate Australia by even getting to those areas that see none, or a lack of, AFL content.

 

[Coolangatta]

I was reading the other day something interesting. As part of the new CBA the aflpa signed off on a potential extra round. Others have pointed out that 19 teams only goes into 24 rounds not 23, so if Tasmania comes in, one extra round will be added. Hopefully the afl actually get paid for the extra games this time, different to the missing $20 mill for gather round that we never heard anything about from fox or 7.

Now anyway, I like the sound of this extra round, the season should start on the labor day weekend anyway, it's a no brainer, but the extra round I would love to see as regional round.

9 games across places like:
Cairns
McKay
Sunshine coast
Coffs harbour
Newcastle
Central coast
Illawarra
Albury
Mildura
Broome
Bathurst
Darwin
Canberra
Wellington
Wagga etc..

The opportunity to completely dominate Australia by even getting to those areas that see none, or a lack of, AFL content.

If that's what they end up doing, target the major population areas that aren't secondary markets.

So let's say by 2028 Hawthorn take Cairns, Roos take Bendigo, Dogs still have Ballarat, Suns still have Darwin, Giants still have Canberra...

I'd put the 9 games in Newcastle, Sunshine Coast, Central Coast, Wollongong, Townsville, Toowoomba, Albury, Mackay, and Rockhampton.

That's going by Wiki's significant urban areas list.

You could chuck out a couple of those QLD ones and throw in Busselton, Wagga, Mildura, Shepparton instead.

I see you've got Wellington in there; could chuck Auckland in there too if they ever have an AFL standard ground (which would be a deciding factor in locations).

Probably for me (if they all will have AFL standard grounds): Newcastle, Sunshine Coast, Central Coast, Wollongong, Townsville, Albury, Mackay, Auckland, Wellington.

I'd send the Pies to Auckland, want a big fish for NZ. Giants or Swans to play in Newcastle and Wollongong, and a big club playing in Townsville, probably the Tigers. Suns and Lions could play up there, get the Saints playing at Albury.

 

[Bjo187]

If that's what they end up doing, target the major population areas that aren't secondary markets.

So let's say by 2028 Hawthorn take Cairns, Roos take Bendigo, Dogs still have Ballarat, Suns still have Darwin, Giants still have Canberra...

I'd put the 9 games in Newcastle, Sunshine Coast, Central Coast, Wollongong, Townsville, Toowoomba, Albury, Mackay, and Rockhampton.

That's going by Wiki's significant urban areas list.

You could chuck out a couple of those QLD ones and throw in Busselton, Wagga, Mildura, Shepparton instead.

I see you've got Wellington in there; could chuck Auckland in there too if they ever have an AFL standard ground (which would be a deciding factor in locations).

Probably for me (if they all will have AFL standard grounds): Newcastle, Sunshine Coast, Central Coast, Wollongong, Townsville, Albury, Mackay, Auckland, Wellington.

I'd send the Pies to Auckland, want a big fish for NZ. Giants or Swans to play in Newcastle and Wollongong, and a big club playing in Townsville, probably the Tigers. Suns and Lions could play up there, get the Saints playing at Albury.

I agree on the locations you mentioned, they are more ideal, however I put places I know have decent footy grounds. Like coffs harbour as an example. I like them going to these regional areas, it helps them creep further into qld and nsw from all directions.

 

[Howard Littlejohn]

If that's what they end up doing, target the major population areas that aren't secondary markets.

So let's say by 2028 Hawthorn take Cairns, Roos take Bendigo, Dogs still have Ballarat, Suns still have Darwin, Giants still have Canberra...

I'd put the 9 games in Newcastle, Sunshine Coast, Central Coast, Wollongong, Townsville, Toowoomba, Albury, Mackay, and Rockhampton.

That's going by Wiki's significant urban areas list.

You could chuck out a couple of those QLD ones and throw in Busselton, Wagga, Mildura, Shepparton instead.

I see you've got Wellington in there; could chuck Auckland in there too if they ever have an AFL standard ground (which would be a deciding factor in locations).

Probably for me (if they all will have AFL standard grounds): Newcastle, Sunshine Coast, Central Coast, Wollongong, Townsville, Albury, Mackay, Auckland, Wellington.

I'd send the Pies to Auckland, want a big fish for NZ. Giants or Swans to play in Newcastle and Wollongong, and a big club playing in Townsville, probably the Tigers. Suns and Lions could play up there, get the Saints playing at Albury.

Why? New Zealanders wouldn't know Collingwood from any other football club. Huge brand in Australia, essentially unknown outside Aus, Nauru and maybe PNG. There would be more ex-pats and more people make the trip, but not more genuine locals, for Carlton v Collingwood than North v St Kilda. If anything Sydney, Melbourne, Adelaide, Brisbane, Gold Coast are names they would at least recognise; as cities/regions, not football clubs.

Not that Auckland has an AFL ready venue atm anyway. Eden Park is too small to even be a cricket ground if not for an ICC exemption for reasons of tradition, and the ovals don't exactly have seating for more than a handful of people. AFLNZ were looking at an oval, but that would not have had spectator facilities worth a damn, just a playing size suited to Australian Football (at least at the amateur level) and permanent facilities suited to the sport I'm not sure of that went ahead or not.

 

[Coolangatta]

Why? New Zealanders wouldn't know Collingwood from any other football club. Huge brand in Australia, essentially unknown outside Aus, Nauru and maybe PNG. There would be more ex-pats and more people make the trip, but not more genuine locals, for Carlton v Collingwood than North v St Kilda. If anything Sydney, Melbourne, Adelaide, Brisbane, Gold Coast are names they would at least recognise; as cities/regions, not football clubs.

Not that Auckland has an AFL ready venue atm anyway. Eden Park is too small to even be a cricket ground if not for an ICC exemption for reasons of tradition, and the ovals don't exactly have seating for more than a handful of people. AFLNZ were looking at an oval, but that would not have had spectator facilities worth a damn, just a playing size suited to Australian Football (at least at the amateur level) and permanent facilities suited to the sport I'm not sure of that went ahead or not.

You make sense. I suppose a good turnout doesn’t mean jack if it isn’t from the locals. Maybe send North there then, if they turn up to watch them, give em a team, they’ll turn up for anything.

 

[Walshawk]

2.65 million people in Western Sydney alone. Keep winning and keep doing community outreach and they have the biggest potential of pretty much any population base in Australia.
Tassie has a pop of 571 (understood it's heartland afl and that will be massive initially).
They are different ventures. One is a heritage play....one on a competitor brand.

The problem is that no one in Western Sydney likes footy. Even the Swans could on draw a few hundred at Blacktown tonight. It is an AFL wasteland. What if the NRL put a second team in South East Melbourne. Would that work just because there are 3m people there? Change is needed. After 12 largely successful seasons crowds and ratings have not grown at all.

 

[PaythePerryman]

The problem is that no one in Western Sydney likes footy. Even the Swans could on draw a few hundred at Blacktown tonight. It is an AFL wasteland. What if the NRL put a second team in South East Melbourne. Would that work just because there are 3m people there? Change is needed. After 12 largely successful seasons crowds and ratings have not grown at all.

This was never a 12 year plan....that would be incredibly short sighted. It's a long term investment and I don't believe it's going anywhere.
It's growing in Western Sydney...so is the academy.
Membership tally has grown, crowds didn't recover well from covid but we shall see how we go over the next 10 years.

 

[Coolangatta]

The problem is that no one in Western Sydney likes footy. Even the Swans could on draw a few hundred at Blacktown tonight. It is an AFL wasteland. What if the NRL put a second team in South East Melbourne. Would that work just because there are 3m people there? Change is needed. After 12 largely successful seasons crowds and ratings have not grown at all.

Sydney people are like that with crowds for any sport, including NRL. They just don’t turn up, or so I’ve read. Just their culture. Obviously it’s less of an issue in the NRL because the ratings are so much better. That’s the problem.

Whether it gets better, I don’t know, but there is interest in footy there. Not sure if the number of local clubs have increased there by much but according to anecdotes I’ve read there are a lot more kids seen in WS with footy and Giants merchandise than you’d think, certainly before the club existed. Let’s see what happens when they grow up what impact it’s really had.

 

[Walshawk]

This was never a 12 year plan....that would be incredibly short sighted. It's a long term investment and I don't believe it's going anywhere.
It's growing in Western Sydney...so is the academy.
Membership tally has grown, crowds didn't recover well from covid but we shall see how we go over the next 10 years.

Yes but any good business reviews and adjust plans at least every five years. Membership numbers mean almost nothing these days. So, that aside, how is the game growing? Many of the Auskick centres in WS have shut down. How is the Academy there growing? NRL crowds in WS are up. Why would GWS not be the same? ‘Steady as she goes’ will prove to be a mistake.