ASADA seeks evidence from Fairfax

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andrewb said:
Where's the money trail?
How much would TB4 for 34 players in the reported dosages cost? $250k? More?

Find me a money trail and you win.

ASADA has the bank transactions, why can't they find it?

Because it doesn't exist.
Click to expand...
How do you know it doesn't exist?
 
Ancient Tiger said:
Why don't you read the literature on TB4?
http://www.metabolicalchemy.com/thymosin-beta-4/
It clearly states that it effects the immune system. Just like Dank was saying.......

Await your learned response.
Click to expand...

Well you will not get one as the EFC faithful seem to have a filter on Google which fails to show anything about TB4. But for the rest of us..

Google : Search on What is TB4?

Get http://allaboutpeptides.com/tb4-an-in-depth-look/

TB4 belongs to a group of peptides or family of peptides called thymosins. Thymosins modulate cell migration (normally cells are fixed with no motility), angiogenesis (growing of blood vessels from other blood vessels) and immune responses.4 They have been categorized as biological response modifiers. Usually the term refers to substances that arouse the body's response to an infection. TB4 specifically is a key regulator of tissue regeneration as it arouses an immune response which leads to regeneration."
 

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Dave said:
You'd lose.



I'm not the one hanging my hopes on it, it's you amongst others who have been banging on about how it means doom and gloom.



I guess an ACC interview 12 months beforehand where he said on pain of 5 years jail he used Thymomodulin is spin to you.

If he'd admiited TB4 use to the ACC and said thymomodulin to the fairfax journo you'd all be believing what he told the ACC and telling us how he lied to the journo.



Bulldust. They don't win every case.



A case that involved eyewitness testimony of him doping, helping others to dope, admitting to doping to a surgeon, re-tested samples that show use of EPO. Yeah not unlike it at all.



And yet the fact that the club and players are challenging it doesn't tell you anything.



Was it? I'd be curious to know how you'd know that unless you worked for ASADA.



You hope.
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Dave said:
You'd lose.



I'm not the one hanging my hopes on it, it's you amongst others who have been banging on about how it means doom and gloom.



I guess an ACC interview 12 months beforehand where he said on pain of 5 years jail he used Thymomodulin is spin to you.

If he'd admiited TB4 use to the ACC and said thymomodulin to the fairfax journo you'd all be believing what he told the ACC and telling us how he lied to the journo.



Bulldust. They don't win every case.



A case that involved eyewitness testimony of him doping, helping others to dope, admitting to doping to a surgeon, re-tested samples that show use of EPO. Yeah not unlike it at all.



And yet the fact that the club and players are challenging it doesn't tell you anything.



Was it? I'd be curious to know how you'd know that unless you worked for ASADA.



You hope.
Click to expand...

TB4, come out of Danks own mouth. Don't worry about spin and BS. It was quoted. No escaping it that. He said it. That plus all the other evidence means you're screwed.

95-98% of show cause lead to infractions whether positive tests or evidence based. You know ASADA wouldn't go with them unless they had their arse covered completely. No different to USADA and Lance.

Essendon are challenging the procedure because they know they're screwed on the evidence. It's all they have. And, yes, much of the evidence was found after the joint investigation. It's how they got to this stage after the interim report and confident enough to go to the show cause stage.

One thing you'll learn, hope and spin isn't going to change any of the above. Best you accept it otherwise you'll be in a world of hurt. Not as painful when you go down, not to mention a very pleasant surprise if you do somehow happen to win.

That's life. Sometime you have to be a man and accept your fate. Denial will be no use whatsoever.
 
So which one is it:

A) dank doped the team in 2012 and deliberately changed the documentation after his ACC interview.

Or

B) Dank doped the team but only realized once Mckenzie called him on it in 2013.

If you can't see that they are binary scenarios don't bother responding.
 
andrewb said:
So which one is it:

A) dank doped the team in 2012 and deliberately changed the documentation after his ACC interview.

Or

B) Dank doped the team but only realized once Mckenzie called him on it in 2013.

If you can't see that they are binary scenarios don't bother responding.
Click to expand...

Who'd know what he said to the ACC. We only know what come out of mouth publicly so not greatly interested in your senarios. Danks gave them TB4, he said so, it's on record. It's a banned peptide. That means your screwed. If you want to deal in facts that's a fact. Spin won't change it. If he made an error and only realised after well, sorry, that won't help Essendon at all. If he didn't give them the drug he wouldn't have said it. A kid would work that out. They took the drug so they're stuffed by the rules. Hence the procedural challenge, it's all they have.

Kiss your arse goodbye if that doesn't work for you.
 
Jimthegreat said:
Who'd know what he said to the ACC. We only know what come out of mouth publicly so not greatly interested in your senarios. Danks gave them TB4, he said so, it's on record. It's a banned peptide. That means your screwed. If you want to deal in facts that's a fact. Spin won't change it. If he made an error and only realised after well, sorry, that won't help Essendon at all. If he didn't give them the drug he wouldn't have said it. A kid would work that out. They took the drug so they're stuffed by the rules. Hence the procedural challenge, it's all they have.

Kiss your arse goodbye if that doesn't work for you.
Click to expand...

I said if you can't see they are binary don't respond
 
andrewb said:
So which one is it:

A) dank doped the team in 2012 and deliberately changed the documentation after his ACC interview.

Or

B) Dank doped the team but only realized once Mckenzie called him on it in 2013.

If you can't see that they are binary scenarios don't bother responding.
Click to expand...

A) Dank doped the team in 2012 and deliberately changed the doco because he knew TB4 was far more serious/performance enhancing than AOD and didn't want it showing up on any records, even though he still believed he could work his way around the S0 rules

and

B) Dank discovers after the McKenzie interview that TB4 is on the S2 list, realises his little S0 work around is irrelevant and that he is in deep shit and shuts his mouth from then on

or a second possible scenario is

A) Dank doped the team in 2012 and changed the doco because he knew TB4 was prohibited and it was never meant to appear on any paper work

and

B) Dank got confused in the McKenzie interview and meant to say Thymomodulin, an easy mistake considering the cocktail of substances he had been mucking around with
 
andrewb said:
I said if you can't see they are binary don't respond
Click to expand...
Why would a "scientist" make such a huge mistake? TB4 is a completely different drug than Thymomodulin. When it was pointed out it was banned, why didn't he correct himself immediately? Why wait till the next day?

Please answer these basic questions before trying to work out more complex situations.
 
jenny61_99 said:
Apparently, conveniently ONE vial of thymomodulin sourced from who knows where.
Click to expand...

Oh I get it. So according to Essendon supporters a vial of thymomodulin found at Essendon is absolute evidence that they were using this and not TB4.

Yet 14 viles of Hexarelin which are WADA banned and were found stored in Dank's office at Essendon apparently is not evidence at all that it was being used. o_O

motivator6d560db7c7787768b430366da4.jpg
 

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Ancient Tiger said:
Why would a "scientist" make such a huge mistake? TB4 is a completely different drug than Thymomodulin. When it was pointed out it was banned, why didn't he correct himself immediately? Why wait till the next day?

Please answer these basic questions before trying to work out more complex situations.
Click to expand...
He thinks he is smarter than everyone else. It probably came as the biggest shock that he had got it so wrong. But thinking he is smarter meant he was prepared to go with some outlandish BS the next day thinking lowly journos would believe said BS
 
andrewb said:
So which one is it:

A) dank doped the team in 2012 and deliberately changed the documentation after his ACC interview.

Or

B) Dank doped the team but only realized once Mckenzie called him on it in 2013.

If you can't see that they are binary scenarios don't bother responding.
Click to expand...

The two scenarios are only mutually exclusive if we accept the notion that only TB4 was used. More than 1 drug removes the binary. Oh next time you tell someone not to respond make sure your exclusion clause stands scrutiny.
 
JakeandFatman said:
What? You mean I quoted the AFL charge sheet that was responsible for Essendon removing their threat of court action? The AFL charge sheet that caused Paul Little to go from "We're taking the AFL to court" to accepting sanctions against the club within days? The AFL charge sheet that was the basis for Essendon being the only AFL club to ever be kicked out of a finals competition and have their coach suspended for 12 months?

Somehow you consider that "subsequntly withdrawn" ROFL!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Do you even think about stuff before you say it?

And now you want me to respond to an interview where Dank is justifying the use of TB4 by saying it's for "Colds and Flus". What did you expect Dank to say? "We are giving them TB4 to regenerate tissue in hamstrings". And somehow you are using this to confirm he really meant Thymomodulin ROFL

haha look up the word gullible in the dictionary and you may find a picture of yourself.
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JakeandFatman said:
Oh I get it. So according to Essendon supporters a vial of thymomodulin found at Essendon is absolute evidence that they were using this and not TB4.

Yet 14 viles of Hexarelin which are WADA banned and were found stored in Dank's office at Essendon apparently is not evidence at all that it was being used. o_O
Click to expand...
thymomodulin.png
 
andrewb said:
I said if you can't see they are binary don't respond
Click to expand...
Also, if they were using Thymomodulin and Dank knew that TB4 was banned, why didn't he take the utmost care when writing out the consent forms which just wrote Thymosin? Why wouldn't he be absolutely sure that the correct drug, Thymomodulin, was written on those consents? Since he had the ampoule around and players allegedly saw it (hahahaha) why would they sign a consent that had a different name on it to the drug they saw in this apparently seen ampoule???

Come on. You are an intelligent person. You tell me why these things happened the way they did…..
 
Question to Essendon fans

Why do you even bother to try and defend our club on big footy? their is so many clowns that think/know we did it we are never going to win the argument, just boycott threads like this, your just giving other club fans what they want.
 
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Ancient Tiger said:
Also, if they were using Thymomodulin and Dank knew that TB4 was banned, why didn't he take the utmost care when writing out the consent forms which just wrote Thymosin? Why wouldn't he be absolutely sure that the correct drug, Thymomodulin, was written on those consents? Since he had the ampoule around and players allegedly saw it (hahahaha) why would they sign a consent that had a different name on it to the drug they saw in this apparently seen ampoule???

Come on. You are an intelligent person. You tell me why these things happened the way they did…..
Click to expand...

While he is at it ask him to explain how much of an amazing coincidence it is that "Thymosin Beta 4" is actually referred widely in the peptide business as "Thymosin" and when you order it from peptide websites it is marketed as "Thymosin"... even though it goes on in detail to describe it as TB4.

Just another amazing coincidence!
 
Bombers_Insider said:
Question to Essendon fans

Why do you even bother to try and defend our club on big footy? their is so many clowns that think we did it we are never going to win the argument, just boycott threads like this, your just giving other club fans what they want.
Click to expand...

Incorrect. We don't think you did it. We know you did it.
 
Their expertise is amazing, you would swear that they were in the room when everything happened with their knowledge of the situation. Who would have thought they are really guessing like everyone else, or getting their info from newspaper hacks trying their best to sell papers
 

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ASADA seeks evidence from Fairfax

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