News Cyril and Shannyn Rioli speak to Caro - link to club statement in page 8

[Hawthorn23]

Some further developments to the story in the video below:

Mod edit: it’s a must watch for anyone reading this thread.

 

[Stottzy]

That’s the way, wear your ignorance like a badge of honor.

Right so will you demand the club never to invite Clarko, Luke Hodge or Andrew Newbold back? To think that Jeff's "insult" is the crux of the problems is more ignorant.

 

[Ned Ryerson]

It's the highlighted bit I'm questioning there, that it finally cost us Cyril. What cost us Cyril was everything before it. Had the club solved previous issues and been better at communicating with Shannyn and Cyril, then maybe she could have laughed off Jeff's gag. Find it strange that Cyril states he will never go back to the club while Jeff is there, but according to Jeff is exchanging text messages with 5 weeks prior from last Friday. Anyway, it is only one side of the story and I'm not looking forward to the response considering our PR has been terrible the last couple of years.

Cyril said in the story that incident was the breaking point and why he retired. I’m not for a moment saying the other incidences weren’t worse than Jeff’s comments - but that incident and the handling of it that followed are what finally made Cyril pull the pin. That’s not a narrative I’m spinning it’s what Cyril said - and it’s what his family said on Twitter many years ago but deleted at the time.

 

[SSSSSS]

Always loved Cyril as a player. Probably my favourite to watch of all time.

Love him even more as a human. To step away from hundreds of thousands of dollars to stand up for your principles and belief shows what an outstanding man he is.

The sooner Kennett ****s off the better.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Right so will you demand the club never to invite Clarko, Luke Hodge or Andrew Newbold back? To think that Jeff's "insult" is the crux of the problems is more ignorant.

I’m talking about your ignorant “it was just a joke” and “the offended love being offended” commentary.

Dumb takes.

 

[Crankyhawk]

Private browsing window/incognito window = access to the article. The 9 news sites aren’t quite as locked down as the News Ltd ones are.

The article isn’t (or wasn’t when I looked) paywalled

 

[The Offerman]

The thing that stood out to me most from the Rioli family's terrible story is, how many opportunities they afforded the club to change. The club couldn't even be arsed doing the absolute bare minimum in making sure people, from Kennett all the way down to coaches and players making offensive remarks were held accountable for their mistakes. That, for me.. is unforgivable.

We're told by all how AFL clubs are inclusive of all cultures and individuals from all backgrounds. We've again been shown that's nothing more than marketing talk. I'm disgusted.

 

[harliquin]

Reading some of the comments defending Kennetts jeans "joke" genuinely makes me feel ill and is exactly why this article has been written.

It is not up to white people to decide what is racist.

The apology from Kennett should have been unconditional not excuse laden.

The senior player that made the comments should have been stood down and sent back to cultural awareness training.

The leadership group should have taken some initiative to fix this. If they didn't, they should have been immediate removed from the leadership group.

Whoever was emailed and contacted about improving indigenous welfare and cultural awareness and ignored shanyns email should be walked.

Disgraceful all around from the family club and I hope this is a catalyst for change within our club, across the AFL and into the community so that one day we can celebrate the career of junior properly.

 

[The Spirit of Cricket]

i will always support this club, but today's news is very saddening and we need to be better than this, not just the club, but society, and me personally too

all i hope is that all involved can learn, change their actions and continue to support Cyril and Shannyn regardless if they are ever willing to reconcile

 

[SSSSSS]

Discussions on racism seem to be the most effective litmus test to determine emotional intelligence.

 

[Stottzy]

I’m talking about your ignorant “it was just a joke” and “the offended love being offended” commentary.

Dumb takes.

It's dumb to be calling for Jeff's head for making a pretty tame (and lame) gag and to think this is the core reason we no longer have Cyril. Would Shannyn have taken it as bad had the club solved the issues pre to that? I doubt it. As I've discussed a few times now on here, Andrew Newbold doesn't even get a mention and he was president during 2012-2015, where a majority of the issues occurred.

 

[The Offerman]

It's dumb to be calling for Jeff's head for making a pretty tame (and lame) gag and to think this is the core reason we no longer have Cyril. Would Shannyn have taken it as bad had the club solved the issues pre to that? I doubt it. As I've discussed a few times now on here, Andrew Newbold doesn't even get a mention and he was president during 2012-2015, where a majority of the issues occurred.

I think this story has shown that the club in it's entirety needs to share a larger portion of the blame. To say these comments fall on Newbold and Newbold only is quite naive. Current players will toe the company line as this is their livelihood we're talking about, but if this story has taught the public anything, it's that not much ever really changes.

We're not talking about things that happened half a century ago here..

 

[SSSSSS]

We as a footy club need to take a good hard look at ourselves. We haven't exactly painted ourselves in glory with our dealings of Indigenous players in the past, and as much as I'd hoped we have moved in the right direction (especially housing some of the greatest indigenous players to walk the pages of history in the last two decades) it seems we are still further away from the mark.

Lot of posters in this thread need a good hard look at themselves in the mirror. Shocking stuff.

 

[Stottzy]

I think this story has shown that the club in it's entirety needs to share a larger portion of the blame. To say these comments fall on Newbold and Newbold only is quite naive. Current players will toe the company line as this is their livelihood we're talking about, but if this story has taught the public anything, it's that not much ever really changes.

We're not talking about things that happened half a century ago here..

I'm not saying he should get all the blame, but the fact is he isn't getting any blame from anyone. He doesn't even get a mention in the article. Jeff is copping a big whack for what I think is really a harmless joke and people are blaming it on losing Cyril. It might have been the "final straw", but what lead to the final straw? Certainly wasn't Jeff considering he wasn't involved at the club between 2012-2016. If supporters are gonna have massive hate for Jeff on this, then only fair you have equal as much anger for Clarko, Newbold, Hodgey and others.

 

[flinchfree]

The club statement wasn’t remotely trying denial, so take that for what you will.

Yeah, don't think there is anything to deny.
One man showed us recently that a joke was worthy of assault. I don't agree with his estimation of insult either.
There is a measure to apply to all things.
I will not deny anothers experience of something and accept they will act accordingly, but I must always bring my own scale to judge for myself.

For a couple of the slights/accusations that were taken hard by Shannyn and Cyril, including having the Club be expected to act upon or engage either of them on their suggestions for improving Aboriginal Welfare systems, well that's not one I accept.
The sporting club is under no obligation to take outside opinon, regardless of whether it is valuable and useful or not.
You can think you have the answers, but can't be offended if others see differently. Or simply are not in a position to bring those answers in to effect.
My reading of how Cyril describes those events and how they impacted him, is that he feels Hawthorn were only paying lip service to outward messages we sent to the media, and our supporters. That they lacked the substance he believed would embody those messages.
Well, that's all well and good, but change is a process that takes time. It takes iterations. It takes history and current philosophy to adapt.
He could of worked to remain and be a vocal part of that change, instead he took the slings and arrows as deathblows to his sense of self and respect.
I myself prefer the Club to tell the story they want enacted, even if they're unable to meet the standard initially or require the time to reflect its aspirations.
Coming from where the Hawthorn Football Club had traditionally sat in recruitment and care for it's aboriginal players, we have been a work in progress for 30 years.
It makes sense as we are coming from a long way back. Just ask Hawthorn presidents of the 70's/80's on their overall opinion and expectation for indigenous players and you'll see we don't have a great tradition of front runners or trailblazers on the issue.
Cyril was fed up, likely as much by how the world around him failed to make the strides he believes in as much as the footy Club, and each insult was a thousand.....while the thousands of hugs and words and loving gazes from supporters and teammates and coaches were barely noticed.


Other experiences Cyril described hit me much more squarely, though they feel fairly isolated over a 10 career.
But Cyril has zero interest in being appeased.
He wants justice, retroactively, and for which he can never attain.

That's his prerogative, but if you can't accept when others try and make things right/better there's not much anyone can do past that.

 

[The Offerman]

I'm not saying he should get all the blame, but the fact is he isn't getting any blame from anyone. He doesn't even get a mention in the article. Jeff is copping a big whack for what I think is really a harmless joke and people are blaming it on losing Cyril. It might have been the "final straw", but what lead to the final straw? Certainly wasn't Jeff considering he wasn't involved at the club between 2012-2016. If supporters are gonna have massive hate for Jeff on this, then only fair you have equal as much anger for Clarko, Newbold, Hodgey and others.

This I agree with. The fact Shannyn went directly to Clarkson at one point pleading with him for change and nothing was done shows a great deal about that man for me. Someone who publicly speaks about how important it is to welcome differing cultures and people from different backgrounds to your own, to then go and turn your back on someone who was very obviously hurting shows a disgusting lack of respect and decency. But this isn't Jeff's only period at the club too don't forget. And then you have his dolls, and a myriad of previous racist and insensitive remarks..

 

[Argy]

Hopefully Cyril will see how gutted his fans have been to hear about the treatment he and his wife received while at the club.

If he's reading this, I'd implore him to please not judge the fans by the actions of a few insensitive, insulting dickheads at the club. It would be marvelous if he could try to regain your connection with the club and his supporters - once the time is right.

 

[A Diakos]

I d like to hear the views of all aboriginal players at hawthorn

Wingard
Impey
Bateman
Hill
Burger
Buddy
Williams
Hill

And of course Cyril

Someone mentioned hill chose not to return back …that had something to do with 900k offer for 5 years by Aints which we weren’t prepared to pay

Lots of assumptions made in here

Not for one moment do I discount what Cyril has to say . Nor should we discount the Feelings of all other players

To date they have expressed gratitude and love for the club

 

[Argy]

Reading some of the comments defending Kennetts jeans "joke" genuinely makes me feel ill and is exactly why this article has been written.

It is not up to white people to decide what is racist.

The apology from Kennett should have been unconditional not excuse laden.

The senior player that made the comments should have been stood down and sent back to cultural awareness training.

The leadership group should have taken some initiative to fix this. If they didn't, they should have been immediate removed from the leadership group.

Whoever was emailed and contacted about improving indigenous welfare and cultural awareness and ignored shanyns email should be walked.

Disgraceful all around from the family club and I hope this is a catalyst for change within our club, across the AFL and into the community so that one day we can celebrate the career of junior properly.

Extremely well said.

 

[MightyHawks86]

Progression. On the field is great, but off the field is just as important. What Cyril and Shannyn state in the article shows that Hawthorn as a club have a long way to go. It shows that we need to be better - more understanding and progressive. Not in the future. Right now.

It is heartbreaking that a champion of the club and those he loves feel this way. All we can do is ensure that sad history does not repeat itself, and become better. In all facets. Accept those issues are present. Admit our shortcomings. Strive for progressive change. Lead by example.And never stop striving for it.

 

[daniel23]

Hard to read article but it's definitely the end of Kennet which is a very good thing.

 

[TylerDurden]

Wonder if Clarko gets asked about it.

 

[SammyC]

Wonder if Clarko gets asked about it.

Yeah this will be interesting. He will be asked no doubt and hard for him to justify a ‘no comment’ response. Same as Sam as one of the leaders in 2013. Bit of oxygen left in this story.

 

[The hands of stone]

Hard to read article but it's definitely the end of Kennet which is a very good thing.

I still think he will go kicking and screaming though.......

 

[Endorphin Machine]

Sad all round. Is there any context as to why this has come out in 2022 and not back in 2018? Or even 2013?

 

[hk89]

How unbelievably disappointing that the club wasn't able to do better by Cyril and Shannyn.

While it isn't hard to see that Kennett would have seen his off-hand comment as harmless at the time, the fact that the club insisted on holding to the line that the response was an overreaction is massively disappointing. I could have easily made a similar gaff - and you can see by the comments in this thread, how hard it is for many to understand how the "joke" could be felt as racist by Shannyn - but to then focus on what Kennett saw as the "unintended" nature of the offense, instead of acknowledging the hurt it had caused would no doubt have inflamed the situation.

Understanding that asking your white daughter if she needs some money to help repair her clothes is very different to asking a young indigenous women you don't know very well the same question is perhaps something a lot of older white blokes would struggle with. However Kennett is (hopefully soon-to-be "was") the president of an organisation with a bunch of indigenous employees, and really should have known better. Even without understanding the implied racism of a white boss offering to help an indigenous person pay for repairing their clothes , he should have at least realised he was being an arseh*le, and that this was not a respectful interaction irrespective of racial overtones (and to be clear I'm not saying it wasn't racist, just that I understand how Kennett wouldn't have understood it that way at the time).

However, far more disappointing than the jeans incident is the previous incidents that led to this being the final straw. There are so many disappointing facts about how the club handled all of this, it is hard to know which makes more angry. The fact that indigenous players were asked to 'Let it go" when faced with more overt racism. The fact that we offered deaf ears to people trying to encourage us to be more culturally aware. The fact that we generally offered lip service only to our indigenous programs, and we thought that a 1 day a week role for a club with revenue in the 10s of millions was adequate for the indigenous officer.

From a selfish point of view, Kennett and the club's actions (and inactions) have cost me the pleasure of watching several more years of footy from one of the most entertaining players of all time. This is on top of Kennett and the club completely ****ing up the departure of arguably our greatest coach ever. Surely the time to axe Kennett is now, and would have the added benefit of helping send a (long overdue) signal that we take our commitment to providing a safe environment for our indigenous players seriously.

While I'm generally not a Caro fan, if this article can actually force some meaningful change (and not just the axing of Kennett , which should be the first item on the agenda), then I think Caro has done the club a favour by bringing this to light (and kudos to Cyril and his family for putting themselves in the firing line by being brave enough to come forward). I hope we can become a club Cyril will eventually be happy to return to for future reunions etc, but it sounds like his wounds are fairly deep, it is is impossible to erase his sad memories now.