Bennett and Qld out of touch

[The Old Dark Navy's]

I shouldn't post when disappointed after a SOO series loss but some questions came out of tonight's game about Wayne Bennett's coaching.

He is a fine coach but let's face it, in his coaching career he has coached Brisbane Souths with players like Meninga, Jackson, Belcher at his disposal, assisted at Canberra with an exciting team building into something great, an all star Broncos line up and the Qld Origin side. Adversity is not something that springs to mind with those teams.

You can't play NSW with the same tried and true Broncos formula of bash em up the middle with the big forwards and let the backs do the rest. You have to have the backs to do the rest for a start. Why did Qld select Matt Bowen on the bench and use him when the game was lost in the last 15 minutes? He has more try scoring potential than most out there and should have been used after half time at 17-0 down.

My assessment of some of the Qld players:

Lockyer - standout maroon for mine ... and on one leg too
Hegarty - the Blues wouldn't kick to his wing and the Maroons dropped it before it got out to him, he must have caught a cold standing out there all night
Tate - not a bad game, at least wasn't getting pushed backwards in the tackles, something to be said for that tonight
Carroll - dropped the ball constantly, fell off tackles, too slow, time for a change
Sing - stood tall Matty Sing, was bombarded and kept coming back for more. Just doesn't have the strength and line breaking ability like a Tahu for example
Ikin - had a shocker, enough said
Berrigan - fleeting moments but he would be better at dummy half if Qld could pluck a decent half from somewhere
Tallis - started well and was hitting hard but dropped his head and his men followed suit. Starting to look like a front runner of late
Webcke - didn't mind his game, actually got some ball away which is not exactly his style
Crocker - was a shocker. Dropped everything that came his way including the try that he scored (thanks for that Bill).
Civoniceva - solid but oh so boring
Sattler - there is a reason why he didn't debut in SOO until 31 years of age
The rest ..Carlaw, Price, Norton and co, nothing nice to say, don't say anything at all.

And Clinton Schifcoske can't break into this side ...

 

[robbieando]

Look QLD just don't have the depth to match NSW, and get by with the passion for SOO that they have. They need backs to help Lockyer out. Schifcoske doesn't get a game because he just isn't a winger and there is no way he'll get in ahead of Lockyer. Wesser on the other hand should be tried on a Wing in the next game with Hegarty moving into the centre to replace Carroll.

At half back Qld HAVE to find someone anyone who can put pressure on NSW, Berrigan can't and Ikin is past it thanks to his injuries. Maybe PJ Marsh when he is fit - whatever happens they will never match NSW in this area. Hell can we get Lam back from Wigan for a week????

The Forwards I don't have a problem with except Gee has to go and Sattler is not up to it. How about Tookey?????

 

[robbieando]

After a quick think I feel this is the team that Queensland have to play in Game 3, it has a future look about it.

1. Lockyer (Broncos)
2. Wesser (Panthers)
3. Tate (Broncos)
4. Hegarty (Roosters)
5. Sing (Cowboys)
6. Thurston (Bulldogs)
7. Berrigan (Broncos)
8. Webcke (Broncos)
9. Marsh (Warriors)
10. Price (Bulldogs)
11. Tallis (Broncos)
12. Civoniceva (Broncos)
13. Norton (Bulldogs)

14. Bowan (Cowboys)
15. Flannery (Roosters)
16. Tookey (Warriors)
17. Carlaw (Broncos)

 

[dr nick]

where are all the phil gould detractors now?? i think they have gone into hiding. certainly paul kent has little to say about the whole issue. look how much interest the series generated, and what an overwhelming display by the blues.

great to see the likes of minnichello, fitzgibbon, ricketson, wing etc step up to the plate. they proved a lot of people wrong. what courage from craig to play with that injured eye. steve price was in ga ga land after that hit from kennedy.


Phil Gould is now the most successful coach in origin history. 5 series wins.



PS: i notice luke bailey was the official man of the match (pretty much confirming my suspicions about the channel 9 mobs love affair with andrew johns, they talk as if he is god)


hahaha. so much for the extra try scoring potential of the queenslanders in this game. can anyone explain to me why the ref didnt go to the video for qld's only try? that looked pretty dodgy to me.

 

[dr nick]

Originally posted by The Old Dark Navy's


You can't play NSW with the same tried and true Broncos formula of bash em up the middle with the big forwards and let the backs do the rest. You have to have the backs to do the rest for a start. Why did Qld select Matt Bowen on the bench and use him when the game was lost in the last 15 minutes? He has more try scoring potential than most out there and should have been used after half time at 17-0 down.

ODN, you underrate his coaching. i can only remember one single game where the qld'ers have gone in as favourites, and that was origin 1 this year. Qld never have the side that NSW do on paper, but he sure brings whatever it is out of them. the occasional flogging like the one last night is just testament to the depth of NSWRL compared to the QRL. it is a credit to them that they manage to come so close and occasionally win games.

the origin ledger is now all square and the blues head up to suncorp to secure the all time lead for the first time ever. does anyone think that qld will ever get the lead back?

 

[noodnuts]

if any queenslanders get into the test team it's a joke because man for man, position for position the NSW team are streets ahead of the Queenslanders. name one queenslander who has played better that his opposite number in this series.....i dares ya.

the only reason that some of the queenslanders will get an australian guernsey is politics not form, and that makes the test team a joke. it's supposed to be the best players.

minichello.....killed lockyer
bailey & ryles......smashed webkey
timmins.......demolished ikin
kennedy.......annihilated tallis

you could go thru the whole team.

 

[Joffaboy]

Originally posted by nicko18
where are all the phil gould detractors now?? i think they have gone into hiding. certainly paul kent has little to say about the whole issue. look how much interest the series generated, and what an overwhelming display by the blues.

great to see the likes of minnichello, fitzgibbon, ricketson, wing etc step up to the plate. they proved a lot of people wrong. what courage from craig to play with that injured eye. steve price was in ga ga land after that hit from kennedy.


Phil Gould is now the most successful coach in origin history. 5 series wins.



PS: i notice luke bailey was the official man of the match (pretty much confirming my suspicions about the channel 9 mobs love affair with andrew johns, they talk as if he is god)


hahaha. so much for the extra try scoring potential of the queenslanders in this game. can anyone explain to me why the ref didnt go to the video for qld's only try? that looked pretty dodgy to me.

I listened to the game on 2GB over the net. Was a pretty comprehensive win by the Blues. As expected the commentary was very bias, bit upon watching the game I could see why. The Maroons were very poor, while the Blues were top class, and very skillful even in the slippery conditions.

I absolutely loved the Johns optional second kick nearing halftime. What a brave and unorthodox move. Help the Blue get an extra point when it look as though they would play the %'s and play out time.

Took me back to the dazzling skills and unorthodox play of Steve Mortimer, which unfortunately we see less and less of. Phil Gould was certainly unimpressed with the Johns secondary kick, but i think it was a true celebration of RL and what it was and could be again.

Johns is truly this generations version of Wally Lewis, a true football champion who would be right up there with the best to have played.

Unfortunately fell asleep with about 20 minutes to go on the clock while watching it on TV down here, but all in all a great victory.

Clean Sweep on the way

Phil Gould is and always will be a great coach

Kennedy should get a couple of weeks for the high shot on Price.

 

[dr nick]

yes, it was a masterstroke to go for the dropkick as opposed to the tap from johns. he also slotted that field goal. but overall, if you look at his night, he had a few kicks go dead, and most of them went to lockyer on the full. from the post match talk you could have sworn he had the game of his life. and you have to laugh when people say "Johns, showing great knowledge of the laws of the game, decided to dropkick..". i mean, it should be the minimum required to play the game at top level to know the rules inside out, they talk as if it is the exception.

and was it ikin who tried that 40-20 only to be inches over the 40m line? i mean how dumb can you be? it's not very hard to keep an eye on the 40m line, and i see this sort of thing happen time and time again.

AnywaY, its a shame Gus won't be coaching next year. hopefully he can go back to 2gb or 2ue and join the sports show with peter bosley again.

 

[TigerCraig]

Bit of rule ignorance on my part - as it was a tap restart, if John's drop kick had gone out on the full, would it have been a penalty or scrum?

 

[Fire Storm]

ODN? Couldn't have put it better myself. QLD need to look outside the 'Broncos Box' a little more.

 

[Michigan]

i totally agree, i think this loss was a wake-up call for the QLD selectors too stop foucusing on the Bronco's for their origin team. I think next origin you will see alot more young guys coming through ie. Shifcofske and Wesser who can make plays and set up lots of tries. If there is one thing Queensland were missing last night it was playmakers, not surprising when their team is filled with old bronco's forwards...

 

[Geri]

I think that Reece Wesser (Penrith) would do a great job if slotted into the Queensland side...there are too many Broncos in the Qld side and even too many Cowboys players....they should even look at Chris Walker at Origin level....I think Bennett must use State Of Origin in his negotiations for players to play with the Broncos. They can not lift at this level all of the time...it is more than a club match!

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Originally posted by noodnuts
if any queenslanders get into the test team it's a joke because man for man, position for position the NSW team are streets ahead of the Queenslanders. name one queenslander who has played better that his opposite number in this series.....i dares ya.

the only reason that some of the queenslanders will get an australian guernsey is politics not form, and that makes the test team a joke. it's supposed to be the best players.

minichello.....killed lockyer
bailey & ryles......smashed webkey
timmins.......demolished ikin
kennedy.......annihilated tallis

you could go thru the whole team.

Qld were woeful but this statement is beyond woeful.

A few points ... Minichiello smashed Lockyer? Lockyer was on one leg behind a team going backwards. When exactly did Minichiello win head to head battles between the two? No chance in hell, Lockyer is head and shoulders above Minichiello in every skill IMO and will be one of the first chosen.

Bailey was fantastic but Webcke certainly wasn't to blame for the loss. The gap is narrowing but Webcke can still lay claim to being the best prop forward overall and one game where your teammates are very flat and uni directional shouldn't be the end of him.

Agree with Timmins but Ikin was never going to be in the test side anyway.

Tallis started as well as Kennedy but dropped his head and did little to inspire his players. A break from the captaincy might help to motivate him. Disappointing Gordie ... very disappointing.

As for the make up of the Australian team according to form, do you really want a history lesson about how many times the Australian side has been dominated by NSW players after Queensland have won the Origin series? NSW have never been lacking for surprise selections and test bolters regardless of form since I have been watching the game.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

On a wishful thinking note, imagine how much a team lacking attacking options and line breaking potential could do with a few rugby converts returning to the fold. Mat Rogers is a match winner not to mention almost Andrew Johns' peer in goalkicking prowess. Wendell Sailor and Lote Tuquiri would be unstoppable on the wings.

I think it is easy to forget just how much talent Queensland lost in such a short period of time. You don't just replace these players overnight.

Add to the mix Chris McKenna who was a very handy SOO player.

As for the next game, is Chris Beattie worth another shot as a replacement forward?

 

[Hurbie]

Ben Walker, Schifcofske and Wesser all need Runs.

1-Lockyer (Broncos)
2-Wesser (Panthers)
3-Hegarty (Roosters)
4-Tate (Broncos)
5-Sing (Cowboys)
6-Schifcofske (Raiders)
7-B.Walker (Sea Eagles)
8-Webcke (Broncos)
9-Berrigan (Broncos)
10-Price (Bulldogs)
11-Tallis (Broncos)
12-Civoneciva (Broncos)
13-Norton(Bulldogs)

14-B. Ross. (Panthers)
15-Parker. (Broncos)
16-Flannery. (Roosters)
17-Bowen. (Cowboys)

G/K-Ben Walker.

Gone-
Tonie Carroll-Useless Lump of Crap
Ikin-Gone From 'could' to 'might' have been one of the greatest.
Crocker-Cheapened The Jersey. Tried his hardest, but he ISN'T SoO Quality.
Sattler-More Suited to the St Mary Bowls Club than SoO.
Gee- Fat old Niggler.

New-
Ben Walker-The Form SoO Eligible Queensland Half. Has aquited himself well the last few weeks. was being groomed at Halfback by Bennett before they fell out. Get over it!. Season 2001 was a barnstormer and He is starting to lead the Eagles around the park.
Schifcofske- Played some Five Eighth before. A third 5th tackle option.
Wesser-I don't like His state of Origin Credentials, but It's either him on the wing or Hannay in the Centres. Defence tremendously suspect, even though it has improved tremendously over the past 10 months.
Parker-Time for Queensland to Blood Webcke and Prices Succesors. They ain't no spring Chickens
Ross- As Above.

 

[noodnuts]

Originally posted by The Old Dark Navy's
Qld were woeful but this statement is beyond woeful.

A few points ... Minichiello smashed Lockyer? Lockyer was on one leg behind a team going backwards. When exactly did Minichiello win head to head battles between the two? No chance in hell, Lockyer is head and shoulders above Minichiello in every skill IMO and will be one of the first chosen.

minnime crashed over lockyer to score in the corner. teams should be picked on form not reputation as wayne bennet does with disastrous consequences, if lockyer has an injured leg you cant feel sorry for him and pick him for OZ.

 

[dr nick]

whew, i'm glad you are not a selector mate. Lockyer is the second/maybe third best player in the country

 

[Crooked Rain]

Queensland could've done with Jason Smith at five-eighth and Chris McKenna in the centres and possibly even Adrian Lam at halfback. All three are playing in England.

Don't worry the Maroons will be back, they've just got to get rid of the oldies.

I'd like to see either Matty Elliott, John Lang or Michael Hagan take over as coach next season.

cheers
c.r