Win Prizes Ask an Atheist II

[Gethelred]

Welcome to the Ask an Atheist thread II.

Previous part:

Win Prizes - Ask an Atheist - Shoe's on the other foot now!

Alright, we're going to have a change of tack. As I'm sure you can see, the thread title has been changed to Ask an Atheist. People who have a question to ask of the atheists who populate this thread - more than the christians do - should feel free to ask questions of them. If you've still got...

www.bigfooty.com

Standard board rules apply.

 

[Total Power]

Along with Essendon memberships?

I thought that comes free with baptism. Both are in struggle town

 

[Vindicater]

Along with Essendon memberships?

They are already pre bought.

 

[carltonchelsea]

How would you feel if your daughter, for some reason, found God and became Christian?

I’d ask her to show me where and how she “found” him.
I still struggle to get her to read more than what’s required in year 7.
I doubt she’ll ever read the bible, so she would have to be misled by, what I’d call nefarious means or peoples, and they wouldn’t like me knowing where they lived!
My son is an atheist, a lot of his friends are not, he occasionally riles them up with various arguments I’ve helped him with.
My daughter believes in nature, she’s very kind and responsive to animal welfare and the likes, doubt she’d ever be persuaded to the dark side of the force.
But, it’d depend on how she feels and reasons with me if Yahweh, Jesus or Mohammed or any other being gave her cause to want to follow a middle eastern mythology/tradition.
She has a lot of a Jewish friends through her acting work and study.
Wants to live in Caulfield and go to school with them.
Might be an option for me to get out of south Frankston sooner rather than later, dunno.

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

I would probably buy my future grandchildren science books for every gift however.

This!

 

[Total Power]

I’d ask her to show me where and how she “found” him.
I still struggle to get her to read more than what’s required in year 7.
I doubt she’ll ever read the bible, so she would have to be misled by, what I’d call nefarious means or peoples, and they wouldn’t like me knowing where they lived!
My son is an atheist, a lot of his friends are not, he occasionally riles them up with various arguments I’ve helped him with.
My daughter believes in nature, she’s very kind and responsive to animal welfare and the likes, doubt she’d ever be persuaded to the dark side of the force.
But, it’d depend on how she feels and reasons with me if Yahweh, Jesus or Mohammed or any other being gave her cause to want to follow a middle eastern mythology/tradition.
She has a lot of a Jewish friends through her acting work and study.
Wants to live in Caulfield and go to school with them.
Might be an option for me to get out of south Frankston sooner rather than later, dunno.

I heard Michael Voss called himself Yahweh

 

[carltonchelsea]

I heard Michael Voss called himself Yahweh

Doubt there’d be many a man nor woman that would be brave enough to challenge hiim on it, probably not even Yahweh him or herself.
Yahweh-“Yes yes yes, whatever you say Michael……I mean Yahweh”.
Jesus-“Dad, you’re not going to let him just boss you around like that now are you”
Voss-“pipe down kid, or I’ll bench press you…..”

 

[ManInTheArena]

Tathagatta Buddha, the Father Buddha, said "with our thoughts we make thd world".

Elemental forces caused the egg to hatch. From it then came a stone monkey
The nature of monkey was irrepressible.

That's my point. We confuse our "self" with our thoughts and most of our thoughts are about concepts which don't exist in reality. "Atheist" being one of them. You can't eat it, punch it, smell it, hear it, or see it. "Atheist" simply doesn't exist. It's a concept built on a house of cards of other concepts, and that is the human condition - building most of our reality and identity on concepts that do not really exist. It aided in our reproductive success and that's the only reason our ability to conceptualise "exists".

Perhaps if we dropped all these concepts that make people "others" we wouldn't be c**ts to each other 24x7.

 

[ManInTheArena]

Depends if you care or not.
For all intents and purposes, I’m an anti-theist, does it define me, no, do I care, only when attacking the theists position.
If I’m out surfing with my daughter, we are at one with the water and the forces of nature, my anti-theism doesn’t help me either way!

Does it ever help you?

 

[carltonchelsea]

Does it ever help you?

Did you not read my post, it only helps me when I’m rejecting the ridiculous arguments from the Yahwehists or the sublimely ignorant from any stupid ideology.
How would it help me build something, or walk my dog, or cook something complex, or help me make music or or or and more.
It’s good for one thing only, rejection of the claims made by the ignorant!
What else would you care to know about me?
More than happy to share…..

 

[Total Power]

Did you not read my post, it only helps me when I’m rejecting the ridiculous arguments from the Yahwehists or the sublimely ignorant from any stupid ideology.
How would it help me build something, or walk my dog, or cook something complex, or help me make music or or or and more.
It’s good for one thing only, rejection of the claims made by the ignorant!
What else would you care to know about me?
More than happy to share…..

Yahwehists lol..love it. Jesus and Yahweh are the same God...only when it suits them apparently.

 

[Username Anthony]

I've studied the Bible formally for 5 years and informally for 40. I've studied other belief systems almost as long.

Have you ever wondered why atheists go to university when they can just buy the text books and study them from home, to avoid paying the school fees?

 

[Total Power]

That sounds like a healthy attitude.

I'm a daylight agnostic. I think I'm pretty smart but there's no way I can understand even a tiny fragment of how the universe works.

Anyone coming to me with a pamphlet that proves them right is going to come off second to my combined arrogance and ignorance.

I've studied the Bible formally for 5 years and informally for 40. I've studied other belief systems almost as long.

My only firm conclusion is expressed in the Rg Veda:

But, after all, who knows, and who can say
Whence it all came, and how creation happened?
the gods themselves are later than creation,
so who knows truly whence it has arisen?

Whence all creation had its origin,
he, whether he fashioned it or whether he did not,
he, who surveys it all from highest heaven,
he knows - or maybe even he does not know.

Sin the Bible comes from a Semitic word meaning debt. It later accrues a sense of a transgressive act.

There is not mention of sin in the Eden story, so the Christian story of original sin is a layer interpretation.

This isn't evil or invalidating, all religions reinterpret older stories to develop new truths.

A literal reading of Genesis shows God creates the world twice, God is intersex, God is dishonest and not all knowing (and a cruel prankster, happens again Kob)magic works, and heaven is full of water that leaks if the windows are opened.

These odd contradictions (the Bible as a whole contradicts itself as well as most Abraham's dogmas a bunch of times) aren't a sign of the Bible being "false".

They are the result of many thinkers in many cultures asking new questions of old stories, and adding new twists to the existing corpus.

You are like a fresh breath of air in this thread mate..all the other Christians in this thread have no NFI about other religions and mythologies and have no clue about mythologies are supposed to work and they interpret this literally. They can only cheerlead the NT without understanding that they have no copyright on spirituality. Having an idea of other religion(s) and mythologies puts Bible in context!

 

[carltonchelsea]

Have you ever wondered why atheists go to university when they can just buy the text books and study them from home, to avoid paying the school fees?

Um, yeah sure, you’d let a self educated person cut you open and operate?
Most educated people love their lecturers and professors, some even become colleagues and then mentors to them.
What a farcical statement!
Blind ignorance of the higher education system!

 

[liz]

Have you ever wondered why atheists go to university when they can just buy the text books and study them from home, to avoid paying the school fees?

There are many reasons to enrol in a course and have one’s education guided.

What’s that got to do with belief in a deity?

 

[Vdubs]

There are many reasons to enrol in a course and have one’s education guided.

What’s that got to do with belief in a deity?

Simply the expert opinions and explanations of the Bible we get here from atheists, ironically.

 

[liz]

Simply the expert opinions and explanations of the Bible we get here from atheists, ironically.

Huh?

What’s the connection?

 

[ManInTheArena]

Did you not read my post, it only helps me when I’m rejecting the ridiculous arguments from the Yahwehists or the sublimely ignorant from any stupid ideology.
How would it help me build something, or walk my dog, or cook something complex, or help me make music or or or and more.
It’s good for one thing only, rejection of the claims made by the ignorant!
What else would you care to know about me?
More than happy to share…..

Yeah I read it. That's why I'm asking, does it ever help you?

You said it doesn't help you with anything but arguing with theists. How does arguing with theists help you?

 

[Total Power]

Simply the expert opinions and explanations of the Bible we get here from atheists, ironically.

Yeah experts are those who are 'evangelicals' . Just listening to one side of the argument must be fun. I mean they are already Christians, what you expect them to say? "Oh i am sorry, i am wrong, the evidence says otherwise"?

 

[Username Anthony]

There are many reasons to enrol in a course and have one’s education guided.

But unguided atheists read the Bible, a Book in which it says "many things are hard to understand," so how can they understand it if they're not guided by the Truth?

 

[Username Anthony]

Um, yeah sure, you’d let a self educated person cut you open and operate?

But you get educated by reading don't ya?

Most educated people love their lecturers and professors, some even become colleagues and then mentors to them.

So they're already educated when they're loving their lecturers and professors?

 

[Cyclops]

Yeah I read it. That's why I'm asking, does it ever help you?

You said it doesn't help you with anything but arguing with theists. How does arguing with theists help you?

Objection, you're badgering the witness. I don't believe they said they were helped by arguing with theists.

In my experience ideologues seek arguments, so a bad Christian (say a pushy ideologue) might argue and our correspondent might need to argue back to stop say a bit of bullying or some silly rule making.

Have you ever wondered why atheists go to university when they can just buy the text books and study them from home, to avoid paying the school fees?

Your question has no merit. Why would anyone wonder about this counterfactual scenario? To make a lame thomist syllogism about faith? Lol.

You are like a fresh breath of air in this thread mate..all the other Christians in this thread have no NFI about other religions and mythologies and have no clue about mythologies are supposed to work and they interpret this literally. They can only cheerlead the NT without understanding that they have no copyright on spirituality. Having an idea of other religion(s) and mythologies puts Bible in context!

I'm an agnostic, but thanks.

There are more things in heaven and earth than are dreamed of in my philosophy. Yeshua bar Yusuf the rabbi may well have been the messiah born of a virgin. The gospels do not prove this. Its a book. I know books. People make books, I never saw God at the printers.

Don't get me wrong, I'm convinced as an historian Jesus likely existed. His followers were brimming with faith in him as a ressurected being. Some saw him die, and Jesus as a messiah as it was understood then was a bust (no new kingdom, the tevolt in 66 failed) so there was no reason to invent the story. The apostles had a shared experience that convinced many of them that their teacher came back.

If ither people have Jesus in their lives good on them . My nephew does, I praise and encourage him because he does good.

Christianity is a religion I think Jesus would not recognise. He was a Jew and a Rabbi. He ate dinner with the more exclusive Jews, and rarely spoke to non Jews: a Jew of the Jews preaching to Jews about Jewish salvation. Jesus never used the word Christian, it was attriburwd to some if his followers yearscafter he died.

I think the bits where he speaks of "the nations" are layer interpolations. The Bible is full of them, as well as forged letters and fake prophecies.

Don't confuse the massively complex bundle of writings with God. Only an idiot would think the Bible is God or proves anything about God. It's a book. I can write extra words in it, change, add delete bits.

Thousands already have.

 

[liz]

But unguided atheists read the Bible, a Book in which it says "many things are hard to understand," so how can they understand it if they're not guided by the Truth?

You continue to make no sense.

This atheist (guided or not) doesn't waste time reading the bible. When I choose to study other domains, sometimes I do so by private reading, but if I want an in depth understanding I enrol in an appropriate course where higher level skills will be developed, I will benefit from the curation of material by someone more learned than I, and where I will participate in learning as a social activity. (I might also get a valuable certification of what I have learned.)

 

[Username Anthony]

Yeah experts are those who are 'evangelicals' . Just listening to one side of the argument must be fun. I mean they are already Christians, what you expect them to say? "Oh i am sorry, i am wrong, the evidence says otherwise"?

The experts on Christianity are the priests not the lay people, just like the Jews used to have a High Priest and a priesthood that they had to listen to (Deut. 17:9-13), so do the Christians now.

Unguided atheists can't understand the Bible, so why would a Christian want to hear from them?

 

[Ghost Patrol]

But unguided atheists read the Bible

No. But it's got thin paper, so consider using it to roll a joint in emergency situations.

 

[carltonchelsea]

Yeah I read it. That's why I'm asking, does it ever help you?

You said it doesn't help you with anything but arguing with theists. How does arguing with theists help you?

What else does my anti-theism exist for except arguing my rejection of theists claims, maybe you could help me out?
What else would I use it for?
Maybe choosing a political candidate, there’s something, you got any ideas beyond that?