Traded Tim Kelly [traded with #57 and future 3rd to West Coast for #14, #24, #33 and future 1st]

[Blueeygrey]

I wouldn't, but I said ages ago that if Kelly doesn't want Freo Bell should milk that if he ends up in the draft. I hope he doesn't, but it's not a bad play demanding on your draft targets. Could turn 6 into multiple picks.

St Kilda could also get involved to gain an extra selection EG:
St Kilda = B. Hill, 27, 69 & 79 (+456)
N. Melb = Future 1st (16) 14, 33 & 45 (+498)
W.C.E. = T. Kelly, 24, 57 (-993)
Fremantle= 7,8 & 26 (-Hill + 8)

 

[MelbCat]

There is no way we can get a pick below 10, unless the deal was top ten this year and next years first.

Should be very interesting not just in the TK trade but a lot of club's looking to swap picks.
I reckon we'll also see the most players changing club's this year.

 

[raffrox]

I am just glad that (it seems) that Freo & WCE don't think like you.

You might be mistaken.

So Bell's comments don't suggest we'll be in for Kelly if there's a slight chance?

 

[Scotland]

Before the 2010s you had to go in the PSD if you were a listed player coming off contract. PSD moves were more common when this was the case. These days it's barely even held.

You are more likely to get to your club of choice via the national draft unless your new club has a very early pick. Clubs will burn PSD picks for fun but covet ND picks. Kelly in a PSD wouldn't last to pick 14 unless 1-13 had full lists. Contract terms apply in both cases.

 

[FreeTK]

You might be mistaken.

So Bell's comments don't suggest we'll be in for Kelly if there's a slight chance?

You mean his comments on Trade Radio?

I interpreted them as being pragmatic and realistic. Fremantle should be making representations to his manager why they are a viable option for Kelly. In hindsight, he probably knew that Kelly had made up his mind when he gave that interview.

Personally, I felt like he crossed a line a little when he said "we know these thing can get complicated". It came across to me as if he was willing for his club to be used as a stalking horse by Geelong to up the trade value on Kelly with the hope the trade fell through and then swoop in with a top ten pick.

 

[MelbCat]

Before the 2010s you had to go in the PSD if you were a listed player coming off contract. PSD moves were more common when this was the case. These days it's barely even held.

You are more likely to get to your club of choice via the national draft unless your new club has a very early pick. Clubs will burn PSD picks for fun but covet ND picks. Kelly in a PSD wouldn't last to pick 14 unless 1-13 had full lists. Contract terms apply in both cases.

I have no doubt that he'll get to WCE one way or another. Wells said on TR that talks were positive.
I think another club will get involved to sort out the picks.

 

[MelbCat]

You mean his comments on Trade Radio?

I interpreted them as being pragmatic and realistic. Fremantle should be making representations to his manager why they are a viable option for Kelly. In hindsight, he probably knew that Kelly had made up his mind when he gave that interview.

Personally, I felt like he crossed a line a little when he said "we know these thing can get complicated". It came across to me as if he was willing for his club to be used as a stalking horse by Geelong to up the trade value on Kelly with the hope the trade fell through and then swoop in with a top ten pick.

I read Bell's comments as his chosen WCE but we'll keep trying. He also said something about having the picks to appease Geelong should a deal not be able to be done.
Freo would be silly not to keep trying until the deal is officially done (not for Geelong to get a better deal, but he is a gun player) . Money talks ......

 

[raffrox]

You mean his comments on Trade Radio?

I interpreted them as being pragmatic and realistic. Fremantle should be making representations to his manager why they are a viable option for Kelly. In hindsight, he probably knew that Kelly had made up his mind when he gave that interview.

Personally, I felt like he crossed a line a little when he said "we know these thing can get complicated". It came across to me as if he was willing for his club to be used as a stalking horse by Geelong to up the trade value on Kelly with the hope the trade fell through and then swoop in with a top ten pick.

Crossed the line?

If there's a sniff, we're in.

Thats what Bell is saying. I don't think he cares if the Eagles don't like that.

 

[FreeTK]

I read Bell's comments as his chosen WCE but we'll keep trying. He also said something about having the picks to appease Geelong should a deal not be able to be done.
Freo would be silly not to keep trying until the deal is officially done (not for Geelong to get a better deal, but he is a gun player) . Money talks ......

That's fair I guess. Like many other people, I have my fair share of qualms and gripes with current system we have for player movements.

It feels to me that there is too much interference from clubs. Once a player (in this case Tim) nominates are club, that should exclude all other clubs from engaging with his representatives or the home club about said player. It creates situations like the one we have right now.

I also think that clubs shouldn't be allowed to engage with opposition players and their managers about potential trades during the season. They should extend trade week to be all of October and that period is open to clubs making representations to players and their agents.

The situation with Lynch meeting clubs while recuperating from surgery was a bit crass. I'm sure we have also had many many conversations with TK and his manager and probably would like to knock that on the head.

 

[FreeTK]

Crossed the line?

If there's a sniff, we're in.

Thats what Bell is saying. I don't think he cares if the Eagles don't like that.

 

[MelbCat]

That's fair I guess. Like many other people, I have my fair share of qualms and gripes with current system we have for player movements.

It feels to me that there is too much interference from clubs. Once a player (in this case Tim) nominates are club, that should exclude all other clubs from engaging with his representatives or the home club about said player. It creates situations like the one we have right now.

I also think that clubs shouldn't be allowed to engage with opposition players and their managers about potential trades during the season. They should extend trade week to be all of October and that period is open to clubs making representations to players and their agents.

The situation with Lynch meeting clubs while recuperating from surgery was a bit crass. I'm sure we have also had many many conversations with TK and his manager and probably would like to knock that on the head.

Totally agree, it's basically tapping up player's. In soccer said clubs caught tapping up player's are fined or have a transfer ban or both.
You also have the media unsettling players early ie: Lynch as you mentioned.
I could be wrong but I think a lot of deals done well in advance with just the finer details done during trade week

 

[Scotland]

People aren't ready for Tim Kelly to sign with West Coast in January 2019 with an agreed trade subject to ladder positions made at that time. They just aren't.

 

[MelbCat]

People aren't ready for Tim Kelly to sign with West Coast in January 2019 with an agreed trade subject to ladder positions made at that time. They just aren't.

Exactly, Kelly's commitment has been impeccable and credit to him.
But I'm sure there have players in the past who knew of a move and gave 1/2 arsed efforts.
Trade period needs to be overhauled to stop this from happening. Go down the soccer path and a mid season draft during the bye period and an end of season draft.

 

[Shadow89]

People aren't ready for Tim Kelly to sign with West Coast in January 2019 with an agreed trade subject to ladder positions made at that time. They just aren't.

I must be in the minority, because I absolutely am. Maybe there can be a clause that gives the player a chance to 'back out' if their position changes, but largely, I'd rather just hear the player say they're going and focus on the footy.

I can guarantee, that as much as the AFL media piss and moan about access, that they would be one of the key parties that wouldn't want this to happen. How else would they speculate and write a thousand BS articles with no substantiation?

 

[Flags_In_The_Bag]

The farce about West Coast being able to support him better is utter crap, why not be honest and say it for success. Hope Geelong say either you go to Freo as they have better options for us to get for you, or we let you walk to the draft.

 

[Bestbird]

I think a fair deal would be a pick from 5-9 & 14. Not sure how WCE can get a pick in that range tho

Almost all of the similar trades included a second coming back. Neale contracted 6 plus 19 minus 30 as an example

 

[raffrox]

Glad I wasted my time to check out that quality reply.

Especially since what I posted are just the facts of the situation.

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

Almost all of the similar trades included a second coming back. Neale contracted 6 plus 19 minus 30 as an example

Treloar 7 and a future first with 28 coming back

Shiel 9 and a future first with a future second coming back

Gibbs 10 and 16 with a swap of future seconds (with Carlton expected to finish well below Adelaide) and Adelaide getting Carlton’s future third back as well

Lever 10 and a future first with 35 plus a favorable future pick swap going back to Melbourne.

That definitely seems to be the trend.

 

[marty36]

The farce about West Coast being able to support him better is utter crap, why not be honest and say it for success. Hope Geelong say either you go to Freo as they have better options for us to get for you, or we let you walk to the draft.

I hope he walks to the draft as it will be better for the competition in soo many ways

On SM-G965F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Shadow89]

I hope he walks to the draft as it will be better for the competition in soo many ways

On SM-G965F using BigFooty.com mobile app

He won't, but one day someone will get that prediction right...Only last happened 10 years ago. His interview last night pretty much affirmed that he's not interested in the draft. A deal will get done.

 

[Shadow89]

If we get any picks in the range of 5-9, then Geelong will absolutely be obligated to give something back in return (Pick 36 IMO). I still think Carlton's 9 for Papley ls the most likely possibility (for 24 and Future 1st: 14-18). It would mean that Sydney can get future picks for their academy kids (Points value of 1469 for 1770), they won't have Pick 9 to trade, and then they can just give up Pick 5 and your Pick 24 for Daniher. 9 and 14 to us, with Kelly and 36. In trade terms 14, 24 and Future 1st (2,927 points if you win the flag), for Kelly (values Kelly at 2427 points) and 36 (502 points). This is in line with last year's offer of 20, 22 and Future 2nd - 34 this year (2299 points). This would mean there's only a points difference of 128. Cats are getting what they want, you guys are getting what you want, and Sydney are getting what they want. Win win for everyone.

Actually, upon further inspection and thought, I've realized I can turn this into a 'monster trade', haha

Basically the simple breakdown, of all clubs and ins and outs included in this 8 club deal:

*********************

Sydney:

IN: Joe Daniher, West Coast Future 1st (14-18 assumed), Carlton Pick 42
OUT: Tom Papley, Zak Jones, Pick 9

'Cherry on top' part of deal - Currency for future academy picks. Essentially Daniher for Jones and Pick 9 (less paid), and WC Future 1st and 42 for Papley (less received) balances out.

**********************

Geelong:

IN: Jack Steven, West Coast Pick 9 & Pick 14,
OUT: Tim Kelly, Pick 36, Future 2nd

'Cherry on top' part of deal - First top 10 pick in a decade

**********************

West Coast:

IN: Tim Kelly, Geelong Pick 36
OUT: 14, 24 & Future 1st

'Cherry on top' part of deal - Only losing 14 and a Future 1st that is highly compromised by academy picks, while only dropping 12 places with a Pick swap of 24 > 36.

**********************

Carlton:

IN: Tom Papley, Jack Martin
OUT: Pick 9, 42, 47

'Cherry on top' part of deal - essentially 'splitting' Pick 9 to get Jack Martin for Sydney Future 2nd, instead of getting back something for 9

**********************

Essendon:

IN: Pick 5, Pick 24
OUT: Daniher

'Cherry on top' part of deal - Gain a top 5 pick for a player who has been injury prone for 2+ years, while losing nothing in draft position the other way

**********************

St Kilda:

IN: Brad Hill, Zak Jones, Geelong Future 2nd
OUT: Pick 6, St Kilda Future 2nd, Jack Steven

'Cherry on top' part of deal - Gain a Future 2nd rounder from Geelong instead of the rumoured Pick 54 on offer (upgrade of around 20-25 spots)

***********************

Gold Coast:

IN: Sydney Future 2nd, Carlton Pick 47
OUT: Jack Martin

'Cherry on top' part of deal - Sydney are rebuilding and Future 2nd could be in the low 20's, with 47 essentially able to be used on academy kids given lack of bidding made available by AFL

************************

Fremantle:

IN: Pick 6
OUT: Brad Hill

'Cherry on top' part of deal - Straight swap of Pick 6 with nothing going back, means Fremantle primed to pick up two of the gun WA talents on offer

************************

Similar to the merry go round of picks from last year, but can all be done in one trade and everyone is reasonably satisfied/everyone gets something they want, and everyone gets a 'cherry' so to speak.

What do you guys think? Would be the biggest trade in AFL history in the unlikely event that it ever came to fruition, haha.

 

[Obeanie1]

Calm down. It'll work itself out. Not to sure people will be trading away from a top 4 pick as easily as you're thinking though.

Crows and Saints are the picks. Saints especially.

Crows possibly.

It will cost overs but possible.

Two top 10 picks will get the Saints pick in a heart beat. 14 plus 24 plus a 2020 2nd would get very close. Wells should know that.

 

[marty36]

Crows and Saints are the picks. Saints especially.

Crows possibly.

It will cost overs but possible.

Two top 10 picks will get the Saints pick in a heart beat. 14 plus 24 plus a 2020 2nd would get very close. Wells should know that.

For Adelaide to Give up it's pick 4, it would want two firsts, if not the supporters would burn the place down

Crows management are treading on thin ice at the moment with its supporter base

On SM-G965F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[WillieNillie]

Okay ive got a deal worked out. Pick 1 in the PSD is used for Tim Kelly. Before Round 1 we have

Gold Coast give up - Tim Kelly + 2020 3rd rounder
Eagles give up - 2020 1st rounder + 2020 2nd rounder
Geelong give up - Tears and a sore butt

 

[Obeanie1]

Yep. 3 times. Look up these players:

- Nick Stevens

- Luke Ball

...can't remember the 3rd, but there is a third one

Luke Ball nominated Collingwood and got there in the draft after Saints cut their nose off to spite their face.

But yes he wasn't traded there.