List Mgmt. COLLINGWOOD Trade and F/A Discussion

[SchuPie]

If Busslinger is/becomes the best tall in the draft and slides to our first, would you take him knowing he's a KPD and then hope to grab a KPF later...or simply grab the best KPF available at our first pick?

Man, we need a series of high (high high) draft picks

 

[VinnieB]

Number 18 from the Australian u/18 team is a must!

 

[barrackers]

If Busslinger is/becomes the best tall in the draft and slides to our first, would you take him knowing he's a KPD and then hope to grab a KPF later...or simply grab the best KPF available at our first pick?

Man, we need a series of high (high high) draft picks

Best available tall regardless of which end for mine. We don’t have enough tall depth in defence to overlook a better prospect in favour of a key forward if it eventuates that way.

 

[stormskye]

If Busslinger is/becomes the best tall in the draft and slides to our first, would you take him knowing he's a KPD and then hope to grab a KPF later...or simply grab the best KPF available at our first pick?

Man, we need a series of high (high high) draft picks

The difference in talent between top 5, then top 10 etc is evidenced by daicos and Horne this year. Before daicos we had a bunch of very late firsts and second round picks, which are never guarantees to come on. If they do they might be decent but not stars. We have a long tenure down the bottom to come given our lack of top picks that have been thrown away. I still think given our list profile losing Degoey for compo might be best long term.

 

[TradeDraft]

If Busslinger is/becomes the best tall in the draft and slides to our first, would you take him knowing he's a KPD and then hope to grab a KPF later...or simply grab the best KPF available at our first pick?

Man, we need a series of high (high high) draft picks

We might have 2 Top 10 Picks

 

[TradeDraft]

The difference in talent between top 5, then top 10 etc is evidenced by daicos and Horne this year. Before daicos we had a bunch of very late firsts and second round picks, which are never guarantees to come on. If they do they might be decent but not stars. We have a long tenure down the bottom to come given our lack of top picks that have been thrown away. I still think given our list profile losing Degoey for compo might be best long term.

So won't be any good for another 3-4 Seasons?

 

[stormskye]

So won't be any good for another 3-4 Seasons?

We need 3-4 drafts to rebuild this list mate. And by that time all our best players will be gone and need replacing. We are a long way off, that’s what happens with horrible list management.

 

[SchuPie]

We need 3-4 drafts to rebuild this list mate. And by that time all our best players will be gone and need replacing. We are a long way off, that’s what happens with horrible list management.

Just IMO, but this is what makes some of our selections this year a little baffling
McRae virtually has a free pass in terms of results yet often team selection doesn't always reflect a development-based approach but rather a results driven approach
We should always play to win but always select a team that is best in achieving the ultimate goal in the future.
I totally understand the thought of why teams + supporters should always theoretically want teams selected with the best chance to win but in this draft-based era, one that doesn't necessarily match our chance of winning the flag this year (or coming years)

 

[JuniorB]

Just IMO, but this is what makes some of our selections this year a little baffling
McRae virtually has a free pass in terms of results yet often team selection doesn't always reflect a development-based approach but rather a results driven approach
We should always play to win but always select a team that is best in achieving the ultimate goal in the future.
I totally understand the thought of why teams + supporters should always theoretically want teams selected with the best chance to win but in this draft-based era, one that doesn't necessarily match our chance of winning the flag this year (or coming years)

I think the hard part is balancing the 2 ( development vs winning).
The fact that we've f**ked up our list management and drafting for a number of years hasn't helped.
Our salary cap management has meant we have missed out on potential quality free agents and given away a player who wanted to stay and was BOG against us last week.
If we win too much (wink, wink) we end up with lesser draft picks, but we still want to foster a winning culture.
It's not easy and we're still feeling the pain of years of mismanagement.

 

[Chrispiesssss]

Ryan Clarke

4

Ryan Clarke

Age

27

Ht

186cm

Wt

83kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

18.8

5star

K

9.1

4star

HB

9.7

5star

M

3.4

3star

T

2.2

4star

G

0.2

2star

D

18.5

4star

K

8.8

4star

HB

9.8

5star

M

1.8

2star

T

2.5

3star

G

0.3

3star

D

19.6

5star

K

7.0

3star

HB

12.6

5star

M

2.4

3star

T

2.2

4star

G

0.0

1star

from the swans?

 

[well left]

Ryan Clarke

4

Ryan Clarke

Age

27

Ht

186cm

Wt

83kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

18.8

5star

K

9.1

4star

HB

9.7

5star

M

3.4

3star

T

2.2

4star

G

0.2

2star

D

18.5

4star

K

8.8

4star

HB

9.8

5star

M

1.8

2star

T

2.5

3star

G

0.3

3star

D

19.6

5star

K

7.0

3star

HB

12.6

5star

M

2.4

3star

T

2.2

4star

G

0.0

1star

from the swans?

I see Amartey kicked 4 today


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

After two years, a club should have a pretty decent idea. If they decide to cash someone in whilst they still have value - good on them. I don't think us supporters are in much of a position to judge though.

Not sure of your point… we are all just supporters making judgments.

 

[DopeMaster]

The difference in talent between top 5, then top 10 etc is evidenced by daicos and Horne this year. Before daicos we had a bunch of very late firsts and second round picks, which are never guarantees to come on. If they do they might be decent but not stars. We have a long tenure down the bottom to come given our lack of top picks that have been thrown away. I still think given our list profile losing Degoey for compo might be best long term.

Yeah I think if we finish low enough and the pick is high enough there’s a strong argument to be made.

With a bit of luck we can use the salary saved from DeGoey to target a free agent next year that fills the hole left. Even if the FA is a slight downgrade, I’d probably take that for an extra top 5-10 pick. All depends on where we finish this year, as it’s a less enticing proposition for pick 12 for example.

 

[whiskeytown]

I see Amartey kicked 4 today


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

20 disposals, 11 marks, 4.2

Won’t get a proper go at the swans in the same way Lipinski and Krueger weren’t at their clubs

Contracted until 2023 but being a Vic boy he might be open to a trade home

 

[JLC]

Trading Henry and macrae won’t fix things or fast track the improvements needed . Which is the only point I was making, responding to a suggestion to do that so we can draft talls early in the rounds.

In fact you’re backing up my point by suggesting talls can be found later in the draft

I would definitely keep Henry and Macrae.

Logue needs to be our no 1 target, very impressive player who is going to be available, we are apparently going for Hill again but Logue is much more what we need. We should have the cap space to sign him and re-sign Jamie and JDG if WHE and Sidebottom aren't contracted next year.

Trade currency will be our issue, I don't think we'll be trading our first (even for the very impressive Logue) and not getting much for WHE so not sure how we can make a trade happen, find a way to turn the 3rd rounders and WHE into a first? Maybe do something with a future 2nd? over to you GW!

Our list is pretty average. Surely there cannot still be cap issues - we barely have a spine. If there are then trade the causes.

 

[JLC]

Surely we can nab a tall from the Suns? They seem to have a surplus.

Oh and now is the time to get Matt Rowell

18

Matt Rowell

Age

23

Ht

180cm

Wt

82kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

17.4

4star

K

7.6

3star

HB

9.8

5star

M

0.8

1star

T

5.2

5star

CL

3.8

5star

D

17.4

4star

K

7.6

3star

HB

9.8

5star

M

0.8

1star

T

5.2

5star

CL

3.8

5star

D

17.4

5star

K

7.6

3star

HB

9.8

5star

M

0.8

1star

T

5.2

5star

CL

3.8

5star

. Would compliment our midfield perfectly.



Sent from my VOG-L09 using Tapatalk

 

[cityslick1]

Surely we can nab a tall from the Suns? They seem to have a surplus.

Oh and now is the time to get Matt Rowell. Would compliment our midfield perfectly.



Sent from my VOG-L09 using Tapatalk

Either Rowell is disinterested at the suns, or still recovering from his injuries. Looked like a brownlow chance year 1, now putting in some 15 disposal games…

Hope he doesn’t end up like Luke ball in losing his key strengths

 

[loki04]

Just IMO, but this is what makes some of our selections this year a little baffling
McRae virtually has a free pass in terms of results yet often team selection doesn't always reflect a development-based approach but rather a results driven approach
We should always play to win but always select a team that is best in achieving the ultimate goal in the future.
I totally understand the thought of why teams + supporters should always theoretically want teams selected with the best chance to win but in this draft-based era, one that doesn't necessarily match our chance of winning the flag this year (or coming years)

Its quite silly actually because those years will run out and he won’t have the talent to turn it around, we will end up in the wilderness rebuilding the rebuild in 3 years. Because apparently winning 8 games is creating a winning culture over 5…

 

[SchuPie]

Its quite silly actually because those years will run out and he won’t have the talent to turn it around, we will end up in the wilderness rebuilding the rebuild in 3 years. Because apparently winning 8 games is creating a winning culture over 5…

I understand team balance, you can't play all kids, but at the moment I don't understand our agenda or the rationale.
For example: I think WHE, at the moment, makes us a miles better team than Poulter...but WHE isn't winning us a premiership, and we need to i) find out if Poulter is capable of being there on the journey with us and ii) if so, develop him as quickly as possible.
If I was WHE this would make me furious so our solution is to rotate him through the side or allow him to leave at the end of the year. That is the problem with being a senior player, playing for a club that is re-building.

Which is kind of the problem with the draft system - I don't want to be a supporter that hopes we finish at the bottom of the table but the system encourages it.

 

[loki04]

I understand team balance, you can't play all kids, but at the moment I don't understand our agenda or the rationale.
For example: I think WHE, at the moment, makes us a miles better team than Poulter...but WHE isn't winning us a premiership, and we need to i) find out if Poulter is capable of being there on the journey with us and ii) if so, develop him as quickly as possible.
If I was WHE this would make me furious so our solution is to rotate him through the side or allow him to leave at the end of the year. That is the problem with being a senior player, playing for a club that is re-building.

Which is kind of the problem with the draft system - I don't want to be a supporter that hopes we finish at the bottom of the table but the system encourages it.

Yeah I’m not saying play an u21 team, but we should have a youth preference policy and a talent over role player type ie Macrea vs c.brown.

basically what you describe with whe and Poulter. There are a few more calls that could be made too.

 

[No SPIN]

Its quite silly actually because those years will run out and he won’t have the talent to turn it around, we will end up in the wilderness rebuilding the rebuild in 3 years. Because apparently winning 8 games is creating a winning culture over 5…

That would wholly depend on who the extra 3 wins was against.
If it was against top teams, then that provides huge confidence to the group, and demonstrates a stronger and more competitive base to build from.
But getting smashed by those same teams does the complete opposite.

So it’s not as simple as you suggest.

 

[CPH12]

Ryan Clarke from the swans?

Not sure what the knock on him is. Seems to have high numbers every week. Sydney and Gold Coast are two clubs to monitor for midfield options. Have plenty of depth and talent in the seconds

 

[Seedsfan]

All these calls to bottom out are mind blowing. What on earth for, let’s aim to develop the kids we have and astutely add to them. Draft picks mean two fifths of **** all at the end of the day. Look at the Suns, they have had more top ten draft picks than I have had hot dinners

 

[sr36]

Just IMO, but this is what makes some of our selections this year a little baffling
McRae virtually has a free pass in terms of results yet often team selection doesn't always reflect a development-based approach but rather a results driven approach
We should always play to win but always select a team that is best in achieving the ultimate goal in the future.
I totally understand the thought of why teams + supporters should always theoretically want teams selected with the best chance to win but in this draft-based era, one that doesn't necessarily match our chance of winning the flag this year (or coming years)

There's a belief on this board that playing kids, whether they're ready or not, is the best way of developing them.

Personally, I think that good teams get more bang for their buck with draft picks and develop their kids better, because they don't try to fast track them until they show they're ready.

 

[sr36]

Not sure of your point… we are all just supporters making judgments.

I was disagreeing with your argument.