Senior 4. Jack Watts

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Re: Jack Watts - The Schoolboy Effect??

Shocking thread. Chris Judd, Jobe Watson, Brendan Goddard, Cyril Rioli, Luke Ball, Ryan O'Keefe, Ted Richards, Tom Hawkins and Tom Scully all came from APS schools and are going okay.
 
Re: Jack Watts - The Schoolboy Effect??

Goddard, Watson and Hawkins all struggled for 5 years in the AFL system...

Plus your mate (Scully) has not performed better than Watts this year.
 
Re: Jack Watts - The Schoolboy Effect??

Too many Melbourne supporters get sucked in listening to what opposition supporters say.

Jack Watts goes alright in my opinion.
 

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Re: Jack Watts - The Schoolboy Effect??

Very true that some of our fans have been easily led by that bollocks. Far too many.

As I said last week in the preview:

Jack will NEVER receive the credit he deserves, for this performance (against the Swans) or any other (such as his game against Carlton).

For the simple reason that so many, in the media, disturbingly large numbers of opposition supporters, etc. want nothing more than to see him fail, and will happily ignore anything good he does on the field, try to find a way to rationalise and spin it, or just straight-out deny it altogether.

It's very clear that, as far as so many people outside our club are concerned, "special" rules are applied to Watts when it comes to judgements and comments made about him, which are applied to no other player. If Naitanui had put up a performance like this (the Swans game, but the same applies to the Carlton game too) it'd be trumpeted out all around the country for days afterwards. You can bet on that.

There is no other player in the AFL who cops such disgraceful double standards and such blatant hatred and bias against him, except for Jack. And it's disgusting that this continues to occur.
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Re: Jack Watts - The Schoolboy Effect??

All apart of the scrutiny that eventually comes with being a #1 overall draft pick. Happens to pretty much every #1 draft pick in every sport. There are high, and mostly unfair, expectations bestowed upon the player, and their every moment is under the biggest microscope, where they're every action is dissected with unfair bias.

This "schoolboy effect" is moot, because Watts doesn't have to justify anything.
 
Re: Jack Watts - The Schoolboy Effect??

Dazb86 said:
He's playing like a basketballer playing football at the moment. Looks like he tries to avoid contact instead of initiating it.

I think that could be coached out of him given time.

I don't think the private school system hurt his development because he'd be getting better coaching and development (you'd hope) at AFL level anyway.
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He has all the skills to become a very good if not elite footballer - I think you sum it up with your first line very well.

Needs to get contact in to his game to take it to the next level..
 
Re: Jack Watts - The Schoolboy Effect??

I think the concept of this thread is an interesting one, however that's about as far as it goes for me because there are a lot of examples you could use to disprove the theory.

I think Watts has a lot of upside and has been playing ok this year. His game Vs Sydney was very encouraging, especially considering he didn't have many mates that game in that department.

What disturbs me is what disturbs a lot of people, his apparent aversion to contact. I don't expect him to be crashing packs etc however it is clear as day that he doesn't love the physical contact part of the game.

The comparison to Goddard is a pretty decent one. It also shows you can train/develop a player to be more physical. With this and more bulk and game time I think JW will get there.
 
Re: Jack Watts - The Schoolboy Effect??

This is how close we are.

we have got a 195cm metre guy who has got great skills.

he's got great composure.

He's a great decision-maker.

He's come from being a skinny runt who was crushed in the 2009 QB - a game he should never have played in.

he is not an instant superstar.

OK, he needs more aggression. That will come with self-confidence.

As an overall bundle, hell, I will take this any day.

he is going to make it. let the morons laugh.
 
Re: Jack Watts - The Schoolboy Effect??

It’s an interesting theory, albeit IMO just a theory.

I was having an argument about this with a mate the other day. Sam Day was considered as big if not bigger talent than Jack Watts, and although stats are not everything, at the same age Jack averaged 7 more disposals per game, 1.7 marks and 1 tackle and Day averaged only 0.1 more goals per game more. All this and Day is already listed as 5kg heavier than Watts is currently.

We are hard on him, and it still shits me that he picks and chooses the contests he hits but the boys got game.
 
Re: Jack Watts - The Schoolboy Effect??

Looking for a comment on this one - what about playing JW beside Mitch Clark, with MC acting virtually as a mentor - giving JW some confidence in the tough stuff. All JW needs is some kgs and some anger and he will probably captain MFC one day.
 
Re: Jack Watts - The Schoolboy Effect??

Wonaeamirri33 said:
4th-best contested mark in our team so far this season, behind Howe, Clark, and Rivers. 6th-best in contested ball - level with Mitch.

So no.
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I believe he is. I'm using my own experiences with footy when looking at him. I'd played basketball for 9 years as a centre before playing my first proper game of footy for a club. I used to 'box out' from throw ins (basketball term) in the ruck alright but when it came to marking contests I'd be clueless and would be used as a step ladder or try to float in for the mark instead of crashing packs. This was mainly because in basketball you'd look to avoid contact most of the time and I was too used to doing it for footy to come naturally.

This is how it looks like Watts is playing at the moment. I don't think it comes naturally for him to hit contests hard.

Might be his basketball background that has caused it not the fact he played in the private school system.
 
Re: Jack Watts - The Schoolboy Effect??

Daz, that's a well-crafted quality response, which I certainly appreciate. And I entirely see where you're coming from.

But nevertheless, the fact that Jack is now the 4th-best contested marking player in a team which is itself the 3rd-best contested marking side in the AFL, speaks volumes.

Maybe it isn't a natural thing for him to take on the contest in that way, I don't know.

But it's very clear that he's doing so more and more, and getting better at it all the time.
 
Re: Jack Watts - The Schoolboy Effect??

I think Watts will still end up an excellent player. He has way too much class, poise and athleticism to not succeed.

However, some players have mongrel in spades, some players have a bit of it, some have none. Unfortunately Watts has none, and never will. We just need to accept that, and it can't be taught.. I fear this is what will hold him back from becoming a real superstar of the comp.
 

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Re: Jack Watts - The Schoolboy Effect??

Viney said:
There's been a stack of great footballers to come out of the APS system

I think the football community are all over slagging Watts' no matter what he does

I've seen Watts' game against Sydney described as "...the worst 34 possession game ever" etc.

I've seen him kick 3 goals and people say he should've had 4 or 5

I don't think I've seen him play a game where everyone has just said "shit Watts' had a good game"

It doesn't matter what he does, how he plays, where he plays, who he plays on etc, he will always be bagged

The kid needs bulk, size and confidence

He's ultra skilled, he reads the play will, his desire for the contest will come in time

I've said it a million times, look at Goddard. Universally bagged for being soft and a pea heart for the first 5 seasons he played, now he hits contests as hard as anyone and everyone seems to have forgotten his early softness
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Good post, i agree with goddard comparison he took time to find his feet at AFL level, they are also similar sizes and there was (and still is) great debate where to play him.

In regards to the OP i disagree a lot of other players have come through the same system and have developed differently to Watts. In regards to not playing TAC footy, Watts won the Larke Medal for best player in Divison one of the U18 championships.

I think the more pressing issue is the way we develop players, we seem to draft the right kids they show promise and after 3 years go completely backwards! i.e. cale morton
 
Re: Jack Watts - The Schoolboy Effect??

I'm happy with Watts playing off half back. We need someone back there who can kick. Leave him there it's working out well. Who cares if he never becomes a forward, draft/trade someone else. Use him for what he is good at.
 
Re: Jack Watts - The Schoolboy Effect??

Mr Mojo Risin said:
I think the concept of this thread is an interesting one, however that's about as far as it goes for me because there are a lot of examples you could use to disprove the theory.

I think Watts has a lot of upside and has been playing ok this year. His game Vs Sydney was very encouraging, especially considering he didn't have many mates that game in that department.

What disturbs me is what disturbs a lot of people, his apparent aversion to contact. I don't expect him to be crashing packs etc however it is clear as day that he doesn't love the physical contact part of the game.

The comparison to Goddard is a pretty decent one. It also shows you can train/develop a player to be more physical. With this and more bulk and game time I think JW will get there.
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Good post.

Isn't Jack Viney in a private school system? Will he be soft when he starts AFL? Don't think so. It's a good discussion topic, but ultimately, it comes down to a thirst for the contest. Like most have mentioned, Watts has all the skills to become elite. But he shirks a contest. Whether he can become a player who enjoys the contact, I'm not sure, but it has nothing to do with him coming from a private school.
 
Re: Jack Watts - The Schoolboy Effect??

wowlace said:
I'm happy with Watts playing off half back. We need someone back there who can kick. Leave him there it's working out well. Who cares if he never becomes a forward, draft/trade someone else. Use him for what he is good at.
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Woohoo, finally getting some sense and positive talk about Watts, totally agree play him across half back give him the ball and let him do his thing. Giddy up
 
Just a thought re: the APS/AGS vs. the TAC... Without having been anywhere near the latter, I would suggest that the harder brand of footy is played between schools. Having attended an APS school, fair to say there is generally a lot of feeling in the games, and to suggest that the general image of a pampered, soft private school boy translates to soft footballers is a stretch. Sure there are some *cough* me *cough*, but especially in the First XVIII it's a big deal - tough footy where the hits are hard and the competition fierce.

Meanwhile in the TAC, the most talented kids run around for a team they have no real affiliation to, beyond a regional link, for two years with the aim of getting drafted at the end of it. Also I believe there is a gentlemen's agreement re: tagging in the TAC - the idea being to let the players show off their abilities without being niggled all day. Not saying that creates soft players, but to suggest that all private school players are soft reeks of chips on shoulders to me (see: the Hun).

The real disadvantage, again viewed from a distance, would be the game plans and structures, training habits and overall skill level that the school teams lack compared to the TAC - the latter being more focused on creating AFL players and obviously having a better talent pool.

/rant
 
Re: Jack Watts - The Schoolboy Effect??

Jacks a tall player, tall players take time to develop, his breakthrough year will be at 24-25 when his frame will finally fill out, have all the skills hes learnt right here right now, and will be dominant whatever his position on the field is. As was said before, just like Goddard.
 
Re: Jack Watts - The Schoolboy Effect??

Animosity said:
Jacks a tall player, tall players take time to develop, his breakthrough year will be at 24-25 when his frame will finally fill out, have all the skills hes learnt right here right now, and will be dominant whatever his position on the field is. As was said before, just like Goddard.
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With his solid play down back lately, I reckon Goddard is the best comparison Watts can receive at the moment. In fact, I would be shocked to think Neeld and co. aren't using Goddard as the template for Watts.
 
Aenimence said:
With his solid play down back lately, I reckon Goddard is the best comparison Watts can receive at the moment. In fact, I would be shocked to think Neeld and co. aren't using Goddard as the template for Watts.
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they are very very similar although jack is a better contested mark for mine.. he's going to be a jet and will have a great impact than natinui in my opinion.. his skills and decision making are first class, plus he is great in traffic.. he'll be an a grader for us, he just knows how to play..

the media and knockers can g&gf'd..
 
Re: Jack Watts - The Schoolboy Effect??

Watts is far too valuable to be playing where he is now. It won't be permanent.
 
Re: Jack Watts - The Schoolboy Effect??

Pendlebury came from a Basketballing background and if Watts turns out to be 3/4 as good as him you can't complain.
 
Re: Jack Watts - The Schoolboy Effect??

guitarded said:
Watts is far too valuable to be playing where he is now. It won't be permanent.
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Watts is coming along just fine,i am satisfied with his porgress and in my opinion will become a key player in our assault in a couple years time.
 

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Senior 4. Jack Watts

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