List Mgmt. Contract, Trade & Draftee Discussion - 2022 Off Season Edition

[Keys]

Contract status of all players now fully updated

The Contracts Thread

2024 List Changes : Out: Retired- Gaff Delisted - Jones, Trew(R), Baker(R), Witherden, Burgiel, Culley(R), Rotham, L Edwards Traded - Darling (NM) Barrass (Hawthorn) In: Trade/FA acquisitions - Graham (Richmond) Baker (Richmond) Owies (Carlton) Draft - Allan (Pick 16) Shanahan (Pick 30) Gross...

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[Yeo_Check_Out_ma_Flow]

Wonder what is means for Rory Lobb as well.

It means Peter Bell might finally be able to add a feather to his cap after retaining Lobb for the length of his contract.

It's a much uglier feather than he would have received for retaining Neale though...More like the filthy, bin juice soaked feather of an Ibis as opposed to a Peacock.

 

[GWeagles]

Wonder what is means for Rory Lobb as well.

I assume they will still trade him and take what value they can get. They should then be well placed to bargain on Jackson.

 

[Yeo_Check_Out_ma_Flow]

Lyons to Brisbane.

Brodie to Fremantle.

Hodge to Brisbane.

Yeah, honestly that is not a difficult question to answer.

 

[Tugga27]

I assume they will still trade him and take what value they can get. They should then be well placed to bargain on Jackson.

I assume it will get done as well but Freo have said it might not if Logue goes.

 

[briztoon]

Yeah, honestly that is not a difficult question to answer.

Levi Casboult to Suns.

 

[Biggie]

Gunston

Bock

Will Minson

Will Minson

Age

39

Ht

199cm

Wt

106kg

Pos.

Ruck

Career

Season

Last 5

D

11.2

3star

K

6.0

2star

HB

5.2

4star

CL

3.5

5star

HO

21.3

5star

No current season stats available

D

3.4

1star

K

2.0

1star

HB

1.4

2star

HO

7.4

5star

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

Lyons to Brisbane.

Brodie to Fremantle.

Hodge to Brisbane.

The clubs that moved those players on have gone great guns since?

 

[pantskyle]

Unless North picks up some compo picks from the AFL (end of/mid first round or second round) or next year's second round I don't think they have the capital to get a deal done.

I would say they wouldn't be foolish to throw this year's first or next year's first on the table, but they also grossly overpaid for CCJ so who knows.

Uncontracted isn't he? Straight to the psd.

 

[briztoon]

The clubs that moved those players on have gone great guns since?

That was never the point of the original post (I believe).

It was about moving on contractd players, to benefit the team. Opening up list spots and salary cap space. And if possible, to extend the lifespan of the player in the game.

 

[Yeo_Check_Out_ma_Flow]

Levi Casboult to Suns.

Darcy Cameron to Collingwood?

 

[briztoon]

Darcy Cameron to Collingwood?

Nah, believe that was part of the ruck merry go round last year. He was in demand, we wanted him as our first priority, but he wanted to stay in Melbourne.

 

[Yeo_Check_Out_ma_Flow]

Nah, believe that was part of the ruck merry go round last year. He was in demand, we wanted him as our first priority, but he wanted to stay in Melbourne.

Did he not get from Sydney to Collingwood in 2019 with a late pick upgrade to the Swans? Limited opportunity at Sydney, now flourishing at the Pies. Both teams playing in a prelim this weekend. Believe you're thinking of Fort?

 

[Keys]

Fremantle’s trade collateral for Jackson :
• Pick 13
• Geelongs round 4 pick : 70-72
• Their 2023 picks noting that if they trade their future 1st they can’t trade their 2nd or 3rd picks
• Logue - pick 19 if North get a PP?
• Acres - pick 28 maybe but that seems high?
• Tucker - ???

Does 13,19 and their future 1st get it done?

Leaves them with whatever they get for Tucker and Acres plus their future 2nd & 3rd

Trading Lobb makes more sense than keeping him

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

That was never the point of the original post (I believe).

It was about moving on contractd players, to benefit the team. Opening up list spots and salary cap space. And if possible, to extend the lifespan of the player in the game.

Well the original post was mine…

And the point was that moving on players is not a precursor to success.

Look at the sides that have won flags over the past 15 or so years. How many of them have got there by pushing players out the door?

The only example I can think of is Hawthorn shopping Croad (and then throwing in McPharlin) for valuable draft picks in 2001 and then winning the flag in 2008.

Has anyone seen any success in the 20 years since then?

 

[Bender_]

So just a theory here, with people that like to compare the points value of picks - is there any round where picks are no longer worth points? Like if we said to Brisbane we give them out round 5,6,7,8,9 and 10 for Divon Ribbitson and then they use those points to get Ashcroft?

 

[The Falcon Strike]

Pity it is unlikely we leverage our Pick 2 PSD

North to take Logue in the PSD and we could then take Jackson.....

#pipedream

Albeit - i don't think we would want to pay what his manager would be asking

 

[briztoon]

Did he not get from Sydney to Collingwood in 2019 with a late pick upgrade to the Swans? Limited opportunity at Sydney, now flourishing at the Pies. Both teams playing in a prelim this weekend. Believe you're thinking of Fort?

Did he?

I thought he was part of last year’s 4 way ruck shuffle. Possibly have the wrong player in mind.

Pretty sure the conversation started about how a club can push out contracted player, respectfully, to both the benefit of the club and player.

Example.

We told Witherden that he was no longer part of the clubs plans moving forward, and was unlikely be considered best 22 for the remainder of his contract (two years).

So Witherden’s manager looked for a trade.

I don’t know if West Coast will extend Witherden or not, but if you do, that would be an example.

 

[Get_The_Gaff]

Straight out of the Peter Bell, feather in my cap, playbook. It’s part bluff, part hard ball tactics.

I’m dead set positive that Bell wants to develop an image that’s worse than Dodoro’s.

It shouldn't be a bluff . If freo want to win a premiership they should keep lobb.

**** him if he wants a trade . He is contracted and been paid very well even when he was average .

 

[Smeg Head]

So just a theory here, with people that like to compare the points value of picks - is there any round where picks are no longer worth points? Like if we said to Brisbane we give them out round 5,6,7,8,9 and 10 for Divon Ribbitson and then they use those points to get Ashcroft?

Round 5 on is worth nothing apparently.

 

[Keys]

So just a theory here, with people that like to compare the points value of picks - is there any round where picks are no longer worth points? Like if we said to Brisbane we give them out round 5,6,7,8,9 and 10 for Divon Ribbitson and then they use those points to get Ashcroft?

Points run to zero after pick 73 and you can only use as many picks as you have list spots available

 

[Yeo_Check_Out_ma_Flow]

Did he?

I thought he was part of last year’s 4 way ruck shuffle. Possibly have the wrong player in mind.

Pretty sure the conversation started about how a club can push out contracted player, respectfully, to both the benefit of the club and player.

Example.

We told Witherden that he was no longer part of the clubs plans moving forward, and was unlikely be considered best 22 for the remainder of his contract (two years).

So Witherden’s manager looked for a trade.

I don’t know if West Coast will extend Witherden or not, but if you do, that would be an example.

Yeah Darcy Cameron definitely moved from Sydney to Collingwood at the end of 2019.

I see your point but I wouldn't say Witho has benefited much from coming to us. He's been languishing in the WAFL for the later part of the season and has basically shot his trade value now with some pretty lacklustre performances. The only benefit to him was that he was able to extend his career another couple of years. Whether it gets any further than that remains to be seen.

 

[briztoon]

Well the original post was mine…

And the point was that moving on players is not a precursor to success.

Look at the sides that have won flags over the past 15 or so years. How many of them have got there by pushing players out the door?

The only example I can think of is Hawthorn shopping Croad (and then throwing in McPharlin) for valuable draft picks in 2001 and then winning the flag in 2008.

Has anyone seen any success in the 20 years since then?

Was it.

The post I had in mind, was the post with how such a conversation would go down.

Obviously, that was replying to a previous conversation (sorry I skipped 2 or 3 pages).

(Ok warning, I’m NOT having a crack at West Coast with the following. Just saying how I see things)


If we’re talking West Coast specifically, I don’t believe pushing out your older players, or keeping them, is going to make a significant difference in whether you’ll be a flag contender any time soon.

You’ve got that many mediocre players you can delist this off season, you don’t need to push out your older players this off season.

The problems will start, if Simpson starts making line ball selections between a draftee or cooked 30+ year old, and always going the experienced player.

But you shouldn’t be dropping everyone over 30, and adding 5 or 6 draftees in to your starting 22.

That just turns you in to North west.

If you want to develop your youth, you should be drip feeding 2 or 3 in to your starting 22 each season.

And you need at least one senior player who’s going to set standards off field.

Hodge did that for us. No more soft drinks during the season. Just water. Restrictions on PlayStations and Fortnight, etc. Proper sleeping routines.

When the players have free time, be responsible and don’t put yourselves in situations.

What happened at West Coast at the beginning of the year. You guys don’t have anyone strong enough, in a leadership capacity, setting appropriate team standards. (sorry)

If your senior players aren’t driving club standards and culture, they’re not worth keeping, because they are the players your draftees looked up to as heroes, before they were drafted.

Their performances on field aren’t as important. You only really need one or two in the best 22 come game day.

If you don’t have enough quality and experience in the 26 to 30 age group, then you probably do need a few more of those 30+ players.

 

[briztoon]

So just a theory here, with people that like to compare the points value of picks - is there any round where picks are no longer worth points? Like if we said to Brisbane we give them out round 5,6,7,8,9 and 10 for Divon Ribbitson and then they use those points to get Ashcroft?

Second pick of the fifth round.

But you can only take the same amount of picks to the draft as you have list spaces.

So if you only have 5 vacant list spots, and need 3000 points, you’re going to need 5 second round picks.

 

[Bender_]

Second pick of the fifth round.

But you can only take the same amount of picks to the draft as you have list spaces.

So if you only have 5 vacant list spots, and need 3000 points, you’re going to need 5 second round picks.

Yeah aware of the picks vs list spots - was unsure of the points value later in the draft.

 

[kane249]

Uncontracted isn't he? Straight to the psd.

Depends how ruthless they want to be.

Would suck for Freo to draft Logue with a top 10 pick, invest years of development into him and then lose him for free (haha sucked in campaigners)