Analysis 2023 Gameplan

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Lsta062

Brownlow Medallist
Jul 15, 2014
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Firstly, what in the world is it? I can't really work out an identifiable system given that the players aren't executing whatever they're being told to do very well. They seem to look confused much of the time and kinda look like they're winging the decisions that they're making.

Apart from our general fitness, midfield speed, and skill-level deficiencies, I noticed a few things about our style:

1. We slow the play down way too much.
While we stop and try to find the perfect target inside 50 or down the field, the opposition has already set up defensively. Without Lynch, we don't have a lot of strong contested marks, so the opposition defence will lap it up more than we do. We should play with pace instead.

2. We rely on precision kicking when slowing the game down. That's not going to win us many games with our current foot skills. For our skill level, it is much better for us to just kick to space if we cannot find a vacant target.

3. We're so stagnant off the ball for much of the match except for a 10-20 minute period each game. Being so flat-footed leads to little pressure on the ball carrier. That's why the opposition seem to have so much time when they have the ball while we seem to be under constant pressure. In the games we lost, you can find plenty of examples showing how our opposition were more dynamic in their running patterns. We need to improve our running patterns because it's currently very different to our Premiership years.

4. We don't use the corridor much. We tend to look at the wings and kick to a contest instead of moving the ball through the corridor and I don't know why because we usually look much better when moving it through the corridor. In the last 7 or so minutes of the Gold Coast game, I noticed that we were still trying to move the ball through a clogged wing. It's like Stuart Dew knew how conservative our ball movement was because Gold Coast players stacked the wings and basically left the corridor vacant for them to use whenever we turn the ball over. Things like this are why we lose close games and don't come back often when trailing. Look at Collingwood, who start playing attacking footy through the corridor when it's time to come back and win. Collingwood don't allow the opposition to set up defensively whereas we give them plenty of time to do so with our conservative ball movement.

We can and should rectify these four things at the very least. It doesn't guarantee that we will improve by a lot since we're quite ordinary in basic skills like kicking, but at least we can try a few things that may work. What did you guys notice in terms of gamestyle over the first 7 rounds?
 
Our forwards structure is an abomination, stagnant, bomb it in long and hope for the best, so many entrys on the weekend we’re painful to witness


I've harped on about this in a few threads now but I think you're right - it's about our forwardline. At the start of the season we gained Taranto and Hopper and Dimma rubbed his hands in glee. He thought - 'Not only have I solved our clearance issues but now I have far greater depth with our midfield rotations. The problem is, how will I play all our midfielders all in the one team? I know! I'll rest them forward!'
Sounds wonderful in theory but he effectively robbed Peter to pay Paul.

Even before Lynch's injury, we had an unbalanced forwardline.

With an unbalanced forwardline, it means -
  1. We can't force turnovers in the F50 but, more importantly, turn the ball over further up the ground.
  2. We lose speed through the corridor and our ability to chain handballs together to move it through traffic.
  3. We have less outside runners to break from stoppages and we can't race back into a relatively empty forwardline when we break.
  4. It means less opportunity to crumb goals.
  5. Less opportunity to set up goals for our talls.
  6. Less opportunity to get the opposition second guessing their own attack and ability to take risks cutting through the corridor or switching.

Without a least three small half-forwards, our game plan reverts to chip kicks, long bombs from stoppages and stagnant long passes into a congested forwardline.

Playing Pickett forward is the first step. Bringing in two more small(ish) pressure providing crumbers is the next.
 
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Firstly, what in the world is it? I can't really work out an identifiable system given that the players aren't executing whatever they're being told to do very well. They seem to look confused much of the time and kinda look like they're winging the decisions that they're making.

Apart from our general fitness, midfield speed, and skill-level deficiencies, I noticed a few things about our style:

1. We slow the play down way too much. While we stop and try to find the perfect target inside 50 or down the field, the opposition has already set up defensively. Without Lynch, we don't have a lot of strong contested marks, so the opposition defence will lap it up more than we do. We should play with pace instead.

2. We rely on precision kicking when slowing the game down. That's not going to win us many games with our current foot skills. For our skill level, it is much better for us to just kick to space if we cannot find a vacant target.

3. We're so stagnant off the ball for much of the match except for a 10-20 minute period each game. Being so flat-footed leads to little pressure on the ball carrier. That's why the opposition seem to have so much time when they have the ball while we seem to be under constant pressure. In the games we lost, you can find plenty of examples showing how our opposition were more dynamic in their running patterns. We need to improve our running patterns because it's currently very different to our Premiership years.

4. We don't use the corridor much. We tend to look at the wings and kick to a contest instead of moving the ball through the corridor and I don't know why because we usually look much better when moving it through the corridor. In the last 7 or so minutes of the Gold Coast game, I noticed that we were still trying to move the ball through a clogged wing. It's like Stuart Dew knew how conservative our ball movement was because Gold Coast players stacked the wings and basically left the corridor vacant for them to use whenever we turn the ball over. Things like this are why we lose close games and don't come back often when trailing. Look at Collingwood, who start playing attacking footy through the corridor when it's time to come back and win. Collingwood don't allow the opposition to set up defensively whereas we give them plenty of time to do so with our conservative ball movement.

We can and should rectify these four things at the very least. It doesn't guarantee that we will improve by a lot since we're quite ordinary in basic skills like kicking, but at least we can try a few things that may work. What did you guys notice in terms of gamestyle over the first 7 rounds?

I went to pre-season training all summer and the players were executing Dimma's gameplan. His focus was to prevent turnover and rebound against us.

Travel around the boundary line
Shoot on goal from the boundary line
Lock ball in forward 50

This involved heading to the boundary and around, the ball never went through the centre square even forward 50 entries Dimma would continually stop training when the ball was centred into the forward 50 saying that would allow for rebound. Often referenced the Brisbane final, so much so I felt like he was trying to coach what would win the last game rather than looking forward to next season.

Our gameplan has maybe evolved to trying to save a game rather than trying to win a game. Hopefully Mini can allow the players to play more naturally and evolve the gameplan to something that fits the list and players we have available now. Definitely we need to find our Graham's Broad's and Townsend of 2017. Maybe they are Biggy, Coulthard and Green because we lack speed and athleticism to play any other way in the 22 we have been playing
 
Problem is we’re old and slow and we’re playing safe football bc if we get caught on the rebound we’re left behind.
Midfield is like a migrating crab colony. As awesome as TT is he’s still slow and we only look threatening in there when TT and Bolton are in together. It’s a massive issue and why we’re getting run over in games and teams are getting lots of inside 50,s and easy goals. Sundays game was a nightmare to watch against inferior opposition and it really exposed our deficiencies in this area. We need some electricity in there bc atm it’s on battery power .
 
Problem is we’re old and slow and we’re playing safe football bc if we get caught on the rebound we’re left behind.
Midfield is like a migrating crab colony. As awesome as TT is he’s still slow and we only look threatening in there when TT and Bolton are in together. It’s a massive issue and why we’re getting run over in games and teams are getting lots of inside 50,s and easy goals. Sundays game was a nightmare to watch against inferior opposition and it really exposed our deficiencies in this area. We need some electricity in there bc atm it’s on battery power .
Well we wont be old next year with Tarrant - Jack - Trent gone and replaced with
Gibcus - Himmelberg - Sonsie
 
Well we wont be old next year with Tarrant - Jack - Trent gone and replaced with
Gibcus - Himmelberg - Sonsie
We really need to get our stuff right in terms of fitness in the preseason. Sonsie is the only midfielder in that bunch and he’s not overly quick mate. Our midfield is a massive issue bc it’s slow.
 
Definitely lost our edge which was speed. Teams were always fearful of us for that but now its a weakness especially our forward which is so slow!!
Yes, and we probably also lost fitness. Remember when teams just couldn’t keep up with us in the last quarter and we’d blow them away back in our Premiership years? It’s rarely happened since the beginning of 2022. It feels like other teams nowadays are doing it to us what we did to them in the Premiership years.

Also, the gap between our best quarter and our worst quarter seems stark, which may also signal an issue with fitness
 
We really need to get our stuff right in terms of fitness in the preseason. Sonsie is the only midfielder in that bunch and he’s not overly quick mate. Our midfield is a massive issue bc it’s slow.
Currently with the team make up you are 100% Correct but that could quickly change with players we have that are currently not in the team

Replace Cotchin , Graham with say 2 of Coulthard , Campbell , Smith , Green , Banks and some positional tweaking and all of a sudden things change
 
Currently with the team make up you are 100% Correct but that could quickly change with players we have that are currently not in the team

Replace Cotchin , Graham with say 2 of Coulthard , Campbell , Smith , Green , Banks and some positional tweaking and all of a sudden things change
So you think Riox2 if we toss in a few small fast forwards or a HBF combination we’ll improve in the guts with speed? I can see what you’re saying the can push up, bu I don’t think it’s a satisfactory solution as we actually probably need another Shai type. As much as I regret saying this , but MRJ may need to try and reinvent himself as a MF.
 

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So you think Riox2 if we toss in a few small fast forwards or a HBF combination we’ll improve in the guts with speed? I can see what you’re saying the can push up, bu I don’t think it’s a satisfactory solution as we actually probably need another Shai type. As much as I regret saying this , but MRJ may need to try and reinvent himself as a MF.
We never really know what we have with which game plan the new coach decides to implement
Who would have thought when we drafted a 180cm vfl player that was passed up multiple times he would be such an integral part of our game and influence our team - Kane lambert

Some midget kid that nobody ever heard about that we all thought who the hell is this midget and why do we need another small foward with 18 on the list - Liam Baker

60kgs midget small foward with pick 29 would become best in his draft - Bolton
Mature age HBF thats played an important role in all 3 flags - Broad
PSD pick that was passed up and got a chance and won the B & F in our premiership year - Short

Anything could happen mate
 
We never really know what we have with which game plan the new coach decides to implement
Who would have thought when we drafted a 180cm vfl player that was passed up multiple times he would be such an integral part of our game and influence our team - Kane lambert

Some midget kid that nobody ever heard about that we all thought who the hell is this midget and why do we need another small foward with 18 on the list - Liam Baker

60kgs midget small foward with pick 29 would become best in his draft - Bolton
Mature age HBF thats played an important role in all 3 flags - Broad
PSD pick that was passed up and got a chance and won the B & F in our premiership year - Short

Anything could happen mate
We've still got to be realistic as you still need the cream like Dusty, Cotchin, Lynch and Jack
 
We've still got to be realistic as you still need the cream like Dusty, Cotchin, Lynch and Jack
hopper / Taranto offer same or even more than what Trent has for 3-4 years on the ground to be perfectly hones
Shai is yet to hit his prime and could be top 10 player in the league
Ryan / Gibcus we have no idea how high their ceilings are going to be yet


Glass half full mate ;)
 
I went to pre-season training all summer and the players were executing Dimma's gameplan. His focus was to prevent turnover and rebound against us.

Travel around the boundary line
Shoot on goal from the boundary line
Lock ball in forward 50

This involved heading to the boundary and around, the ball never went through the centre square even forward 50 entries Dimma would continually stop training when the ball was centred into the forward 50 saying that would allow for rebound. Often referenced the Brisbane final, so much so I felt like he was trying to coach what would win the last game rather than looking forward to next season.

Our gameplan has maybe evolved to trying to save a game rather than trying to win a game. Hopefully Mini can allow the players to play more naturally and evolve the gameplan to something that fits the list and players we have available now. Definitely we need to find our Graham's Broad's and Townsend of 2017. Maybe they are Biggy, Coulthard and Green because we lack speed and athleticism to play any other way in the 22 we have been playing
The Brisbane loss I was at, a relatively high scoring affair. Close result that sh/could have gone our way.
A mark or spoil in the goal square by one of the 5 players would have changed history.
We win a game with Neale having record stats.
No Graham, no George, Rusty Dusty.
Finals Debutants Noah, Miller, gibcus, Ross and Sonsie.
The running 10 running stats for that game we win more than half.
End of the day its dumb football that's cost us the win.
Roll on 2023 it's TT and JH squeezing Prestia out of the action; a forward line with Martin and Graham and mansell and a few talls.
The unintended consequence of tarrano and hopper is the player's in the fwd line.

Biggie is rarely in the side. Green has not been amazing. Coulthard a good debut.

At least Prestia and Pickett kicked goals.
I was expecting to drop that game. Us finding a way to win a close one is important.
See what selection is tonight
 
Definitely lost our edge which was speed. Teams were always fearful of us for that but now its a weakness especially our forward which is so slow!!
Was our edge really ever leg speed? Thinking of 19 I can only really think of Short, Rioli and Castagna as having blistering pace. I think we had a lot of mid paced players with huge tanks and the motivation and willingness to run flat out both ways
 
Was our edge really ever leg speed? Thinking of 19 I can only really think of Short, Rioli and Castagna as having blistering pace. I think we had a lot of mid paced players with huge tanks and the motivation and willingness to run flat out both ways
Great call most of players run both ways and the pressure was first class.
 
Was our edge really ever leg speed? Thinking of 19 I can only really think of Short, Rioli and Castagna as having blistering pace. I think we had a lot of mid paced players with huge tanks and the motivation and willingness to run flat out both ways
Definitely speed in the fwline. Locking into f50 was because we could trap it in.
 
Was our edge really ever leg speed? Thinking of 19 I can only really think of Short, Rioli and Castagna as having blistering pace. I think we had a lot of mid paced players with huge tanks and the motivation and willingness to run flat out both ways
2019 Ellis, Houli and Broad Graham always ran. Markov, Balta and Menadue were fast.
Distance ran by the team in one of the finals 279km (vs 298.3 Giants game with the sub)
kick in after a behind from half way down the field ended one RFC Pressure point

2021 Gale complaining about the stand rule in an interview. AFL repeals nothing. Every rule change is always genius; going to make the game an amazing spectacle. Trying to roll back the stand rule was a waste of energy and the team didn't adapt. Dusty copping a serious injury was a first for the Dusty & the club.
 
I went to pre-season training all summer and the players were executing Dimma's gameplan. His focus was to prevent turnover and rebound against us.

Travel around the boundary line
Shoot on goal from the boundary line
Lock ball in forward 50

This involved heading to the boundary and around, the ball never went through the centre square even forward 50 entries Dimma would continually stop training when the ball was centred into the forward 50 saying that would allow for rebound. Often referenced the Brisbane final, so much so I felt like he was trying to coach what would win the last game rather than looking forward to next season.

Our gameplan has maybe evolved to trying to save a game rather than trying to win a game. Hopefully Mini can allow the players to play more naturally and evolve the gameplan to something that fits the list and players we have available now. Definitely we need to find our Graham's Broad's and Townsend of 2017. Maybe they are Biggy, Coulthard and Green because we lack speed and athleticism to play any other way in the 22 we have been playing

You would think after the horrible '14 -'16 period of the overly controlled style and the following 4 years of success 'letting the boys play', he would know better than to devise another game plan stifling the players natural instincts and flair again.
 
Shane Edwards was the key to our success. Before we were successful he was always dishing out aggressive, super fast long handballs to advantage. We were never fast enough or brave enough to see what he was trying to do. 2017 the players were freed up and caught up with what he was doing.
By 2021 Edwards was not the same player. I know it is not all him and yes we won games without him and yes Martin, Jack, Rance may be better players overall but it was Edwards that made the game plan work.
We need more speed and better hand ballers with amazing vision to take our game plan to the next level. We are also not as manic when defending, particularly in our forward line.
 
So you think Riox2 if we toss in a few small fast forwards or a HBF combination we’ll improve in the guts with speed? I can see what you’re saying the can push up, bu I don’t think it’s a satisfactory solution as we actually probably need another Shai type. As much as I regret saying this , but MRJ may need to try and reinvent himself as a MF.
You dont need to be quick through the midfield, not many sides are

Collingwood probably look the quickest side in the comp and they have pendles, Mitchell, Adams and DeGoey running through the midfield. Speed comes from the periphery, sure if you have a dynamic mid its a real weapon but if you go through most teams in the comp, you'll see most of the midfields aren't stacked with express pace.

Melbourne? Petracca, Oliver Viney, not quick
Essendon - Hobbs, Merrett, Parish
Sydney - Warner, Parker, Gulden
Brisbane - Neale, Dunkley, Bailey
Adelaide - Laird, Dawson, Keys
Ports probably the quickest with Rozee and Butters but thats the exception not the norm

Most of the speed comes from the wings, half fwd and half back lines
 
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