Best 22 in ‘22

[davemc_lions]

He does go when he needed to even if I agree he is still a bit small. But I'm not certain we ever want him to get that big. We need him to focus on that endurance. We've been burnt time and again by teams that run harder than us. Even last night Langdon and Brayshaw killed us on the spread. Langdon is a sh*t kick but he killed us by running again and again into space. He wouldn't be the worst for Harry to look at some vision of and learn from

brayshaw did the same.. There wingers stayed wide for the recieve.. We all went into the ball to try to stop Petraca and Oliver getting it out
how many times you see we had 2-3 tackle there top guys
Which left a few open

 

[M Malice]

brayshaw did the same.. There wingers stayed wide for the recieve.. We all went into the ball to try to stop Petraca and Oliver getting it out
how many times you see we had 2-3 tackle there top guys
Which left a few open

There was an interview with Petracca earlier in the season where he was asked about their approach to contested situations and he said they never want to send too many to the contest and always showed confidence in the player closest to the contest to stick the tackle, force a stalemate or an errant kick to a Demon off the contest.

Great simple system, when we go awry we get too many sucked into the contest.

 

[Squizz89]

Not sure what the 22 will look like. I am liking this idea that some people have mentioned about moving Starce into the guts (as well as getting Rayner back in there).

We need an inside bull or two. Lachie, Lyons, Zorko etc all have their benefits but we need someone in there who can get the ball and explode from a contest or take a tackle on and break it. Those 3 as good as they are aren’t those types of midfielders.

 

[scoman]

Not sure what the 22 will look like. I am liking this idea that some people have mentioned about moving Starce into the guts (as well as getting Rayner back in there).

We need an inside bull or two. Lachie, Lyons, Zorko etc all have their benefits but we need someone in there who can get the ball and explode from a contest or take a tackle on and break it. Those 3 as good as they are aren’t those types of midfielders.

I'm not sure we are ready to move Starce just yet. I think Rayner, Cocky and even Bailey (although undersized) can be those players. Tbf Zorko has been that player over the years despite his size, but his best years are gone and it is an uphill battle for a player of his size to do it consistently and in big games.

 

[BRAB]

brayshaw did the same.. There wingers stayed wide for the recieve.. We all went into the ball to try to stop Petraca and Oliver getting it out
how many times you see we had 2-3 tackle there top guys
Which left a few open

Pretty easy for Brayshaw to stand out the back when Melbourne's bulls throw or drop the ball half the time. We needed to see the tackles weren't being rewarded and adjust accordingly.

Next year hopefully Rayner and berry can have a strong impact at the contest. We needed to trap the ball more consistently

 

[jackess]

Not sure what the 22 will look like. I am liking this idea that some people have mentioned about moving Starce into the guts (as well as getting Rayner back in there).

We need an inside bull or two. Lachie, Lyons, Zorko etc all have their benefits but we need someone in there who can get the ball and explode from a contest or take a tackle on and break it. Those 3 as good as they are aren’t those types of midfielders.

Zorko used to be but his body is shot

 

[trikster]

FB: Starcevich, Adams, Gardiner
HB: Rich, Andrews, ?
C: Bailey, McCluggage, ?
HF: Zorko, Hipwood, McCarthy
FF: Cameron, Daniher, McStay
Foll: McInerney, Neale, Lyons

The rest (in no particular order) : Birchall?, Rayner, J. Berry, T Berry, Prior, Robertson, Ah Chee, Robinson, Cockatoo, Payne, Madden, K Coleman, Lester

I think the first 16 pick themselves. If Birchall doesn't retire we need to move beyond him asap, i.e. a younger player step up to force him out based on form as a back 6 that includes Rich/Birchall/Gardner is too slow (we can hide 2 slow players but not 3). Personally I'd like to see Prior on HBF and Ah Chee on the wing if he is fit enough to play that position as he offers both some defensive and attacking abilities.

Bags this year showed he is even better around the contests and spreading than sitting out on a wing (where he is an AA level player anyway).

Next key defender : Lester
Next small defender : K Coleman
Next mids : J Berry, Robinson, Robertson
Next small forward : Rayner
Next key forward : nobody (yes I've left Fullarton off this list as I don't think he offers enough)

I'd love to find a place for Cockatoo also after another pre-season, but can't find anyone to drop.

2nd ruck is an issue/interesting dilemma as while Daniher played well in that role/up the ground, I think post Hipwood injury/Fullarton as 2nd ruck showed Daniher has a bigger impact when kept close to goal.

 

[Wilbur23]

Any team without Fullarton anywhere near the squad PLEASE.

 

[McIvor]

Any team without Fullarton anywhere near the squad PLEASE.

Fullarton won't make it, time to cut the cord and delist him and move on. Not sure I recall him ever taking a mark and is way more fumble than Banfield ever was.

On reflection, as much as I like Mitch Robbo, I don't think we should have renewed him. As it stands, I don't think our list can win a GF, so I don't think giving Robbo games next year helps our club long term. Got to get games into our kids particularly the likes of Dev and Sharp.

Fagan obviously doesn't rate our list. I mean despite all our injuries this year, we've only used 32 players, the least of any club this year and unlike many other clubs, including say the Dogs and Hawks, who used well over 40. Id rather bottom out somewhat next year and go again in 23 when Cam and Hippy have a good bunch of games under them and the likes of Dev, Prior, Harry etc have 30 games plus under their belt. Id just about give up if Birch is retained.

 

[KissKiss]

At the start of the year I thought Robbo was done and was time to find a new winger. But then he came back and blew us away for quite a few weeks. But he is one bad bit of form away from being done. Looking to next year as sad as itll be I hope someone comes in and goes past him in the first 22

 

[knaf]

Fullarton won't make it, time to cut the cord and delist him and move on. Not sure I recall him ever taking a mark and is way more fumble than Banfield ever was.

On reflection, as much as I like Mitch Robbo, I don't think we should have renewed him. As it stands, I don't think our list can win a GF, so I don't think giving Robbo games next year helps our club long term. Got to get games into our kids particularly the likes of Dev and Sharp.

Fagan obviously doesn't rate our list. I mean despite all our injuries this year, we've only used 32 players, the least of any club this year and unlike many other clubs, including say the Dogs and Hawks, who used well over 40. Id rather bottom out somewhat next year and go again in 23 when Cam and Hippy have a good bunch of games under them and the likes of Dev, Prior, Harry etc have 30 games plus under their belt. Id just about give up if Birch is retained.

Almost agree with everything in this except on Fullerton. Not ready yet and I doubt best 22 next year, but I can see gradual improvement And potential. Better depth than ASmith and Ballenden. So retain for minimal injury coverage and development.

The best 22 with Hippy, Rayner, JBerry, Gardiner, Answerth and Andrews fully fit and in form; and development of young players with pace such as Coleman, Madden, Sharp, Dev, Prior etc is IMO Premiership capable. However we never have everyone fully fit and we need to get another20 plus games into that young group to see if at least two or three of them are genuine best 22 players. Add Payne to that group.

choice seems to be stay a solid top eight side, or mini rebuild while kids develop. Coaches and management need to make hard decisions, even if it means that idiots ( like me) complain after each loss.

 

[LongLion]

Fullarton won't make it, time to cut the cord and delist him and move on. Not sure I recall him ever taking a mark and is way more fumble than Banfield ever was.

On reflection, as much as I like Mitch Robbo, I don't think we should have renewed him. As it stands, I don't think our list can win a GF, so I don't think giving Robbo games next year helps our club long term. Got to get games into our kids particularly the likes of Dev and Sharp.

Fagan obviously doesn't rate our list. I mean despite all our injuries this year, we've only used 32 players, the least of any club this year and unlike many other clubs, including say the Dogs and Hawks, who used well over 40. Id rather bottom out somewhat next year and go again in 23 when Cam and Hippy have a good bunch of games under them and the likes of Dev, Prior, Harry etc have 30 games plus under their belt. Id just about give up if Birch is retained.

Yea yea just like McStay was useless and had to go. Have you not yet worked out that it takes time for these taller players to develop. When you have been watching footy for 50+ years the penny may finally drop for you.

 

[Quigley]

Yea yea just like McStay was useless and had to go. Have you not yet worked out that it takes time for these taller players to develop. When you have been watching footy for 50+ years the penny may finally drop for you.

Usually you have to have a elite trait or at least a good trait to make it. Fullarton has not shown any real skill that indicates he might make it. He is mobile and is occasionally solid below his knees. But he is a poor mark, is not very physical, lacks footy IQ for a forward, is not a goal kicker at any level, has below average ruck skills. Sure he is likely to improve as he gets older but I am not seeing any area where he is likely to be decent at AFL level.

On McStay he was incredibly frustrating and his performance has not been there for most of his career but you could always see that there was talent there. He hadn't put it together but you could see traits that could make him into a player.

 

[twhowler]

The more I think about it the more I warm to Starcevich to go into the midfield. He has the best attack on the ball in our entire side. Strong. Fast. Midfield in the juniors. And his kicking is greatly underrated - he hit up a target between 2 Melbourne mids on the weekend that was high risk but it was inch perfect. He will turn 23 next season. If Rayner can get in there as well our midfield looks very different.
The only issue is that he has been superb in the backline, but if Birchall goes out you get in a player that can actually play on his man. Rich the main kicker with Kiddy also providing kicking and running drive. 3 talls. Plus any 2 of Madden, Answerth, Ah Chee and Prior and you have your back 7.

 

[LongLion]

Usually you have to have a elite trait or at least a good trait to make it. Fullarton has not shown any real skill that indicates he might make it. He is mobile and is occasionally solid below his knees. But he is a poor mark, is not very physical, lacks footy IQ for a forward, is not a goal kicker at any level, has below average ruck skills. Sure he is likely to improve as he gets older but I am not seeing any area where he is likely to be decent at AFL level.

On McStay he was incredibly frustrating and his performance has not been there for most of his career but you could always see that there was talent there. He hadn't put it together but you could see traits that could make him into a player.

I prefer to hold judgement on him until he puts on a bit more size. I like is hands for the ground balls but yes his marking is a concern.

 

[martinson]

Usually you have to have a elite trait or at least a good trait to make it. Fullarton has not shown any real skill that indicates he might make it. He is mobile and is occasionally solid below his knees. But he is a poor mark, is not very physical, lacks footy IQ for a forward, is not a goal kicker at any level, has below average ruck skills. Sure he is likely to improve as he gets older but I am not seeing any area where he is likely to be decent at AFL level.

On McStay he was incredibly frustrating and his performance has not been there for most of his career but you could always see that there was talent there. He hadn't put it together but you could see traits that could make him into a player.

McStay showed good talent when tried in the backline a few years ago and flashes of talent as a high forward . My criticism of him was that he rarely chased and didn't tackle hard enough, but that he could get it occasionally and kick it very well when forced up the ground. There are a few factors in his improvement this year , first off he's been around long enough that he should be at his peak now and the pressure being taken off having to be a focal point down forward has him playing with more freedom ,and I don't care what anyone else thinks he's definitely lifted his work rate ,looks fitter , enjoys getting up the ground.

It's a total shame he's potentially knocked out of the finals in 5 minutes when he's at his peak.

 

[davemc_lions]

Maybe Answerth can get up and going as well
Although Starc, Coleman and Madden maybe all gone past him now

 

[mattsmob]

Maybe Answerth can get up and going as well
Although Starc, Coleman and Madden maybe all gone past him now

Not sure I'm quite sold on Madden at this stage, very quick and strong for his size but was very fumbly, has a very awkward kicking action still which is to be expected but some of his decision making in offence was very questionable for me.

 

[McIvor]

Yea yea just like McStay was useless and had to go. Have you not yet worked out that it takes time for these taller players to develop. When you have been watching footy for 50+ years the penny may finally drop for you.

I never said that. Macca has always had talent, footy IQ, could take a grab and so on when he first came in. Fullarton has never demonstrated those traits and just coz you may have watched 50+ years means squat and no more than anyone on here. I know it takes time for falls but some show something just as Shack did years ago and others just don't come on. You have your opinion, I have mine, but we couldn't disagree more and there will be no penny dropping, Fullarton simply will not become a good AFL player for all reasons Quigley said above.

 

[McIvor]

Maybe Answerth can get up and going as well
Although Starc, Coleman and Madden maybe all gone past him now

Isn't Noah out for the year? Im always surprised to see ppl say to pick him.

 

[davemc_lions]

Isn't Noah out for the year? Im always surprised to see ppl say to pick him.

not sure what next year holds.. If he gone for next year not be good.
Has had lots of problems poor kid.

 

[LongLion]

I never said that. Macca has always had talent, footy IQ, could take a grab and so on when he first came in. Fullarton has never demonstrated those traits and just coz you may have watched 50+ years means squat and no more than anyone on here. I know it takes time for falls but some show something just as Shack did years ago and others just don't come on. You have your opinion, I have mine, but we couldn't disagree more and there will be no penny dropping, Fullarton simply will not become a good AFL player for all reasons Quigley said above.

I wasn't inferring you had said that about McStay but that was what was being said by many for a long time and look at McStay now. All you have replied with is parroting Quigley's words. I prefer to look for positives in our players with the hope they will continue to improve. Fages philosophy is to maximise players positive traits and continue to work on the others. Too many knee jerk reactions from many of our 'supporters'

 

[John_Proctor]

I guess we've all been thinking about this a lot lately.

Tall Defenders: Gardiner, Andrews, Adams
Small/medium Defenders: Rich, Starcevich, Coleman
Midfield: McLuggage, Neale, Bailey
Rucks: Oscar, Zorko, Lyons
Small/Medium Forwards: McCarthy, Raynor, Cameron
Tall Forwards: Daniher, McStay, ??//Hipwood
Bench: Robertson, Robinson, Berry, Lester (can play every position),

Next in line Talls: Payne, Fullarton, Ballenden
Next in line smalls: Ah Chee, Prior, Mathieson, Cockatoo, Madden, Answerth (whatever happened too?), T Berry.

Rest: effectively untried.

Gone (very hard to read but with all the resignings we are running out of options): Birchall, Ellis Yolman (contracted), B Smith, A Smith,

Biggest weakness obviously 2nd ruck/3rd tall forward in the absence of Hipwood next year. Might be looking for a trade or a delisted player.

Bench deliberately focuses on more actual midfielders as we have too many 10 possession players in the team. Coleman has looked good in defence and brings some pace to the backline.

Has been good this year to see Robertson, Madden, Prior, Fullarton (extreme struggles in last 2 games aside), Payne, Coleman show their stuff in the team.

 

[mattsmob]

Well that was incredibly brutal but thought I'd try and bring some positives towards next season.
Bailey, McCluggage and Starcevich look like genuine stars and AA quality players in a really good team and will only get better from here. To add to those 3 Andrews, Coleman, Berry, Payne, Robertson, Fullarton, Rayner, Hipwood and McStay are all a year or two away from coming into their prime.

From the team tonight there are some obvious improvements to the 22 that will be made due to injured players either coming back into the team or fully recovering. Add a fully fit Andrews and Gardiner plus some more consistency in games played to Berry, Cockatoo, Daniher and Adams and that's a big difference, not to mention Rayner, Hipwood and McStay.

To make a prelim and win a grand final you need a lot of things to go your way and without trying to make excuses we haven't had much luck this season.

 

[PattyKwasagun]

Okay, here we go. Less about playing around with this, and more a genuine prediction of what round 1 next year will be:

Starcevich Andrews Gardiner
Coleman Adams Rich
McCluggage Neale Robinson
Lyons McInerney Rayner
Bailey Fullarton* McStay
Cameron Daniher McCarthy
I/C: Cockatoo, Zorko, Ah Chee, J Berry (Medical Sub: Dev)

*to be replaced by Hipwood as soon as Eric's available