AFL Player #21: Dyson Heppell - Goodnight, sweet prince. What a legend! 🤙 - 24/8

[Lore]

Contract Status: Unrestricted Free Agent 2024
My Boy Draft 2024: Pick 27, Highly Evolved

 

[andleanback]

Tangential but isn't Hobbs supposed to be Selwood-like in that respect?

Well there’s selwood like and then there’s actual selwood . Hobbs is selwood like in the way he plays, not sure he’s on the same level of confidence as a leader coming into the system as selwood was. Also selwood was much more advance as a player in year 1.

 

[Lore]

Of all the content about Hepp today, this is the one you should watch:

Heppell's final address as skipper

See Dyson Heppell's heartfelt announcement to teammates about stepping away from the Essendon captaincy.

www.essendonfc.com.au

 

[boncer34]

I think we’d have had a better captain and that would have had an impact on our club. I didn’t say anything about “miraculous improvements.”

If you think leadership doesn’t impact team performance….well, we don’t have much to discuss.

If you think Hep (who I love as a bloke and rate as a player) wasn’t part of our organisational leadership deficiency……again, we are obviously poles apart.

Are you seriously arguing he was a high quality captain?

BTW - spare me the LOL’s mate. I have never understood why you choose to engage that way. It’s an unpleasant way to interact.

Zach Package is saying everything I'm thinking.

 

[Highly Evolved]

Thanks Hepp - I think you did a great job under challenging conditions and an average culture that was outside of your control.

 

[Snake Charmer]

Thanks Hep. The time was right. I hope Ridley take over the top job

 

[BrunoV]

My impression of Heppell is that he was the sort of captain that really tried to put an arm around everyone, that he actually cared about everyone.

That might sound cliche but it's not because not everyone can do that. Plenty of successful captains would not have been anywhere near that approachable or even tried to be.

I don't believe Hird would have been approachable, certainly not in the way Heppell appears to have been. There is an aloofness a guy like him cannot escape even if it doesn't reflect him or his personality. It's like having the King leading the charge for your company. You'll die for him but you'll never feel like his friend or equal. I think it was much the same for Judd though I suspect he was a little deliberate in his aloofness. Fyfe doesn't seem to have handled it well at all.

I doubt any of the players have a bad word to say about Heppell. Again, that's not going to be the case for the stereotype that people around here have been calling for. It's also not a bad thing in an of itself.

Buckley, Voss, Ricciuto, Brown, Harley, Mitchell were extremely demanding and/or confrontational. That will leave collateral damage in its wake.

Sellwood and Hodge are difficult to pin down. Both are the demanding confrontational types but are more approachable. Hodge was one of the boys, as much of a lad as there was which brought him down to the level of commoner, and I suspect Selwood had much more of Heppell's approach than meets the eye. Their ability to be both of the archetypes is why they lasted so long. I see Riewoldt the same way.

Heppell seems very similar to Cotchin and Boak of the current group. One is a 3 time premiership captain and the other would not have been out of place (when he played in teams losing prelims by less than a kick). I see Ward here and maybe Kirk too although those guys had a natural aggression in the way they played that makes them a bit more of a blend.

A lot is said and written about what was required post saga. It's almost all been wrong because we followed that script and we've been a shit show for another 6 years. It seems to be assumed that everything would have collapsed if we didn't coddle the players. What is the basis for that assumption.

Heppell as a captain, an idea in a vacuum, was fine. I think he could have been reallly good had the team had a hard edge. I don't think he's been suited to much about the last 6 years because we haven't needed togetherness or any of that bulshit. That whole line of thinking is corrosive PR spin that has set the club back even further.

We needed to be a tough, selfless team. The team needed someone with the authority to hit it between the eyes with reality. It is naive in the extreme to pretend it would not have been a significant influence. There was a list there that needed to be moulded, and could have been especially in 2017/2018.

It's not Heppell fault that he wasn't that guy and it doesn't make him a bad captain.

 

[The Donners]

He didn't get the votes.

Or, to be more specific, the voting system isn't a straight popularity vote for who you want to be captain. Every player rates all of their teammates on 4-5 criteria which align to the "Essendon values", and the values the year he got dropped were changed from the previous year to emphasise something that Hurley did better than Merrett, which meant that Hurley came into the leadership group and Merrett was dropped.

The Essendon values changed to 4Cs (care, commit, compete, celebrate) when Rutten officially took over running the whole program in 2021, but before that they had something else that was never made explicit under Worsfold, so we don't know exactly what Merrett wasn't doing that got him dropped.

The general assumption is that he's more introverted than Heppell, and less... easy for his teammates to talk to, confide in, harder to ask for support?

Woosha was great in one sense and horrible in another.

Nothing wrong with a few years to roll us over and then look at guys like Hobbs, Mcgrath, Redman ect

It might give McGrath time to solidify his spot in the side. Could be a ripping small defender (and am expecting him to be so) but to date he’s been a very average footballer.

 

[yodellinhank]

Woosha was great in one sense and horrible in another.

It might give McGrath time to solidify his spot in the side. Could be a ripping small defender (and am expecting him to be so) but to date he’s been a very average footballer.

Woosha was horrible in every sense.

McCluggage is being spoken about as potential captain. McGarth hoping to solidify his spot in the side. Nice one Dodo.

 

[ant555]

To elaborate - his inability to drive standards.

He’s been one out which hasn’t helped, but he has never been able to influence the group the way Selwood and others have.

I know where you are coming from. He was more a nice good bloke captain and in the last few years he has lacked the game to have an on field impact.
He was not at Selwood level but in fairness as a few have said in the posts above he has not had a support cast to work with. Selwood was an exceptional captain and was able to continue driving the standards but he came into a system that already had a shake up and had some very hard line leaders in it.
I think even Selwood would have had his issues with our playing group.

 

[ant555]

To be fair selwood was one of the blokes who was driving standards early in his first year in 2007. And was even calling out older team mates for poor efforts early in the season when they weren’t going so well, they then turned into a dynasty. Selwood arriving was one of the key reasons for this.

I think the whole club meeting at the end of 2006 drove it. A few senior players called out Ablett and a few others. Selwood was certainly a factor from very early on but I would not say he was a key reason. The key reason was everyone from the top down being honest with themselves.

 

[DERO]

Geelong were using Leading teams weren’t they? Serious question.

 

[andleanback]

I think the whole club meeting at the end of 2006 drove it. A few senior players called out Ablett and a few others. Selwood was certainly a factor from very early on but I would not say he was a key reason. The key reason was everyone from the top down being honest with themselves.

And they still didn’t start the season well. They lost to north down in geelong. They drew a line in the sand that was the turning point. Plenty of geelong players from 07 have talked of the impact selwood had when he walked in the door, a player that drove standards straight away and really made a few players get their heads out of their asses to move the club forward. Being a key reason I was referring to also how they’ve gone on to be a continuous successful side during his whole career not a flash in the pan team that wins a flag and falls away.

 

[boncer34]

And they still didn’t start the season well. They lost to north down in geelong. They drew a line in the sand that was the turning point. Plenty of geelong players from 07 have talked of the impact selwood had when he walked in the door, a player that drove standards straight away and really made a few players get their heads out of their asses to move the club forward. Being a key reason I was referring to also how they’ve gone on to be a continuous successful side during his whole career not a flash in the pan team that wins a flag and falls away.

North weren't crap

 

[NAB777]

And they still didn’t start the season well. They lost to north down in geelong. They drew a line in the sand that was the turning point. Plenty of geelong players from 07 have talked of the impact selwood had when he walked in the door, a player that drove standards straight away and really made a few players get their heads out of their asses to move the club forward. Being a key reason I was referring to also how they’ve gone on to be a continuous successful side during his whole career not a flash in the pan team that wins a flag and falls away.

Yep. Have spoken to a few people down that way about this.
Some of the things he was doing in Geelong's losing performances at the start of 07 made the 'older' guys have a look at themselves.

 

[boncer34]

Joel Selwood at 18 is not the Joel Selwood at 34. He was a dumb kid too once.

Especially in 2007.

 

[yodellinhank]

Geelong were using Leading teams weren’t they? Serious question.

Leading Teams came in 2008 I think cat fans have said. Was a thing by '09 I reckon because a club I was at did it to two blokes, saying the whole group would be done over the course of the year and then that was the last we heard about it.

 

[andleanback]

North weren't crap

Your point?
They thought they were a much better side these them, they hardly ever lose down there and north rarely won. They did beat them by 106 in a final later that year.

the chat after the north match was also about how they were 2-3 and were watching another season slide away, line in the sand and they only lost 1 match for the remainder of season.

 

[boncer34]

Your point?
They thought they were a much better side these them, they hardly ever lose down there and north rarely won. They did beat them by 106 in a final later that year..

My point is that Geelong losing to the 4th placed team early in the season wasn't a sign they started poorly.

They hardly ever lose there now. Prior to their run of dominance it was a different story. For example in 2006 they went 4-3-1.

Also Norfs record down there before that game over the past 6 efforts was 3-3. Not quite a rare win if you're making it 4 of the last 7.

 

[andleanback]

My point is that Geelong losing to the 4th placed team early in the season wasn't a sign they started poorly.

They hardly ever lose there now. Prior to their run of dominance it was a different story. For example in 2006 they went 4-3-1.

Also Norfs record down there before that game over the past 6 efforts was 3-3. Not quite a rare win if you're making it 4 of the last 7.

They were 2-3 and after they lost to north. That’s the point…
They would also expected themselves to beat north down there.

They were underperforming for the talent they had on their list and selwood was one that called out players to be better.

 

[DERO]

They were 2-3 and after they lost to north. That’s the point…
They would also expected themselves to beat north down there.

They were underperforming for the talent they had on their list and selwood was one that called out players to be better.

Selwood, who was 5 games into his first year?

Carn mate.

 

[boncer34]

They were 2-3 and after they lost to north. That’s the point…
They would also expected themselves to beat north down there.

They were underperforming for the talent they had on their list and selwood was one that called out players to be better.

And I'm saying it's borderline average. They lost to one of the better teams of that season at a ground they had mixed results at against them in recent time.

Joel was doing that in 2007? ok.

Hey Lore this should probably go in non-essendon thread.

 

[jmoo wan]

Hey Lore this should probably go in non-essendon thread.

or delusional pearlers?

 

[andleanback]

Selwood, who was 5 games into his first year?

Carn mate.

Yeh… viney was calling out senior players after his 3rd game
Some players are built different

 

[andleanback]

And I'm saying it's borderline average. They lost to one of the better teams of that season at a ground they had mixed results at against them in recent time.

Joel was doing that in 2007? ok.

Hey Lore this should probably go in non-essendon thread.

It’s on record from many of the geelong boys saying it.

If any top rated side has 2 wins after 5 rounds it’s alarm bells. You’re not giving yourself much room for the rest of the season for any hiccups if you want to make top 4.

 

[boncer34]

It’s on record from many of the geelong boys saying it.

If any top rated side has 2 wins after 5 rounds it’s alarm bells. You’re not giving yourself much room for the rest of the season for any hiccups if you want to make top 4.

Cool. No playing group ever rewrites history with rose coloured glasses so that settles that.