List Mgmt. COLLINGWOOD Trade and F/A Discussion

[No SPIN]

I’m not sure Robbie D’Orazio would give this post a

It’s the easiest solution to retain Grundy, but it’s also the most likely to lead to another Treloar media shitstorm scenario because that info stays behind closed doors for as long as it takes Robbie to get his closest journo contact on the blower.

lets not dismiss the possibility that Grundy's contract is heavily performance based, given its an obvious fail safe inclusion, for any expensive long term contract.

 

[Scritchyscroony]

Leppa on McStay because he's not McStupid

Leppa is saying McStay is one of the few players in the league who is "up there with Bontompelli for goal assists and score involvements".
My immediate thought was... How do you achieve that averaging 8 possessions a game?
So I checked the stats: in 2022 Bontompelli is in the top 10 for both stats, McStay is not even in the top 100.
Maybe Leppa sees some special invisible score involvements ?

 

[Chrispiesssss]

Leppa is saying McStay is one of the few players in the league who is "up there with Bontompelli for goal assists and score involvements".
My immediate thought was... How do you achieve that averaging 8 possessions a game?
So I checked the stats: in 2022 Bontompelli is in the top 10 for both stats, McStay is not even in the top 100.
Maybe Leppa sees some special invisible score involvements ?

His comments change the CHB talk

 

[KinderSmock]

Fixed that for you.

Madness really.

Well we'll agree to disagree. When JDG and Grundy return, I don't expect our problems to magically remediate or vanish.

 

[Prexm]

Leppa is saying McStay is one of the few players in the league who is "up there with Bontompelli for goal assists and score involvements".
My immediate thought was... How do you achieve that averaging 8 possessions a game?
So I checked the stats: in 2022 Bontompelli is in the top 10 for both stats, McStay is not even in the top 100.
Maybe Leppa sees some special invisible score involvements ?

The video skipped to him then talking about JDG as up there with Bont

 

[Scritchyscroony]

The video skipped to him then talking about JDG as up there with Bont

Thank-you.
That makes sense.

Relief!!

 

[Jen2310]

yeah clearly the first half of the video talking about mcstay. the 2nd half de goey

 

[Chrispiesssss]

AFL trade news: Rivals reportedly keeping tabs on Suns pair

Could either be pried out of Queensland?

www.zerohanger.com

Fiorini & Flanders.

 

[manicpie]

AFL trade news: Rivals reportedly keeping tabs on Suns pair

Could either be pried out of Queensland?

www.zerohanger.com

Fiorini & Flanders.

Flanders? Who's that, but I'll take him if he's any good

 

[Apex36]

Flanders? Who's that, but I'll take him if he's any good

No idea about his footballing abilities, but he sure is sexy

 

[Mick F]

Flanders? Who's that, but I'll take him if he's any good

Hails from Gippsland, where many a champion has started an illustrious sporting career.

 

[SchuPie]

The Giants are reportedly under significant cap pressure, to the point that they're offering Taranto major unders despite being a required player that they value.

Exactly
This happens all the time and will always happen with clubs always having to negotiate their caps - whatever the reason
Each year there’s bargains to be had no matter the calibre of player

 

[Scodog10]

lets not dismiss the possibility that Grundy's contract is heavily performance based, given its an obvious fail safe inclusion, for any expensive long term contract.

I’m dismissing it. You and others can cling to that if you like, but if I’m a dual AA signing a 7 year deal with massive offers from rival clubs I’m not making any of it performance based let alone it being heavily weighted that way. I would go so far as to say there isn’t a performance clause in any long term expensive contract. None of Oliver, Petracca or Moore would have them. The only reason JDG’s offer did was the NY episode.

 

[Dynamics]

If I’m a journalist and that’s what he runs with this morning my editor is going with the headline “Collingwood refuse to speculate on the future of Grundy and JDG” I’m then throwing in sentences like “industry sources suggest Collingwood has shopped both players” “with McStay and Taranto on the clubs agenda and no salary cap squeeze we understand Collingwood need to clear cap space” and “whilst Anderson refused to be drawn into it sources within the Collingwood FD are more flexible on their futures”.

That’s fish in a barrel stuff and whilst you and I will see straight through it the average punter not on Big Footy doesn’t so it just creates talkback calls and becomes a bigger story. I definitely don’t have the solution on the best way to handle it if we’re exploring all opportunities, but I know this isn’t it.

I hear what you're saying, but it works for other organisations, I haven't just made this up as an idea out of nowhere. Liverpool FC for example, and they're dealing with a multi national front of media organisations sniffing out transfer news on a minute to minute basis, which dwarfs anything the AFL media can throw at us. The one time Jurgen Klopp succumbed to a couple of comments in a press conference last year, it blew up and impacted contract negotiations. He was pulled straight back into line and so were the negotiations.

We have the ability to create a new normal and the only pressure the AFL media can put on our club is that which we perceive. Let them speculate while we deal in facts in a civilised and principled manner. Talkback will talkback. Muckrakers will rake muck.

I think it all actually aligns with the new small-c Collingwood that was talked about post-Eddie. Speak softly and carry a big stick.

Just my two cents anyway. I've never run a footy club, thank god!

 

[TradeDraft]

Isn’t the obvious solution to have Grundy extend his contract for a year or two in exchange for lowering his package by $200-250k per annum?
McGuire suggested as much on Footy Calcified.

Is that even Possible?

Eddie was in Charge when he got the Big Contract

 

[Scodog10]

Problem is your ‘let’s say’ hypothetical runs right up against the reality of the cap squeeze. why would we pay Grundy As much as we can while we’re so tight that players are getting forced out? Doesn’t make any sense at all IMO.

It was the timing of the contract being signed. Grundy signed in January 2020 and in the post Covid environment the salary cap dropped 9%. If we don’t lose that extra amount we probably would have kept kicking the can down the road a little longer. As a counterpoint if we hadn’t front loaded his deal how would trading him being up for discussion? Or do you see a club paying him $800k or more?

 

[TW Sherrin]

I have some confidence it was around that over the course of the deal when first signed over 7 years, but I don’t think the current FD would be negligent enough to trade him with the type of shortfall that would create if that remained the case. My basic assumption is that we front loaded some of the contract on the basis that we didn’t want to be paying a 34 yo ruckman $900k +. We’ll have to wait until next year, but I think Grundy has been on circa $1.2m in 2022 (given our list profile and the guys that came off contract this year it could be as high as $1.4m). Hence the immediacy of needing to shed salaries in 2020 because we knew 2021-2022 were going to bite hard…

Let’s say we’ve paid $2.2m over the first two years of a $6.65m deal. That leaves $4.45m outstanding or $890k pa which is manageable depending on the destination and trade.

I hate these front loaded deals. If his deal is front loaded and he is then moved its a terrible deal.

 

[FAIRANDBALANCED]

That board was painful.

Looking at Frampton's SANFL stats aren't that inspiring. Adelaide - SANFL. However, Frampton has been moved around a bit and recruiters know what they are looking at. Guess in the final few rounds they'll look to add value to his name. Delist vs. a third.

Not a HS subscriber but they have an article here where he is mentioned: https://www.heraldsun.com.au/subscribe/news/1/?sourceCode=HSWEB_WRE170_a_GGL&dest=https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/afl-trade-news-stay-up-to-date-with-the-latest-contract-free-agent-and-player-movement-buzz/news-story/80576bd0972a4e3b4ecd89171be26833&memtype=anonymous&mode=premium&v21=dynamic-warm-control-score&V21spcbehaviour=append

Imagine a trade period of:

IN: Frampton, McStay, Taranto, Bruhn
OUT: JDG, Grundy.

How is that a good trade period? The idea is to get better, not just be different.

 

[Scodog10]

I hate these front loaded deals are crap for this reason. If his deal is front loaded and he is then moved its a terrible deal.

I both agree and disagree. For instance if we don’t front load he’s getting a lot of money in his 30’s which is bad business, IMO. The flip side obviously being we could lose him after we’ve been paying the overs part of the contract. I think it’s when guys leave to cash in that I get most annoyed at it and that’s not the case here. If I was to say I hated anything about AFL contracts it’s any that are over 5 years. Even 4 is long with FA set at 8 years. What we’re now seeing is most players go 2 years, 2 years, 2 years and 2 years up to FA then try to get their career contract of 5 or more…

 

[Jen2310]

Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[Carlthetruth]

If McStay is coming the club isn't stupid enough to lose Jordie for nothing. The Cats thought they could get Jezza for free then GWS matched and that juicy draft hand of 3 first round picks went ****! If Jordie wants to go we match and get something, end of story.

 

[Bianconeri]

Agreed but it is Adelaide fans.

Further discussion on their board:
Apparently it's done. I imagine burger rings back our way... but I like burger rings

really?..
s**t.. imagine Big Billy goes to the Pies and end up playing in a premiership in the next couple of years..
be *n hilarious.

It's done apparently.

I don't understand the Frampton bagging.
He has been the best player in the sanfl side consistently for the last 8-10 weeks
Just because we played him out of position in the afl, if he played Doedee's position, he would have thrived.
He would be a good fit for the Bulldogs, I hope he gets another chance

What? He did get a chance at the interceptor.... he played 1 good game which was against the bulldogs if I remember correctly, everyone was singing his praises and thought he was a lock for all australian at that point ... then the following week was dreadfully exposed by GWS (I think). The bullies let him run free, gws put a forward on him and he was exposed about 20 times during the game.
He is not afl standard. Failed as a forward who could get on a lead but the ball always slipped through his fingers, or mostly missed a goal. Failed in defence because he cannot defend 1 on 1. If rumors are true, Collingwood can have him for free imho, he is not worth anything.
Too bad for afc we put our defender eggs on a failed draft pick. It's unfortunate because afc has a really long history of somehow getting excellent defenders.. ie Hart, rutten, talia... this might be the first period in time where we haven't got a very good reliable big defender...

So he’s an intercept defender? We’ve got plenty of those on our list we need someone that can actually defend one on one.

 

[sr36]

If McStay is coming the club isn't stupid enough to lose Jordie for nothing. The Cats thought they could get Jezza for free then GWS matched and that juicy draft hand of 3 first round picks went ****! If Jordie wants to go we match and get something, end of story.

We've only seen trades occur a few times on free agents. The key thing with Cameron and Dangerfield is that they didn't walk for money. They went for lifestyle to a club who wasn't paying the usual FA overs. the other ones ahve been small fish that went for small trades to protect FA compo.

If you match, you've got to be willing to keep the player at the contracted rate. And that contracted rate is likely to be more than the other club is willing to pay him if picking him up as a trade.

 

[manicpie]

We've only seen trades occur a few times on free agents. The key thing with Cameron and Dangerfield is that they didn't walk for money. They went for lifestyle to a club who wasn't paying the usual FA overs. the other ones ahve been small fish that went for small trades to protect FA compo.

If you match, you've got to be willing to keep the player at the contracted rate. And that contracted rate is likely to be more than the other club is willing to pay him if picking him up as a trade.

It would seem unlikely if JDG accepted an offer from a rival club and we matched it, that the rival club would reneg their offer

 

[Prexm]

Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

I doubt any fan would be happy if it ends up what the article is suggesting , McStay for DeGoey. Says cheaper don’t think he will be significantly cheaper either.