Autopsy Round 7, 2024: Port Adelaide v St.Kilda

[gringo2011]

I don't really remember any bad Wilkie or Battle game last year.

Also, sometimes it is the depth of the poorness. An AFL quality player shouldn't have even attempted that handball that gifted Port Adelaide a goal on Friday night.

I'll be happy if he improves. I'm just not going to rely on it in any way, shape or form.

We were the number 1 defensive side for a lot of last year with Howard in. Our best defence was peeling back to plug holes and a team defence up the field pressuring as we went. With no midfield we are having to move players from defence into midfield which exposes others and loses cohesion.

If you watch where we let sides take kicks from they are usually lower percentage. Even last year you get chances against us but they'll be 60 meters out on an angle or long range.

We could definitely get a better player but they are either locked into sides or shit too. Mraz looks pretty good in the upcoming draft.

 

[gringo2011]

Howard needs to be cut some slack off a long layoff, I still believe he is the superior option to Cordy, who was given an absolute bath by Naughton last week. But in the long-term it’d be nice to not require either.
Bonner is a genuine liability. Not only can he not defend, he doesn’t put his head over the ball and hold the ball in when that’s the obvious defensive play. In addition, his well lauded kicking has consistently let us down. Sure he racks up disposals but chipping it around in the back line will pad out anyone’s stat line.
Stocker made a couple of blue’s on the weekend but he’s been pretty reliable over his time at the saints. And to echo a previous poster, with Webster back he will be better supported and be able to shine. Overall the backline needs to build continuity with a set 6/7. This will solidify us defensively and enhance our offence out of the back half.

I don't mind Bonner. Apart from his record turnover game he's been solid. He's a depth option that is holding his position. Can't ask much more from a journeyman top up player. He's probably outperforming Billings to be honest and that's a win for us.

 

[pebblesofsand]

Some of the most sublimely skillful players in AFL history wouldn't have pulled off that handpass. Just hold onto the ball and see what the umpires do.

I'm not a Howard hater - I was backing him in for some time, and in 2020 he was excellent. He's a shadow of that player now.

Given that when Howard got the ball, Wilkie was actually an outlet, so the smart move was to handball to Wilkie - the only problem was that Wilkie moved to even up a contest that Howard had already won.

 

[gringo2011]

Also if we had Sheezel, he wouldn't be playing that unaccountable half back role given we have Sinclair and NWM doing that.

He would likely be playing at half fwd role which is much harder. Given his performance, he would probably be doing better than Phillipou has this season but it's a difficult role and much harder when the rest of the forward line is completely dysfunctional.

Or he's kicking 3 goals a week and on track to be a star forward. Hard to know for sure but if it was that easy we'd put Pou on a HBF.

 

[BrutThough]

I don't really remember any bad Wilkie or Battle game last year.

Also, sometimes it is the depth of the poorness. An AFL quality player shouldn't have even attempted that handball that gifted Port Adelaide a goal on Friday night.

I'll be happy if he improves. I'm just not going to rely on it in any way, shape or form.

Battle has done similar handballs into the corridor or just sloppy kicks which cost a goal multiple times over the past 2 years. He just doesn't cop the same heat and criticism for it. Wilkie was fantastic last year but has had some poorer games this year with little criticism (but he does have credits in the bank).

Howard has his things to improve on but I still stand by that he is judged much harsher than his teammates for the mistakes he makes.

 

[BrutThough]

Or he's kicking 3 goals a week and on track to be a star forward. Hard to know for sure but if it was that easy we'd put Pou on a HBF.

I dont think prime Toby Greene could kick 3 goals a week with how we set up the forward line.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

At least we realised pretty quickly that Pelican was a snake-oil salesman. Just a shame Trout lasted so long.

Pelican was the strategist , and some of his stuff might have worked .

Sell off player ...Bring in gun player.

OK Pelican, meet our new gun players, Spencer White, Nathan Wright. Tom Lee?

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Agree on Byrnes and Bonner. Both are work horses, neither are high end but both are Lyon style grunt players. Byrnes kicking has improved but turned over a few under pressure for the first time in ages. Bonner was pretty good even one on one which is his downfall usually.

Wilson seems to have taken a huge lift in confidence from his rising start nom. He played like a guy who knew he belonged. He's been trying few tricks up until now and they don't quite come off but he's realised that he can just outwork his opponent through his elite tank now and doesn't need the flashy stuff.

Byrnes is like the low budget version. He's a runner who gets end to end with the play and always pressures. His skills are a bit downmarket in comparison but he's the type that Lyon first picks.

Hard to judge Howard after such a long layoff. He gets a few games to wind back into it and then you'd question his future. It was a weird side selected with a lot of height and it didn't really work.

I think it remains to be seen if Byrnes is first picked.
As it stands, he's comfortably ahead of the first and second year players.

 

[SG34]

Judge Pou after a decade mate. Either way, Norf weren't interested in our proposal anyway.

This isn’t directed at Pou (mate)
This is about trading out established players - Hunter Clark in particular, to North at the end of ‘22.

Somebody said we could have got Harry Sheezal in such a scenario.

That is what the judgment and reflection was directed at.

 

[Saintbloke]

Wilson is a gun and so will Pou. pou is playing one of the hardest positions on the ground in a team thar can;t hit targets inside 50 anyways. I keep saying it but as soon as he gets a 25+ game his confidence will skyrocket.

I want all our young guys to do well, but to be honest, I don't think Pou has the goods.

 

[gringo2011]

Pelican was the strategist , and some of his stuff might have worked .

Sell off player ...Bring in gun player.

OK Pelican, meet our new gun players, Spencer White, Nathan Wright. Tom Lee?

At a time when GWS and GC were taking the bulk of first round picks. I'm not a gambler but finishing mid table and selling off your stars for a pick that would normally be a second rounder was foolhardy to say the least. If anything it was the time to hold talent and hope that a few slipped through and topped up in trades until the water cleared.

 

[gringo2011]

I want all our young guys to do well, but to be honest, I don't think Pou has the goods.

It takes most players until around 50 games to find consistency and then probably another 50 to peak. It's way too early to tell. He's got elite attributes but having a rather unspectacular second year. Let's see in season 3 and 4 what he looks like.

Not many players hit the ground running. Hunter Clark is mid 20s and still not established. Max King is still considered a kid and he is in his 5th season.

 

[gringo2011]

I think it remains to be seen if Byrnes is first picked.
As it stands, he's comfortably ahead of the first and second year players.

I think he adds something in his ability to run end to end. That looks straight out of the Ross Lyon play book. Guys like Darcy Wilson probably eventually push him out but he's still getting selected even after ordinary games.

 

[Saintbloke]

It takes most players until around 50 games to find consistency and then probably another 50 to peak. It's way too early to tell. He's got elite attributes but having a rather unspectacular second year. Let's see in season 3 and 4 what he looks like.

Not many players hit the ground running. Hunter Clark is mid 20s and still not established. Max King is still considered a kid and he is in his 5th season.

Sorry mate have to disagree about Pou- might have excellent skills, but I just don't think he will make it.

 

[True Believer]

Sorry mate have to disagree about Pou- might have excellent skills, but I just don't think he will make it.

Jesus - did he have a crack at your daughter or something?? I have read some next-level drivel on here, but this is in serious contention for a podium finish......

Pou won't make it.....!!!

 

[Miha]

Gday Saints fans.

good content today

Pou cooked
Trade Ro

 

[SG34]

I think he adds something in his ability to run end to end. That looks straight out of the Ross Lyon play book. Guys like Darcy Wilson probably eventually push him out but he's still getting selected even after ordinary games.

I tend to agree.
Speedy and energetic, but as a user of the ball?
Here is my question to the panel.
'Is Ronnie Byrnes a good decision maker?'

I am sure likes the Speed, and the 'goer' element.
The execution I think he can overlook.

But the decision making?

Some skilled players make what seem like poor decisions when they are trying to follow a team directive. They are pushing the envelope, and taking risks that will hurt them. (Brad Hill could have safely passed up the line on the weekend, but kicked straight into devil's gob by hoping for a 30% 1-3 to work out on the weekend. Other players, with less skill, Ross maybe? will play percentages)

I honestly thought Byrnes would be gone, gone before even Bytel and Ben Long, but here he is! Go Ronnie. (I don't know how those other two are going at their respective clubs, but I suspect reserves.)

 

[The Punter]

Long 1 game, Bytel 0.

 

[CaptainRisky]

Howard needs to be cut some slack off a long layoff, I still believe he is the superior option to Cordy, who was given an absolute bath by Naughton last week. But in the long-term it’d be nice to not require either.
Bonner is a genuine liability. Not only can he not defend, he doesn’t put his head over the ball and hold the ball in when that’s the obvious defensive play. In addition, his well lauded kicking has consistently let us down. Sure he racks up disposals but chipping it around in the back line will pad out anyone’s stat line.
Stocker made a couple of blue’s on the weekend but he’s been pretty reliable over his time at the saints. And to echo a previous poster, with Webster back he will be better supported and be able to shine. Overall the backline needs to build continuity with a set 6/7. This will solidify us defensively and enhance our offence out of the back half.

There is a common theme in the ones you spoke about , Howard, Stocker, Bonner and Cordy are all cast offs and yes we did trade for Howard as port well and truly stitched us up by making him Captain for a week to bolster his trade value and what do we do ,,,,,, Fecking fall fall it.
How about we stop bringing in cast offs and think we are going to make them better.

 

[CaptainRisky]

I tend to agree.
Speedy and energetic, but as a user of the ball?
Here is my question to the panel.
'Is Ronnie Byrnes a good decision maker?'

I am sure likes the Speed, and the 'goer' element.
The execution I think he can overlook.

But the decision making?

Some skilled players make what seem like poor decisions when they are trying to follow a team directive. They are pushing the envelope, and taking risks that will hurt them. (Brad Hill could have safely passed up the line on the weekend, but kicked straight into devil's gob by hoping for a 30% 1-3 to work out on the weekend. Other players, with less skill, Ross maybe? will play percentages)

I honestly thought Byrnes would be gone, gone before even Bytel and Ben Long, but here he is! Go Ronnie. (I don't know how those other two are going at their respective clubs, but I suspect reserves.)

With a healthy injury list Byrnes wont be getting a game, got to be one of the worst kicks in the league, don't get me started on him or we will be here all day

 

[CaptainRisky]

Agree on Byrnes and Bonner. Both are work horses, neither are high end but both are Lyon style grunt players. Byrnes kicking has improved but turned over a few under pressure for the first time in ages. Bonner was pretty good even one on one which is his downfall usually.

Wilson seems to have taken a huge lift in confidence from his rising start nom. He played like a guy who knew he belonged. He's been trying few tricks up until now and they don't quite come off but he's realised that he can just outwork his opponent through his elite tank now and doesn't need the flashy stuff.

Byrnes is like the low budget version. He's a runner who gets end to end with the play and always pressures. His skills are a bit downmarket in comparison but he's the type that Lyon first picks.

Hard to judge Howard after such a long layoff. He gets a few games to wind back into it and then you'd question his future. It was a weird side selected with a lot of height and it didn't really work.

How do you know what type of players Ross loves , its a bit of a myth on here that everyone knows what Ross likes IMO
I don't think he has too many options ATM , lets see when we have players available if Ross loves the Byrnes type as much as some think

 

[Nutsngum]

There is a common theme in the ones you spoke about , Howard, Stocker, Bonner and Cordy are all cast offs and yes we did trade for Howard as port well and truly stitched us up by making him Captain for a week to bolster his trade value and what do we do ,,,,,, Fecking fall fall it.
How about we stop bringing in cast offs and think we are going to make them better.

You genuinely believe Port made Dougal Howard Captain to attempt to drive up his trade potential months before a trade was requested or even publicly known about in any form?

Cordy was a free agent with a contract offer in front of him from the dogs.

So, not even close to a common theme.

 

[CaptainRisky]

You genuinely believe Port made Dougal Howard Captain to attempt to drive up his trade potential months before a trade was requested or even publicly known about in any form?

Cordy was a free agent with a contract offer in front of him from the dogs.

So, not even close to a common theme.

Ok so Cordy was a free agent and they were more than happy to let him go, Well port did it for some reason because if they really rated him they wouldn't have let him go unless they knew they were getting an overs deal for him

 

[Circus]

There were a lot of things that really pissed me off about this game: umpiring, missed handballs/marks, sloppy kicking, stupid turnovers, etc. But something that happened a few times was Howard screaming, and waving his arms like a dysfunctional windmill, for the ball to be kicked to him from full back when he was 20 metres away, in no better position to move it on compared with the kicker running out of the square. What is the point of that??

At one stage the ball was kicked to him, by Bonner or NAS, and what did he do........stood still looking for options and then kicked to a contest on the HB flank where it was.........turned over!! WTF?? He should be banned for ever doing that again, its just plain dumb.

If he is allowed to kick from our backline he must get a run up, because he's not slow in a straight line, and kick it as far as he can. That way at least our players will sort of know where it's going, somewhere a long way away. He can't short pass, his decision making is slow, he is very awkward at everything except spoiling the ball in the air, but much worse is that he seems to think he's much better than what he is. That's not good team play.

I'd like to give him a pass because he's missed so much footy, and at his best he is essential to our backline (particularly allowing Wilkie to play to his strengths), but that type of play is a personality defect in action. Why does he think him kicking the ball makes our team better, when history proves otherwise!!

 

[gringo2011]

I tend to agree.
Speedy and energetic, but as a user of the ball?
Here is my question to the panel.
'Is Ronnie Byrnes a good decision maker?'

I am sure likes the Speed, and the 'goer' element.
The execution I think he can overlook.

But the decision making?

Some skilled players make what seem like poor decisions when they are trying to follow a team directive. They are pushing the envelope, and taking risks that will hurt them. (Brad Hill could have safely passed up the line on the weekend, but kicked straight into devil's gob by hoping for a 30% 1-3 to work out on the weekend. Other players, with less skill, Ross maybe? will play percentages)

I honestly thought Byrnes would be gone, gone before even Bytel and Ben Long, but here he is! Go Ronnie. (I don't know how those other two are going at their respective clubs, but I suspect reserves.)

I think Byrnes has been much better with disposal this season. That Port game seemed to bring our skills down. We fumbled, dropped marks, turned over by foot and missed tackles. He seemed to miss a few crucial kicks but so did Stocker and several others. Sometimes you have a bad night. I'm letting him prove himself again. He's actually one of our best inside 50 kicks even when his disposal was abysmal.

Bytel is still racking them up in the VFL but he looks pretty much a GOP at this point. Long is pretty good in the VFL but once he made it into the seniors he had a 4 disposal 2 behind game as a small forward and lost his place in the side.