Discussion 2022 General AFL Discussion

[Highlander35]

Wouldn't know, I just read what people say.

Governance - City on a Hill

Governance Governance at City on a Hill City on a Hill is committed to planting and leading healthy churches. Our governance structures play an important role in in providing the appropriate accountability, wisdom and support to our leaders, as we pursue our mission together. As one movement of...

cityonahill.com.au

Currently five of our churches are Anglican and are licensed as Authorised Anglican Congregations (AACs)
in the Melbourne Diocese (Melbourne, Melbourne West, Melbourne East, Geelong, Surf Coast). These
churches operate under the Parish Governance Act as one church through a combined cooperative
agreement, with shared leadership and governance. Under this arrangement, the Senior Pastor is licensed
as the Priest-in-charge, and ministry staff across the churches licensed by the Archbishop as either assistant
clergy or authorised lay ministers

Yah, and a Sedevacantist is gonna tell you that they're Catholic.

 

[Dard Ball Get]

AFLW player refuses to participate in pride round. Second year in a row

Why?

 

[Sun Ra]

Why?

Muslim.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Yah, and a Sedevacantist is gonna tell you that they're Catholic.

I really don't care about their bullshit religions, i just know you can't take it into account as part of a hiring process.

 

[jwikked]

I actually agree with a lot of the stuff here, and i'm not someone who identifies with any religion.

Ex-Essendon CEO Andrew Thorburn says linking faith and employment a ‘dangerous idea’

Thorburn, who resigned over links to church that condemns homosexuality, fears example will ‘reduce tolerance for others and diversity of thought’

www.theguardian.com

I sorta agree. I don't understand why he didn't step down from the Church once he found out what their views actually were. He did say he didn't share those same views (anti gay, etc), so I'll give him the benefit of the doubt there.

 

[jwikked]

At least hve the balls to tag me mate.

They posted in the same thread you read, why get pissy because you were mentioned but not tagged? It wasn't hidden.

 

[Dard Ball Get]

Muslim.

Christopher Hitchens died too soon

 

[sunny3193]

Particularly Catholic homosexuals.

The clergy?

 

[flyingmagic]

Calling it Anglican rather than NeoCalvinist is a very fun minimisation.

But it is Anglican.

 

[Highlander35]

But it is Anglican.

And Fred Phelps was a baptist minister.

 

[sunny3193]

Essendon appoints Brian Houston as interim CEO while it reviews hiring process — The Shovel

"He told us he was 'between jobs' at the moment"

www.theshovel.com.au

You are a very very naughty Sun.

 

[sunny3193]

Yah, and a Sedevacantist is gonna tell you that they're Catholic.

Tell me that I’m not the only one who googled that.

 

[phantom13]

They posted in the same thread you read, why get pissy because you were mentioned but not tagged? It wasn't hidden.

Why do you care. It has nothing to do with you.

 

[phantom13]

I sorta agree. I don't understand why he didn't step down from the Church once he found out what their views actually were. He did say he didn't share those same views (anti gay, etc), so I'll give him the benefit of the doubt there.

He actually didn’t say anything about not sharing those views, go read his quotes again, he talks about being inclusive and progressive in the organisations, he also says he doesn’t always agree with pastors etc but he doesn’t say it’s about these issues.

Given he has made the choice to NOT adress the specific issue at hand and he’s also made the choice to stay with the church who made the statement and dismiss the bombers job it would seem that he’s more aligned to the views than you’re suggesting.

We don’t know that for sure but logic would dictate given the amount of shit he’s getting it would be a lot quicker and simpler to say he doesn’t agree with it than staying quiet.

 

[George]

Father Bob actually sounds like a gay bloke tbh

 

[phantom13]

I don’t agree with the media hounding him backing his car out of the driveway BUT they also very directly asked him what his personal views are and he’s still not answering.

This doesn’t seem like a guy who doesn’t hate the gays.

 

[jwikked]

I don’t agree with the media hounding him backing his car out of the driveway BUT they also very directly asked him what his personal views are and he’s still not answering.

This doesn’t seem like a guy who doesn’t hate the gays.

"Let me be clear - I love all people, and have always promoted and lived an inclusive, diverse, respectful and supportive workplace - where people are welcomed regardless of their culture, religious beliefs, and sexual orientation."

Why does he need to share his personal views, when they aren't relevant? What is relevant is how he treats those people within the organizations he runs.

 

[phantom13]

Why does he need to share his personal views, when they aren't relevant? What is relevant is how he treats those people within the organizations he runs.

Do you think that statement specifically refutes the sermon that notes homosexuality is a sin? Cause it doesn’t.

They are relevant though when they are completely opposed to the views of the club and the position is the CEO.

It’s seriously not that hard

Essendon - doesn’t think being gay is a sin or a bad thing

City on a hill - does think being gay is a sin and a bad thing

The ceo of Essendon can’t be of the opinion of City on a Hill.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Do you think that statement specifically refutes the sermon that notes homosexuality is a sin? Cause it doesn’t.

They are relevant though when they are completely opposed to the views of the club and the position is the CEO.

It’s seriously not that hard

Essendon - doesn’t think being gay is a sin or a bad thing

City on a hill - does think being gay is a sin and a bad thing

The ceo of Essendon can’t be of the opinion of City on a Hill.

Essendon doesn't think.
Well i mean its not a person, its an organization.
But then its obvious the people running it don't think much either.

Anyway, Essendon has policies.
City on a hill have some sort of list of stuff that's good or bad in their view.

The guy who just stood down was running a Bank with similar policies to Essendon. He had issues there but nothing to do with gays, everything to do with being a bastard, which would probably suit Essendon down to a tee.
If you really think that business managers go around letting their personal preferences dictate everything, you are mistaken.

The Media aren't so quick to point the finger at their own people who may or may not be in a similar quandary , i mentioned one earlier, you dismissed it as a straw man argument.
I think if the religion in question wasn't Christianity, and the guy wasn't a white boomer, you'd be screaming discrimination.

 

[phantom13]

Essendon doesn't think.
Well i mean its not a person, its an organization.
But then its obvious the people running it don't think much either.

Anyway, Essendon has policies.
City on a hill have some sort of list of stuff that's good or bad in their view.

The guy who just stood down was running a Bank with similar policies to Essendon. He had issues there but nothing to do with gays, everything to do with being a bastard, which would probably suit Essendon down to a tee.
If you really think that business managers go around letting their personal preferences dictate everything, you are mistaken.

The Media aren't so quick to point the finger at their own people who may or may not be in a similar quandary , i mentioned one earlier, you dismissed it as a straw man argument.
I think if the religion in question wasn't Christianity, and the guy wasn't a white boomer, you'd be screaming discrimination.

I’m clearly not mistaken because this particular personal view absolutely got Essendon to make him stand down in spite of the fact that in itself was a shit show.

I’m not naive enough to think this isn’t part PR exercise either.

It is a straw man, as I said, when a club hires a Muslim CEO who refuses to oublically state their position on homosexuality and said club refuses to stand them down come back in here and crow as loud as like, until then, it’s a dumb hypothetical.

And now you’re back to just making shit up. I condemned the Manly guys and Manly as a club for not doing more about the 7 guys who refused to wear the pride jumper. They were 20-30 year old islanders. I condemn the aflw player who refuses to wear the pride jersey she’s a 20 something year old Muslim woman. Should be noted none of them is a CEO so their influence on an organisation is much more limited than his would have been.

This “oh the poor rich white christian boomer” shit is tired. Perhaps if so many of them weren’t homophobic shit heels then they wouldn’t get called out on it so much would they.

It’s funny that you’re so happy to make an assumption about me and my views in spite of having no clue what you’re on about but you’re absolutely adamant we don’t know his views in spite of a litany of evidence showing how he feels. Maybe ruminate on that. Or don’t, I don’t care.

 

[jwikked]

I’m clearly not mistaken because this particular personal view absolutely got Essendon to make him stand down in spite of the fact that in itself was a s**t show.

The media attention made Essendon get rid of him, not any perceived view that he has shared. If nobody made any noise about it, he'd still be there.

But sure, keep on fighting that "good" fight. It's fun to see people with an inflated sense of morality.

 

[phantom13]

The media attention made Essendon get rid of him, not any perceived view that he has shared. If nobody made any noise about it, he'd still be there.

But sure, keep on fighting that "good" fight. It's fun to see people with an inflated sense of morality.

Given I acknowledged it was part PR exercise this isn’t exactly something I’m not aware.

What about the gay member who handed back his membership that really started the whole thing? He wasn’t media. The media circus is all pretty ott but decisions like the one to appoint him without due diligence and the impact that can have on the gay community (a long ostracized and marginalized one) should be considered. You want to jump on the persecution of the poor Christian faith members but at the same time shrug about the queer members. Ones not vilifying the other.

I don’t have an inflated sense of morality, I’m an anonymous scumbag on an Internet forum, no one here is going to change their mind because of what I think, but I do think it’s pretty ****ing sad to be living in 2022 and still seeing so many people defends someone’s right to be a homophobic piece of shit. Call me the sjw if it makes you feel better though.

 

[gringo2011]

Probably paywalled but this article from Tim Costello is worth read.

‘The words were wrong’: Dons saga pastor backtracks, Costello pushes for bill of rights

Andrew Thorburn’s messy departure from Essendon football club prompted a conservative church to apologise for likening abortion to concentration camps.

www.theage.com.au

“When Essendon says ‘we want to be the most diverse club in the AFL’, they really now have a problem,” Costello said, adding the decision meant it would be difficult for a Muslim or conservative Jew to get a position on the club’s board.

“This has ripple effects that we just need to pause and think about.”

The issue for me with religion is that they want people to stop discriminating against their right to discriminate. I have no issue with people having their own discrete beliefs but when it stops you performing roles that have consequences in the real world, then it's problematic. Same reason that separation of church and state have always been a thing even when the world was much more religious.

An overt Orthodox Jew or muslim probably never gets as far because people will have already decided that they'd not be capable of performing roles that require them to step outside their belief system. These modern happy clapper churches are a weird phenomena. The Hillsong freaks have tried to push into federal and state politics recently.

 

[Dr Spaceman]

These modern happy clapper churches are a weird phenomena. The Hillsong freaks have tried to push into federal and state politics recently.

It can be a problem with some of these weird church people when you appoint them at the CEO level, however it’s even worse when they head up your Medical & Fitness Department

 

[jwikked]

apparently the Tasmanian team decision could be made today. Fingers crossed they get their team. Tasmania deserved a team before SA had their second team (Port Adelaide franchise est. 1997)