Universal Love Charlie ‘Chook’ Constable

[Vdubs]

Yeah in a perfect world I'd agree, but I think they think that we are indeed in trouble and given it's a rookie spot what's the harm?

Could not see any other logic driving a decision to rookie him

you think
-they think?
--we are in trouble?
The big issue was possibly lack of VFL which has made it difficult for all fringe-dwellers to maintain good form and fitness. CC is a borderline player but the club knows his s & w, and they think he deserves a rookie spot, and if no other team selects him, imho, that is a win for us

 

[CatToTheFuture]

you think
-they think?
--we are in trouble?
The big issue was possibly lack of VFL which has made it difficult for all fringe-dwellers to maintain good form and fitness. CC is a borderline player but the club knows his s & w, and they think he deserves a rookie spot, and if no other team selects him, imho, that is a win for us

It was a dumb thought bubble of mine. No need to get antsy

 

[Spearman]

I may have it confused with another players, but didn't he have some small circulatory or respiratory issue that made it more difficult for him? I thought it was mentioned in 2020 maybe.

 

[My Tilly]

You can certainly query how they went once they got down to the club. But it's not that difficult to understand why the club thought they might still be 'up to the level'.

Actually based on their previous season exploits, Steven an amazing 19 disposals from 7 matches and Jenkins not even able to remain in the best 22 in a bottom eight team, I think the club had a good idea as to what may lie ahead.

I guess the older players get, the greater their chances of recapturing their glory days. Geelong hierarchy's motto that is.

By contrast, Constable looks quite likely to finish his AFL career on 12 senior games.

Great foresight here.
How did you come to that conclusion?

 

[BORIS332]

Actually based on their previous season exploits, Steven an amazing 19 disposals from 7 matches and Jenkins not even able to remain in the best 22 in a bottom eight team, I think the club had a good idea as to what may lie ahead.

I guess the older players get, the greater their chances of recapturing their glory days. Geelong hierarchy's motto that is.



Great foresight here.
How did you come to that conclusion?

What point are you trying to make?

 

[My Tilly]

What point are you trying to make?

Constable was not given much of an opportunity to begin with and if he was as shit as what you all say, how come he managed over 19 touches a game. He was pretty consistent and well deserving of more senior matches based on his VFL form this year.

If he did improve on his ability to run out a game (possible given he's a tall kid and only 22 years of age), club may have found a player. But I guess we are much better off focusing on guys 30+ who can add a lot more to the team heading forward. Higgins is a good example.

 

[goyoucatters]

Great foresight here.
How did you come to that conclusion?

He's just been delisted by his current club. And has garnered no meaningful interest from any other team over two consecutive trade periods now.

On the basis of those circumstances, the possibility that his AFL career might pull up at his current games tally doesn't seem all that controversial to me.

 

[Vdubs]

It was a dumb thought bubble of mine. No need to get antsy

Sorry, not trying to be antsy. Just not so sure "we are in trouble"

 

[Partridge]

You can certainly query how they went once they got down to the club. But it's not that difficult to understand why the club thought they might still be 'up to the level'.

Steven was a four-time B&F winner at his previous club. And had polled double figures in the Brownlow in four of his past five seasons before joining the Cats.

And was a monumental and well known risk before he even arrived. Then proceeded to be shoved into the senior team with no form or justification to back it up (after getting involved in off-field trouble before the season started), and produced the single worst debut was a name recruit I have ever seen.

There is no way Steven can be defended with "well the club couldn't have known". Everyone knew how risky it was.

 

[BORIS332]

Constable was not given much of an opportunity to begin with and if he was as sh*t as what you all say, how come he managed over 19 touches a game. He was pretty consistent and well deserving of more senior matches based on his VFL form this year.

If he did improve on his ability to run out a game (possible given he's a tall kid and only 22 years of age), club may have found a player. But I guess we are much better off focusing on guys 30+ who can add a lot more to the team heading forward. Higgins is a good example.

19 touches a game playing pure mid, wow, what a superstar. Higgins averaged 20 playing permanent HFF and you’re bagging him.

Let’s just go with your game plan of only playing young kids, who cares if they’re slow, don’t chase or tackle, have zero impact.

 

[CatToTheFuture]

19 touches a game playing pure mid, wow, what a superstar. Higgins averaged 20 playing permanent HFF and you’re bagging him.

Let’s just go with your game plan of only playing young kids, who cares if they’re slow, don’t chase or tackle, have zero impact.

To be fair he only spends a couple of quarters as a pure mid. Outside that he's on the bench

 

[catswhiskers]

Yeah in a perfect world I'd agree, but I think they think that we are indeed in trouble and given it's a rookie spot what's the harm?

Could not see any other logic driving a decision to rookie him

I have had a chance to watch the Kayo VFL 2021 offerings.

If a rookie spot is available (and no slider presents ) then Brownless would have to be rookied before Constable. IMO.

Brownless had a very good year and won a lot of his own ball. His attacking bent appeals to me.

If you can, watch the Cats V Bombers VFL game at GMHBA in fine and then wet conditions- gives a good comparison of the possible future for both.

 

[goyoucatters]

And was a monumental and well known risk before he even arrived. Then proceeded to be shoved into the senior team with no form or justification to back it up (after getting involved in off-field trouble before the season started), and produced the single worst debut was a name recruit I have ever seen.

There is no way Steven can be defended with "well the club couldn't have known". Everyone knew how risky it was.

Absolutely was a risk. Which takes you back to that whole risk/reward scenario. Cost us pick 58 for a player who was one season past winning the B&F at an AFL club.

Yes, of course, it was a spot on the list. We could have drafted another player instead. We're getting to the point in recent years where this kind of pick is pretty much the last taken in any given year, though. While you can defend either position, it's seriously not that outlandish to choose a known (but risky) quantity over another youngster who's pretty much already been passed over by every other footy club.

For the record, players taken at picks 51-70 have a less than 1 in 3 chance of reaching 40 AFL games. On that basis, I don't think looking at someone like Steven was entirely illogical. Sure, it didn't work out. And, yes, you seriously suspected that before he even came down to the club. Doesn't change the fact that something close to his best would have been more than good enough to justify the cost. And, despite the injury-interrupted season, he'd actually played some more than reasonable footy at the back end of 2019 as well. It wasn't as if he was seasons past being 'at the level'.

We all see it differently, of course. But I don't think the club was out of their minds looking at giving up something smallish at the back end of a draft on the basis that a greater reward might result from the risk. When you're coming from as far back as we are in almost every draft in recent years, it's understandable (if not preferable) that the club looks to circumvent the lottery of later picks by offering them up for players who they believe can add value while the club is near the apex.

The club is not winning on this front in recent years, I admit. But I would be in the camp that is both disappointed by the output of the likes of Steven and Higgins while still being accepting of the approach that got them to the club in the first place. Marginal calls in both cases, I believe.

 

[My Tilly]

19 touches a game playing pure mid, wow, what a superstar. Higgins averaged 20 playing permanent HFF and you’re bagging him.

Let’s just go with your game plan of only playing young kids, who cares if they’re slow, don’t chase or tackle, have zero impact.

Given the age of our current best 22, I think we have no choice but to play guys who may never be superstars but offer us similar stats to what Higgins or Dahlhaus currently do. The worst that can come from that, their stocks rise from getting some AFL exposure. May not be much but hey, Josh Walker, Trent West and guys like that got us back a very late round pick because they had AFL exposure at an early age.
I don't think Constable would turn out to be anything more than solid depth but even his harshest skeptic's would have to agree he never got much of an opportunity to begin with.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

19 touches a game playing pure mid, wow, what a superstar. Higgins averaged 20 playing permanent HFF and you’re bagging him.

Let’s just go with your game plan of only playing young kids, who cares if they’re slow, don’t chase or tackle, have zero impact.

Yep. Not up to it.
17 other clubs have agreed with our clubs assessment 2 off-season's running.

 

[Vdubs]

Yep. Not up to it.
17 other clubs have agreed with our clubs assessment 2 off-season's running.

He's going to Essendon as a rookie.


according to our mock draft

 

[Pure_Ownage]

To be fair he only spends a couple of quarters as a pure mid. Outside that he's on the bench

Which is the problem. He has good attributes as a player but his tank is nowhere near afl standard and might never be.

 

[Strange Cat]

Which is the problem. He has good attributes as a player but his tank is nowhere near afl standard and might never be.

And his disposals aren’t damaging enough, he just doesn’t suit the next level and there’s no shame in that ….not everyone can make it.

 

[you pick one]

And his disposals aren’t damaging enough, he just doesn’t suit the next level and there’s no shame in that ….not everyone can make it.

We don't get great value from Cam Guthries disposals either he's the epitome of not damaging.

 

[Strange Cat]

We don't get great value from Cam Guthries disposals either he's the epitome of not damaging.

At least Cam doesn’t spend 80% of the game on the bench

 

[Art Vandelay_]

We don't get great value from Cam Guthries disposals either he's the epitome of not damaging.

Cut the cord ypo, you lost this battle.
He proved you wrong.

I doubt Constable will prove the masses wrong.

 

[Biggy_Boy]

At least Cam doesn’t spend 80% of the game on the bench

In 2019, when Constable was given some games, not used as the sub all the time and was able to practise in the VFL, he averaged about 68% TOG. That's only about 2-5% off what Guthrie has averaged in the last few years, since he's become more of a permanent midfielder. So, not sure if that's the best comparison point really. Presumably if Constable had been able to improve his tank so he could stay out there and effective for a few more minutes a game, akin to where Guthrie is, he'd have a place in the starting side. And while his inability to do that may be the reason for his delisting, I think it's fair to say that 2020 and 2021 have not been great years for young player development. Severely interrupted seconds competitions, limited and reduced access to club staff as well as likely less capacity for the club to address its young players as the primary focus has been keeping the senior team going in the midst of constantly changing rules for the primary competition. These have not been ideal conditions for players to develop. I would figure it hard to develop match conditioning when you have few opportunities to play matches.

 

[you pick one]

Cut the cord ypo, you lost this battle.
He proved you wrong.

I doubt Constable will prove the masses wrong.

Interest the boys from Krock have swung behind me have a listen to their last pod cast.

 

[you pick one]

At least Cam doesn’t spend 80% of the game on the bench

Pity if you ask me,unless he turns his current game around and that's a chance with the new coaching group, hope he does,

 

[Art Vandelay_]

In 2019, when Constable was given some games, not used as the sub all the time and was able to practise in the VFL, he averaged about 68% TOG. That's only about 2-5% off what Guthrie has averaged in the last few years, since he's become more of a permanent midfielder. So, not sure if that's the best comparison point really. Presumably if Constable had been able to improve his tank so he could stay out there and effective for a few more minutes a game, akin to where Guthrie is, he'd have a place in the starting side. And while his inability to do that may be the reason for his delisting, I think it's fair to say that 2020 and 2021 have not been great years for young player development. Severely interrupted seconds competitions, limited and reduced access to club staff as well as likely less capacity for the club to address its young players as the primary focus has been keeping the senior team going in the midst of constantly changing rules for the primary competition. These have not been ideal conditions for players to develop. I would figure it hard to develop match conditioning when you have few opportunities to play matches.

Guthrie is an AA and best and fairest winner. Constable is a slow VFL plodder