Bomber players could walk if they can prove a breach of contract

[BOMBERS 4 LIFE!!!!]

If my employer breaches my contract and I leave, my new employer isn't obligated to compensate them.

True that's why it's need to be done via trade.

 

[tigerwill]

If we want's leave because the club failed it's duty of care then fine but i want the club compensated and not leave as a DFA with the club getting **** all in return.

Huh?
You suggest it's okay a player leaves as the club failed him re duty of care, but also the club gets compensation for said failure.

 

[BOMBERS 4 LIFE!!!!]

Huh?
You suggest it's okay a player leaves as the club failed him re duty of care, but also the club gets compensation for said failure.

Would you be happy with Cotchin leaving for nothing?

 

[Lance Uppercut]

Honest question Lance. Do you think - based on everything that is in the public arena at this stage - that the players wouldn't have grounds for claiming breach of contract due to the severe lack of health and safety protocols over the duration of the peptide program?

I think there's definitely grounds. But it's no slam dunk.

But as I have said, the whole thing is a red herring anyway. It was never going to used. Connors did exactly the same thing this time last year. He has already got what he wanted - gullible people talking about it and creating inflationary pressure around Ryder's value.

 

[Mofra]

Would you be happy with a Cotchin leaving for nothing?

I don't recall Cotchin being injected with substances that still can't be identified due to poor record keeping, some of which may be banned by ASADA.
Can you please provide the link?

Thanks

 

[tigerwill]

True that's why it's need to be done via trade.

That circumvents the need to take it to the grievance committee. But perhaps there would be a bitchfight as to worth and trade value (going by what Robbo reckons the bombers would ask for)

 

[Hollow Knight]

Would you be happy with Cotchin leaving for nothing?

Who is arguing you have to be happy?

The AFL recruitment rules aren't built around the principle of making you happy all the time.

 

[tigerwill]

Would you be happy with Cotchin leaving for nothing?

Was he used as a lab rat, injected god knows how many times with a concoction of who knows what?

Different scenario of a player seeking greener pastures and one who (may) have been denied a duty of care by his employer.
Big, big difference. How you can make a comparison defies belief.

 

[Lance Uppercut]

More classic Lance Uppercut self-delusion.

Connors outcome is the best outcome for his player. Thats what he gets paid on.

As clubs have three assets - tradeable players, draft picks and cap room - any player that requires only one of these is a better deal for that club.

Therefore, for Ryder to be "worth it" for the acquiring club, he could have a high cap number, or a low cap number and cost a draft pick to acquire, and so on.

In short, Essendon's interests and Connors do not meet - Essendon want draft picks or tradeable players, and dont care what Ryder gets paid. Connors does care what Ryder gets paid. The acquring club are neutral, depending on the combination of cap room, trade assets and draft picks.

Essendon's top priority is reputational risk. They cannot, under any circumstances, let the truth about their program come out - that they dont know what Ryder was doped with, because the records were either forged, not kept or shredded. An arbitration hearing will involve questions being asked about what drugs Ryder was given and when. Essendon will have to answer those questions, or let him go.

Therefore, Connors will negotiate personal terms first, and Ryder and the new club will put together a draft contract, consistent with him getting a release from his current contract. Essendon will then be threatened with the arbitration hearing, with the alternative being a face-saving deal. This deal might be made, or might not be made - but unless Essendon are willing to have a third forum put a spotlight on their doping program (*), Essendon dont have a lot of cards to play.

My guess is a second round for third round pick swap would be enough to save face, and this gets Ryder to the club that offers him the best combination of lifestyle, likely finals and money.


(*) And not just on the WADA-uncompliant drugs - "How often was Mr Ryder given the anti-psychotic drugs ? Are those drugs approved for use in Australia ? Where did Essendon obtain those drugs ? Why was Mr Ryder given those drugs ? Were side effects discussed with Mr Ryder ? What was the involvement in the club doctor in giving Mr Ryder these anti-psychotic drugs" and so on

you say that like there is not multiple clubs who can meet all those parameters. There are in fact multiple clubs with cap space, and that creates competition with bidding. Your fantasy that Connors will only deal with one club comes majorly unstuck when the reality is that competition will bring a better result for Ryder and ergo Connors.

There is far too much uncertainty around the breach of contract to rely on.

Your guesses haven't been too good throughout this saga just quietly.

 

[Lance Uppercut]

Another process who's legality can be challenged?

is that like how you grovelled your way back onto BigFooty?

 

[FuManchu]

Who is arguing you have to be happy?

The AFL recruitment rules aren't built around the principle of making you happy all the time.

Now C'mon, I know you live in Brisbane, but even up there, you must be aware of the Essendon mindset of expectation and privilege.

Surely!!

 

[jenny61_99]

I think there's definitely grounds. But it's no slam dunk.

But as I have said, the whole thing is a red herring anyway. It was never going to used. Connors did exactly the same thing this time last year. He has already got what he wanted - gullible people talking about it and creating inflationary pressure around Ryder's value.

Maybe. Maybe not.

 

[IanW]

True that's why it's need to be done via trade.

The entire point of this is that, no, it doesnt need to be done via trade.

 

[FuManchu]

The entire point of this is that, no, it doesnt need to be done via trade.

He thinks EFC have a right to be treated fairly but don't think the players have a right to leave the employ of a club that can't tell them what they injected them with.

 

[tigerwill]

you say that like there is not multiple clubs who can meet all those parameters. There are in fact multiple clubs with cap space, and that creates competition with bidding. Your fantasy that Connors will only deal with one club comes majorly unstuck when the reality is that competition will bring a better result for Ryder and ergo Connors.

There is far too much uncertainty around the breach of contract to rely on.

Your guesses haven't been too good throughout this saga just quietly.

He could have as many suitors that have cap space available. BUT It still depends on where the player prefers to go.
If Ryder told Connors emphatically he only wanted to go to Brisbane and Brisbane only, how would that pan out. The competition for his services fizzles out.

 

[B0SK]

is that like how you grovelled your way back onto BigFooty?

It's no use trying to bait me Lance, but by all means keep on trying if it makes you happy.

 

[neutralguy]

If we want's leave because the club failed it's duty of care then fine but i want the club compensated and not leave as a DFA with the club getting **** all in return.

Never change mate I love reading your comedy. I am surprised though that none of the posters that "claim" they pull up ridiculous posts from both viewpoints never seem to pull up your ridiculous posts, mirite LU?

 

[lones37]

I have no problem in Ryder leaving but not via some bs clause.

Got a feeling if the club was able to tell him what the **** he was injected with he wouldn't be going anywhere.

 

[Lance Uppercut]

Never change mate I love reading your comedy. I am surprised though that none of the posters that "claim" they pull up ridiculous posts from both viewpoints never seem to pull up your ridiculous posts, mirite LU?

what do you think I'm the internet police?

It's not my job to pull up every stupid post on Bigfooty. That's not my mutha****ing job. Right now my job's to eat these donuts, and maybe... hey wait a minute, aren't you

 

[IanW]

you say that like there is not multiple clubs who can meet all those parameters. There are in fact multiple clubs with cap space, and that creates competition with bidding. Your fantasy that Connors will only deal with one club comes majorly unstuck when the reality is that competition will bring a better result for Ryder and ergo Connors.

There is far too much uncertainty around the breach of contract to rely on.

Your guesses haven't been too good throughout this saga just quietly.

The delusion, it burns. The public auction is going on between Ryder and other clubs, not other clubs and Essendon - it's all about the personal terms, and the club that doped him will get scraps if that.

And as far as track records, someone or other was beating the drums about thymosin, what it did and why it was important, while someone else was bleating about how there isnt enough evidence of what happened, and how politics wouldnt possibly be involved.

34 SCNs about thymosin later, and an object lesson on why you should sack the club coach involved in doping and cooperate with the investigation, you're still bleating.

I'll say it now - just like with the Statement of Charges - Essendon will talk a tough game, but when the pressure is applied they fold like a cheap suit. Middleton will not stop the SCNs - if he was inclined to do that, he would have issued the injunction - and then Essendon will realise they need cap room to hire new players, and then letting Ryder go will clear that cap room.

 

[coryne]

If we want's leave because the club failed it's duty of care then fine but i want the club compensated and not leave as a DFA with the club getting **** all in return.

Why should the club be compensated for breaking the clubs duty of care towards the player ??? Was the WCE compensated when Cousins broke his obligations towards the club ???

 

[BOMBERS 4 LIFE!!!!]

The entire point of this is that, no, it doesnt need to be done via trade.

What if Ryder wants to do a trade? there have been murmurings that he doesn't want to leave the club empty handed.

 

[kfc1]

I would think the fact EFC admitted to, and accepted penalties for, breaches relating to the administration of a drug program would mean that the players would be on reasonably strong grounds when it came to demonstrating that there was a failure of the club's duty of care.

Serious legal question: If the penalties related to the "unsafe environment" which occurred in 2011/12, were handed out in 2013 and Ryder continued to play through 2014, does that make it less likely that he can void a contract for the "unsafe environment"? Especially given EFC will be able to demonstrate that they have addressed all the internal governance and recordkeeping issues?

 

[Jobe Watson]

Do people really, honestly think that Ryder - or any Essendon player for that matter - is going to use this clause?

If Ryder is leaving, which is doubtful, it will be done through a trade. We'll probably get unders depending on Friday's decision, but he will not leave for nothing.

 

[Lance Uppercut]

I'll say it now - just like with the Statement of Charges - Essendon will talk a tough game, but when the pressure is applied they fold like a cheap suit. Middleton will not stop the SCNs - if he was inclined to do that, he would have issued the injunction - and then Essendon will realise they need cap room to hire new players, and then letting Ryder go will clear that cap room.

you'll "say it now" will you?

Is this going to be as good as all your declarations about anyone mentioning AOD being gawn, and that WADA won't allow soft penalties to a team like Cronulla?

I'll just leave these here and people can make up their own mind about the veracity of your declarations

Yep.

And thats why, after having their spine stiffened on a couple of occasions, ASADA are going to make sure Cronulla and Essendon eat it.

Its aimed at everyone who is facing interviews.

And WADA is cranky right now, given what the judge ruled in Madrid.

This procedure is what we like to call 'WADA coming over the top'.

Which according to the Delusion Caucus doesnt happen, but its amazing what you can find out if you dont try and lie to yourself.

Well, for a start, they are going to compare players training outputs pre- and post-doping program.

Then they'll be comparing the medical records - and any player who has Doc Reid's notes mention thymosin or AOD is gorn.

Then of course they'll simply ask them, with everyone involved knowing saying 'I didnt take nothing' will get four year bans without pay for Aggravated.

Well, it depends if he actually does have notes, and on how well they compare with the declarations the players were supposed to be making about what they were using.

Oh, that and outright banning anyone who took thymosin beta-4, of course.

And banning anyone who took a S0 drug like AOD-9604.