Mega Thread AFL to investigate Essendon for controversial fitness program - PART3

[Woodie99]

In regards to Essendon and all the jokes about fielding a reserves team, does anyone here legitimately think there is no middle ground and they're just going to wipe out an entire list of players for a couple of years?

Be realistic, they can only ban players they can prove have taken PEDs and that to begin with is sketchy. The fact is that we have no idea of the evidence that lead to the ACC report or whether it can be even be acted upon. My personal belief at this point is that the evidence will be strong in regards to officials and more importantly criminal charges against certain individuals (Doctor, if that IS his real name), but I'm not sure whether that evidence will also be beyond reasonable doubt when it comes to who took the PEDs and when, especially if they were unaware what they were being administered.

ASADA clearly weren't on the ball throughout this whole thing and, as much as it absolutely pains me to admit it, Caroline Wilson actually had a good point. What the hell were these people doing if they only acted when the case was taken to them?

While the case against certain officials may be sound, nothing I've read thus far makes it sound like the players themselves will have anything more than a circumstantial case to answer. It just doesn't sound like they have enough or they'd have come down like a hammer already.

It is a stink that will no doubt linger for a long time over Essendon and a sad one at that, but I don't think much will come of it in terms of player suspensions, and what does come will probably be, at best, a small selection of players and certainly not the whole list.

Agree with you post, but I think you have to take into account that the report wasn't to be released until march, why is this? Maybe they were still gathering evidence, IMO EFC goinr to the AFL over this was a very smart move.

 

[boncer34]

Why is anybody bothering to continually engage in this pointless circular drivel that boncer is posting?

It's clearly designed to be a distraction.

Solution: Don't get distracted.

Hi Teffy. Hows Caddy training down at Arden Street?

 

[SnowRoo]

Matt Thompson ‏@MattThompsonAFL
STATEMENT: Essendon Football Club is fully cooperating with the AFL & ASADA investigation & is not in a position to make any further comment

Think we all know what position they are in, hope ASADA use lube.

 

[Boxhead_31]

Matt Thompson ‏@MattThompsonAFL
STATEMENT: Essendon Football Club is fully cooperating with the AFL & ASADA investigation & is not in a position to make any further comment

Could be read as:
"We can't make a statement about the thing we can't make a statement about"

 

[le dominateur]

They held the press conference because they were named - they are not being investigated because they held a press conference.

Essendon supporters cannot seem to grasp this fact.

 

[BlueTouchPaper]

To be fair the 'sports scientists' are only in the early years of self assessment from peers, are not required to be certified or registered with a goverment body. It also was said of that self assessments that only about 6 from the afl would qualify.

This area needs alot of work.

In isolation, it's not an issue - although it definitely will become one after this.

But when it coincides with your club being targeted by a criminal investigation and the largest single PED investigation into Australian sport, it is massively concerning. Not to mention it coincides with the worst soft-tissue injury run we've seen in a long time.

I feel for Hird, he would be oblivious to most of this - but the players and coach, as far as I am concerned, need to have unwavering trust in one another.

Maybe that still exists.

 

[TerryWallet]

First time I'd heard it was in 2005, from memory, and it definitely wasn't started by myself.

Dermott?

 

[whiteoak]

If it was us, I could understand the pedantry. There's still a chance that they're not.

Essendon haven't been explicitly named as the club on p. 17. Caro reckoned her source said they weren't. Based on the number of NRL clubs involved there's still a chance that the p. 17 club is an NFL club. Dank has worked with a number of them.

Point missed I do believe.

It was all rumour and innuendo as to why Essendon called the presser in the first place.

Now it has been revealed that Essendon has MULTIPLE players under suspicion for using PED's. But Boncer is desperately trying to deflect attention to page 17 of the ACC report.

As if that changes their culpability!

 

[Lance Uppercut]

lovely day on the golf course today. Probably could have hit them a bit better but what do you do. Somewhat fittingly Dusty Martin was in the group in front of us.

So what's happening guys? I imagine all these alerts and tags I have are some friendly how do you do's for a quiet, boring Sunday?

 

[ziad]

If essendon re found guilty, how can they be allowed to play in a comp which starts in a month (less if you count pre-season). If they start the season and then get kicked out it's going to cause chaos. How long does it take to investigate whether there was something dodgy going on?

surely the will do the right thing and stand out for the season (and next) now

 

[Ancient Tiger]

Has the fish guy from Essendon made any comments?

 

[mike14]

None of what I posted has anything to do hinges on the legality of the substances.

sure it does. If Hird asked if the substance was legal, got told it was, and it turns out it was, then it's no problem...

 

[Flawed Genius]

lovely day on the golf course today. Probably could have hit them a bit better but what do you do. Somewhat fittingly Dusty Martin was in the group in front of us.

So what's happening guys? I imagine all these alerts and tags I have are some friendly how do you do's for a Sunday?

Shoulda stayed on the course I imagine. Hang on I'll get the bomb shelter ready

 

[Hard_to_Beat]

Hi Teffy. Hows Caddy training down at Arden Street?

Not bad Lance.

Move on son.

 

[boncer34]

Been able to find one where he denies that Essendon are the club involved?
Nope cheers cobber ta

I'm not the one that started this line of discussion. I'm also not arguing the opposite. All I'm asking for is evidence.

If you can't provide it thats fine.

 

[yibbida]

Despite boncer34 trying to derail the tread, the interesting thing that came out of today's press conference is that the investigation is likely to take months before any players or officials are sanctioned (if there is to be sanctions).

If there are a number of players that are suspended in 3 months time, how will the teams that played against (and possibly lost to) Essendon feel? If it were one or two players any club would likely suspend the players until the investigation was complete, but if it is 80% of the team what should they do?

 

[vonn]

I normally read the last few pages of a thread to get any idea of what the discussion is about. All I have gotten now is confusion with boncer34's insistence on semantics. If you cannot make the connection between the report and a direct quote, I can't even begin to imagine the internal struggles you have when living and conversing with others day to day.

Aside from that, is their any precedent to go from to get an idea of what the AFL will do & punishment?

 

[boncer34]

Not bad Lance.

Move on son.

Don't you have me on ignore? Aww Teffy you been telling fibs again?

 

[Ancient Tiger]

lovely day on the golf course today. Probably could have hit them a bit better but what do you do. Somewhat fittingly Dusty Martin was in the group in front of us.

So what's happening guys? I imagine all these alerts and tags I have are some friendly how do you do's for a quiet, boring Sunday?

Nah. Just another lovely Sunday!

Enjoy the 19th hole Lance!

 

[Travisty]

In the first paragraph you are certain that the said piece of information from the document will ruin Essendon, "...part of the document that is GOING to ruin your football club...". In the second, you say "...to see how deep of a mess your club MAY well be in", indicating an element of doubt in your assumption that Essendon is screwed. Which one is it?

The first paragraph refers to my state of mind on the matter.

The second is in reference to what boncer34's mindset would be if he had the comprehension skills of a 5th grader.

You are clutching at straws that do not exist.

 

[BlueTouchPaper]

sure it does. If Hird asked if the substance was legal, got told it was, and it turns out it was, then it's no problem...

No it doesn't. He cannot confirm what his players have been taking. That is the crux of it all. In light of all that has happened, this in and of itself is a massive red flag.

 

[strobe00]

If essendon re found guilty, how can they be allowed to play in a comp which starts in a month (less if you count pre-season). If they start the season and then get kicked out it's going to cause chaos. How long does it take to investigate whether there was something dodgy going on?

Could be a while. Will depend entirely what Dank and co. have done, and what they say about it.

I reckon ASADA will have a sh*t of a time trying to prove anything, and Dank wouldn't be forthcoming even if he had administered dodgy substances, which he still mightn't have. He'd be stupid to do something that couldn't be explained away.

So I reckon it'll drag.

Not allowing the Dons to field a team until everything is wrapped up would be a hell of a lot more distruptive than the case you mention.

 

[TennisPlayerAndy]

lovely day on the golf course today. Probably could have hit them a bit better but what do you do. Somewhat fittingly Dusty Martin was in the group in front of us.

So what's happening guys? I imagine all these alerts and tags I have are some friendly how do you do's for a quiet, boring Sunday?

Go and have another round Lance...

 

[BlueTouchPaper]

Be realistic, they can only ban players they can prove have taken PEDs and that to begin with is sketchy.

This is wrong.

Malifice's interpretations will enlighten you.

 

[LargeFooty]

the 'sports scientists' are ... not required to be certified or registered with a goverment body ... This area needs alot of work.

Spot on. There is nothing a "sports scientist" knows that a doctor involved with professional sport does not. However, there is much a team doctor knows that a "sports scientist" will never know, let alone understand.

There is a reason for the reported conflict between team doctors and "sports scientists" within the AFL/NRL ....