Bluemour Melting Pot XXVII

[bendigoblues]

‘That’s Essendon’: Giants footy boss tees off at ‘unreasonable’ Bombers, Crows over trade offers

‘That’s Essendon’: Giants footy boss launches at Bombers, Crows over trade offers

www.foxsports.com.au

This is an interesting topic but I think I'm with McCartney on this.

I know everyone is trying to do best by their club...but at the same time there should be some mutual respect to do a deal both teams can be happy with and is reasonably fair.

Essendon, expectedly, convinced Caldwell but then didn't stump up up and deal went through last minute. We already know their Dunkley offer was very underwhelming, only adding a 2nd rounder to pick 7 late and not taking into account Dogs don't need pick 7...pretty lazy.

And the Crows only offering pick 40 for Hately knowing they could get him in the PSD. I guess you could argue good on them they got him for free and they used their leverage? On the other hand it's quite disrespectful and really abusing the situation since 40 is way under for a pick 14 from only 2 years ago...they could have at least tried to offer a pick in the mid-late 20s.

Curious to know people's thoughts...use your leverage to full advantage to ream the other club or be respectful enough to at least offer something at least a bit more reasonable? This is for normal situations like this, not Collingwood's salary cap issues leading to a fire sale.

Its a shame the system is so rubbish that it allows these things to happen. If they made rookie deals longer eg 5 years and the a player could sign anywhere it would solve a lot of these issues. Get rid of all the compensation picks, academy's and FS rubbish as well.

That said, and it was a point of topic this week with Saad, if you poach a player, get them to verbally commit then they should be brought in. * are always tight arse scum with this, and hopefully player managers dont encourage their clients to go there.

 

[Blue_Fusion]

So, it's our responsibility to pay up for one of their uncontracted players...

but it's their responsibility to low ball for an opposition's uncontracted player...

Dodo logic at it's finest..

 

[murphster]

‘That’s Essendon’: Giants footy boss tees off at ‘unreasonable’ Bombers, Crows over trade offers

‘That’s Essendon’: Giants footy boss launches at Bombers, Crows over trade offers

www.foxsports.com.au

This is an interesting topic but I think I'm with McCartney on this.

I know everyone is trying to do best by their club...but at the same time there should be some mutual respect to do a deal both teams can be happy with and is reasonably fair.

Essendon, expectedly, convinced Caldwell but then didn't stump up up and deal went through last minute. We already know their Dunkley offer was very underwhelming, only adding a 2nd rounder to pick 7 late and not taking into account Dogs don't need pick 7...pretty lazy.

And the Crows only offering pick 40 for Hately knowing they could get him in the PSD. I guess you could argue good on them they got him for free and they used their leverage? On the other hand it's quite disrespectful and really abusing the situation since 40 is way under for a pick 14 from only 2 years ago...they could have at least tried to offer a pick in the mid-late 20s.

Curious to know people's thoughts...use your leverage to full advantage to ream the other club or be respectful enough to at least offer something at least a bit more reasonable? This is for normal situations like this, not Collingwood's salary cap issues leading to a fire sale.

Yeah I posted something yesterday on this, Adelaide acted in bad faith imo by only offering 40 for Hately and didn’t really even try to stump up more as they were always planning on using what should be the last resort to take him in the PSD, I suspect they had the shits over the Crouch compo and wrongfully took it out on GWS.

All I can say is what goes around comes around and Adelaide better be ready to have the same done to them very soon.

As for Essenscum DoDo will always be DoDo and the only reason he stumped up anything in the end is because he knew North would pounce in the PSD before he got to them, I really wish that it did play out that way and Essenscum ended up with nada because that would have made my year.

 

[Koutamightafides]

I see now the AFL are looking at a second trade period , gee Gill is a tosser . He is so pro-Essendscum and anti-Carlton already and it's time he was replaced with Brendan Gale I reckon . Might be a conspiracy theory but a couple of people have made comments about him not liking Carlton from back when he was a player and trained with us over a preseason and being told he wasn't AFL standard and wouldn't be given a contract even though we were shite and he was a good height and not the worst player . F*** Gill he is a tosser .

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

Think H would be happy to sign for a base of 600+ incentive

I hope so and that seems fair but what do you think happens if he gets a 5 year close to a million dollar offer?
This is the situation I fear we are going to find ourselves in

 

[teddy-hopkins]

‘That’s Essendon’: Giants footy boss tees off at ‘unreasonable’ Bombers, Crows over trade offers

‘That’s Essendon’: Giants footy boss launches at Bombers, Crows over trade offers

www.foxsports.com.au

This is an interesting topic but I think I'm with McCartney on this.

I know everyone is trying to do best by their club...but at the same time there should be some mutual respect to do a deal both teams can be happy with and is reasonably fair.

Essendon, expectedly, convinced Caldwell but then didn't stump up up and deal went through last minute. We already know their Dunkley offer was very underwhelming, only adding a 2nd rounder to pick 7 late and not taking into account Dogs don't need pick 7...pretty lazy.

And the Crows only offering pick 40 for Hately knowing they could get him in the PSD. I guess you could argue good on them they got him for free and they used their leverage? On the other hand it's quite disrespectful and really abusing the situation since 40 is way under for a pick 14 from only 2 years ago...they could have at least tried to offer a pick in the mid-late 20s.

Curious to know people's thoughts...use your leverage to full advantage to ream the other club or be respectful enough to at least offer something at least a bit more reasonable? This is for normal situations like this, not Collingwood's salary cap issues leading to a fire sale.

We walked Martin through to the PSD so we probably shouldn't be throwing too many stones in our glass house..... however -

Martin was an unfulfilled talent with very patchy form having been dropped and injured during the year. GC's demand was unreasonable and they were drunk on the free draft picks handed out by the AFL. Essendon just want to scr3w everyone hard on every deal.

 

[Aphrodite]

 

[ferrisb]

At Bunnings, you have to walk past the 'specials' bins at the front to get to the checkout. Everything is SO cheap, so you buy it all.

Sure, when you get home you realise you now have 6 ratchet sets, 5 impact drills, 8.7 million 3M hooks, enough AA batteries to power a small nation, and 27 dremel accessory kits despite not owning a rotary tool. But think of all the money you saved getting things on special!!!

That is Essendon's recruiting strategy...

And then in a few years you have to get rid of your unwanted/broken/wantaway tools and list them on gumtree for 2 x RRP...

 

[Arr0w]

I hope so and that seems fair but what do you think happens if he gets a 5 year close to a million dollar offer?
This is the situation I fear we are going to find ourselves in

Harry won't get a 5 mil, 5 year deal and if he did, it would only be a club like North

If you were Harry, would you go through another rebuild?

 

[slashin_velvet]

I think it needs to go back to preventative measures.

1. Draftees should be signed to 3 year initial deal and or a decreasing scale, trades should only take place if both parties agree

2. Abolish PSD

3 RFA - Acquiring club pays 50% of the compensation, coming off their first live pick

AFL still get their yearly meat market, while having more protective measures

I'd add - the players are contracted to the AFL, so the clubs should be entitled to trade them wherever the club wants. Uncontracted players have a choice, contracted players can get sent to where the best offer comes from.

 

[murphster]

We walked Martin through to the PSD so we probably shouldn't be throwing too many stones in our glass house..... however -

Martin was an unfulfilled talent with very patchy form having been dropped and injured during the year. GC's demand was unreasonable and they were drunk on the free draft picks handed out by the AFL. Essendon just want to scr3w everyone hard on every deal.

We also offered fair value for Martin so nothing like these 2, our final offer I think was 2 2nd round picks which if anything was overs, that GC didn’t except was down to the concessions offered by the AFL so we used PSD as last resort not first resort like Adelaide have.

 

[thebluenewdeal]

I see now the AFL are looking at a second trade period

If that’s the case then the big fish is back in play

 

[Aphrodite]

Treloar on SEN now.

Gee he speaks well. Gotta love his honesty.

He has won me over.

Really feel for Adam.

 

[Arr0w]

I'd add - the players are contracted to the AFL, so the clubs should be entitled to trade them wherever the club wants. Uncontracted players have a choice, contracted players can get sent to where the best offer comes from.

Nah, if anything it should be the other way round

Personally I wouldn't go that far

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

Harry won't get a 5 mil, 5 year deal and if he did, it would only be a club like North

If you were Harry, would you go through another rebuild?

Look what they offered Kelly for instance, if he breaks out as expected then it’s not far off what gun KF’s command. Even looking at someone like McGovern and how much he got from us. You only have to have one side take the risk, could even be Sydney.

personally I would because I don’t think their list is that bad and it could set him up for life. Also their are no guarantees, I wouldn’t have wanted to be at Richmond at the end of 2016 or Saints 12 months ago. 5 years also gives him the opportunity to have another 3-4 year contract somewhere afterwards if it goes pear shaped. Though I can understand why players wouldn’t.

 

[AT97]

Yep. Can’t hold his ground in one v ones well enough. Can’t ‘plant’ and keep his opponent away from the ball. You see this at training. I still believe he’s a good third tall intercept option. Releasing Plow.

In the trade review?? Austin mentioned Marchbank as a potential wingman.

 

[Aphrodite]

Ned Guy statement on BigFooty's crash last night:

"This was a really successful website maintenance exercise. We definitely didn't have any server capacity issues. We've just been thinking for a while that we wanted to restart the system. Not because there was a problem, but because the website is going so well, Chief was making too much money and was going to go into a higher tax bracket. And we thought the best time to continue to strengthen the site was 1 hour after trade period ended. And that's what we've done"

However, Guy's comments were contrasted by one of the affected posters HBF. "At no time did I have any indication that the server was being cut off. I first heard about it through the media. I had no contact from anyone at BF. I called up Chief and he said Yeah, we're looking to restart the servers. It's probably best if you look at posting on some other sites. I feel really let down by everyone at BF. It's been a tough year; only 17 rounds of footy, I haven't been able to attend games with my very very very good friend. And now this? Sure, I've got some things I need to work on; both in my posting and IRL. But I just feel let down by the way this was handled".

 

[Aphrodite]

Kane Cornes sums up every team's trade period in 3 words

All 18 teams' trade period summed up in three words.

www.sen.com.au

someone got to see if cornes is okay. theres no way he writes this about carlton without a gun to his head

Definitely hacked!

 

[agro]

I see now the AFL are looking at a second trade period , gee Gill is a tosser . He is so pro-Essendscum and anti-Carlton already and it's time he was replaced with Brendan Gale I reckon . Might be a conspiracy theory but a couple of people have made comments about him not liking Carlton from back when he was a player and trained with us over a preseason and being told he wasn't AFL standard and wouldn't be given a contract even though we were sh*te and he was a good height and not the worst player . F*** Gill he is a tosser .

And somehow we still managed to put him in that years team photo.

 

[Arr0w]

Look what they offered Kelly for instance, if he breaks out as expected then it’s not far off what gun KF’s command. Even looking at someone like McGovern and how much he got from us. You only have to have one side take the risk, could even be Sydney.

personally I would because I don’t think their list is that bad and it could set him up for life. Also their are no guarantees, I wouldn’t have wanted to be at Richmond at the end of 2016 or Saints 12 months ago. 5 years also gives him the opportunity to have another 3-4 year contract somewhere afterwards if it goes pear shaped. Though I can understand why players wouldn’t.

I think you are worrying, unnecessarily

How often does a player form a club on the verge or in finals that leaves for more money?

Generally only players that have won a flag or more that do

 

[Kramer1]

I simply don't get the Collingwood cover up...they are the biggest sporting club in the land, surely they have someone capable of managing relations with respect to the public...let's call it public relations for short.

They could have used all sorts of still weasly, but not blatant bullshit lines...

Finishing a few steps short of a flag in consecutive years we believe we have taken this list as far as it could go, and now it is time to re-tool.

We've had to address some imbalances in our list this year - short term pain for long term gain.

We think our supporters would rather see us really push for a flag and fall short than just try to stay in the 8. Now we look to reset and rebound as quickly as we can.

Even some half truths...no one wants to see good players leave but no individual is bigger than the club and we've done what had to be done for the CFC.

Or maybe even something nearer the truth. Mea Culpa. We stuffed up, we thought we were in a better position than we were and made some contract calls that have left us exposed. Now it's on us to fix it.

Gobsmacked at how wrong they have got their messaging, how bad this looks for Buckley...and it's going to get much worse.

 

[lex3191]

‘That’s Essendon’: Giants footy boss tees off at ‘unreasonable’ Bombers, Crows over trade offers

‘That’s Essendon’: Giants footy boss launches at Bombers, Crows over trade offers

www.foxsports.com.au

This is an interesting topic but I think I'm with McCartney on this.

I know everyone is trying to do best by their club...but at the same time there should be some mutual respect to do a deal both teams can be happy with and is reasonably fair.

Essendon, expectedly, convinced Caldwell but then didn't stump up up and deal went through last minute. We already know their Dunkley offer was very underwhelming, only adding a 2nd rounder to pick 7 late and not taking into account Dogs don't need pick 7...pretty lazy.

And the Crows only offering pick 40 for Hately knowing they could get him in the PSD. I guess you could argue good on them they got him for free and they used their leverage? On the other hand it's quite disrespectful and really abusing the situation since 40 is way under for a pick 14 from only 2 years ago...they could have at least tried to offer a pick in the mid-late 20s.

Curious to know people's thoughts...use your leverage to full advantage to ream the other club or be respectful enough to at least offer something at least a bit more reasonable? This is for normal situations like this, not Collingwood's salary cap issues leading to a fire sale.

This is exactly why I believe Austin was right to say **** it and get Saad in and move on instead of continuing dealing with Dodo.

It seems that Dodo is only interested in zero sum negotiations. It’s old school and antiquated and frankly isn’t in the best interest of the club he serves from a list strategy perspective.
To use a cliche Dodo is prepared to ‘cut off his nose to spite his face’.

I think the Dunkley deal best encapsulates this, here’s a guy who has nominated your club, is young, fits your club needs, and prized by his current club and touted as a future captain.

No disrespect to Heppell’s football abilities but he has all the leadership qualities of a Hawaiian shirt. Dunkley would have been a prize acquisition and had the potential to influence the culture of the club and convince want away players to stay. You get that deal done. If it’s two first then you do it.

Good luck to him with his prized first round picks in a compromised draft, I’m sure he’ll be able to trade in three walk up starts /s

But **** I’m glad Austin is smart enough to realise that there’s no reasonable deal possible with Dodo. Might as well bang your head a couple of times against the wall before you start dealing with him to level the playing field

 

[Kramer1]

‘That’s Essendon’: Giants footy boss tees off at ‘unreasonable’ Bombers, Crows over trade offers

‘That’s Essendon’: Giants footy boss launches at Bombers, Crows over trade offers

www.foxsports.com.au

This is an interesting topic but I think I'm with McCartney on this.

I know everyone is trying to do best by their club...but at the same time there should be some mutual respect to do a deal both teams can be happy with and is reasonably fair.

Essendon, expectedly, convinced Caldwell but then didn't stump up up and deal went through last minute. We already know their Dunkley offer was very underwhelming, only adding a 2nd rounder to pick 7 late and not taking into account Dogs don't need pick 7...pretty lazy.

And the Crows only offering pick 40 for Hately knowing they could get him in the PSD. I guess you could argue good on them they got him for free and they used their leverage? On the other hand it's quite disrespectful and really abusing the situation since 40 is way under for a pick 14 from only 2 years ago...they could have at least tried to offer a pick in the mid-late 20s.

Curious to know people's thoughts...use your leverage to full advantage to ream the other club or be respectful enough to at least offer something at least a bit more reasonable? This is for normal situations like this, not Collingwood's salary cap issues leading to a fire sale.

McCartney nails it...Dodoro does his club and his targeted players no favours with the blood out of a stone approach. Where has it left them? It's the most motley list in the AFL. Rather than take a positive outcome from Saad and invest it, he tries to double down...who cares if Dunkley isn't worth two rounders, Essendon went hard at him, got him and Pickering on side in the media, garnered the assets, and still they still managed to shit the bed...pick 8 was effectively house money. Dunkley was the right type, right age and ideal temperament for a pretty volatile Essendon environment. Dunkley, Shiel and Merrett would have been one of the best on ball brigades, potentially for years to come. Now he's got a rag tag list and opposition list managers with long memories.

As for Crows...while we have been beneficiaries, I can't see a reason to retain the PSD. At least with Martin we know we put a reasonable offer up, and there were extenuating circumstances.

 

[HARKER]

I simply don't get the Collingwood cover up...they are the biggest sporting club in the land, surely they have someone capable of managing relations with respect to the public...let's call it public relations for short.

They could used all sorts of still weasly, but not blatant bullshit lines...

Finishing a few steps short of a flag in consecutive years we believe we have taken this list as far as it could go, and now it is time to re-tool.

We've had to address some imbalances in our list this year - short term pain for long term gain.

We think our supporters would rather see us really push for a flag and fall short than just try to stay in the 8. Now we look to reset and rebound as quickly as we can.

Even some half truths...no one wants to see good players leave but no individual is bigger than the club and we've done what had to be done for the CFC.

Or maybe even something nearer the truth. We stuffed up, we thought we were in a better position than we were and made some contract calls that have left us exposed. Now it's on us to fix it.

Gobsmacked at how wrong they have got their messaging, how bad this looks for Buckley...and it's going to get much worse.

There's no way out of this for Collingwood and how they plotted to take this stance with their players, regardless of what they may have done....would be comical if it wasn't so patently insensitive, aggressive and stupid.

How the hell did this company line come about? It's something that would have happened in the 80's with a kilo of coke strewn across the boardroom table.
It's just weird.....and what do they do now? Stick their fingers in their ears, make some loud noises and hope it all goes away? Weird......all that time to think about things and this is what they come up with.

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

I think you are worrying, unnecessarily

How often does a player form a club on the verge or in finals that leaves for more money?

Generally only players that have won a flag or more that do

Williams, Caldwell, Hatley, Corr and Cameron this year from one side.
Williams simply for money, Caldwell probably different reasons but also getting paid big overs, and Corr I imagine also for financial reasons.
how many players stay for massive unders at a young age? Look at GWS, Collingwood or even west Coast, they are/were keeping them but still have to pay up.
I look at teams like Richmond, Geelong, Collingwood, West Coast even Port and wonder who would you would be willing to target and pay ~50% more then what they would be getting? I could easily see a situation where someone comes out and offers McKay that with a $900k offer on the back of a few big games.
King at St Kilda is probably someone who will get similar who is playing finals, apparently his brother is already on $600k next year.