Opinion Midfield 2024 season Strength

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Optimistic Dog

Optimistic Dog

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Oct 11, 2014
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Western Bulldogs
Our much-hyped midfield is certainly losing its dominance, the strongest point was 2021 with Bont, Dunkley. Bailey, McCrae, Treloar and Libba at or near their peak. Now in 2024 we have the Bont still outstanding, Libba somehow still has good as ever, no Dunkley, Jacko coming off a poor season and ADZ still ok but probably on the down and no Bailey. Add Harmes who lacks class and will probably be a negating mid and Sanders big raps but in his first season.

I do not think it as a real strength anymore and probably sits about 5 in best midfields even though the Herald Sun rate it 2. I would expect sometimes the midfield to be dominate when Bont stars but can see it getting beaten and out-paced at times. Hope I am wrong because a winning midfield is so important
 
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Optimistic Dog said:
Our much-hyped midfield is certainly losing its dominance, the strongest point was 2021 with Bont, Dunkley. Bailey, McCrae, Treloar and Libba at or near their peak. Now in 2024 we have the Bont still outstanding, Libba somehow still has good as ever, no Dunkley, Jacko coming off a poor season and ADZ still ok but probably on the down and no Bailey. Add Harmes who lacks class and will probably be a negating mid and Sanders big raps but in his first season.

I do not think it as a real strength anymore and probably sits about 5 in best midfields even though the Herald Sun rate it 2. I would expect sometimes the midfield to be dominate when Bont stars but can see it getting beaten and out-paced at times. Hope I am wrong because a winning midfield is so important
Click to expand...
Don't forget English forms part of that midfield.
 

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I think several of our rival teams have improved the quality and depth of their midfields in recent seasons to the point where they can match us and, more regularly, beat us.
Towards the back end of last season it was particularly galling to see the midfields of lowly ranked Hawthorn and West Coast out-work our guys and contribute to unlikely victories.
I also think there are questions arising about our midfield ranking and I'm glad to see our recent efforts to upgrade it.
 
We also have had little coming through for the past five years. Trelor was a lucky recruit and rate to have a star available and incentivised.

Who has been brought in that time and how have they gone:

  • West / most disappointing because most talent but when he goes into midfield he doesn’t get the numbers and because he plays forwards (and I think does a good job) he isn’t getting enough minutes. I hope he still makes it but by now he should have shown more - some have come later particularly from HBF into mid
  • Garcia - has had terrible injuries but has come back last year without losing any speed but his skills still don’t seem to have got the level we need
  • McNeil - has only shown short burst and mainly forward
  • McComb - hasn’t worked

We have lost Dunkley who is a very good player but still fourth on our list at the time and losing minutes to Smith also but with Macrae dropping off and Trelor slowing he would be up the ranks a bit but still really plays the role Bont plays better - so not so much about ability as being blocked from his best position. Certainly a negative - expect case of his age. And Toby McLean wrecked by injury.

Coming in new is Harmes and Sanders - I think they will be good. But less than the loss at this stage (even though I think Sanders could be a perfect replacement).

Not a complete panic but we can see us slide further in the next few years:

  • Bont has five years+ so no problem
  • Macrae is resilient and should have at least 3 years left

But we are likely to lose
  • Trelor is already suffering a fair few injuries / expect two more years of not major injuries
  • Libba is strangely at the peak of his powers and fitness. If he doesn’t cop a major injury he could go 3 years but that’s a risky if?

So I think we are still a top 4 midfield but in the next few years will decline to be at least two lock midfielders short of a top four where to be dominant you like to see six very good players

But next year - let’s assume Trelor out but Smith back and in form would be:

Bont
Smith
Libba

Macrae
Sanders
Daniel

Others would rotate or play roles like Harmes, West etc

Current options in order of likelihood of being best 22

  • Daniel finds his groove - he is already getting the best numbers of the options but doesn’t appear to be a first touch rover or a high possession distributor but he is so talented he may make it his own - still looks borderline for the role going forward
  • Sanders looks great and has all the traits including power that we are missing but hasn’t played
  • West might click - has the traits and every time he goes for the ball he looks great but across the game doesn’t look great / needs All Black consistency v flashes
  • Left field like Gags works in the contest - early practice suggest this might work but no proof yet. Bevo also tried rotating Flea which show some glimpses but I believe Naughty would be even better doing a Carey/Ablett
  • Move someone good into the mid: most likely Red or Truck.

While wing options are a bit limited - if two of Poulter, Bedendo and Friejah come on Truck could be released either into the midfield of back. Seems like we don’t have too much to play with.

But Back we have Duryea, Dale, JJ, Coffield, Cleary, Khamis, VDM, Bramble and Gallagher. 10 players for 4 spots.

Just so we are clear - I am not a fan of moving Red into the guts but the argument has merit.

Duryea is slowing and so that puts more pressure on Red as the only quick and aerially strong defender for the power small that most top team have. We got in Gags and Bramble for coverage and lost Crozier who just lost speed. Neither of these are proven.

Quarterback defenders are Dale and Williams goes back with Cleary coming through. Looks solid.

For the rebounder we have JJ (also dropping off in games not talent), VDM so looks a bit thin and Red can perform that role.

And the intercept marking gap we have been trying to fill for years since Wood with lots of options has a new entrant Coffield and a growing Khamis. Very different role than Red.

If we lose Smith then maybe that provides a push but you have win the mid to win.
 
Then midfield is fine. It is still a top end inside unit. We do well in the clearances and contested ball.

The outside game, X factor and pace have always been our weakness in the middle. Even with our "best" unit, that you mentioned. All teams had to do was even out the inside stuff vs us, or force a turn over.

Even with the "best" midfield we had, we started to regress in clean ball use and seemed to struggle to hit targets before the personnel and set ups changed. The same unit today would probably be just as much a heel.

It's all in the players heads. Up to them to stop making stupid decisions with the ball, if they were able to do it a couple of years ago, no reason they can't wipe that out of their game now. And get back to dominating the inside game most weeks. We have addressed leg speed, age, and ball use the last couple of off-seasons. I think we will start to see the benefits of that kick in this season coming.
 
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NthBondiDoggies said:
We also have had little coming through for the past five years. Trelor was a lucky recruit and rate to have a star available and incentivised.

Who has been brought in that time and how have they gone:

  • West / most disappointing because most talent but when he goes into midfield he doesn’t get the numbers and because he plays forwards (and I think does a good job) he isn’t getting enough minutes. I hope he still makes it but by now he should have shown more - some have come later particularly from HBF into mid
  • Garcia - has had terrible injuries but has come back last year without losing any speed but his skills still don’t seem to have got the level we need
  • McNeil - has only shown short burst and mainly forward
  • McComb - hasn’t worked

We have lost Dunkley who is a very good player but still fourth on our list at the time and losing minutes to Smith also but with Macrae dropping off and Trelor slowing he would be up the ranks a bit but still really plays the role Bont plays better - so not so much about ability as being blocked from his best position. Certainly a negative - expect case of his age. And Toby McLean wrecked by injury.

Coming in new is Harmes and Sanders - I think they will be good. But less than the loss at this stage (even though I think Sanders could be a perfect replacement).

Not a complete panic but we can see us slide further in the next few years:

  • Bont has five years+ so no problem
  • Macrae is resilient and should have at least 3 years left

But we are likely to lose
  • Trelor is already suffering a fair few injuries / expect two more years of not major injuries
  • Libba is strangely at the peak of his powers and fitness. If he doesn’t cop a major injury he could go 3 years but that’s a risky if?

So I think we are still a top 4 midfield but in the next few years will decline to be at least two lock midfielders short of a top four where to be dominant you like to see six very good players

But next year - let’s assume Trelor out but Smith back and in form would be:

Bont
Smith
Libba

Macrae
Sanders
Daniel

Others would rotate or play roles like Harmes, West etc

Current options in order of likelihood of being best 22

  • Daniel finds his groove - he is already getting the best numbers of the options but doesn’t appear to be a first touch rover or a high possession distributor but he is so talented he may make it his own - still looks borderline for the role going forward
  • Sanders looks great and has all the traits including power that we are missing but hasn’t played
  • West might click - has the traits and every time he goes for the ball he looks great but across the game doesn’t look great / needs All Black consistency v flashes
  • Left field like Gags works in the contest - early practice suggest this might work but no proof yet. Bevo also tried rotating Flea which show some glimpses but I believe Naughty would be even better doing a Carey/Ablett
  • Move someone good into the mid: most likely Red or Truck.

While wing options are a bit limited - if two of Poulter, Bedendo and Friejah come on Truck could be released either into the midfield of back. Seems like we don’t have too much to play with.

But Back we have Duryea, Dale, JJ, Coffield, Cleary, Khamis, VDM, Bramble and Gallagher. 10 players for 4 spots.

Just so we are clear - I am not a fan of moving Red into the guts but the argument has merit.

Duryea is slowing and so that puts more pressure on Red as the only quick and aerially strong defender for the power small that most top team have. We got in Gags and Bramble for coverage and lost Crozier who just lost speed. Neither of these are proven.

Quarterback defenders are Dale and Williams goes back with Cleary coming through. Looks solid.

For the rebounder we have JJ (also dropping off in games not talent), VDM so looks a bit thin and Red can perform that role.

And the intercept marking gap we have been trying to fill for years since Wood with lots of options has a new entrant Coffield and a growing Khamis. Very different role than Red.

If we lose Smith then maybe that provides a push but you have win the mid to win.
Click to expand...
McLean is a big one often overlooked. Absent injuries he’d be in his prime right now as an inside-outside mid with great agility (which sadly completely left him)
 
List management did an outstanding job bringing in Sanders this year. Assuming Smith goes, we got a year ahead of his contract with a fantastic replacement (different skill set but looks like he’ll have a good career) and we use whatever we can get for smith on another 1st round mid, in a 2024 draft that looks stocked with mids at the top end. Sammy P on fire 🔥
 
Libbaaaa said:
Couple of mentions of Treloar being injury prone for us, he has played over 80% of available games for us. Keep that up and he’ll finish a 100 game player for us. Great recruit.
Click to expand...
He will need to play a couple of full seasons for us to reach 100, or three seasons at his injury rate. Would love for him to be able to reach that mark given he has been around a few clubs. Was just short with Collingwood by 6 games, and one season short at the Giants.

Will he hang around the game for three more years is the question? Given a few posters have suggested in the past he might retire to spend time with the family.
 
Libbaaaa said:
Couple of mentions of Treloar being injury prone for us, he has played over 80% of available games for us. Keep that up and he’ll finish a 100 game player for us. Great recruit.
Click to expand...

hes had hamstring injuries throughout his career, and his game style relies on a bit of speed.
Libba OTOH doesnt rely on physical attributes, and has been pretty resilient, apart from some unlucky knees.
 

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Apart from the Bont our midfield is middle rate at best.

We bring and extra to the stoppage (which papers the cracks) and it whilst this looks good in theory, it puts a lot of pressure on the forward line who are outnumbered, and then the backline on the overlap as the onballers don't work back hard enough.
The defensive mindset and gut running is just not there like the best teams at the moment (and we play on a smaller ground). Smith, Trealoar, McCrae and Daniel cannot do it at pace. In Smith case, its the want more than the ability. Libba busts his gut yet can't really cover the ground, his role is in and under.
So against the best we were exposed multiple times last year.

I personally do not want to see Daniel or McCrae in the middle. There is still roles for them but its not in the coal face. Too easy to push off and can't make up ground on the break. I would even let Libba spend some time up forward as he can snag a goal.

We need a fresh look and Sanders will help plus my push of Richards is looking likely as well.

Sticking with the same will not see us rise. Its time to mix it up just like we did in 2015.
 
LondonBulldog said:
Apart from the Bont our midfield is middle rate at best.

We bring and extra to the stoppage (which papers the cracks) and it whilst this looks good in theory, it puts a lot of pressure on the forward line who are outnumbered, and then the backline on the overlap as the onballers don't work back hard enough.
The defensive mindset and gut running is just not there like the best teams at the moment (and we play on a smaller ground). Smith, Trealoar, McCrae and Daniel cannot do it at pace. In Smith case, its the want more than the ability. Libba busts his gut yet can't really cover the ground, his role is in and under.
So against the best we were exposed multiple times last year.

I personally do not want to see Daniel or McCrae in the middle. There is still roles for them but its not in the coal face. Too easy to push off and can't make up ground on the break. I would even let Libba spend some time up forward as he can snag a goal.

We need a fresh look and Sanders will help plus my push of Richards is looking likely as well.

Sticking with the same will not see us rise. Its time to mix it up just like we did in 2015.
Click to expand...
Great call, our mids were so so average last year and were carried by Lib and Bont. A refresher is needed and I would like to see Sanders, Gallagher and West played more through there this year.
 
Whoyagot said:
Great call, our mids were so so average last year and were carried by Lib and Bont. A refresher is needed and I would like to see Sanders, Gallagher and West played more through there this year.
Click to expand...
I play golf with Gallagher's uncle, he is primed this year, one of the strongest at the club for his height. I think he may play round 1, pending the practise match vs Hawthorn.
 
LondonBulldog said:
I play golf with Gallagher's uncle, he is primed this year, one of the strongest at the club for his height. I think he may play round 1, pending the practise match vs Hawthorn.
Click to expand...
I been very bullish on him, has all the attributes speed, smarts and physicality. Showed good signs in a couple of VFL games last season and has ticked all the boxes so far this preseason. Next couple of weeks will tell us where he sits ATM.
 
ScragCity said:
I think our midfield is middle of the pack now but our forward line is potentially the best in the comp.
Click to expand...

It’s a fair comment and Naughton, Marra, Weightman and Lobb/Darcy are a great core 4. If Jones and Clark really come on this year and give us 10-15 solid games each as pressure forwards then I think we’d have a really strong case.

I think the midfield can still be one of the best in the comp, but we have to change how we are setting up, how many players we’re rotating through there, and be willing to mix it up more to give the opposition different looks. Hopefully doing that might also help mitigate the issue of conceding lengthy opposition run-ons.
 
I think the addition of Harmes and trying to rotate a few more bodies through the middle is very much geared towards freeing up Bont to use his unmatched class to win the football. Bont is an excellent tackler, and that side of his game will always be there, but if he is doing a little less dirty work it may keep him fresher throughout the game.
 
ACLs are a b#stard and it's not something you hope comes to any player.

That said, the midfield and team generally looks to be in a better place in the absence of any need or external pressure to accommodate Bailey Smith.

I have hope where previously I may have had little.
 
Libbaaaa said:
I think the addition of Harmes and trying to rotate a few more bodies through the middle is very much geared towards freeing up Bont to use his unmatched class to win the football. Bont is an excellent tackler, and that side of his game will always be there, but if he is doing a little less dirty work it may keep him fresher throughout the game.
Click to expand...
Hopefully fresher throughout the back 9 of his career also.
 
Tom is the lynchpin of the midfield as the in and under player. If he’s out or not firing Bont, Macrae, Adz, etc don’t get the ball out of the stoppage
 

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Opinion Midfield 2024 season Strength

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