GreyCrow
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Thats what I mean though. They should be capitalising on it. I heard so much how the 7s win would help womens rugby etc etc
Play Nice AFL Womens - General Discussion
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The reality is that soccer does not attract the top athletes and can't sustain interest as a spectator sport in this country. Soccer has grown massively in the private schools apparently but have they actually produced any players? I bet you that, despite only being introduced a few years ago, rugby would see AF as a bigger threat in the Sydney private schools than soccer in terms "in school" and RL as the ongoing biggest threat in terms of offering the schoolboys contracts to switch post school
In terms of the women, though the Matildas have been doing well recently, anyone who thinks that women's soccer is a potential rival for attention longer term hasn't been paying attention.
BringBackTorps
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Soccer has also grown ENORMOUSLY in Govt. & Private primary schools around Australia; ditto Govt. secondary schools. Soccer is benefiting from the loss of many male primary teachers around Aust. AF, RL, & RU-contact sports- are seen as "too challenging" by many female teachers to coach & umpire.
I am not aware of any Syd. GPS, ISA, or CAS soccer players (who was not also in a local comp.) emerging from these school comps. who has gone on to to play in the A League. It is widely agreed that in GPS, ISA, & CAS schools, RU generally attracts by far the best athletes (Ditto RL in Govt. schools).
Kings & St Augustines still dont allow AF to be played in their schools -& St Josephs dont allow AF to be played in Years 7-10, wanting those students to focus on school RU. AF has been growing strongly in Syd. private schools since 2013, when for the first time they allowed it to be played. (Only Riverview pre-2013 allowed AF, & for many years their students happily played against suburban comp.clubs -mixing with the riff raff!).
Whilst A League Clubs are privately owned by many wealthy benefactors who are willing to accept "small"losses, the A League is sustainable over the long term. Their historic average crowds are reasonably good. However, the 2017 significant derby crowd decline in A League games at the start of their season (where the A League has clear air until Test cricket starts in a month.), IF it continues to worsen over all games, will cause angst for their owners. Sadly, Ch.10's 15% ratings decline have not been the panacea many predicted.
It is correct that the W League attracts poor crowds (average c.500 for W League games which do not precede a men's A League game at the same venue) - & little general interest.
At the W League Launch on 23.10.17, the star S. Kerr (who I understand only played AF until 14, then waltzed into the National adult Matilda's team when she was 15 -so much for the claims of some soccer followers that AF players have minimal skills!) made a specific appeal for the public to attend W League games. The AFLW has forced all the other female sports to "lift their game".
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Daniel Kerr ex Eagles player and a very good midfielder has high hopes his sister will end her sports career playing in the WAWFL or AFLW.
It appears that the FFA is in a very bitter fight internally according to some reports on local sports media, and all hell will break loose if they dont qualify for Russia, and what can they expect when 150 players are overseas plying their trade.
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While on the topic of other sports, it was interesting to hear James Sutherland interviewed during the women's cricket broadcast on Sunday. When the World T20 tournament in 2020 was raised, he mentioned they're planning on holding the men's and women's tournaments at different times, unlike previous years.
At this stage it's looking like the men's will be played in October-November and the women's during February-March. The reason given for this was so the women's tournament would have greater exposure and not be overshadowed by the men's. On top of that, he said something to the effect of "with a bit of luck Australia will make the final and it will be the best attended women's sporting event in history".
The new pay deal was also mentioned, as well as how this was the first women's Ashes series CA have sold tickets for. I've never really heard women's cricket talked up this way pre-2017, as if it wasn't just an obligation but more so an opportunity. It goes to show how the narrow-minded "AFL acting like they invented women's sport" comments totally miss the point.
At this stage it's looking like the men's will be played in October-November and the women's during February-March. The reason given for this was so the women's tournament would have greater exposure and not be overshadowed by the men's. On top of that, he said something to the effect of "with a bit of luck Australia will make the final and it will be the best attended women's sporting event in history".
The new pay deal was also mentioned, as well as how this was the first women's Ashes series CA have sold tickets for. I've never really heard women's cricket talked up this way pre-2017, as if it wasn't just an obligation but more so an opportunity. It goes to show how the narrow-minded "AFL acting like they invented women's sport" comments totally miss the point.
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/spo...p/news-story/e09347dcd9e0e86d098ad83e40c39e12
Private girls schools in Sydney start new comp.
Private girls schools in Sydney start new comp.
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Workskil Australia renewed a new 3 year sponsorship with the Adelaide Crows women's team, largest sponsorship undertaken by the non for profit organisation. Continue to be our joint major sponsor along with BHP for our women's team.
BringBackTorps
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Englishman Simon Hill, soccer commentator/booster, & AFL basher, joins the long list of commentators from other sports keen to undermine/attack the AFLW. Hill recently said that as AF is "not an international sport" & "is a dead-end sport, it should receive NO (my empasis) government funding". Hill deserves the award for being Aust.'s no.1 cultural cringer.
The Age's G.Baum writes here that Hill is at it again, belittling AFLW as a "suburban giggle-fest".
It's only the AFLW's first year. How visceral will other sports' negativity be as the AFLW inevitably expands to 18 Clubs, & reaches new heights of popularity -why do they denigrate it so much?
Baum also makes the interesting comment "...how to explain the explosion of AFLW, which has taken even the AFL by surprise...".
www.theage.com.au/afl/decoding/the-football-wars-between-soccer-and-australian-rules-20171117-gznpv2.html
The Age's G.Baum writes here that Hill is at it again, belittling AFLW as a "suburban giggle-fest".
It's only the AFLW's first year. How visceral will other sports' negativity be as the AFLW inevitably expands to 18 Clubs, & reaches new heights of popularity -why do they denigrate it so much?
Baum also makes the interesting comment "...how to explain the explosion of AFLW, which has taken even the AFL by surprise...".
www.theage.com.au/afl/decoding/the-football-wars-between-soccer-and-australian-rules-20171117-gznpv2.html
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Except he's a pom....which is what makes him even more risible in my opinion. It is like he set out to Australia on a boat in 1903 which went through some time portal in the roaring 40s and it was 2003 when he arrived. Essentially cannot abide that Australia refuses to fall in line with his sporting preferences and buy's into all sorts of tin foil hat fantasies and cultural insults as a salve. Sad man
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Simon Hill is an arrogant w***er who believes that soccer is the only sport anyone should follow, despite most Australians finding it to be a giant snooze fest. he cant seem to get over that.
Sam Kerr's comments are spot on though, playing at World Cups and Olympic Games are far more exciting spectacles to play in than AFLW's grandest of days as the curtain raiser to Gold Coast and whoever. Soccer has bigger possibilities.
Gold Coast doesn't have a women's team...the overwhelming number of matches weren't curtain raisers last year and I'm pretty sure none will be next year...it is a bit creepy that you are hanging around the AFL women's forum if you don't know this tbh
Women choosing AFLW will get to play in front of bigger crowds in front of bigger national audiences in more professional environments than women choosing soccer.
It is harsh reality for the cultural cringers to face up to, I know, but why do you think the best Australia's female athletes will see the world like you do when the best male athletes never have?
Ah okay, I do apologise. I was under the impression the AFLW grand final was a Gold Coast Suns curtain raiser. My mistake, carry on.
Were you, really? There was a three hour gap between games and the stadium was cleared in between matches.
You may also have been aware that it involved the Brisbane Lions as home team who were prevented from playing in the only oval stadium in Brisbane?
Anyway, putting aside the creepy belittling of the AFL W on the AFL W forum, I suspect it is a fair assumption that the 15K that turned up to the grand final was at the low end of what the GF crowds will be usually.
threenewpadlocks
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Difference is that by 2019 the AFLW will have around 450 players on list spots - ie the chance of any given athlete to make the AFLW is greater than other sports - contrast with:
W-League - less than 200 list spots (and then obviously only 25 or so players going to the World Cup etc.) - plus W-League players are getting paid less with worse facilities than AFLW players
Super Netball - less than 100 list spots and only 15 or so players go onto the World Cup
etc. etc.
So whilst it's very easy for Sam Kerr, who is currently one of the best female players in the world and gets all the accolades and international competitions to say how fantastic women's soccer is, the fact is that only remains true for the very best player that Australia has to offer. Fact of the matter is for the 40th best soccer player vs the 40th best footy player in Australia, the footy player has it better, and that's before you go into the 200th best Australian soccer player who is playing state/suburban level vs the 200th best footy player who is playing every week for her team in the AFLW.
Someone like Libby Birch, who was recruited as a netball athlete by the Dogs, was probably convinced to switch codes as a result. She was a gun netballer, making junior rep squads, but even still, she was highly odds-on to ever be good enough to ever make one of the 80-odd Super Netball list spots, that being the hard maths even if she eventually became one of the 150 best netballers in the country. Compare that to the AFLW: where even as roughly only the 150th or so best footy player in the country, she was playing in a national competition and has done a lot of promotional work with the AFL.
W-League - less than 200 list spots (and then obviously only 25 or so players going to the World Cup etc.) - plus W-League players are getting paid less with worse facilities than AFLW players
Super Netball - less than 100 list spots and only 15 or so players go onto the World Cup
etc. etc.
So whilst it's very easy for Sam Kerr, who is currently one of the best female players in the world and gets all the accolades and international competitions to say how fantastic women's soccer is, the fact is that only remains true for the very best player that Australia has to offer. Fact of the matter is for the 40th best soccer player vs the 40th best footy player in Australia, the footy player has it better, and that's before you go into the 200th best Australian soccer player who is playing state/suburban level vs the 200th best footy player who is playing every week for her team in the AFLW.
Someone like Libby Birch, who was recruited as a netball athlete by the Dogs, was probably convinced to switch codes as a result. She was a gun netballer, making junior rep squads, but even still, she was highly odds-on to ever be good enough to ever make one of the 80-odd Super Netball list spots, that being the hard maths even if she eventually became one of the 150 best netballers in the country. Compare that to the AFLW: where even as roughly only the 150th or so best footy player in the country, she was playing in a national competition and has done a lot of promotional work with the AFL.
Well put. There are an enormous and growing number of opportunities for the AFLW first in number of list spots, but then also in the massive number of other job opportunities that the sheer size of the industry can offer.
The disadvantage women's soccer has is it doesn't even have the riches and glory that the men's european soccer has which has proven demonstrably insufficient in attracting the better athletes in Australia.
If you were, say, a 14 year old now that was a there abouts state level soccer and football player and you have the option of a very modest soccer academy or the far better resourced youth development opportunities Australian football has to offer. And, at the end of that, you look forward 4 years and you only have to be the top say 50 odd players in your age cohort to get listed with an AFLW club and all the opportunities that affords. Alternatively, you would need to back yourself to be in the top 25 soccer players in the country at anyone time to make the Matildas squad and still likely end up worse off in the long run
Sam Kerr deserves all the credit and successes she has earned...but the fact that they had to get her to say that (and I bet she wasn't comfortable saying it) says more about soccer's desperation than anything. Sadly, for it, the Matildas have been a strong team for a long time and the FFA under-invested in their profile until it was too late
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Not to mention that there is no guarantee aflw will be around in 10 years. Im sure it will but I cant see too many people paying $30 to go to an aflw match. Its all good when its free
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Let's see.
AFL, most cashed up sport in Australia.
Female footy participation, skyrocketing.
Attendance, highest of any female team sport in Australia, by a mile.
Sponsorship for women's teams, walking out the door.
Media profile, huge, and for AFL kept up through summer.
Number of national women's leagues much poorer sports leagues have managed to run, numerous.
I see where your coming from now, doomed to fail.
I can just see it. Gil, standing before the media, egg on face, admitting the AFL got it wrong. Women's sport to tough an egg for them to crack. AFL will have to leave it to the real pro sports, like soccer and basketball and hockey, and slink off licking its wounds.
When do you reckon, end of next season? Maybe half way through season 3?
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Settle down. Just saying soccer is a better choice for S.Kerr than aflw.
I said Im sure it will be around but Im also saying when they want to start making decent revenue they are going to have to get people through the gates, paying customers.
Cant rely on free entry the whole time.
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I said Im sure it will be around but Im also saying when they want to start making decent revenue they are going to have to get people through the gates, paying customers.
Cant rely on free entry the whole time.
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GreyCrow
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I dont understand your argument. How much revenue is womens soccer taking in? From the little tv viewing I've watched there are bugger all paying people there.
Its a long term investment by the AFL. They are prepared to lose big money to make money , not in 5 years but in 10 years. AFL have been in SA for 20 years. Dont worry about us oldies who knew the VFL, but ask anybody under 30 what their SANFL team is they look at you as if you are silly. The AFL have captured that market.
In much the same way, a girl 5-10 is the market for the future. Dragging mum, dad and bf through the gates over the next 20 years is the investment.
Sponsorship. Without googling can you name a sponsor of womens soccer.
Its a long term investment by the AFL. They are prepared to lose big money to make money , not in 5 years but in 10 years. AFL have been in SA for 20 years. Dont worry about us oldies who knew the VFL, but ask anybody under 30 what their SANFL team is they look at you as if you are silly. The AFL have captured that market.
In much the same way, a girl 5-10 is the market for the future. Dragging mum, dad and bf through the gates over the next 20 years is the investment.
Sponsorship. Without googling can you name a sponsor of womens soccer.
You said there's no guarantee which was ridiculous enough. It's possible that in ten years time they are still not formally charging entry but it is still swimming in sponsorship, tv rights and membership revenue.
Jatz response nailed the ridiculousness
That's easy, westfields!
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*sigh*
Sam Kerr(and probably about most of the team) would be full-time pros nowadays, or close to. They play in Europe or the USA. AFLW is a part of the booming women's sports scene. Every sport is booming, and that includes soccer. 10k+ for a midweek friendly is a testament to that. It is a trend happening worldwide. Look at the women's world cup in soccer and cricket. Heck, I didn't even hear that many complaints about equal pay in tennis this year. That was a welcome change.
You mean like Ben Simmons, Mitch Marsh, Alex Keath, Matty Wade etc etc etc.
They will go to what sport they want to go. No one has forced Sam Kerr to say anything. She is probably sick of the question by now. She knows her soccer career will far outweigh anything the AFLW could offer and she enjoys the career she is having. She also enjoys AR, which would rock your mind i am sure. Heck, outside Perry and certain Olympians, she is probably the most marketable female star in Aussie sport right now. The only thing i agree with is that she deserves every success and the FFA was slow to read the changing tide in sport.
Sam Kerr(and probably about most of the team) would be full-time pros nowadays, or close to. They play in Europe or the USA. AFLW is a part of the booming women's sports scene. Every sport is booming, and that includes soccer. 10k+ for a midweek friendly is a testament to that. It is a trend happening worldwide. Look at the women's world cup in soccer and cricket. Heck, I didn't even hear that many complaints about equal pay in tennis this year. That was a welcome change.
You mean like Ben Simmons, Mitch Marsh, Alex Keath, Matty Wade etc etc etc.
They will go to what sport they want to go. No one has forced Sam Kerr to say anything. She is probably sick of the question by now. She knows her soccer career will far outweigh anything the AFLW could offer and she enjoys the career she is having. She also enjoys AR, which would rock your mind i am sure. Heck, outside Perry and certain Olympians, she is probably the most marketable female star in Aussie sport right now. The only thing i agree with is that she deserves every success and the FFA was slow to read the changing tide in sport.
Why would Sam Kerr liking footy "rock my mind"? Seriously, you have a massive cultural cringe and shoulder chip towards Australian football....we've established that. Stop trying to flip it round it's getting boring. Heck you spend all your time on an Australian football forum
Anyway, you'll hate this but you should read it anyway
https://www.exclusiveinsight.com/georgie-parker-this-is-no-publicity-stunt/
No problem with Kerr playing whatever she wants. Its the suggestion a reason to choose soccer is that footy might not be around much longer.
I think it is the least likely of all national women's leagues to close in the next 10 years.
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