Unofficial Preview Prelim discussion v Demons/Blues / Gunston watch.

[dlanod]

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Edit: thanks Section 5

 

[Squizz89]

Fages making a big mistake leaving 10 goals on the table

At which end?

 

[Squizz89]

All jokes aside, it wouldn’t shock me if he played, if we play Melbourne. We played pretty well down there against them with him in the team, until we shit the bed late. I’m not saying I want that to happen, but I could (only just) understand the rationale against them.

Carlton, not so much.

 

[martinson]

All jokes aside, it wouldn’t shock me if he played, if we play Melbourne. We played pretty well down there against them with him in the team, until we s**t the bed late. I’m not saying I want that to happen, but I could (only just) understand the rationale against them.

Carlton, not so much.

I wouldn't get it in any respect.

Just looking at the body of work this year and the fact that he effectively had to be retired to save the indignity of being dropped. Any other player wouldn't have a hope of winning their spot back.

This is a dangerous thing to say but I could see him getting up for one game with time off if thing's went well and you could ambush the opposition somehow.

But no one rational would risk it. I don't know why anyone would expect him to go better or even adequately in a fierce finals game on anything I've seen this year. We went through the same thing at Fitzroy with recycled champions who were past it. Probably up to a dozen who played one or two good games and you kept thinking they were contributing something but once they weren't there it improved the team.

 

[Cubs2Lions]

I wouldn't get it in any respect.

Just looking at the body of work this year and the fact that he effectively had to be retired to save the indignity of being dropped. Any other player wouldn't have a hope of winning their spot back.

This is a dangerous thing to say but I could see him getting up for one game with time off if thing's went well and you could ambush the opposition somehow.

But no one rational would risk it. I don't know why anyone would expect him to go better or even adequately in a fierce finals game on anything I've seen this year. We went through the same thing at Fitzroy with recycled champions who were past it. Probably up to a dozen who played one or two good games and you kept thinking they were contributing something but once they weren't there it improved the team.

I say we keep the lineup 100% as it is and then either one of Rich, Gunston or Lyons battles it out a 100m race on GF week to decide who will be our sub for the upcoming Grand Final

 

[Viceregal]

Fages making a big mistake leaving 10 goals on the table

Why would we want to spot the Pies/Giants/Power a 10 goal lead? I mean its not like we need the extra challenge or anything...

 

[3KZ is Football]

I wouldn't get it in any respect.

Just looking at the body of work this year and the fact that he effectively had to be retired to save the indignity of being dropped. Any other player wouldn't have a hope of winning their spot back.

This is a dangerous thing to say but I could see him getting up for one game with time off if thing's went well and you could ambush the opposition somehow.

But no one rational would risk it. I don't know why anyone would expect him to go better or even adequately in a fierce finals game on anything I've seen this year. We went through the same thing at Fitzroy with recycled champions who were past it. Probably up to a dozen who played one or two good games and you kept thinking they were contributing something but once they weren't there it improved the team.

Len Thompson are John Rantall the two that most readily spring to mind, in that they come closest to the moniker “champion”. I thought Max Richardson and Robert Walls were serviceable. Then there are players like John Cassin and Warwick Irwin when we took him back after he left us for Collingwood. Both were mistakes, especially Cassin.

 

[martinson]

Len Thompson are John Rantall the two that most readily spring to mind, in that they come closest to the moniker “champion”. I thought Max Richardson and Robert Walls were serviceable. Then there are players like John Cassin and Warwick Irwin when we took him back after he left us for Collingwood. Both were mistakes, especially Cassin.

So often you see clubs and supporters getting sucked in by the past. Or more often accepting that they're not as good as they were but they still offer something or at least something better than what we've got. Hardly ever works. No one ever got anywhere looking in the rear vision mirror.

Btw these comments aren't directed at Gunston in particular. Just an observation over decades of watching clubs waste their time on has beens. In this era we've been very good at getting hold of elite players still on their way up. I think we have enough experience in the team now to look to improve with youth.

As for the players you mention Thompson and Rantall were elite champions but done when we got hold of them. Max and Wallsy were still good players in H/A but when it got to finals just got outpaced.

 

[Elixuh]

Fages making a big mistake leaving 10 goals on the table

Fages just wants our opposition to relax thinking gunners isn’t playing. When it’s announced he is playing our opposition will panic. It’s all part of the plan.

 

[3KZ is Football]

Fages just wants our opposition to relax thinking gunners isn’t playing. When it’s announced he is playing our opposition will panic. It’s all part of the plan.

What? RELEASE THE KRAKEN style?

 

[3KZ is Football]

So often you see clubs and supporters getting sucked in by the past. Or more often accepting that they're not as good as they were but they still offer something or at least something better than what we've got. Hardly ever works. No one ever got anywhere looking in the rear vision mirror.

Btw these comments aren't directed at Gunston in particular. Just an observation over decades of watching clubs waste their time on has beens. In this era we've been very good at getting hold of elite players still on their way up. I think we have enough experience in the team now to look to improve with youth.

As for the players you mention Thompson and Rantall were elite champions but done when we got hold of them. Max and Wallsy were still good players in H/A but when it got to finals just got outpaced.

I actually think Wallsy was OK in 1979, but he really hit the wall in 1980. Still got among the goals, but in a side that had Richardson, Thompson and Rantall all in their final years and Merrigan virtually finished.

For our Gunston link, Walls scored goals in 9 out of 12 games in his final year. This year Gunston has scored in 9 out of 17 games.

In his final year, Walls scored 23 goals at 1.9 goals a game, in a side that finished bottom of the ladder, which was still slightly better than his career average of 1.7 goals a game.

This year, Gunston has kicked 22 goals at 1.3 goals a game, which is below his career average of 1.87 goals a game. It is also worth remembering that 6 of his goals came against the West Coast Eagles.

This year, Gunston’s return against teams who are still in the finals race has been.

Port Adelaide: 2 goals - losing side.
Melbourne: 0 goals - winning side.
Collingwood: 0 goals - winning side.
Carlton: 2 goals - winning side.
G.W.S: Did not play.

We kicked 19 goals in the Qualifying Final, against Port Adelaide, with a forward line that is becoming more cohesive and dangerous WITHOUT GUNSTON.

Qualifying Final GOALS
Daniher 5, Rayner 3, Fletcher 3, Cameron 2, Zorko, McCluggage, McCarthy, Lyons, Hipwood, Bailey

The beautiful thing about our forward line is that there is space for players to move through and it is very hard to match up on. Our run and defensive pressure was also awesome, particularly from Hipwood and Cameron who were fantastic up the ground. Teams that stand between us and the Premiership will be spending hours and hours trying to work out how they can stop the best forward line in the competition.

There is absolutely NOTHING that can be improved or gained by including Gunston. Ultimately the point that martinson makes, that it will not happen because our football department can’t be that stupid stands. As I’ve said, including Gunston will go down as the greatest act of self sabotage I have ever seen in well over 50 years of following football.

P.S.
In his first year at Fitzroy, the much maligned Jeff Hogg scored goals in 10 of 16 games. He kicked 23 goals for an average return of 1.43 goals per game. He also managed this in a side that finished second bottom of the ladder with 5 wins. A performance that rates much more highly than Gunston’s this year.

Hoggie!

 

[KissKiss]

That's a hard one actually

It depends who went down doesn't it.

I think I'd probably go Lyons but wish I had other choices.

Looks like Fullarton's on the outer. You wouldn't trust Cockatoo to make it through a game . Lohman's done . Matho ?

Or Fort ? If it was a tall who went down I'd take Fort.

Not much else lying around. It's a shame about Ashy but if he's the only one we can't consider we're ahead of the rest this year injury wise.

Personally think Prior is the best option of who is available. Hes probably the most positional flexible in can play a few different roles, and is willing to run and work hard defensively. He was tough to be dropped last time round as well

 

[martinson]

Personally think Prior is the best option of who is available. Hes probably the most positional flexible in can play a few different roles, and is willing to run and work hard defensively. He was tough to be dropped last time round as well

Yes I forgot about him. He hasn't kicked on as we might've hoped but at least you know he'd give his all.

 

[Viceregal]

IF ..​

the Lions are already waiting for the winner of the Blues-Demons semi-final ...

THEN ...​

I can only imagine how jumbled some Lions supporters' emotions will be if it's a Michael Voss-coached team heading their way for a prelim.


Nah no conflit at all for me GO LIONS! - and even if they win and it is a Voss-coached Blues in the GF my pro Voss and anti-Blues biases will pretty much cancel each other out and it will depend who they are playing out of Pies/Port/GWS!

 

[Cubs2Lions]

 

[BrainOfMorbius]

IF ..​

the Lions are already waiting for the winner of the Blues-Demons semi-final ...

THEN ...​

I can only imagine how jumbled some Lions supporters' emotions will be if it's a Michael Voss-coached team heading their way for a prelim.


Nah no conflit at all for me GO LIONS! - and even if they win and it is a Voss-coached Blues in the GF my pro Voss and anti-Blues biases will pretty much cancel each other out and it will depend who they are playing out of Pies/Port/GWS!

I know where he's coming from on this though. 100% Lions but I'd prefer not to be the club that ends Vossy's redemption arc as a coach. He will always be this club's greatest ever son in my eyes.

 

[mpal6]

I know where he's coming from on this though. 100% Lions but I'd prefer not to be the club that ends Vossy's redemption arc as a coach. He will always be this club's greatest ever son in my eyes.

They've achieved their goal for this season already. Got to finals and won 1 too ! Everything now is a bonus for them from that context so I'll be more than happy to face them in a prelim.

 

[WheildonTheAxe]

I still think that Melbourne have more weapons than Carlton that are harder for us to shut down (namely Petracca and Gawn). So I'm happy to welcome Voss back.

 

[twhowler]

I still think that Melbourne have more weapons than Carlton that are harder for us to shut down (namely Petracca and Gawn). So I'm happy to welcome Voss back.

I tend to agree and wonder as much as we are told revenge is not a factor, whether that semi final loss burns deep for the dees.

Blues would likely get back Silvagni and Martin. Although if they opted to play McKay instead of Silvagni i think that would be a bonus for us.

 

[Tom14]

I still think that Melbourne have more weapons than Carlton that are harder for us to shut down (namely Petracca and Gawn). So I'm happy to welcome Voss back.

Yeah Carlton's midfield is very very good but they don't have anyone as dynamic as Petracca, and Gawn would be our biggest problem.

Curnow obviously a million times better than any Dees forward but provided we can keep clearances and contested ball close, we'll score on Carlton.

 

[rye]

both teams play pretty similar styles of footy tbh. expecting the game tonight to border on unwatchable if their last two encounters are anything to go by

 

[Viceregal]

And for those who feel like they are in a wasteland of waiting where nothing is happening on our second weekend off ... tonight there will be change!

The thread title tonight (or tomorrow) will read either

Prelim discussion v Demons / Gunston watch.
or
Prelim discussion v Blues / Gunston watch.
or ideally one of the above with the end being / Gunstan recused himself for the rest of the seaon!

​

 

[StevoJenkins]

Think that GWS will go over Port, then GWS will get killed by Collywobble.
Would like GWS to win the chocies against Collywooble, only to be beat by us, but don't see it happening.

Out of Melbourne vs Carlton, probably want Melbourne to get through. Carlton have been on a roll, regardless of if they are at the Gabba, they will be confident due to their winning streak. Melbourne are down a fit league-best ruckman (Gawn has a broken toe) and one of their best mids and their forwardline has been meh for a while.

Carlton could try and play their grand final, get a bunch of injuries, then play us, but I doubt it.

 

[Dalions]

both teams play pretty similar styles of footy tbh. expecting the game tonight to border on unwatchable if their last two encounters are anything to go by

If we play at our best we can beat Either.

 

[Dalions]

Melbourne are down a fit league-best ruckman (Gawn has a broken toe) and one of their best mids and their forwardline has been meh for a while.

I wouldn’t read too much into the Gawn talk.
Since Grundy was left out of the side, he has been the best Ruckman in the game by far.

 

[The Zork]

The players who I think can hurt us.

Melbourne dangers:
Gawn
Petracca
Pickett
I’ll throw Fritsch in

Carlton dangers:
Curnow
Cripps leaving his feet to bump

They’ve obviously both got quality elsewhere but if these players get going we can find ourselves in trouble.