Mitch McGovern 2: As The Worm Turns (read the OP)

[Crow till I die]

Interesting, hadn’t thought about list numbers.

Note we only had 39 in 2018.
Out: McGovern, Hampton, Dear, Gibson, Cheney/Kelly
In: Stengle, Smith, McAdam, Pick 8, Pick 16, Pick 21, Pick 37, Pick 27, Pick 29

So even assuming one of Cheney/Kelly are going to be traded/delisted that leaves us with a maximum six spots to fill. But, we’ve shown we prefer to go 39 due to salary cap recently meaning more likely only going to be 5 spots unless there’s other players going. Keeping Mackay looks like a terrible option when you look at all this.

If the picks proposed GC/Carlton/Adelaide trade is true (Picks 2+3) that would be 4 in with Smith possibly taking the 5th free spot leaving pick 37 not in use.

Trade pick 37 for a future pick if that happened

 

[Crow till I die]

But it’s not really believable, is it? GC already have 2,3,17,26,29, plus whatever they might get for May. But they might only have 5-6 spots to fill. Why would they trade their top end picks for even more picks in the 15-30 range that they probably wouldn’t need. It doesn’t really make any sense.

I think they have more list spots to fill than 4 or 5

 

[Shaz2012]

It's all hypothetical but was only throwing around names and draft picks that have been linked to the club.

I agree that all the players at the lower end of the scale in terms of draft value but if they're traded them in for specific needs, then list spots to draft picks doesn't add up. It's just something I've been thinking about in the terms of the likelihood vs. cost in real terms of trying to bundle picks to move up the draft order.

Yeah, its a good point you make. It just also highlights to me that a lot of the hypothetical trades don't make any sense. For one, I would be surprised if we went for both Stengle and McAdam and it looks like we are committed to Stengle since it was mentioned on afc.com.au. For me, working through those 6 available spots, I would expect us to let Signarello go and re-sign one of, if not both, Otten and Cheney. Potentially, we could re-rookie one of them. That leaves 4 or 5 spots, with current useful picks of 8, 16, 20 and 40. I dont think Stengle costs us 40 given he is an out of contract rookie and assuming we pick up Smith as an out of contract player for a late pick that leaves 2 or 3 spots with 8, 16, 20 and 40.

So for the people suggesting that we might accept Carlton's two seconds, it just doesn't add up. We would have a maximum of 4 spots on our list and so one of those picks would not even be used. If we did re-sign both Cheney and Otten, which is highly likely imo, neither of Carlton's seconds would even be used.

It goes back to whose responsibility it would be to turn those 2nd rounders into a pick that we would want, and it simply has to be Carlton.

 

[1990crow]

I think they have more list spots to fill than 4 or 5

At my count they will have 8-10.

 

[Golumless]

He wasn't happy with how Reid went last year? Hopefully we arent going back to the Noble days

Or we're being more aggressive with trying to sell our club to other players. Though, it does make you wonder if we're thinking about adding a couple of speculative talents to our list if he's there (seeing I doubt we'll even entertain the idea of trading firsts without getting a higher 1st round pick).

 

[GreyCrow]

who says Don is there to do anything but have a holiday?

 

[Pea Nut]

You have no idea what trade value the state players have do you. You're assuming.

His valuation is a lot closer to reality than an overwhelming number of Carlton supporters who are convinced that the state players have the equivalent value of an end of first round priority draft pick, and follow it up with "oh but Tim Kelly was good this year and he was pick 24". That's the true delusion.

 

[Rory Walkerfield]

At my count they will have 8-10.

Ok, and they currently have 4 top 30 picks plus the lynch compo to come. Plus potentially may and Hall picks.

 

[Golumless]

You have no idea what trade value the state players have do you. You're assuming.

We do know, and the value is practically 0.

They are akin to the speculative rookie pick player. Sure a club may want them, but really, they're not going to give up much if anything to get them.

Unfortunately we're dealing with this utterly terrible idea of them being used in a trade because Geelong hit the needle in the haystack. The absolute fluke that could make the transition, and be a star season 1.

 

[Miss Vanessa]

At my count they will have 8-10.

What is the count though? They have already delisted 3 from the senior list, plus Lynch, May and Hall. There’s six spots, but they are trading in another (can’t recall who exactly). So that’s 5. Who are the other 3-5 who are being cut? If you can name them, then sure, GC might go for a multiple pick downgrade, but it just seems more like wishful thinking from Crows fans than anything concrete.

 

[Rory Walkerfield]

What is the count though? They have already delisted 3 from the senior list, plus Lynch, May and Hall. There’s six spots, but they are trading in another (can’t recall who exactly). So that’s 5. Who are the other 3-5 who are being cut? If you can name them, then sure, GC might go for a multiple pick downgrade, but it just seems more like wishful thinking from Crows fans than anything concrete.

I also thought their list manager or club rep said they won’t trade 2 or 3 but would consider trading 5 if they got that for May.

 

[Miss Vanessa]

I also thought their list manager or club rep said they won’t trade 2 or 3 but would consider trading 5 if they got that for May.

Plus, there’s that... again, it all just seems like very wishful thinking on our behalf.

 

[Rory Walkerfield]

Plus, there’s that... again, it all just seems like very wishful thinking on our behalf.

I can see us packaging up a few picks and getting 5 off GC, but nothing more. Ogilvie did say that picks1, 2, 3 and 4 are rarely traded. Interesting he stopped at 4...

 

[Crow till I die]

What is the count though? They have already delisted 3 from the senior list, plus Lynch, May and Hall. There’s six spots, but they are trading in another (can’t recall who exactly). So that’s 5. Who are the other 3-5 who are being cut? If you can name them, then sure, GC might go for a multiple pick downgrade, but it just seems more like wishful thinking from Crows fans than anything concrete.

Scrimshaw is leaving, barlow delisted and another was delisted from memory and i think another player indicated they wanted to be traded as well

 

[Pea Nut]

I also thought their list manager or club rep said they won’t trade 2 or 3 but would consider trading 5 if they got that for May.

Consider everything that list managers say at this time of year with a grain of salt. They regularly say 1 thing and then do the opposite. There's a lot of posturing. Freo came out and said they won't trade Lachie Neale. Not saying one way or another in this case, but just because a list manager has said something doesn't mean that's the end of it.

 

[Pea Nut]

Scrimshaw is leaving, barlow delisted and another was delisted from memory and i think another player indicated they wanted to be traded as well

Mackenzie Willis.

 

[Rory Walkerfield]

Scrimshaw is leaving, barlow delisted and another was delisted from memory and i think another player indicated they wanted to be traded as well

Michael Barlow (del)
Josh Jaska (del)
Michael Rischitelli (del)
Matt Rosa (ret)
Max Spencer (del)
Mackenzie Willis (del)

Add to this Lynch, Scrimshaw and potentially May, Martin and Hall.

I thought Rischitelli for one would be offered a rookie spot.

 

[ad victoriam]

I think they have more list spots to fill than 4 or 5

Currently have 6 delisted without adding Lynch, May, Scrimshaw, Hall and maybe Brodie
that will make it up to 11, with 3 mature age player coming in means they will need 8 drafts, 3 of them will be used on academy players.
Looking ahead for a team that will need 11 players this is the draft to do it. more so if most of those picks are in before 3rd round starts.

 

[Pea Nut]

I thought Rischitelli for one would be offered a rookie spot.

They have already confirmed that they will after his name and image went up on the screen of retiring players at the Brownlow.

 

[footy4ever]

If that happens the Non-Crows thread will be an absolute delight for the whole off-season won't it.

Just wait until Port manoeuvre to get Rankine. That's who I want before all others, and I feel sick thinking there's even the remotest possibility he'll end up at Port.

 

[ad victoriam]

What is the count though? They have already delisted 3 from the senior list, plus Lynch, May and Hall. There’s six spots, but they are trading in another (can’t recall who exactly). So that’s 5. Who are the other 3-5 who are being cut? If you can name them, then sure, GC might go for a multiple pick downgrade, but it just seems more like wishful thinking from Crows fans than anything concrete.

Delisted or retired - Barlow, Jaska, Rishitelli, Rosa, Spencer, Willis, then you have the follow group who may or have requested trades, Lynch, May, Scrimshaw, Hall, Maybe Martin, Brodie

That makes up to 12.

 

[Samcro24]

who says Don is there to do anything but have a holiday?

Neil used to shoot the shit with the Victory coach for the whole trade week didn't he?

 

[Bicks]

Michael Barlow (del)
Josh Jaska (del)
Michael Rischitelli (del)
Matt Rosa (ret)
Max Spencer (del)
Mackenzie Willis (del)

Add to this Lynch, Scrimshaw and potentially May, Martin and Hall.

I thought Rischitelli for one would be offered a rookie spot.

I'd love to get Jaska over on a Lachie Murphy SANFL "apprenticeship", really liked him when playing for the Geelong Falcons and Vic Country in 2017, just needed to beef up a bit, pretty decent all round skills. Tall defender and reasonably athletic and good closing speed.

http://www.afl.com.au/video/2016-11-10/draft-prospect-josh-jaska

 

[Gets!]

Just wait until Port manoeuvre to get Rankine. That's who I want before all others, and I feel sick thinking there's even the remotest possibility he'll end up at Port.

Yep agreed. Rankine in Port Power colours is just vomit inducing. If I’m picking right now between him and Luko, I’m going Rankine. Oozes of someone who will light up GF day...

 

[Crowked]

Jesus that was an epic long catch up, only to find nothing has happened, just another cycle of the same shyte.

3 things.

The Gov deal could only be done if we are getting pick 1 as a straight swap. So obviously it’s not done in any way shape or form.

State league players have almost no trade value at all. This is in response to a Carlton fan asking.

Lastly, if we can get Burton from Hawthorn for pick 15, we should do it if we are confident of his knee. Will be a gun swing man if his knee holds up. Would be a handy get since we might be losing one.