Scandal Alastair Clarkson whacking port fan

[captain ebert]

When will chris fagans head be put on the chopping block! He did twice as much as clarko. *sarcasm*

Anyone defending those flogs need to hear the whole story.

Fagan "I was worried someone was going to throw a punch"

 

[MinerBoy]

There's definitely something deeper going on here with the Cheshire Cat to be sure.....The moral outrage exhibited is completely out of all proportion with what has transpired.

Truth.

 

[Procrastinator35]

Might ask you the same thing? Why don't you direct the same inquiry to some of your fellow supporters? It's an interesting topic for discussion - its been illuminating for me that so many people haven't the faintest idea (or regard) about the law, what constitutes self-defence. I've found it interesting that people feel if you're drunken and loud you deserve to be smacked in the head (or worse). Most of all, your good self has reinforced that many on this forum will defend actions purely because that person is a fellow member of their organisation - that mentality is a socially acceptable form of cognitive illness, you know.

Right, Right, Right, Right...And your disproportionate outrage on this incident has nothing whatsoever to do with the fact that Alistair Clarkson is the Coach of the HFC!...This is after all a football Forum matey.

If you want to be all high n mighty & discuss the topic of violence &proportionality in self-defence etc, etc,... Then there's a social Issues board elsewhere that's more appropriate for such discussions!

 

[MinerBoy]

I've found it interesting that people feel if you're drunken and loud you deserve to be smacked in the head (or worse).

I've found it interesting that people see footage of a forceful push off to salvage your own personal space and attempt to twist it into a round house king hit, choker hold and despicable act of violence.

We get you don't like him and have issues with his history. The fact you've let it cloud your ability to assess the incident though does you no favours.

 

[Cheshire Cat]

Right, Right, Right, Right...And your disproportionate outrage on this incident has nothing whatsoever to do with the fact that Alistair Clarkson is the Coach of the HFC!...This is after all a football Forum matey.

If you want to be all high n mighty & discuss the topic of violence &proportionality in self-defence etc, etc,... Then there's a social Issues board elsewhere that's more appropriate for such discussions!

This thread has to do with whether Clarkson's action were justified or not. That's what I'm discussing.

 

[The King!]

Fagan "I was worried someone was going to throw a punch"

Why are fagan and clarkson not allowed to be fearful?

 

[The King!]

I've found it interesting that people see footage of a forceful push off to salvage your own personal space and attempt to twist it into a round house king hit, choker hold and despicable act of violence.

We get you don't like him and have issues with his history. The fact you've let it cloud your ability to assess the incident though does you no favours.

Would be interesting to see the response if it were someone else involved from another club maybe Leon Cameron or someone lower profiled

 

[Procrastinator35]

This thread has to do with whether Clarkson's action were justified or not. That's what I'm discussing.

If the police decide that there is a case to be answered for, then that will be decided in a court of Law....Not here!

 

[Cheshire Cat]

Except only one of us has ever deviated from what happened into suppositions, hypotheticals, melodramas and an infinite world of what ifs.

You are (of course) making your own suppositions based on the same incomplete evidence. Not only that but arguing that the action was one necessity which it was not (Clarkson has admitted that it was not - as he said he wished he had continued to walk away).

 

[Valleyboy9]

Not sure how old you are, but it's pretty much common knowledge that if you want a punch in the mouth, walking up to a stranger, harassing them and getting in their face is the right way to go about it.

Mmmmm. Not sure about that. Possibly the Hawthorne way but in general terms punching someone in the mouth is a criminal offence. If you hold a position within a club such as a coach it is important to display a level of professionalism. Striking someone unless you have been struck first won't wash.

 

[MinerBoy]

Would be interesting to see the response if it were someone else involved from another club maybe Leon Cameron or someone lower profiled

It would also be interesting if it was one of these moral crusaders in the same position. Even should they have they self restraint to not force the bloke off, I'd love to get their take on what point of an interaction like this you are deemed to now be "fearful of being hit or intimidated by the situation".

From the safety of their keyboards it's quite clear that they wouldn't have found any discomfort in the situation.

 

[Cheshire Cat]

If the police decide that there is a case to be answered for, then that will be decided in a court of Law....Not here!

Agree. On that note, I guess I'll see my way out. It's been real!

 

[captain ebert]

Why are fagan and clarkson not allowed to be fearful?

amazing isn't it, they're worried about a punch being thrown & what happened next?
They've spun so much shit.

 

[peppy la pew]

Different circumstance to this and not relevant. The fans agenda was (or should have been) clear to Clarkson (get his attention, get a photograh with him, irritate him). Complete strangers approaching you or I whose agenda would be unclear is a different scenario.

They weren't fans dressed in colours, they were complete strangers to him and Fagan, stick to the facts

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

amazing isn't it, they're worried about a punch being thrown & what happened next?
They've spun so much shit.

We know who's spinning shit.

No punch was thrown.

The flog copped a push to the base of his neck with an open hand.

 

[The King!]

amazing isn't it, they're worried about a punch being thrown & what happened next?
They've spun so much shit.

Theres a video what spin is there just watch it ffs

 

[MinerBoy]

You are (of course) making your own suppositions based on the same incomplete evidence. Not only that but arguing that the action was one necessity which it was not (Clarkson has admitted that it was not - as he said he wished he had continued to walk away).

I'm basing my case on all comments that have been put forth by the people involved and who were witness and the footage that is available. You are making yours on preconceived prejudices and assumptions on this incident that have had no basis in footage or any of the information that has come out.

I've also never argued it was necessary. He could have tried (AGAIN) to push his way past the clown. Likewise I've never argued it was unreasonable to give him a push off considering previous attempts to do so had only seen the person get further in his space. Neither option was wrong. You have only the ability to see the situation from the POV that helps re-affirm your preconceived prejudice.

But when you start talking round house hooks, king hits and the like, rather than seeing it for what is what (i.e. stop over dramatising what happened) then it is plainly obvious you have no intention on dealing with this simple facts of the scenario and want the hyteria to take hold.

Rather than waffling, take time to comprehend.

 

[Mr Meeseeks]

Most of all, your good self has reinforced that many on this forum will defend actions purely because that person is a fellow member of their organisation - that mentality is a socially acceptable form of cognitive illness, you know.

Im not defending him, I just dont really think its a story worth caring about. Im well aware Clarko is an angry campaigner, i just dont care.

Also, there seems to be supporters of all clubs defending him more than I am. In fact its kind of overwhelming how many have spoken up, including many who admit to hating Hawthorn, how do you explain that? That kind of nullifies the point that you've spent over 100 posts and almost an entire day trying to make doesn't it?

 

[romeohwho]

They weren't fans dressed in colours, they were complete strangers to him and Fagan, stick to the facts

Yep but clearly football agenda/Port supporters-couldn't have made that much clearer, could they?

 

[Mervyn Beasley]

I had a very similar incident to Clarkson walking back from the game. Walking up King William street with a female friend, a rather drunk Port fan came up to us and made a few sarcastic comments about the game which we ignored and kept walking. He didn't let up and when he tried to put his arm around me, I elbowed/pushed him hard in the ribs, hard enough that he fell over but his drunken state probably had a bit to do with it. I then received a verbal spray that I can't repeat here but we kept walking trying to put some distance between us. A couple of other Port fans who saw the incident told us not to worry, they would take care of him if he followed us. Luckily he gave up, more for his sake then mine as the gentlemen who came to our rescue were big blokes and I suspect wouldn't have just politely asked him to go on his way (and in case either of our rescuers are reading this - thank you!)

So according to some on this thread, I am the one at fault for a 'violent' reaction. I should have just let this drunken yobo slobber all over me, he was just being 'friendly'. Seriously people, think about what you are saying, you are looking very foolish.

I am very interested in Cheshire Cats thoughts and opinions on the above??

 

[threesixpio]

You are (of course) making your own suppositions based on the same incomplete evidence. Not only that but arguing that the action was one necessity which it was not (Clarkson has admitted that it was not - as he said he wished he had continued to walk away).

In retrospect - again you err on this

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Yep but clearly football agenda/Port supporters-couldn't have made that much clearer, could they?

Not necessarily. They were walking from pub to pub. They could've followed anyone.

 

[Valleyboy9]

Fagan "I was worried someone was going to throw a punch"

Just supporting his coach. Had a quick discussion after the incident and got there story together.

 

[romeohwho]

Not necessarily. They were walking from pub to pub. They could've followed anyone.

Yep-but they were making comments about the footy weren't they?

 

[Chief]

Just looked at the video - no call for Clarkson to lash out. He could easily be charged with assault.

He's an angry, angry little man.