Autopsy The gentle dogs go down in a thriller

[The Inbetweener]

If anyone can get hold of it and hopefully SEN release a clip, but Whateley just gave an epic spray to Lobb.

Basically along the lines of smashing his management for shopping him around to other clubs and the supposed raw deal his management say he's getting the Dogs after being 'sold a dream', but also on Lobb for not actually taking his opportunities and playing like a busted since he arrived.

It was brilliant and spot on.

 

[theburst]

pre-game Johnno said we were banged-up looking for the Bye then Chris Grant went on about in inequalities re Lions having had their 2nd Bye, we 0...perhaps seeped into players thinking during week...we were often all over the place...
somehow need to scrap,fight whatever it takes to get the 4 points next week before the rest

 

[Dogs Rule]

Thank God somebody has said it.

 

[The Inbetweener]

Thank God somebody has said it.

They went hard on the byes/ fixture as well.

 

[dergert]

He was one of the better performers last night that looked like they were trying.

Johnno said after the game he didn't think JOD looked comfortable in the fwd line.

I thought he looked alright and if we didn't have such good depth he'd be worth persisting with long term.

 

[dergert]

Gallagher looks more like a hff rotating mid than inside mid & wing imo.

 

[Mutt]

Great post and completely agree with most of what you’re saying.

I think it’s a bit rough on Sanders to say he is completely out of his depth. He has played some good games in the 1s this year and looked good against Collingwood last week. He had a rough game last night but so did most of the team.

I agree he is not quick in terms of leg speed, but he has an ability to move through tight spaces and get the ball out of there quickly.

He’s an 18 year old in his first season, who for the first time isn’t dominating at the level. It’ll take time for him to adjust and put on strength, but I really do think we have a good player in him.

I didn't see that last night. I hope you are correct. I want to be very wrong....

 

[dogwatch]

Personally, I don't have an issue with the team and the result. I felt it was going to happen and said as much prior to the game. If we jag any of the games earlier in the year that we won on "expected score" then this result isn't a big deal. At the end of the day, the injuries are catching up, players are a little more battered than a team who's had two byes.

A conversation is likely going to need to happen about the make up of the midfield though. If Ed Richards is healthy, I don't think Liberatore or Treloar can start in the midfield, but I don't think either of those players are capable in other areas of the ground, so it's going to be awkward given both are contracted for 2025.

I'm not sure what the midfield/CBAs solution is but Libba will be much better next week, almost guaranteed. I'll be concerned for him if he's not. And he wasn't bad last night anyway.

As for Treloar I can't see how you can take the bloke who's leading our B&F out of the role he is revelling in. This is his best season with us and possibly in his career. I don't care how old he is as long as he can keep doing it.

If Richards is healthy he certainly comes into the midfield although let's not expect him to be instantly as good as he was in that first half against Sydney before the head knock. Like Libba and JUH when he's had a few weeks off it can take a while to find rhythm and touch again.

Maybe it's just a case of more frequent rotations. We are way too predictable with our CBAs. That makes it easier to plan against us.

 

[dogwatch]

He went back when Keath was having a concussion test for 20 minutes

My criticism isn't on JOD but throwing out the defensive structure that had worked so well for a month and then getting opened up because of it

While JOD did OK in an unfamiliar role was it worth it to have him there?

If he had played in defence where he was close to our best tall last week we might save quite a few goals and not looked so brittle and unsettled down back. And Khamis could have started as a marking forward instead of in the vest. I reckon he'd have been good for 1-2 goals and like most observers I was surprised he started as sub.

 

[Munnez]

A very very young inexperienced team out there tonight. We are not strong enough to have so many injured or suspended. Our boys weren’t strong enough for their men. They were off their second bye and ran us off our legs. I think we’ll be ok, they have a hardened, well drilled group, they’ve been down but they’re too good to be down too long. They were moments off a premiership 9 months ago.
Jed Busslinger must now come in. Like Cleary’s balance would be helpful too. Libba wasn’t back to his best yet.

If we lose next week that is season done. Then I would definitely be bringing Busslinger on to see how he goes at the level and help with retention

 

[Munnez]

How can anyone be 207cm and take 1 mark for an entire game.


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Our field kicks were excruciatingly bad last night in his defence. And I don't think he was moving particularly well in commentary they mentioned that he seemed to be favouring an ankle. So struggled to get any separation he isn't a great contested mark at the best of times

 

[Libbaaaa]

I'm not sure what the midfield/CBAs solution is but Libba will be much better next week, almost guaranteed. I'll be concerned for him if he's not. And he wasn't bad last night anyway.

As for Treloar I can't see how you can take the bloke who's leading our B&F out of the role he is revelling in. This is his best season with us and possibly in his career. I don't care how old he is as long as he can keep doing it.

If Richards is healthy he certainly comes into the midfield although let's not expect him to be instantly as good as he was in that first half against Sydney before the head knock. Like Libba and JUH when he's had a few weeks off it can take a while to find rhythm and touch again.

Maybe it's just a case of more frequent rotations. We are way to predictable with our CBAs. That makes it easier to plan against us.

Send Libba to Serong, won’t get exposed for pace and can match him physically.

 

[dogwatch]

I watched last night from almost directly behind the goals on level 2 - the first time I've done that for a while. Some observations about our game style last night and about some players -and I am loathe to pot individual players, but if we are to challenge again, we have to see things for what they really are:

1. We press up incredibly hard and consistently. We are too slow to sustain it, for Brisbane had more leg speed in their mid-sized players and ran through our press at will. This left the defenders (who also lacked leg speed compared to their opponents) isolated, with their direct opponents already on their goal side or in a position to lead into space. The high and aggressive press is not playing to our strengths as a group.
2. We either didn't tag Neale or chose the wrong player. Why do we let opposition teams' dominant players run free each week?
3. Sanders worries me. He looks completely out of his depth. I don't think he is ready for AFL yet and I worry that his lack of pace means he will struggle with AFL as it is played now- until he gets stronger and more guile. He isn't Libba but needs to study Tom closely and earn to capitalise on his strengths. I hope I'm wrong, but I fear that Sanders might struggle to be the player we are hoping for.
4. Daniel is completely unsuited to AFL as it is played right now. He is too slow, too short, and too light. He is just a liability anywhere on the ground. I hate to say it, but he doesn't fit into our future.
5. We must stop bringing other teams' discards onto our list and expect them to be a better option than drafting and developing a low-draft pick kid. Recruiting and playing Bramble (and others like him this and every year) smacks of a win-now mentality instead of drafting and developing for sustained success.

I'm feeling flat after having witnessed last night...so rant over.

ps. and the yellow maggots can go and eat a bag. Disgusting umpiring performance.

Spot on. Agree with all five points.

And well expressed too.

I've been reluctant to express my concerns about Sanders because it is unfair to be over-critical of a first year kid. There can be a lot going on that we don't know about. We need to be measured, but we should also be able to discuss it.

It's no fault of his. I'm sure he'll make a player - perhaps even 150 or 200 games - but the high price we paid in draft assets didn't feel right at the time and feels a bit worse now. He has time on his side so I'm staying hopeful. I'm hoping he'll lose some of the puppy fat and come back stronger in 2025. He'll certainly need to be strong in the contest if he doesn't have much burst speed for breakaways and chasing.

His vision is very good but right now it feels like he is second guessing how he should be playing rather than being instinctive. I think it has affected his confidence. In his favour he seems to have a good head on his shoulders so he should be able to work his way through this patch, and come back a much more damaging player next year. That's my hope anyway. Somebody wise needs to take him under their wing in the off-season.

 

[dogwatch]

For what it's worth, here are the team profiles from last night.

Similar average age but definitely a lot more in the <50 games category. Brisbane had 13 players in the sweet spot of 100-200 games. We only had 7, about half of their number.

No doubt our injuries had a bit to do with that. Naughton, Richards, Harmes and JJ are all in the 100-200 range.

 

[Randomthoughts]

We must have the worst home record in the league. I’ve attended all marvel home games this year, only to see one win.

It’s been a difficult year to attending the marvel games for sure .

 

[Oliver G]

It’s been a difficult year to attending the marvel games for sure .

We've won just 3 from our past 11 home games at Docklands, only North have a worse "primary" home record over the same period.

 

[grassman75]

I would also spew up

Not worth more than 750k a year at most

 

[Mr. Walker]

A couple of random thoughts on the game
JOD played well and imo plays even better in defence. But has anyone checked his actual height against reported height? He just doesn’t look tall enough to be a CHB. It’s performance that counts I guess.

Good that the club brought up the bye inequity situation. In my fanciful moments I think maybe it’s the job of the AFL Integrity unit to raise it but that’s never going to happen.

I like Garcia and want him persevered with but can he not do so many dinky kicks ( that often miss their mark). It looks like he is a relatively low possession player so make them count for something son.

I hope the calls for Libba to be moved out of the middle are not based solely on last night’s performance. The guy is a legend and makes a greater contribution to us winning than at least 95% of his teammates. He makes a difference.

I am missing whatever elite AFL traits that Gallagher has. He has played every game so the coaches can see it but not me. That’s why they pay them the big bucks I guess. What is it that they see?

 

[olimauldon]

Feel like shit just want Sam Darcy back

 

[DognBones]

Some good observations on Sanders above. My take is that he hasn't adjusted to the pace of the game and more often than not he handballs because he's not confident in getting an effective kick away. Also, he's certainly not a burst midfielder by any means and an off-season spent trying to improve his sprinting capability would benefit.

 

[Next Waiting]

We missed Richards a lot last night. The dynamic is very different and much more dangerous when he plays, esp centre bounces.

Against this opponent and others with quality in the midfield, we'll struggle without Richards. Outside of Bont, I think he's the most important wheel in the midfield. As important as Treloar and possibly moreso.

Might have gone past Libba in the importance stakes (not arguing spiritual stakes).

 

[go_sports_team]

The only thing I feel I'd like to add to this thread is - christ almighty Brisbane fans are just insufferable. Was at the game with my son last night and he was still rattled this morning by the goading and jeers from the mostly drunk bogan yobs in the crowd aimed at dogs supporters. Not something he'd really experienced at other games.

Oh and of course Lobb can pack his bags now.

 

[Next Waiting]

Last night just highlighted how important it is to recruit/draft a gun mid this year. Fast and skilled.

No Richards, and our attacking options are stiffled. The same if you take Bont out. When all 3 of Bont, Richards and Treloar (in current form) are playing, I like our chances...against anyone. Take one out and we suddenly become vulnerable it seems. You can shut one down, and the good teams might be able to shut 2 down as the Lions did last night, but 3 is a lot lot harder .... bordering on not realistic.

So we need insurance to make the most of the forward line we can put together when not decimated by injury or suspension. We didn't lose it in the forwards or defence last night. We lost it fair and square in and around the clinches.

Sanders is not the player I'd hoped they'd be looking for last year. We need to go again ... hard ... at the top end of this year's draft or at the top end of another club's list (cough...Butters after they miss finals...cough).

 

[ossie_21]

Last night just highlighted how important it is to recruit/draft a gun mid this year. Fast and skilled.

No Richards, and our attacking options are stiffled. The same if you take Bont out. When all 3 of Bont, Richards and Treloar (in current form) are playing, I like our chances...against anyone. Take one out and we suddenly become vulnerable it seems. You can shut one down, and the good teams might be able to shut 2 down as the Lions did last night, but 3 is a lot lot harder .... bordering on not realistic.

So we need insurance to make the most of the forward line we can put together when not decimated by injury or suspension. We didn't lose it in the forwards or defence last night. We lost it fair and square in and around the clinches.

Sanders is not the player I'd hoped they'd be looking for last year. We need to go again ... hard ... at the top end of this year's draft or at the top end of another club's list (cough...Butters after they miss finals...cough).

Way too early to judge Sanders, not every young kid can hit the ground running. Back in Perth and the Reid frenzy is insane, but even he has shown zero consistency yet but has only shown moments, but the hype is ridiculous.

Sanders’ issue is a chaotic game plan, no set system and a coaching panel with question marks all over it.

I think post game yesterday Neale was asked about the job Berry did on Bont, even he said he rated the Dogs as having either the best or one of the best midfields in the comp.

It’s coaching - everyone ****ing knows it. After 15 touches in the first term, point me to any other coach at any level other than Auskick who wouldn’t send someone to at least make Neale accountable. That’s only 1 small part of how badly we were beaten.

We are halfway through the season and I still cannot explain to a random person what our game plan actually is. I’m a Bulldogs fan, but I can explain the game plan of several other teams in the comp. How the **** can that be allowed to happen? It’s actually insane.

 

[Munnez]

I'm traditionally harsh on VDM, but he also had the worst I50 entry of the night.

Mid Q3, he broke clear on the far wing, Bont was streaming forward through the middle, no-one ahead with a 1-1 up forward (JOD I think) who did the right thing and led wide...

...and VDM inexplicably kicked it as far as he could, deep into the pocket and oob...

It was too Lobb between two Lions defenders and he had to take it out or the Lions would have been off again