Discussion Round 1, Best 22

[mysainters]

Noticed that Gold Coast's Tom Lynch is out for 6 weeks, so won't be playing round one. Bock and McKenzie also not expected to be playing, as they are eased back into the team.

All important players...

 

[Defacto]

Scott Watters was just on SEN and very Interestig wordig when talking about Tom Lee. Said "we expect him to force his way into side DURING the year" so to me sounds like they aren't expecting to see him early in year bit like Maister last year.

just like we were saying all along that he will take time and will be much like beaue but probably a bit better given the extra miles claremont got into his legs in the 2nd half of the season

 

[bradfooks]

Dempster Simpkin Blake
Newnes Fisher Gilbert
Dal santo Hayes Montagna
Siposs Riewoldt Milera
Milne Tom Lee Saad
Mcevoy Jones Armitage
Dennis-lane Roberton Steven Hickey

My only trouble was fitting Geary, Gwilt, Kosi, Ross & Ray in. Injuries and form will see these guys out. Very tough for spots first up. Why people didn't have the likes of Blake and Montagna in team, proven performers and will do their job week in week out

 

[aussierulesrules]

In the words of the great poets and philosophers, yeah...nah.

Montagna has been left out of teams for R1 because he is suspended and will miss round one. Gwilt, Geary and Maister are very easily in our best 22 right now.

 

[Highlander35]

Dempster Simpkin Blake
Newnes Fisher Gilbert
Dal santo Hayes Montagna
Siposs Riewoldt Milera
Milne Tom Lee Saad
Mcevoy Jones Armitage
Dennis-lane Roberton Steven Hickey

My only trouble was fitting Geary, Gwilt, Kosi, Ross & Ray in. Injuries and form will see these guys out. Very tough for spots first up. Why people didn't have the likes of Blake and Montagna in team, proven performers and will do their job week in week out

Well, for starters, Joey is suspended for round 1. If Hickey's on the bench Gwilt offers more than blake in that 3rd Tall defender role. Geary will be in the side ahead of Roberton. NEwnes will likely be the sub in that side, and gilbert will play up the field. Maister will be ahead of Lee. Schneids will probably push ahead of at least one of TDL and Milera. Jones' Foot skills could see him dropped. And then you've got Stanley at FB or up forward to consider.

So a side such as:

Dempster Stanley Simpkin
Geary Fisher Gwilt
Steven Dal Santo Gilbert
Schneider Riewoldt Maister
Milne Hickey Saad
McEvoy Armitage Hayes

Ray Siposs Milera Newnes (s)

Emg: Blake TDL Jones

isn't exactly unrealistic for round 1.

 

[Defacto]

In the words of the great poets and philosophers, yeah...nah.

Montagna has been left out of teams for R1 because he is suspended and will miss round one. Gwilt, Geary and Maister are very easily in our best 22 right now.

agree with that. you werent wrong when you said beau was marking everything on the weekend. worked very well up the ground

 

[SaintLex]

B: Jarryn Geary, Sam Fisher, Tom Simpkin
HB: Arryn Siposs, James Gwilt, Sean Dempster
C: Leigh Montagna, Lenny Hayes, Nick Dal Santo
HF: Adam Schneider, Nick Riewoldt, TDL
F: Ahmed Saad, Beau Maister, Stephen Milne
R: Ben McEvoy, David Armitage, Jack Steven
INT: Sam Gilbert, Farren Ray, Jack Newnes
SUB: Happy for it to go to any one of Terry Milera, Seb Ross, Tom Ledger, Sam Dunell, Nathan Wright etc. provided that they prove that they deserve it through VFL form

Notes:
1. Joey is obviously suspended for Round 1 so I would start Newnes in his position and then perhaps put Ross or maybe even Wright on the bench
2. Not convinced the two ruckman (Hickey/McEvoy) works so i've decided to just go with McEvoy. However, I really hope i'm proven wrong because we really need to start winning more hitouts to remain competitive
3. I've left stanley out because a) he's injured and we should give him all the time he needs to recover/gain match fitness instead of rushing him back and b) I think it would be worthwhile giving him a few games in the VFL to develop his defensive side instead of throwing him in the deep end
4. I'm willing to consider swapping out one of the small forwards for Kosi in the event where we want to use 3 talls to stretch the opposition's defense.

** I really hope I haven't forgotten anyone!

 

[Saint4Life]

Dempster Stanley Simpkin
Siposs Fisher Gwilt
Steven Dal Santo Montagna
Schneider Riewoldt Saad
Milne Maister Milera

McEvoy Armitage Hayes

Int: Ray, Newnes, Geary, Hickey

Emergencies: Kosi , Gilbert, Lee, TDL, Jones, Blake, Roberton, Dunnell, Ledger

Gilbert is an interesting one, might have to play midfield or something, as we seem to have enough backs so to speak, although probably better Geary did.
Kosi still is very important to structure imo, he just grabs those pack marks better than Maister, just depends when hes "on".
Ray can play back or in the middle, great imo. Newness is a gun.
I want to see what Hickey's work rate is around the ground.

Very tough to pick a top 22, I like it

I reckon vs Richmond, we need to stretch them for Talls.

Griffiths beat Roo, and Jack beat Simpkin (and has kicked farken 6 goals against us every game for a while iirc), so having the 3 rucks (stanley, hickey, mac) should help, in fact maybe even Kosi. Interesting times anyway.

 

[Defacto]

my best 22 for round 1 (stanley, monty excluded due to injury)

B Wright Gilbert Gwilt
HB Dempster Fisher Siposs
C Geary Hayes Steven
HF Schneider Rewioldt Hyphen
F Milne Meister Saad
R McEvoy Dal Armitage
I/C Ray Newnes Milera Hickey

 

[FlyingSledghamer]

B: Jarryn Geary, Sam Fisher, Tom Simpkin
HB: Arryn Siposs, James Gwilt, Sean Dempster
C: Leigh Montagna, Lenny Hayes, Nick Dal Santo
HF: Adam Schneider, Nick Riewoldt, TDL
F: Ahmed Saad, Beau Maister, Stephen Milne
R: Ben McEvoy, David Armitage, Jack Steven
INT: Sam Gilbert, Farren Ray, Jack Newnes
SUB: Happy for it to go to any one of Terry Milera, Seb Ross, Tom Ledger, Sam Dunell, Nathan Wright etc. provided that they prove that they deserve it through VFL form

Notes:
1. Joey is obviously suspended for Round 1 so I would start Newnes in his position and then perhaps put Ross or maybe even Wright on the bench
2. Not convinced the two ruckman (Hickey/McEvoy) works so i've decided to just go with McEvoy. However, I really hope i'm proven wrong because we really need to start winning more hitouts to remain competitive
3. I've left stanley out because a) he's injured and we should give him all the time he needs to recover/gain match fitness instead of rushing him back and b) I think it would be worthwhile giving him a few games in the VFL to develop his defensive side instead of throwing him in the deep end
4. I'm willing to consider swapping out one of the small forwards for Kosi in the event where we want to use 3 talls to stretch the opposition's defense.

** I really hope I haven't forgotten anyone!

I like your squad. I think we need to have a real focus on development. I really hope Stanley can stay on the park and play FB, however since this is questionable, this is a position we need to develop, so Ferguson has to come in just in case IMO. With Goddard gone theres too much cost price in having Fisher or Gilbert play KP defenders, they have to be play makers outside D50 and theres no way Simpkin should have to take the 1 tall forward.
Also, all of the mosquito fleet deserve to be and should be in the team in R1. Including Schnides if he's fit.
So I'll give it a go.

Gwilt - Ferguson - Simpkin
Dempster - Fisher - Gilbert
Geary - Hayes - Sipposs
Schnider - Roo - Dal
Saad - Maister - Milne
McEvoy - Armo - Steven
INT: TDL, Blake, Newnes S: Milera

Hickey? Jones? Roberton? Ray? and then the big ???'s Stanley? Murdoch? Wright? Dunnell?

 

[stkildathunda]

This will make selecting our best 22 little easier.

“I’ve got a pretty clear message that I’m fighting for a spot,” Koschitzke said.

“The club’s keen for me to play but the coach has been pretty direct in telling me that I need to put my best foot forward each week.

“Reputations are out the window because we’ve got some good kids coming through.”

“My role will still be the same as a target forward who can pinch hit in the ruck,” he said.

“I’ll do a bit of mentoring with the kids, too.

“Benny McEvoy is really coming along and has turned into a solid player.

“(Tom) Hickey is a promising young player who can take a catch, as well.

“I’m directly competing with him, probably, depending on our structures.

http://www.bordermail.com.au/story/1352366/koschitzke-in-fight-to-hold-saints-spot/

 

[mysainters]

So internally, Stanley is perceived now as a defender and is out of the forwards mix.

Kosi is competing with Hickey for the third tall spot and not with Maister, who it appears will play as well as the 2 talls...and not in place of one.

 

[aussierulesrules]

I would suggest that Beau is almost as much of a lock as Nick is, after being a permanent fixture in our side at the end of last season and looking considerably better this time around, as are Milne and Saad and that Kosi and Hickey are now fighting for the "forward/ruck" spot, with Rhys set to play down back.

I guess the other questions will then be how many of Milera, TDL and Schneider we're able to play and whether we are able to squeeze Lee in at some point, if he continues to improve at the rate he did from his first games in R1 of the NAB Cup to his next game, last weekend, as he really showed a lot of promise against Melbourne.

If he's fit enough to play 4 full quarters then it's pretty hard to justify leaving someone out who is able to take marks with such regularity, both inside the F50 and out (and who's passing into the F50 can be so good, when he does get it outside) and who also has the speed to be able to get it running back the other way, with an open F50. He made plenty of blunders, but the fact is that he took 7 marks (including 4 inside F50), had 4 shots at goal and 3 inside 50's in only about 60 mins of footy, which is nothing to sneeze at, especially since it's pretty clear that he is still just finding his feet.

If he plays again this week and IF he builds on what he did last weekend (ie improves on it, like how he improved considerably from R1 of the NAB Cup to last weekend) then he would surely come into serious considerations, as soon as R1, particularly given we play both GC and GWS in the first 3 rounds.

With it likely to be very greasy in R1 I expect us to go with as many of the "mosquito fleet" as are fit, though, to take advantage of the conditions.

 

[TheLastEmperor]

B: Geary Gwilt Dempster
HB: Siposs Fisher Roberton
C: Gilbert Hayes Dal Santo
HF: Ray Riewoldt Lee
F: Milne Maister Saad
R: McEvoy Armitage Steven
I: Newnes Hickey TDL Milera

A few changes since last time I put up my best 22 (avail) for round 1.

I have doubts Schnieder and Simpkin will be match fit for round 1, so even know I see them best 22 I suspect they won't be considered at the beginning of the season.

In terms of our midfield, Monty will be a big loss so I'm thinking Jones is a big chance to play although I'm going for more creative players in Milera and TDL. I wouldn't be surprised if either miss for Jones though.

For our backline I've brought in Robertson because as mentioned, I doubt Simpkin will be considered and they are similar types although Robertson adds a bit more run.

I suspect SW's likes the idea of 2 tall's (minimum), 2 small's and either another tall or medium-tall set-up in the forward 50. With Stanley likely unavailable I see it between Kosi and Lee. I think even know Lee isn't proven and has had a up and down NAB Cup, SW's still has high hopes that he will improve enough when given games to translate into a decent AFL player. The key is giving Lee time and being patient with him at the start of the season.

I've also gone two rucks. One can rest forward or stay on the bench without having a negative effect on the structure IMO. Roo, Lee and Maister are all capable of playing further up the ground.

 

[mysainters]

Koschitzke said he had been advised to go under the knife at the end of last season after the Saints narrowly missed out on finals. But for the former No. 2 draft pick, the extended layoff that comes after surgery wasn't an option. Not if he wanted to keep his spot in the side. "At my age I couldn't have afforded it," Koschitzke admitted.
"I had a dicky shoulder and a bit of a hip complaint but now I'm feeling really good. It was the right move. The body has held up well."

Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/koschitzke-in-fight-to-hold-saints-spot-20130312-2fwvp.html#ixzz2NHkGyHIB

I was adamantly told he was not injured or carrying anything...

It makes complete sense to me given the form he was in, to suddenly struggling.

Instead of Kosi copping it from the fans, we should IMO, have been frustrated that these guys for so long...had to play through injury. That guys like Justin are subjected to the ridicule of fans because there is nobody to cover for them when they are no 100%

I think his football is still valued, but he is just not the guy who can play through injury, which at his frame and height, history of injury, and stage of his career...probably isn't the shame to him that many think.

Let's give ALL our players the benefit of the doubt is all I'm saying.

He is fighting Hickey for his spot, that's a reality, but if he gets a gig...how about we support him?

Forget 35 degree hitouts, if he is up to it still when the season proper begins, and there is a spot for him, Maiser and Roo to intimidate opposition defences, well good on him.

 

[stkildathunda]

90% of AFL footballers go for post season operations, it's nothing new at all and noone should be surprised when player does go in.

Fact still is he was dropped for some horrendous form over last half of season. You get absolutely no sympathy from me f you decide to play injured. As soon as you cross that line you are saying to clubs and most importantly the fans you are 100% fit.

This goes for any player, I still can't believe club tried to hide fact Roo injured his knee at training day before Adelaide game. The game he had to go off within 2mins of start.

 

[aussierulesrules]

I was adamantly told he was not injured or carrying anything...and the general tone of this thread was hugely unfair and made me feel a little stupid at the time. I had been told he was carrying something, and had heard it was a hip at the time.

It's a bit frustrating to be honest, I like that usually this is a place to share stuff without feeling ignorant....

I'm sorry you felt stupid but I'm not sure anyone came out and said unequivocally that he wasn't carrying anything (although they might have), but the problem was that he said himself in an interview that he "was in the best shape he'd been in his career" late in the year and then Tom Harley said during commentary of the GWS game that the word out of the club was that he had been "dropped" and then there are others who said that Watters said that he had been as well, so when all that is the case it is not easy to just go off someone online saying "I've heard such and such" and take their word for it over all the other evidence at hand, including from the guy himself. That's a very big ask and I think you're taking it way too personally and emotionally. If you had consistently good mail on stuff like this then that would be more fair enough, but I'm not aware of you having had lots of good mail that has proved to be the case that should make us take everything you say as gospel just yet. Now that your mail has proved to be correct on this one I'm sure this will help if you get more in the future.

I for one thought that the chances were that he was carrying something, for the reason you stated (he went from playing well to struggling big time) but there was also the chance that he had simply hit the wall, or that he was struggling with the extra demands of playing in the ruck, so with all the conflicting reports and suggestions, I didn't state anything as "fact" either way (as far as whether he was injured or not was concerned), as I wanted to wait until I saw something like this to make me more sure either way. Not because I didn't believe that you believed what you were saying to be true, but because whoever you heard it from could have simply been mistaken.

We are going to call his performances as we see them though, hence my saying for instance that I didn't think he was in our best 22 any more, based on those performances, which, on the evidence still in front of me so far this preseason, I still think is likely to be the case, as he hasn't looked any better this time around. Of course he may go better when the season proper starts and if he does then I may very well change that view, but don't forget that prior to his very good start to last year he was in terrific form in the lead-up NAB Cup games, so they were a good indication of how he would go in the season proper. If the same is the case this year, then he is going to be in big trouble once the season starts, as his speed and mobility the other day were just as bad as they were at the end of last year and he hardly looked like making an impact. It will be great for him and us if he turns it around and plays some more really good footy for us, especially since it looks as though Hickey is still a ways off being effective up forward, but as of right now (which is what we have to go on if we don't a crystal ball) he is still on Struggle St.

I will 100% support him, as I do anyone who plays for us, if he plays this year, but that doesn't mean we have to necessarily support the decision to play him, or anyone else, when we're discussing it on here, or that we have to say we think he's still in our best 22 if we don't believe that to be the case.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

While all of the mosquito fleet may "deserve" a spot, I'm not sure that the structure should allow it. ( If you had five good ruckmen would you play them all ).
I'm not sure that I see the benefit of rotating and subbing small forwards while our mids get exhausted.
I guess it really boils down to how effective the likes of Schnieder and Milera are in the mid-field. I'm very respectful of Schnieders skills, but as a midfielder he tends to look a bit slow, and I'm not sure he's ahead of Newnes right now.

 

[Half Back Pocket]

B: Geary Gwilt Simpkin
HB: Siposs Fisher Dempster
C: Gilbert Hayes Dal Santo
HF: Jones Riewoldt TDL
F: Milne Maister Saad
R: McEvoy Armitage Steven
I: Newnes Hickey Ray Milera

Roberton, Lee, Blake

(Stanley, Schneider not considered)

Jones is in for 1 week (swap with Joey) for GA Jnr obviously.

 

[Persevering Saint]

I dunno, I reckon Stanley will come in. If he's playing in the VFL instead, will he be wrestling with a less-strong full forward than what the Coasters will serve up?

 

[Sheeza69]

B: Geary Gwilt Simpkin
HB: Siposs Fisher Dempster
C: Gilbert Hayes Dal Santo
HF: Jones Riewoldt TDL
F: Milne Maister Saad
R: McEvoy Armitage Steven
I: Newnes Hickey Ray Milera

Roberton, Lee, Blake

(Stanley, Schneider not considered)

Jones is in for 1 week (swap with Joey) for GA Jnr obviously.

I picked this squad back on the 19th of Feb,
B: Geary, Fisher, Gwilt,
HB: Simpkin, Stanley, Dempster
C: Siposs, Hayes, Dal Santo,
HF: Milera, Riewoldt, Lee,
F: Milne, Maister, Saad,
R: McEvoy, Armitage, Steven,
Int: Ray, Hickey, Schneider, Newnes, Dennis Lane, Gilbert, Wright,

I'm confident if Lee & Wright play well against GWS next week, their in come Rd1.
If Stanley, Dempster & or Simpkin are unavailable, Gilbo, Ray & maybe Newnes will be in the starting 18.

Leaving TDL, Schneider (if fit), Wright, Hickey, CJ & Murdoch fighting for a spot on the bench on the pine..

Murdoch's late run is a very pleasant position to be in, whilst i wasn't at Casey on Sat, friends have assured me his poise & composure was a stand out. Going to be an AFL player without question.

Slight concern with Siposs, as he appears lost sometimes as a defender. My preference is to see Siposs in the forward half, eventually as a genuine full forward. His marking & kicking for goal often reminds me of a young Fev. At 189cm he's only 2cm shorter than Plugger was.

 

[hayes]

Our first match like last year has trap game written all over it. Hopefully they've learnt from that and we avoid a letdown, because if we do the game against GC really should be just another practice game and provided he's fit I'd throw Stanley in there.

 

[Sheeza69]

Our first match like last year has trap game written all over it. Hopefully they've learnt from that and we avoid a letdown, because if we do the game against GC really should be just another practice game and provided he's fit I'd throw Stanley in there.

And no semi fit players..!
I hoped you liked Rhys down back, like Carlisle of Essendon i sense Rhy's best footy will be at CHB.

 

[aussierulesrules]

With regard to Siposs, after his rather quiet last couple of games, once I noticed that he played 95% of the game on Saturday, in spite of the fact that it was stinking hot, it occurred to me that perhaps he is going through a heavy training phase at the moment, hence him looking so exhausted against Sydney and getting so little of the ball in this last two weeks, after looking so good early in the intra-club game and against Adelaide in the NAB Cup.

In commentary during our game with Sydney it was mentioned that Sydney would probably have still been training heavily during the week, due to starting their preseason a month later than us, hence them dropping off late in the game and that's probably what prompted me to wonder whether Arryn is going through something similar, once I saw that he was on the ground for so long in such hot conditions against Melbourne.

It may be that the club felt he needed to get more miles in his legs, perhaps so that he can play more in the midfield this year and as a result it may be that they are pumping extra training/running sessions (and then 95% of the match) into him leading into R1, to give him a better chance of being able to run out games on the wing, or even just across HB, in the season proper and that that may explain why he is getting a lot less of the ball than he was in the latter part of last year and why he looked so tired against Sydney (and probably again on the weekend).

Otherwise, it's hard to explain why he's dropped off so much, when he theoretically ought to be showing more, now that he's in his 3rd season.

 

[aussierulesrules]

Our first match like last year has trap game written all over it. Hopefully they've learnt from that and we avoid a letdown, because if we do the game against GC really should be just another practice game and provided he's fit I'd throw Stanley in there.

I wouldn't go underestimating Gold Coast, they were generally very competitive up there at Metricon in the 2nd half of last year and ought to be better this time around, especially with the additions of the likes of O'Meara (who had 24 possies last week), Lonergan, Broughton and Murphy and the return of Harbrow. Their backline in particular looks to be stronger and more experienced. Any team that has the likes of Ablett, Bennell, Swallow and O'Meara in their midfield, with Smith in the ruck, is not to be taken lightly, especially if the conditions are greasy, which they ought to be used to.

In our favour this year though is that we look to be hitting the season with much better momentum and form, which we haven't done in either of our last two years, which has flowed into the seasons themselves. Going by what Scotty said the other night we will be taking this game very seriously, so I don't think we'll be taking too many chances, if at all, with those who aren't right.