Can Sydney keep Warner and avoid more trade bans?

[Ralphyboy]

Didn't realise Wicks was Cat B. What's his story?

Joined the swans academy at 12. Played as a midfielder. Played his first NEAFL game on loan to the Brisbane Lions at 16!. Was a regular Swans NEAFL top up. Was overlooked in draft year and was not selected for Allies. Continued as a swans top up and performed strongly in the NEAFL including a 40 touch game against GWS. As a result was selected for Allies on short notice however the swans declined to allow him to play. Was selected as Cat B rookie as a 19 year old. Was the first swans player to establish the small defensive role based on pressure and tackling. Previous players such as Dan Robinson had been tasked with this role but were not suited. Has now played 60 or so games for the swans in what is a pretty thankless role which includes setting up forward defensive structures, guarding space to prevent rebounds, holding the ball in the forward 50 and providing an outlet if required. Has evolved into one of the fastest players in the league and is regularly the fastest on the ground. Also is a very high post clearance contested ball winner.

 

[Purple Suit]

Why would you not try and encourage local homegrown talent from continuing into their local AFL team? Especially in non-traditional AFL markets? It’s a typically myopic Victorian view that “interstate” teams be under the same market forces as Victorian.

Discounts are entirely reasonable. Nothing prevents other clubs bidding on these prospects (see Hawthorn rd 5 on Campbell). But NOONE bid on Gulden until (I think Geelong/collingwood) at rd 38.

If clubs value this talent. Bid on them. If not, don’t.

Because it’s a massive advantage that only benefits the Northern Teams. Swans are proof that you don’t need extra advantages, it has destabilised the whole competition once again.

 

[sexyhunk]

Why would you not try and encourage local homegrown talent from continuing into their local AFL team? Especially in non-traditional AFL markets? It’s a typically myopic Victorian view that “interstate” teams be under the same market forces as Victorian.

Discounts are entirely reasonable. Nothing prevents other clubs bidding on these prospects (see Hawthorn rd 5 on Campbell). But NOONE bid on Gulden until (I think Geelong/collingwood) at rd 38.

If clubs value this talent. Bid on them. If not, don’t.

because there is a national draft system in place. there is nothing stopping players from requesting a trade back to their local AFL team after initial 3 years. Or do a JHF and request a trade and clubs facilitates.

this is to keep the integrity of the national draft. is not that difficult.

 

[sthmelb_dimmies]

because there is a national draft system in place. there is nothing stopping players from requesting a trade back to their local AFL team after initial 3 years. Or do a JHF and request a trade and clubs facilitates.

this is to keep the integrity of the national draft. is not that difficult.

What’s stopping Geelonk bidding on swans academy draft prospects? Nothing.

 

[sthmelb_dimmies]

The amount of Victorian sooks in here is at an all time high

 

[Tiger_Of_Old]

MCG is always sold out for the GF so how many Victorian venues hold 150k?

Great reply

 

[CharlieMortdecai]

Sorry how many draft picks did the Swans use on Wicks? Where did the Swans match Gulden?

I hear this quite a lot of from Swans supporters, but Gulden if anything is further evidence of how unfair the system really is.
Let's assume Swans recruiters knew exactly how good he was going to be. In a fair system they would be in a quandry with their first pick. Do you take Campbell, McDonald or Gulden? Presumably Gulden, but it's unlikely you will get Campbell and McDonald as well.
At the moment you just sit with a swag bag of rubbish picks, and pinch yourself every time a bid does not come in.
And Wicks, I assumed he must have been a basketballer or something. But apparently not, by dint of having once been in the academy you can pick him up as a Category B rookie if he goes on to show a bit in the NEAFL.

 

[CharlieMortdecai]

Why would you not try and encourage local homegrown talent from continuing into their local AFL team? Especially in non-traditional AFL markets? It’s a typically myopic Victorian view that “interstate” teams be under the same market forces as Victorian.

Discounts are entirely reasonable. Nothing prevents other clubs bidding on these prospects (see Hawthorn rd 5 on Campbell). But NOONE bid on Gulden until (I think Geelong/collingwood) at rd 38.

If clubs value this talent. Bid on them. If not, don’t.

It's not the system we have or want. It could have gone that way - the U19s could have morphed into the CTL and every club could have invested in their own "academies", using a bunch of junk picks to make sure they got the talented ones regardless of where they sat on the prior year's ladder.
The northern clubs don't have to be under the same market forces as the rest of the league. But they should participate in the same economy.
And wow, really, nothing prevents other clubs from bidding on these prospects? Fantastic, but so what? I think what clubs would like to do with talent they value is select them and add them to their lists.
Do you think we should implement a system that encourages local homegrown talent in SA and WA to play for their local AFL team?

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

Great reply

Thank you.

I can’t begin to tell you the number of times everyone says on grand final day “wow, tens of thousands couldn’t get in today but gee, at least we managed to fit in a hundred thousand of them.”

And those media releases from the Victorian premier announcing plans to build that 150,000 seater we’ve all been screaming out for for so long! Wow! She’s staking her entire political legacy on it.

“With this new 150k football stadium that Labor is building for Melbourne, no Australian will ever be turned away from an AFL grand final ever again. And if they are, we’ll build a 200k stadium. There is no single issue more important to Australians than that everyone who wants to go to the AFL grand final can do so.”

 

[BloodySwan]

I hear this quite a lot of from Swans supporters, but Gulden if anything is further evidence of how unfair the system really is.
Let's assume Swans recruiters knew exactly how good he was going to be. In a fair system they would be in a quandry with their first pick. Do you take Campbell, McDonald or Gulden? Presumably Gulden, but it's unlikely you will get Campbell and McDonald as well.
At the moment you just sit with a swag bag of rubbish picks, and pinch yourself every time a bid does not come in.
And Wicks, I assumed he must have been a basketballer or something. But apparently not, by dint of having once been in the academy you can pick him up as a Category B rookie if he goes on to show a bit in the NEAFL.

Wat? I can't argue with the hypotheticals scenarios you make up in your head.

Let's assume Beatson is a dragon and the AFL are afraid of him because any time they try and cross him he flies into HQ and reigns terror on all the staff. Now in that scenario....

 

[CharlieMortdecai]

Wat? I can't argue with the hypotheticals scenarios you make up in your head.

Let's assume Beatson is a dragon and the AFL are afraid of him because any time they try and cross him he flies into HQ and reigns terror on all the staff. Now in that scenario....

You don't have the depth of imagination to picture a world in which the draft operates without academy or father-son concessions?

 

[BloodySwan]

You don't have the depth of imagination to picture a world in which the draft operates without academy or father-son concessions?

I'm older than 10 and remember when Rocca left the Swans.

 

[sthmelb_dimmies]

It's not the system we have or want. It could have gone that way - the U19s could have morphed into the CTL and every club could have invested in their own "academies", using a bunch of junk picks to make sure they got the talented ones regardless of where they sat on the prior year's ladder.
The northern clubs don't have to be under the same market forces as the rest of the league. But they should participate in the same economy.
And wow, really, nothing prevents other clubs from bidding on these prospects? Fantastic, but so what? I think what clubs would like to do with talent they value is select them and add them to their lists.
Do you think we should implement a system that encourages local homegrown talent in SA and WA to play for their local AFL team?

"The northern clubs don't have to be under the same market forces as the rest of the league. But they should participate in the same economy."

 

[CharlieMortdecai]

I'm older than 10 and remember when Rocca left the Swans.

What happened when Rocca left the Swans? Google tells me you got Mark Orchard, pick 14, pick 33 and some dude called Ben Wilson. Hardly seems like the worst deal

 

[BloodySwan]

What happened when Rocca left the Swans? Google tells me you got Mark Orchard, pick 14, pick 33 and some dude called Ben Wilson. Hardly seems like the worst deal

You being happy with Northern Clubs to be feeder clubs says it all.

Swans go into the draft and find someone good only for them to leave and Swans get to go back into the raffle.

Academies are only good so long as they don't produce any real talent but even if they develop a non top 10 pick player we get accused of playing funny buggers.

Swans follow the rules and a trade ban placed on them

And should the Swans win the Grand Final and resign Warner you can almost bet we'll be punished again "you've had your moment in the sun. Let's go back to another Vic dynasty"

 

[.Shotties.]

What happened when Rocca left the Swans? Google tells me you got Mark Orchard, pick 14, pick 33 and some dude called Ben Wilson. Hardly seems like the worst deal

Anthony Rocca, 220 games for Mark Orchard who played 40 games before requesting a trade back to Collingwood alongside Paul Licuria who went on to play 182 games for Collingwood.

These were all poor results, and the more frequently they happen, the worse for the trading club.

 

[CharlieMortdecai]

You being happy with Northern Clubs to be feeder clubs says it all.

Swans go into the draft and find someone good only for them to leave and Swans get to go back into the raffle.

Academies are only good so long as they don't produce any real talent but even if they develop a non top 10 pick player we get accused of playing funny buggers.

Swans follow the rules and a trade ban placed on them

And should the Swans win the Grand Final and resign Warner you can almost bet we'll be punished again "you've had your moment in the sun. Let's go back to another Vic dynasty"

Bloody hell, losing one player, in 1996, hardly makes the Swans a feeder club.

 

[sthmelb_dimmies]

Bloody hell, losing one player, in 1996, hardly makes the Swans a feeder club.

Rohan
Jordan Dawson
Nankervis
Tom Mitchell
Nick Newman
George Hewitt
Tim Membrey

All current go-home types on AFL lists ex-Swans. Current.

Could be argued Gary Rohan was more lured by a physio than Colac

Nb

Others on senior lists ex-Swans not due to go home reasons

Dylan Stephens
Aliir Aliir
Sam Naismith

 

[BloodySwan]

Bloody hell, losing one player, in 1996, hardly makes the Swans a feeder club.

Educate yourself some more before you get even more embarrassed

 

[CharlieMortdecai]

Rohan
Jordan Dawson
Nankervis
Tom Mitchell
Nick Newman
George Hewitt
Tim Membrey

All current go-home types on AFL lists ex-Swans. Current.

Could be argued Gary Rohan was more lured by a physio than Colac

Rohan - just lol. Besides which he was there for about 10 years
Dawson - yeah, he wanted to go back to SA, it happens
Nankervis - Ruck merry-go-round, couldn't get a game ahead of Tippett
Mitchell - Salary cap squeeze (Franklin and Tippett)
Newman - Out of contract, and not getting a game. Was also tied to Gold Coast when he was looking at options.
Hewett - LOL, he did not go back to SA! (Also a free agent who was with you for 8 years anyway)
Membrey - Are you ****ing kidding me? You delisted him!

1 out of 7.

 

[CharlieMortdecai]

Educate yourself some more before you get even more embarrassed

It's alright sthmelb_dimmies has educated me about all your losses, including players you delisted and South Australians who went "home" to Victoria.

 

[BloodySwan]

It's alright sthmelb_dimmies has educated me about all your losses, including players you delisted and South Australians who went "home" to Victoria.

 

[CharlieMortdecai]

So did the Swans actually lose anybody to the go-home factor between Paul Licuria

Paul Licuria

Age

46

Ht

179cm

Wt

81kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

21.1

5star

K

11.9

4star

HB

9.2

5star

M

4.9

5star

T

2.6

4star

No current season stats available

D

10.4

3star

K

6.6

3star

HB

3.8

3star

M

1.8

2star

T

1.2

3star

in 1998 and Jordan Dawson

12

Jordan Dawson

Age

27

Ht

191cm

Wt

91kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

17.0

4star

K

11.4

4star

HB

5.7

4star

M

4.8

5star

T

2.8

4star

CL

0.6

3star

D

15.7

4star

K

10.9

4star

HB

4.9

3star

M

2.9

3star

T

2.0

3star

CL

0.4

3star

D

11.8

3star

K

7.8

3star

HB

4.0

3star

M

5.0

5star

T

3.0

5star

CL

0.6

3star

in 2021?

 

[Cyclops]

Rohan
Jordan Dawson
Nankervis
Tom Mitchell
Nick Newman
George Hewitt
Tim Membrey

All current go-home types on AFL lists ex-Swans. Current.

Could be argued Gary Rohan was more lured by a physio than Colac

We've all lost players.

The bottom line is that the AFL have a vested interest in creating interest in NSW. To this end they have tried some hamfisted attempts to create success for Sydney and GWS.

They haven't rolled back biased elements that favour Vic clubs though, so I don't see why Sydney shouldn't exploit the crap out of it.

Sydney are being helped into finals this year. They still have to win it at another clubs home ground.

 

[.Shotties.]

Membrey - Are you ****ing kidding me? You delisted him!

It wouldn't hurt you to have just the smallest idea of the situation you're discussing.