VFL VFL 2024 - Geelong & the greater league

[cats_09]

My take was that Parfitt's game was far superior to Hardie's and of the two was the first midfield option. Mannagh looked classy but as a small forward is competing against Stengle, Miers and Close for a spot.

I wonder if it would be worth while shifting Miers up to the wing for a bit - he's been getting worked out by opposition teams of late and not having the same influence on matches as earlier in the season. We know he's an endurance beast, so could we see a change in his role, which in turn opens up a forward line spot for Mannagh?

 

[Pure_Ownage]

My take was that Parfitt's game was far superior to Hardie's and of the two was the first midfield option. Mannagh looked classy but as a small forward is competing against Stengle, Miers and Close for a spot.

I dont see why mannagh is pigeonholed as a small fwd only.
And regardless id put him inside 50 and id put miers or dempsey in the MF anyway.

 

[bombersboy]

I wonder if it would be worth while shifting Miers up to the wing for a bit - he's been getting worked out by opposition teams of late and not having the same influence on matches as earlier in the season. We know he's an endurance beast, so could we see a change in his role, which in turn opens up a forward line spot for Mannagh?

Problem with Miers on the wing is that he has no penetration in his kicking.

 

[Ratcat]

Hardie 36 disposals 10 clearances, gee that's not to bad is it?

 

[OzeSparky]

Hardie 36 disposals 10 clearances, gee that's not to bad is it?

Too some on here it’s crap.

They don’t rate him.

Me. I think he worth a go.

 

[calder_daddy]

Too some on here it’s crap.

They don’t rate him.

Me. I think he worth a go.

Not one poster has said he’s crap.
We have our reasonings for not rating him just as you do rating him

 

[Finknottle]

Rebel coaches MVP award - Smithy's VFL Round 9

Geelong Cats 16.14 (110) def GWS Giants 7.7 (49)

10 Mitch Hardie (GEE)
7 Wade Derksen (GWS)
6 George Stevens (GEE)
3 Daniel Capiron (GEE)
3 Ted Clohesy (GEE)
1 James Willis (GEE)

VFL MVP Leaderboard after round 9

52 Mitch Hardie (GEE)
50 Dom Brew (WER)
41 Jacob Dawson

45

Jacob Dawson

Age

25

Ht

182cm

Wt

82kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

16.4

4star

K

8.3

3star

HB

8.1

5star

M

5.4

5star

T

2.1

4star

No current season stats available

D

15.0

4star

K

5.8

3star

HB

9.2

5star

M

3.6

4star

T

2.0

4star

(SOU)
38 Jarryd Lyons

17

Jarryd Lyons

Age

32

Ht

184cm

Wt

86kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

20.5

5star

K

11.8

4star

HB

8.7

5star

M

2.9

3star

T

4.4

5star

CL

4.8

5star

D

21.7

5star

K

14.7

5star

HB

7.0

4star

M

3.4

3star

T

5.1

5star

CL

4.7

5star

D

11.0

3star

K

5.2

2star

HB

5.8

4star

M

1.8

2star

T

2.0

4star

CL

1.6

4star

(BL)
35 Boyd Woodcock (SOU)
31 Cooper Craig-Peters (FOO)
29 Callum Brown (BHH)
28 Will Fordham (WIL)
28 Thomas Murphy (FRA)
27 Riley Collier-Dawkins (WIL)
27 Ben Jepson (SOU)

The VFL rebel Coaches MVP Award is an award voted by the 21 coaching panels on a 5,4,3,2,1 basis after each home and away game, with senior coaches providing votes on the game their club competed. The maximum votes a player can receive in one match is 10 votes.

 

[cats_09]

Not one poster has said he’s crap.
We have our reasonings for not rating him just as you do rating him

Exactly

There's a difference between saying he's a good VFL player, that may be his level and there's others who look more likely to make the transition to senior level

Compared with "he's crap", let's just delist him now

 

[Warhorse]

Hardie 36 disposals 10 clearances, gee that's not to bad is it?

And 14 score involvements. Apparently Parfitt is better though

 

[dangerwood]

And 14 score involvements. Apparently Parfitt is better though

How do you articulate, quantify/qualify ability and actions that can't be represented in stats? If you asked me who was the best player on the ground I'd probably say Hardie. I'm no Parfitt fan, but Parfitts a better player, he created play and broke lines (still stuffed disposal but we know he can't kick). Hardie racked up possessions, did he influence the contest or is he just smart and knows how to find some ball? This is a good trait but I think you need more.
As someone pointed out, that's all Tom Mitchell does and he can be handy (still arguments on how damaging he is though).
Hardie probably deserves a go but I won't be excited by his debut and I don't think he is going to help us going forward. He probably will find some ball in an AFL game too, but I'm not sure he helps us improve or win. I could be wrong, his trick of finding the ball might be enough but I think it unlikely. Usually you need more.
I don't think Parfitts good enough either, but I think he's more talented than Hardie. I can't present a fact or stat as to why thats the case though, he just looked more dangerous.

 

[Footy Smarts]

If you look through the results of last year's VFL coaches votes it doesn't scream gun future AFL player.

Lachlan Sullivan, Jacob Dawson

45

Jacob Dawson

Age

25

Ht

182cm

Wt

82kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

16.4

4star

K

8.3

3star

HB

8.1

5star

M

5.4

5star

T

2.1

4star

No current season stats available

D

15.0

4star

K

5.8

3star

HB

9.2

5star

M

3.6

4star

T

2.0

4star

, Marty Hore

27

Marty Hore

Age

28

Ht

190cm

Wt

84kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

15.6

4star

K

10.4

4star

HB

5.2

4star

M

4.9

5star

T

1.5

3star

MG

263.1

4star

No current season stats available

D

18.2

5star

K

12.8

5star

HB

5.4

4star

M

6.8

5star

T

1.8

4star

MG

282.2

5star

, Callum Brown, Jarryd Lyons

17

Jarryd Lyons

Age

32

Ht

184cm

Wt

86kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

20.5

5star

K

11.8

4star

HB

8.7

5star

M

2.9

3star

T

4.4

5star

CL

4.8

5star

D

21.7

5star

K

14.7

5star

HB

7.0

4star

M

3.4

3star

T

5.1

5star

CL

4.7

5star

D

11.0

3star

K

5.2

2star

HB

5.8

4star

M

1.8

2star

T

2.0

4star

CL

1.6

4star

and Boyd Woodcock the top 6. Sullivan is just about doing a job as a 6th-7th midfielder at Collingwood. Hore and Lyons are depth players. The other 3 aren't on a list.

It doesn't seem like the best predictor of ability to impact at AFL level. I think the main problem is beating up on undersized kids in the VFL is very different from taking on guys like Bontempelli, Merrett, Neale, etc.

My guess is watching 1 full training session with our AFL guys would tell you more about Hardie than any VFL match could.

 

[standupand]

Exactly

There's a difference between saying he's a good VFL player, that may be his level and there's others who look more likely to make the transition to senior level

Compared with "he's crap", let's just delist him now

That may be true, but when asked what he did well out of the last game you said: "He guards grass well".

I respect your opinion on him that he won't make it at AFL level. But it's hard to believe that that could be the sum positive that could be said of anyone's game, let alone one of 36 disposals and 14 score involvements.

 

[cats_09]

That may be true, but when asked what he did well out of the last game you said: "He guards grass well".

I respect your opinion on him that he won't make it at AFL level. But it's hard to believe that that could be the sum positive that could be said of anyone's game, let alone one of 36 disposals and 14 score involvements.

I also said more than that if you've read my posts when talking about the VFL from the weekend and reflections of Hardie's game

I've balanced my comments on him in regards to what he does well and areas that look to be lacking, and what it is that may be holding him back from getting that senior opportunity

 

[Finknottle]

If you look through the results of last year's VFL coaches votes it doesn't scream gun future AFL player.

Lachlan Sullivan, Jacob Dawson, Marty Hore, Callum Brown, Jarryd Lyons and Boyd Woodcock the top 6. Sullivan is just about doing a job as a 6th-7th midfielder at Collingwood. Hore and Lyons are depth players. The other 3 aren't on a list.

It doesn't seem like the best predictor of ability to impact at AFL level. I think the main problem is beating up on undersized kids in the VFL is very different from taking on guys like Bontempelli, Merrett, Neale, etc.

My guess is watching 1 full training session with our AFL guys would tell you more about Hardie than any VFL match could.

Is that Callum Brown who is now a forward for GWS? He's having a great season for them this year and Geelong were lucky he was on suspension last weekend. Lachlan Sullivan looks pretty impressive at AFL level for Collingwood. Jarryd Lyons has been a very good player at Brisbane Lions and before that the Gold Coast Suns. I recall him punishing Geelong on multiple occasions. He is now 31 so he's not really a player in his prime. If Hardie can beat up on VFL players then maybe he can handle the bigger AFL players.

 

[Kobe Gryant]

Is that Callum Brown who is now a forward for GWS? He's having a great season for them this year and Geelong were lucky he was on suspension last weekend. Lachlan Sullivan looks pretty impressive at AFL level for Collingwood. If Hardie can beat up on VFL players then maybe he can handle the bigger AFL players.

Callum Brown = Ex Collingwood F/S of Gavin Brown.

 

[Finknottle]

Callum Brown = Ex Collingwood F/S of Gavin Brown.

So same name different player. Fair enough.

 

[Finknottle]

Re Hardie's credentials for AFL, we'll never know if he isn't given a game. He is leading the coaches voting at Geelong by a long way and he's leading the VFL MVP voting. These votes are given by the head VFL coach of both teams. As has been mentioned, getting votes is not the only criteria for a callup to the AFL. It seems Parfitt's game impressed some watchers and I thought he played a solid game but I thought Hardie deserved the maximum votes that he received from the coaches. He had a couple of turnovers and a couple of defensive lapses but he more than made up for it. This week would be as good as any to elevate him due to our AFL midfield woes and the quality of the opposition. Extremely unlikely to give him his first taste of AFL against a rampaging Sydney midfield.

 

[Footy Smarts]

Is that Callum Brown who is now a forward for GWS? He's having a great season for them this year and Geelong were lucky he was on suspension last weekend. Lachlan Sullivan looks pretty impressive at AFL level for Collingwood. Jarryd Lyons has been a very good player at Brisbane Lions and before that the Gold Coast Suns. I recall him punishing Geelong on multiple occasions. He is now 31 so he's not really a player in his prime. If Hardie can beat up on VFL players then maybe he can handle the bigger AFL players.

As others said no it's the Callum Brown that was delisted by Collingwood.

Jarryd Lyons has been a decent player but is past his best. He actually only played 14 games last year so was the dominant player at VFL level. He was getting 30+ every week, 40+ multiple times, was a known contributor at AFL level and still couldn't crack the AFL team regularly. Even with their injuries he's only played 3 AFL games this year, with one of those as sub. Despite playing only 6 VFL games he's sitting 4th in the coaches votes so is utterly dominant at that level but still can't crack a game.

So it's not only Geelong that look at dominant VFL form and don't think it will translate to AFL footy.

 

[CatToTheFuture]

If you look through the results of last year's VFL coaches votes it doesn't scream gun future AFL player.

Lachlan Sullivan, Jacob Dawson, Marty Hore, Callum Brown, Jarryd Lyons and Boyd Woodcock the top 6. Sullivan is just about doing a job as a 6th-7th midfielder at Collingwood. Hore and Lyons are depth players. The other 3 aren't on a list.

It doesn't seem like the best predictor of ability to impact at AFL level. I think the main problem is beating up on undersized kids in the VFL is very different from taking on guys like Bontempelli, Merrett, Neale, etc.

My guess is watching 1 full training session with our AFL guys would tell you more about Hardie than any VFL match could.

Is that the gws callum brown?

 

[Footy Smarts]

Is that the gws callum brown?

No. Box Hill, ex Collingwood.

 

[Goggin Our Best]

If you look through the results of last year's VFL coaches votes it doesn't scream gun future AFL player.

Lachlan Sullivan, Jacob Dawson, Marty Hore, Callum Brown, Jarryd Lyons and Boyd Woodcock the top 6. Sullivan is just about doing a job as a 6th-7th midfielder at Collingwood. Hore and Lyons are depth players. The other 3 aren't on a list.

It doesn't seem like the best predictor of ability to impact at AFL level. I think the main problem is beating up on undersized kids in the VFL is very different from taking on guys like Bontempelli, Merrett, Neale, etc.

My guess is watching 1 full training session with our AFL guys would tell you more about Hardie than any VFL match could.

Mate it is ridiculous you and about 5-6 posters who have basically slagged off Hardie hes not good enough

We are playing Richmond who have been decimated by injuries , is it going to break the bank to make Hardie the sub this week ( reward for leading the VFL voting ) so he gets to play a qtr of Afl football

Is that ok in the precious eyes of 5-6 Geel posters who say Mitch Hardie under NO circumstances is not allowed to play 1 second of football for the Geelong senior team

Im sick to death of reading their garbage and their reasons they give why

 

[Willo_]

Is that ok in the precious eyes of 5-6 Geel posters who say Mitch Hardie under NO circumstances is not allowed to play 1 second of football for the Geelong senior team

Im sick to death of reading their garbage and their reasons they give why

Ridiculous... Not a single person has said that, (well as far as I have seen)

Personally I don't think he is a difference maker and will do much at the top level, but I've still said he deserves a crack as a reward for form if nothing else

 

[Kobe Gryant]

Mate it is ridiculous you and about 5-6 posters who have basically slagged off Hardie hes not good enough

We are playing Richmond who have been decimated by injuries , is it going to break the bank to make Hardie the sub this week ( reward for leading the VFL voting ) so he gets to play a qtr of Afl football

Is that ok in the precious eyes of 5-6 Geel posters who say Mitch Hardie under NO circumstances is not allowed to play 1 second of football for the Geelong senior team

Im sick to death of reading their garbage and their reasons they give why

Is that any different to you slagging off Bruhn, Parfitt, Mullin, Atkins, & Bowes regularly?

You've got your reasons for that, and that's fine, everyone's allowed to have an opinion.

The posters you're calling out - just like you - are allowed to have their opinions too, no?

We don't all have to agree, but you can't pick and choose when it applies to you and when it applies to others.

 

[Willo_]

The posters you're calling out - just like you - are allowed to have their opinions too, no?

Actually no, I'm legally the only person on this board allowed to have an opinion sorry

 

[Footy Smarts]

Mate it is ridiculous you and about 5-6 posters who have basically slagged off Hardie hes not good enough

We are playing Richmond who have been decimated by injuries , is it going to break the bank to make Hardie the sub this week ( reward for leading the VFL voting ) so he gets to play a qtr of Afl football

Is that ok in the precious eyes of 5-6 Geel posters who say Mitch Hardie under NO circumstances is not allowed to play 1 second of football for the Geelong senior team

Im sick to death of reading their garbage and their reasons they give why

Overreact much? I haven't slagged off anyone.

And if you're "sick to death" of reading my "garbage" the ignore button is free to use.