Hypothetical: Another year wrecked by injuries - who will be made accountable?

[Warwick]

For two years we have been crucified by injuries, finishing both years with the highest toll in the competition and the most weeks lost through injury.

We simply can not be competitive if we lose over 200 weeks like in 2006. And although most of the attention was on Melbourne and West Coast's injury woes last season, once again it was the Lions topping that list.

Surely another year wrecked by injuries to our list, and questions must be asked of the medical and rehab & prevention staff. Obviously some injuries are just bad luck - such as ACLs and broken bones - and we have definitely copped our fair share of those. But the amount (and severity) of some soft tissue injuries we have suffered over the last 2-3 years is simply astonishing.

Even though it is the pre-season and conservative management is the key, we are even struggling to fill a side to play a practice match. Obviously most of those would just be niggles, but how many sides have half their list grounded already?

It must be said i'm not in any way saying the rehab staff are doing a bad job, but like in any profession, performance must be rated on results. If we don't make money - the board are held accountable. If we are not getting the results on the field - the coach and players feel the heat. Similarly, we have first class facilities and experts at the helm in the rehab and prevention field, but we should be getting a better return.

Once again key injuries could well dictate where we finish. All of a sudden us and Adelaide have the weakest ruck depth in the competition (what a difference 12 months makes). If Charman goes down we could finish in the bottom 4. If an 19 year old ruckman who has played less than a dozen games gets injured, we could be up the creek. Both Brown and Merrett need to play 22 games.

I really hope injuries do not stop us before we start. Our first 7 or 8 weeks are extremely difficult and we could play the first month without Black, Bradshaw, and Clark.

 

[Kochie 16]

I too am pretty shocked with how many niggles we have atm!

 

[beatnik]

i agree that there is nothing wrong with reviewing our programs and key fitness and conditioning personnel if and when we reach an injury pattern of ridiculous proportions but i don't think it's at that stage yet

it's still a little early to be sure that 2008 is a write-off through injury - if this list is accurate then, barring further injuries, we will pretty much have a full list to choose from by round 1 or 2:

Colm Begley (Achilles) - 1 week
Mitch Clark (Quad) - 1 week
Sam Sheldon (Groin) - 1 week
Ashley McGrath (Knee) - 1 week
Simon Black (Groin) - 1 week
Daniel Merrett (Knee) - 1 week
Joel Macdonald (Groin) - 1 week
Jason Roe (Quad) - 1 week
Matthew Moody (Groin) - 3 weeks
James Hawksley (Groin) - 3 weeks
Chris Schmidt (Quad) - 3 weeks
Matthew Tyler (Lower Back) - 3 weeks
Pat Garner (Knee) - 3 weeks
Daniel Bradshaw (Knee) - 3 weeks

looking at those injuries, there could easily be a bit of 'lame duck' routine going on

i get the impression we are not taking the winning of this pre-season competition very seriously and i'm not sure whether so many players are out because they are genuinely too injured to play or because it suits our season plan to avoid being ready too early

on the plus side: we currently have no players in the 'indefinite' injury category...this year we only have Bradshaw who is yet to play a game after a serious injury (e.g. recons, broken bones) but last pre-season we had Lappin, MacDonald, McDonald, Corrie, Selwood, Hadley and Bradshaw in that same category

(Wazza, I still reserve the right to completely change my tune come season's end if we top the injuries for the third year running )

peace

 

[Tas]

i agree that there is nothing wrong with reviewing our programs and key fitness and conditioning personnel if and when we reach an injury pattern of ridiculous proportions but i don't think it's at that stage yet

it's still a little early to be sure that 2008 is a write-off through injury - if this list is accurate then, barring further injuries, we will pretty much have a full list to choose from by round 1 or 2:

Colm Begley (Achilles) - 1 week
Mitch Clark (Quad) - 1 week
Sam Sheldon (Groin) - 1 week
Ashley McGrath (Knee) - 1 week
Simon Black (Groin) - 1 week
Daniel Merrett (Knee) - 1 week
Joel Macdonald (Groin) - 1 week
Jason Roe (Quad) - 1 week
Matthew Moody (Groin) - 3 weeks
James Hawksley (Groin) - 3 weeks
Chris Schmidt (Quad) - 3 weeks
Matthew Tyler (Lower Back) - 3 weeks
Pat Garner (Knee) - 3 weeks
Daniel Bradshaw (Knee) - 3 weeks

looking at those injuries, there could easily be a bit of 'lame duck' routine going on

i get the impression we are not taking the winning of this pre-season competition very seriously and i'm not sure whether so many players are out because they are genuinely too injured to play or because it suits our season plan to avoid being ready too early

on the plus side: we currently have no players in the 'indefinite' injury category...this year we only have Bradshaw who is yet to play a game after a serious injury (e.g. recons, broken bones) but last pre-season we had Lappin, MacDonald, McDonald, Corrie, Selwood, Hadley and Bradshaw in that same category

(Wazza, I still reserve the right to completely change my tune come season's end if we top the injuries for the third year running )

peace

I am curious about that injury list, how many of those injured have already missed a few weeks? While I don't think anyone goes out of their way to win the pre-season cup or practice matches, the pre-season is an important phase for developing your fitness base and missing a month or two can have significant effects during the H&A season.

There seem to be a lot of groin and soft tissue injuries, it is really the fitness and development staff that need to put in programs which the players can manage during the off-season. If someone gets a knock or does their knee there is nothing preventative that can be done to stop that from happening but soft tissue pre-season injuries should be minimal.

I think that is something we have done well over the last decade or so, we have probably one of the lowest records for soft-tissue injuries and I think it comes from knowing the players and putting forth an individual fitness program tailor made for each person, I believe the saints visited us last year in terms of looking at the programs we put in place because they have had chronic soft-tissue injury problems.

If it becomes a long-term issue the club would have to look at the fitness and development staff, you really can't afford to have players missing big chunks or development work or football games when they can be minimised or prevented.

 

[GabbaMan]

The injuries are a bit of a concern, but they may just be niggles that are normally "carried" during the regular season.

As its still preseason maybe due diligence and a little bit of safety first is being practiced. Too early to say really.

Injuries do give opportunities and game time to some of lesser known players though.

What is really disappointing overall at this stage is the average form and turnovers show by our inexexperienced so far.

Especially after watching sides like Sydney and St kilda, both had around 8-9 possible seniors players missing but a lot of their newbees showed great potential and skills.

 

[lionbear]

I think Brisbane have gone in a lot more conservative this pre season, I think they have definitely been looking at round 1 more. Even though it is a long injury list, if there was a game for Premiership Points this weekend I think that list would cut in half straight away.

It is all about round 1 at the moment.

If we had a another season wrecked by injuries you would definitely start to have a look at what was going on. Geelong looked into theres and we saw the results of that last year.

I think as well injury runs have a way of evening themselves out, and we paid a high price from 2005 to 2007, hopefully the pendulum will start to swing our way.

 

[BBFFC]

But the amount (and severity) of some soft tissue injuries we have suffered over the last 2-3 years is simply astonishing.

A lot of that has to do with the fact the surfaces (qld) we train on particularly during the preseason are extremely hard, the climate is also a factor in soft tissue injuries as is the age of our squad, alot of these injuries particularly groin are related to load failure at the pelvis and the younger guys who lack the strength and conditioning are will fail over time.

As for our list atm i agree with afew of the sentiments above, alot of our guys are obviously being nursed through and very much looking at round 1 and beyond.

 

[Hollow Knight]

As for our list atm i agree with afew of the sentiments above, alot of our guys are obviously being nursed through and very much looking at round 1 and beyond.

You'd hope that most of these players could get at least one practice match under the belt to avoid being rusty come round 1.

If these players really are being nursed through minor niggles, I think we can expect to see a massive amount of INs for the final praccy match.

 

[lionbear]

If these players really are being nursed through minor niggles, I think we can expect to see a massive amount of INs for the final praccy match.

I think too Brisbane will want to get at least one win before the season proper. I know it means nothing come Round 1, but to get a pre season win under your belt no matter who the opposition I think really helps team morale moving towards the real stuff.

 

[BigCat2]

Actually, given the "luck" we've enjoyed over the last few years in the past pre-season match, I'd prefer if we forfeited the game altogether.

 

[T Rick]

Actually, given the "luck" we've enjoyed over the last few years in the past pre-season match, I'd prefer if we forfeited the game altogether.

Haha.

 

[awesome_assassin]

A lot of that has to do with the fact the surfaces (qld) we train on particularly during the preseason are extremely hard, the climate is also a factor in soft tissue injuries as is the age of our squad, alot of these injuries particularly groin are related to load failure at the pelvis and the younger guys who lack the strength and conditioning are will fail over time.

As for our list atm i agree with afew of the sentiments above, alot of our guys are obviously being nursed through and very much looking at round 1 and beyond.

I agree with this, surely were due for some luck with injuries soon though.

As long as Brown, Black, Merrett, Charmo and Luey dont get Major injuries throughout the year i think we can hold our own.

I see Luey as being the biggest risk this yr. He's young, body not as strong as some of the older guys, but he will see a lot of game time compared to last year. I hope his body can stand up to it.

 

[beatnik]

You'd hope that most of these players could get at least one practice match under the belt to avoid being rusty come round 1.

If these players really are being nursed through minor niggles, I think we can expect to see a massive amount of INs for the final praccy match.

exactly

 

[Warwick]

A lot of that has to do with the fact the surfaces (qld) we train on particularly during the preseason are extremely hard, the climate is also a factor in soft tissue injuries as is the age of our squad, alot of these injuries particularly groin are related to load failure at the pelvis and the younger guys who lack the strength and conditioning are will fail over time.

I'm fully aware of what may be contributing to the injuries but that means steps must be in place to minimise the risks.

And I must say i'm not just talking about the injuries we have now (hence the hypothetical in the title) - if we have another horrid run of soft tissue injuries in 2008, questions need to be asked.

 

[Hollow Knight]

I'm fully aware of what may be contributing to the injuries but that means steps must be in place to minimise the risks.

And I must say i'm not just talking about the injuries we have now (hence the hypothetical in the title) - if we have another horrid run of soft tissue injuries in 2008, questions need to be asked.

You seem very interested in this Warwick. Considered a career in physiotherapy?

 

[Tassie4ever]

You seem very interested in this Warwick. Considered a career in physiotherapy?

My son IS a physiotherapist and as I have said before on this site, in his opinion there is a recurring theme here. Last year I emailed the CEO with all of the concerns expressed above- didn't get a reply of course, probably didn't expect one. But why is it that we are consistently way in front as the worst side for injuries over a number of years?

If the suggestion is that we avoid practise games because of the fear of injury, then god help preparation. Anyway, we seem to be accumulating the usual ratio without getting out of first gear. As far as I can see, good hard practise doesn't seem to worry other sides.

 

[Warwick]

You seem very interested in this Warwick. Considered a career in physiotherapy?

4 years of pain for little return?

Why would anyone in their right minds want to be a physio?

 

[BBFFC]

4 years of pain for little return?

Why would anyone in their right minds want to be a physio?

I am a sports Physio and exercise physiologist! And it was 5 years of pain. I would love to treat you Warrick

And know a lot of the Lions rehab staff, everything mentioned is of course taken into consideration. What are the alternatives? Not to train? not to play on the Gabba surface?

It's all well on good to scream from the sidelines that 'action must be taken' but they scrutenise their rehab policies extensively at seasons end, the hard facts are the factors that i mentioned before, are real, and very hard to get around, and still have players in peak condition and not underdone.

Knowing the specifics of alot of their player management, they take every possible step to prevent these types of injuries.

By the way I love my job!

 

[John]

I am a sports Physio and exercise physiologist! And it was 5 years of pain. I would love to treat you Warrick

And know a lot of the Lions rehab staff, everything mentioned is of course taken into consideration. What are the alternatives? Not to train? not to play on the Gabba surface?

It's all well on good to scream from the sidelines that 'action must be taken' but they scrutenise their rehab policies extensively at seasons end, the hard facts are the factors that i mentioned before, are real, and very hard to get around, and still have players in peak condition and not underdone.

Knowing the specifics of alot of their player management, they take every possible step to prevent these types of injuries.

By the way I love my job!

It is good to read your post BBFFC. I was under the impression that we were an unprofessional organisation that had no idea after reading a few posts over the last year or 2.

 

[Warwick]

I am a sports Physio and exercise physiologist! And it was 5 years of pain. I would love to treat you Warrick

No problems finding people to treat my body - doing my honours in physio this year. My head on the other hand...

As I said in my first post, i'm not saying our staff are doing a bad job. So people are way off the mark if they think that is what I mean. But our record has not been encouraging the last couple of years, and if that continues, we may need to look outside the square and investigate some of the other team's strategies and ideas.

There are obviously a number of factors that work against us. We are disadvantaged as an interstate team in having to travel every second week, we have the best centre wicket in world cricket smack-bang in the middle of our home ground, we haven't had much luck at all, we live in a warm climate, we have blokes who have played a lot of long, hard seasons of footy etc etc.

It will be interesting to keep an eye on St Kilda this year after they poached the head Sydney bloke with a magnificant record. They are another team who have suffered a number of soft tissue injuries recently.

 

[Grimreepah]

Link

Injury woes trigger Brisbane Lions conditioning review
Article from:
Andrew Hamilton
February 25, 2008 11:00pm

BRISBANE is reviewing its conditioning program after entering the NAB Cup with the longest injury list in the competition.
Although the list is slowly diminishing and the club expects to have close to a full list to pick from in round 1, coach Leigh Matthews last night admitted the inability to get match practice into players over the pre-season tournament had been a major frustration.
He said the pre-season training and conditioning program would be reviewed.
"We are not pleased with the number of guys ready to go," he said.
"There were a lot of reasons, but we thought our percentages weren't quite good enough."
When Matthews and his match committee went to pick a side for the opening clash against Essendon at Carrara a fortnight ago, there were 15 players unavailable through injury.
In addition, co-captain Jonathon Brown had a line through his name for precautionary reasons.
Robert Copeland, Luke Power and Scott Harding were added to that list after a tough training session last week.
Some, like Daniel Bradshaw and Patrick Garner, were coming off long-term injuries but others were the result of pre-season training.
Players such as Daniel Merrett and Ash McGrath suffered wear and tear knee injuries that required surgery, but it was the groin and quad injuries which occurred on the training track that frustrated the coach the most.
Matthews prefers his men to have at least 200 minutes of match practice before they play a senior premiership game.
Several regular senior players, such as Michael Rischitelli, Joel MacDonald and Jason Roe, face a battle to clock up the miles in time.
"The fact was when we got to the beginning of February we had too many players that weren't ready to play," Matthews said.
"The thing we are disappointed in is there are half a dozen players who were OK in December but did little things in the interim that set them back a few weeks.
"It won't affect us for round 1, but it has during the NAB Cup."
Matthews made no link between the spate of soft-tissue injures and the speed and endurance gains made over the summer under the guidance of strength and conditioning coach Lachlan Penfold.
When he arrived, Penfold began a three-year program to give players the resilience to achieve superior fitness levels without suffering injury.

 

[LIONOFZION]

It might only be coincidence but it seems in an effort to get good value for our draft picks we've drafted a number of players over the years that have had big wraps as far as their ability has been concerned but have also had injury clouds as early as their arrival at the club and thus may have slid down the draft pecking order (e.g. Mitch Clark, Lachlan Henderson, Phil Smith just off the top of my head). Should we continue with this "risky" method of recruiting or try to consciously pick players whose bodies appear of greater resilience (if of similar abilities)?
Do we need to chase a top-notch conditioning expert in the future?

 

[waikphys]

Bring back Jimmy Eustace!!

Seriously tho, does anyone who attends training have some insite as to the level at which some of these " injured" players are training??

 

[Warwick]

Link

Good to see. And nice timing too.

Interesting news on the Malceski surgery as well. If it works, it would be absolutely fantastic for all AFL players and clubs. Will be watching that one with a lot of interest.

 

[GabbaMan]

Injuries alone surely wouldn't "wreck" a season, simply because every team has them and every team will have them in varying degrees during a season.

More likely a lack of skilled replacements?

"We are not pleased with the number of guys ready to go," he said.
"There were a lot of reasons,. . ."

"Matthews made no link between the spate of soft-tissue injures and the speed and endurance gains made over the summer under the guidance of strength and conditioning coach Lachlan Penfold".