News Cyril and Shannyn Rioli speak to Caro - link to club statement in page 8

[Hawthorn23]

Some further developments to the story in the video below:

Mod edit: it’s a must watch for anyone reading this thread.

 

[triple treat]

Just for my edification, you (or speaking as you have for all people of color - we) are sick of being treated differently in NOT being exposed to racist behavior, or in being treated in racist form?

So, just to be clear.
Are you saying you get treated differently in a way that bothers you, because people change the level of casual racist behavior - like jokes of questionable appropriateness - around you, and you want instead to be treated exactly the same and to the same level of racism/bigotry/misogyny that other Aussies seem to parlay amongst themselves?

I feel like you're suggesting you'd like to be treated 'equally', and thus even if that means being subjected to racism it's ok because if casual and uniform then you don't feel singled out and worse for the behavior....
Is that correct?

If so, I'd just like to say fu** that, I don't want to be treated with racsim, or any other demeaning attitude nor do I wish my children to be subjected to it, all in the name of equality of culture.
Lets bin the idiots who can't give up being shitheads to others, for as long as it takes for them to die out.
You know, make the world a better and more loving place where people can maximize all they want out of themselves.

Im not suggesting its ok for any racisms, because its not. Im merely suggesting you can have culture awareness and respect without seeing someone differently!!!

 

[Pessimistic]

Find it staggering that our own players felt really uncomfortable with the Goodes situation and the club did nothing to educate/inform the members and supporters.

Any suggestions? A message over the PA? Would that not need AFL buy in?

Whether hawthorn followed up publiclyis moot really as other Goodes incidents with other sets of ans caused ‘early’ retirement so ther was no other occasion for hawks fans to boo Goodes. Wethere they would have or not is just conjecture.

Booing of buddy has not continued.

 

[Fleabane]

See the thing in Australia is people will tone police you to death when you are confronting them with language they don't like

How dare you call Jeff racist, that's really insulting, like have you paid attention to what he does?

Would you call Pauline Hanson racist? Or is that too inflammatory and lazy/disrespectful

What I notice is that the second someone brings up racism as a cause it's howled down, we've decided its taboo to talk about it, the worst thing that can happen to someone in Australia apparently is to be called a racist, even if what they have said or done looks racist.

It's great for the people that want to keep Australia racist, don't want to fix the problems in systems and carry on taking advantage of being white.

It fixes nothing though, which is the whole point of attacking people that use that language harder than the people they are accusing

I'm not going to argue any of this with you as I'm not a fan of any of the above mentioned people and I do think Australians have a real problem with calling out racism and accepting it for what it is. From the few posts I've read I still maintain triple treat didn't deserve to be given the white supremacy tag and be shut down in the way he/she was.
I'm bowing out now as I'd much rather focus on the real story of this thread and waste no more time arguing on fundamentals we probably mostly agree on, even if our styles are pretty different. Good day.

 

[Pessimistic]

While I’m deeplly ashamed that ‘things’ chaise Cyril to walk away. I’m sensing a scattergun approach by Caro.

She used to be so direct on issues and not embellishing an issue that needed none. Perhaps working for nine and the age these days requires that.

Kennet should resign but not on this, simply that his replacement timing seems to be running to his agenda not the clubs

 

[Kwality]

Hadn't seen this until just now.


Hawthorn premiership player Chance Bateman says it is vital for his former club and the football community to acknowledge and respect the reasons behind former teammate Cyril Rioli and partner Shannyn Ah Sam-Rioli’s decision to end their association with the Hawks in 2018.
The pair outlined the experiences that revealed a lack of cultural awareness within the club and led to Rioli exiting the game and return to the Northern Territory aged 28 with the champion forward saying: “I wouldn’t go back to Hawthorn after what’s gone on.”
Bateman, who played alongside Rioli in the 2008 premiership and was the first Indigenous person to play 100 games at the Hawks, said he felt heartbroken for Cyril and Shannyn and was saddened when he read of their experiences.
“If that is the way Cyril feels, and Shannyn as well, it is important that we acknowledge those feelings and respect them because that is how they feel about their experience throughout that time,” Bateman said.

“It is really important that their feelings and thoughts aren’t dismissed or played down.”
Bateman, a Noongar man of Ballardong country, said that unless that was done, there was a risk the club and the football community would not do the work required to learn from such experiences.
Rioli played in four Hawthorn flags, won the 2015 Norm Smith medal and is regarded as one of the most exciting players to ever play the game kicking 275 goals in 189 games.

Bateman, who is now an Indigenous liaison officer at West Coast, said the 32-year-old was a critical reason why Hawthorn experienced a golden era under Alastair Clarkson’s coaching with premierships in 2008, 2013, 2014 and 2015.

He said the pair’s experiences was another reminder about how much work remained to address the issues within football clubs and the wider community to make environments culturally safe.
“It doesn’t matter what industry you are in, whether it be the AFL, AFL footy club or any sort of corporate organisation the journey for reconciliation is ongoing and never ending,” Bateman said.
“There are enormous challenges along the way, there are going to be mistakes, there are going to be things you don’t do as well as you thought you were doing but it is all about continuous education, awareness and looking at ways you can improve.
“It’s not just Hawthorn and not just the AFL but a lot of the time we can give ourselves a bit of a pat on the back for all the great stuff we are doing without actually knowing there is some of this stuff rumbling in the background.”

The Eagles are lucky to have Chance Bateman - he was a victim of the covid $cuts & its great to see he is back now. He's great value for both social skills & his footy smarts.
Its 50 years & 3 generations of Riolis have 'come South' ... since Sibby & Maurice came down to South Fremantle.

 

[grumbleguts]

They key difference with this group you've named is that (to my knowledge), none of them are Indigenous

Um... that's his point.

However what he fails to acknowledge is the percentage of non indigenous who moved on compared to the percentage of indigenous people who have moved on. However any thing any one says on here is speculation. And not really productive.

 

[Kwality]

Another person trying to tell me what I lived and saw with my own eyes was all fake. I was living in the Matrix obviously.

It's the documentaries that tell the real truth. They're so great. They're definitely not deliberately made to push a specific agenda or angle.

What makes you so sure the doco's werent selling you one view ?

 

[mcnulty]

I answered. You just don't like the answer

No, you said you don’t see the value of hypotheticals and answered your own question. Now you’re being dishonest as well.

Extraordinary how you’ve tied yourself in knots here

 

[Kwality]

Does every WAG centre around the rumored reasons for their husband’s hasty retirement?
Does every WAG live in Darwin for a large period of time before moving back to Melbourne and becoming accessible?

Only a 'true believer' would not question/think 'hang on, what?'

 

[Gralin]

What makes you so sure the doco's werent selling you one view ?

Don't need you in here arguing

 

[Gralin]

I'm not going to argue any of this with you as I'm not a fan of any of the above mentioned people and I do think Australians have a real problem with calling out racism and accepting it for what it is. From the few posts I've read I still maintain triple treat didn't deserve to be given the white supremacy tag and be shut down in the way he/she was.
I'm bowing out now as I'd much rather focus on the real story of this thread and waste no more time arguing on fundamentals we probably mostly agree on, even if our styles are pretty different. Good day.

I'm not seeing them being shut down, they have continued posting in the thread.

This argument gets used a lot though. Say something that is racist, homophobic, transphobic, misogynist etc and then say being labelled stifles debate.

I don't see Pauline Hanson being stifled, JK Rowling, Lyle Shelton

Eddie Maguire didn't get shut down when he was called racist for his Goodes comments or a misogynist for his drown Caro moment

 

[Brishawk]

No, you said you don’t see the value of hypotheticals and answered your own question. Now you’re being dishonest as well.

Extraordinary how you’ve tied yourself in knots here

The tldr answer for you is ‘it depends’. Third time I have said this. And again I’d ask you to stop with the insults.

 

[flinchfree]

Im not suggesting its ok for any racisms, because its not. Im merely suggesting you can have culture awareness and respect without seeing someone differently!!!

I'm sorry, what you're saying doesn't make sense.
Seeing someone different to yourself and how they are different is what makes you culturely aware.
There is no need to be aware of those whose culture you share, you live in that world everyday and share understandings with all the people who do the same.
It's the people who are different in culture, for whom you change your actions.

You don't make a ham dinner for your Jewish friends without asking them if they are ok with that, because you know culturally they might not eat it.
You don't make physical contact with an Islamic woman unless she makes it known she's fine with it, because culturally only related men and woman or those in marriage do so.
You see the differences and act respectfully, if you care.

Or you can pretend like you are stating that you simply see everyone the same but somehow intuitively know what is culture sensitive and what is not.

 

[triple treat]

I'm sorry, what you're saying doesn't make sense.
Seeing some different to yourself and how they are different is what makes you culturely aware.
There is no need to be aware of those whose culture you share, you live in that world everyday and share understandings with all the people who do the same.
It's the people who are different in culture, for whom you change your actions.

You don't make a ham dinner for your Jewish friends without asking them if they are ok with that, because you know culturally they might not eat it.
You don't make physical contact with an Islamic woman unless she makes it known she's fine with it, because culturally only related men and woman or those in marriage do so.
You see the differences and act respectfully, if you care.

Or you can pretend like you are stating that you simply see everyone the same but somehow intuitively know what is culture sensitive and what is not.

Mate if you cant understand what im saying then we'll just respectfully end it here. Cheers

 

[MowShow]

Shannyn is currently working in the fashion industry in Melbourne, if one of her colleagues made a joke about clothes Cyril was wearing would he get deeply offended and would she pack up her bags quit her job and go home?? No way!!
Cyril is currently working with indigenous offenders (that’s fantastic) and I know he would be very encouraging and positive with them. So let me get this straight in his eyes it is ok to commit violence or theft against someone but a bad joke or using a name for someone that was most likely never meant to offend anyone is unforgivable regardless of the amount of apologies given.

Rarely is a post made that misses the point by a wider margin than this one. And that’s saying something.

I’m sure a multitude of people have already pointed out where you’ve gone wrong here so rather than do the same I’ll just suggest you take a step away and consider that one of our favourite sons has walked away and feels animosity towards the club - regardless of how minor you think the incident(s) may be, the club needs to be better than that.

Cyril working in the field he currently does speaks volumes towards his outlook - that is, that he must in some way believe in people’s ability to improve and make amends. Using this as an example to diminish his current view/feelings towards the club is both preposterous and frankly, embarrassing.

 

[Satchel]

perhaps the AFL should be looking at incorporating some sort of cultural awareness program into the draft combine - that way it can get coverage over all of the draftees before they hit club level (even if they miss out)

Clearly we need to be adopting some sort of program into the club & I am sure any review that takes place will highlight this

I am not sure arguing over whether or not a comment made is offensive or not is moving us forward

 

[Beandip]

In all this whole mess only one thing is giving me any comfort.

Sammy has been brilliant in his response and he seems hell bent on getting Cyril back as part of the Hawthorn family.
It’s pretty clear that will probably only happen once Geoff is gone, but I am confident it will happen.
Jeff is clearly the face of this whole mess, but others were at fault as well.

As I said in an earlier post I can’t believe that our club and every AFL club has not had cultural awareness training.
I did it last year and believe me when I tell you this “What you think you know about the subject will turn out to be not much at all”

In one exercise we had to do a interpretation drawing of a story and after we finished that drawing we had to write down the 5 most important people in our lives and then the 5 most important places and include them in the drawing. Then we heard a load bang and then we had to tear the whole drawing into strips losing the most important people and places in our lives.

In an instant the 5 most important people and places in my life were gone, it was a simple enough exercise but it really hit home.

To say I was enlightened after doing this course is an understatement.
I hope the club we all love, put everyone in our organisation through a course.

Dewayne and TAC do an excellent, informative, and disheartening cultural awareness training workshop. I too left with such a greater awareness, and a disillusionment with how I'd been presented information from the education system etc.

 

[Dixie Flatline]

CEO Statement

The official AFL website of the Hawthorn Football Club

www.hawthornfc.com.au

 

[hfc70]

Hawthorn - The so called Family Club.

We handled the Patton issue poorly (my opinion) when strong leadership was required. We passed the buck onto the AFL as a hot potato.

Now , we hear from a legend/icon in Cyril , highlighting how poorly he was treated by the Club.

This demands extremely strong leadership from our club - immediately !
Not next month , later in the year….but right now.

That CEO statement is soft & insipid and does not address the issue strongly enough.

Cyril will still feel disgruntled & perplexed by the latest developments

We have missed a massive opportunity to bring Cyril & Shannon back into the Family.

Note - Kennett silence is deafening ( yes , I know he is “isolating”)

 

[threesixpio]

Wish I could double like your post. Ask yourself what is Jeff bringing to Hawthorn currently?

Division - he's always been a divisive figure, even more so now..

Distraction - perhaps the lads were slow out of the blocks on Sunday because of this. We don't need any distraction's.

Accusations of racism - these will continue to fester while Jeff is about and the club will continue to be needled about it. Lance that boil!

Presenting a large negative target to the media. Caro's arrow was timed to help Carlton to perfection. This will keep happening.

Obstacle to funding by the state government according to some. I have no idea if this is true, but it is believable.

Turn off to future members, especially the younger, indigenous or those from 'minorities'

Poor governance - looking from the outside, the club does not seem to be as well run of late..


Added - wrt to constant negative media; eg from the post above. It's going to keep happening, the media will keep feeding.

I think Caro was pretty reasonable here.

So - What is the current status of our indigenous support staff at Hawthirn?

This is a f**ken priority

 

[MrPremiership]

I think Caro was pretty reasonable here.

So - What is the current status of our indigenous support staff at Hawthirn?

This is a f**ken priority

Brady Grey - part time

 

[threesixpio]

Brady Grey - part time

Sounds like he is doing a great job but would be good to hear whether more is needed. Pressers indicate Indigenous players are happy with the club at this time and Sammy seems to be very passionate in this space.

 

[CD Xbow]

I think Caro was pretty reasonable here.

So - What is the current status of our indigenous support staff at Hawthirn?

This is a f**ken priority

Not saying it was unreasonable at all, a quite well written piece and highlights some things the club needs to address. Starting at the top.

 

[Gralin]

CEO Statement

The official AFL website of the Hawthorn Football Club

www.hawthornfc.com.au

I like how Reeves is trying to act like we don't know that the club want always a safe place
Smacks of gasligting something else Rioli experienced at the club

 

[TassieGrown]

Brady Grey - part time

He is loving his role at the club, we are doing some things well and others not so well.