Cameron Ling

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chapmanmagic35

Norm Smith Medallist
Veteran
Apr 16, 2005
6,427
8
Melbourne
AFL Club
Geelong
Ling has been subject to much debate and criticism on this board in 2006. While I do believe his season has not been near the heights he reached from 2002-2005, I do believe we may be being a tad too harsh on him.

Not only has he been a great leader around the club, but he has far and away (with Scarlett and one or two others) been one of the most consistent players at Geelong. Easily.

In my opinion, although it doesn't guarantee you a spot forever, it certainly gives you a few credits when you go through a rough patch. It also certainly should avoid the junk "Trade Ling" talk that has been going around.

To base alot of our problems around a player like Lingy is being grossly simplistic and (yes, everyone's favourite word nowadays) accepting of mediocrity.
 
I don't necessarily believe that Cameron Ling has suffered a drop in form this year. I believe he's always had deficiencies in his game, and the modern game style, together with Geelong's poor form, has cast the spotlight on these deficiencies more so than in the past.

He's not agile or quick, and as a result, can't create space and time for himself. As a result, he's often forced to dispose of the ball under pressure, this leads to the possibly the greatest frustration of supporters - ineffecive disposal and turnovers. And sides are becoming more and more adept at punishing turnovers, as it presents an opportunity to attack before the opposition has a chance to get numbers behind the ball. It's not that these problems weren't ther before, but they're more prone to be exploited now.

He runs hard and long, and provides an example in terms of his fitness and endurance. But I do throw one query over his supposed leadership qualities, in that all to often you don't see him putting in the hard yards to help out a team mate, doing the one percenters like laying shepherds, chasing etc. He seems to like to point and direct traffic, without actually putting in the big efforts himself.

Agreed that all the talk of trading him is rubbish, but he probably needs to re-invent himself or he might find himself sliding out of our best 22.
 

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chapmanmagic35 said:
Ling has been subject to much debate and criticism on this board in 2006. While I do believe his season has not been near the heights he reached from 2002-2005, I do believe we may be being a tad too harsh on him.

Not only has he been a great leader around the club, but he has far and away (with Scarlett and one or two others) been one of the most consistent players at Geelong. Easily.

In my opinion, although it doesn't guarantee you a spot forever, it certainly gives you a few credits when you go through a rough patch. It also certainly should avoid the junk "Trade Ling" talk that has been going around.

To base alot of our problems around a player like Lingy is being grossly simplistic and (yes, everyone's favourite word nowadays) accepting of mediocrity.
Click to expand...

disagree
 
TGTOA said:
I don't necessarily believe that Cameron Ling has suffered a drop in form this year. I believe he's always had deficiencies in his game, and the modern game style, together with Geelong's poor form, has cast the spotlight on these deficiencies more so than in the past.

He's not agile or quick, and as a result, can't create space and time for himself. As a result, he's often forced to dispose of the ball under pressure, this leads to the possibly the greatest frustration of supporters - ineffecive disposal and turnovers. And sides are becoming more and more adept at punishing turnovers, as it presents an opportunity to attack before the opposition has a chance to get numbers behind the ball. It's not that these problems weren't ther before, but they're more prone to be exploited now.

He runs hard and long, and provides an example in terms of his fitness and endurance. But I do throw one query over his supposed leadership qualities, in that all to often you don't see him putting in the hard yards to help out a team mate, doing the one percenters like laying shepherds, chasing etc. He seems to like to point and direct traffic, without actually putting in the big efforts himself.

Agreed that all the talk of trading him is rubbish, but he probably needs to re-invent himself or he might find himself sliding out of our best 22.
Click to expand...

agree
 
He stops the flow of the team.

For that reason, he should never be allowed to enter our defensive 50, so he can get those cheap little kicks and handpasses which bump up his disposals.

Leave him around the HFF/Midfield spot.
 
TGTOA said:
I don't necessarily believe that Cameron Ling has suffered a drop in form this year. I believe he's always had deficiencies in his game, and the modern game style, together with Geelong's poor form, has cast the spotlight on these deficiencies more so than in the past.

He's not agile or quick, and as a result, can't create space and time for himself. As a result, he's often forced to dispose of the ball under pressure, this leads to the possibly the greatest frustration of supporters - ineffecive disposal and turnovers. And sides are becoming more and more adept at punishing turnovers, as it presents an opportunity to attack before the opposition has a chance to get numbers behind the ball. It's not that these problems weren't ther before, but they're more prone to be exploited now.

He runs hard and long, and provides an example in terms of his fitness and endurance. But I do throw one query over his supposed leadership qualities, in that all to often you don't see him putting in the hard yards to help out a team mate, doing the one percenters like laying shepherds, chasing etc. He seems to like to point and direct traffic, without actually putting in the big efforts himself.

Agreed that all the talk of trading him is rubbish, but he probably needs to re-invent himself or he might find himself sliding out of our best 22.
Click to expand...
Yep.
 
chapmanmagic35 said:
Ling has been subject to much debate and criticism on this board in 2006. While I do believe his season has not been near the heights he reached from 2002-2005, I do believe we may be being a tad too harsh on him.

Not only has he been a great leader around the club, but he has far and away (with Scarlett and one or two others) been one of the most consistent players at Geelong. Easily.

In my opinion, although it doesn't guarantee you a spot forever, it certainly gives you a few credits when you go through a rough patch. It also certainly should avoid the junk "Trade Ling" talk that has been going around.

To base alot of our problems around a player like Lingy is being grossly simplistic and (yes, everyone's favourite word nowadays) accepting of mediocrity.
Click to expand...

Ling's intelligence + commitment + good 2006/07 pre-season + leadership qualities = Excellent 2007.

There is no way Ling will ever be traded. Ling loves the club so much that he will lift that extra 10% necessary to be an extremely important link in our upcoming success.

Viva el Ling! Viva el presidente!!
 
I think Ling is still easily in the best 22.

The problem is he is always taking that first mark from the kickout about 35 out straight in front and it shyts everyone. I am almost certain it is a set play and it kills our drive out of the backline. Kickouts should be taken by Scarlett and it should be long to Enright, or short to Hunt in the "Ling" position.

It isn't Lings fault he gets posessions there if it is a set play. He should be a tagger who runs forward, it would be far more disruptive to the opposition if this was the case. He has a big engine and a great kick for goal, is reasonably good overhead so why not use it.

It is poor coaching IMO. Not Lings fault
 
DanA said:
I think Ling is still easily in the best 22.

The problem is he is always taking that first mark from the kickout about 35 out straight in front and it shyts everyone. I am almost certain it is a set play and it kills our drive out of the backline. Kickouts should be taken by Scarlett and it should be long to Enright, or short to Hunt in the "Ling" position.

It isn't Lings fault he gets posessions there if it is a set play. He should be a tagger who runs forward, it would be far more disruptive to the opposition if this was the case. He has a big engine and a great kick for goal, is reasonably good overhead so why not use it.

It is poor coaching IMO. Not Lings fault
Click to expand...

Good call. Ling's a play maker and play spoiler. Surround him with small running types and watch the success mount up!
 

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chapmanmagic35 said:
Ling has been subject to much debate and criticism on this board in 2006. While I do believe his season has not been near the heights he reached from 2002-2005, I do believe we may be being a tad too harsh on him.

Not only has he been a great leader around the club, but he has far and away (with Scarlett and one or two others) been one of the most consistent players at Geelong. Easily.

In my opinion, although it doesn't guarantee you a spot forever, it certainly gives you a few credits when you go through a rough patch. It also certainly should avoid the junk "Trade Ling" talk that has been going around.

To base alot of our problems around a player like Lingy is being grossly simplistic and (yes, everyone's favourite word nowadays) accepting of mediocrity.
Click to expand...

Funny. You seem to whinge and defend anyone that cops criticism at the club, sit there defending losers like Thompson and talk about the club remaining 'strong'. Never seen a fan celebrate mediocrity like you do....then again, that's why you've been dubbed.....MEDIOCRITY MAN.
 
nananana catman said:
Would be good link up half forward, if we had the midfield depth to use him as one.
Click to expand...

In 2007 if we lined up like so (within realistic limitations):

B: D.Johnson Scarlett Egan
HB: Milburn Harley Hunt
C: G.Ablett Bartel Enright
HF: S.Johnson Mooney Ling
F: Chapman N.Ablett Stokes
R: Ottens Corey Rooke
I: King Mackie Prismall Wojcinski

There's Chappy and Stokes in the forward line to rotate through. Milburn, Johnson and Hunt from the backline and Mackie, Prismall, Wojcinski off the bench. Ok not a heap of genuine centre square mids but I think we could still get by easily enough with our rotations. The starting 5 looks very solid to me. Some imaginative coaching and we'd be alright but alas...
 
Unwritten_Law said:
In 2007 if we lined up like so (within realistic limitations):

B: D.Johnson Scarlett Egan
HB: Milburn Harley Hunt
C: G.Ablett Bartel Enright
HF: S.Johnson Mooney Ling
F: Chapman N.Ablett Stokes
R: Ottens Corey Rooke
I: King Mackie Prismall Wojcinski

There's Chappy and Stokes in the forward line to rotate through. Milburn, Johnson and Hunt from the backline and Mackie, Prismall, Wojcinski off the bench. Ok not a heap of genuine centre square mids but I think we could still get by easily enough with our rotations. The starting 5 looks very solid to me. Some imaginative coaching and we'd be alright but alas...
Click to expand...

There is no way I'd have Ling in the HF line. The reason is Chappy can and does lead up the ground, he does it so well when the CHF isn't playing so good. This gives us, at times, our only leading option. Why put that option back a line, doesn't make sense.

Ling is best on the ball, sure he picks up easy disposals, and gets rid of a few clangers. All he needs is skills work from a good coach, in which we don't have.

So many people here have picked on Ling for his disposal, isn't that a coaches responsibility to pick up and fix ??

Our only midfielder that has really impressed this year is Rooke. His development has been fantastic. Bartel has stayed his usual quality self, Kelly has gone down hill, Burns and Tenace have suffered, Joel Corey has been played out of position on many occasions, Ablett has also dropped off and last but not least Enright has also suffered skill problems.

Doesn't this add up to poor coaching. These guys excelled under Cresswell, and since the introduction of Lovett their skills have decreased dramatically and it is really starting to show.

Ling is slow, true, but in the past he had better skills off either foot to get him by. Slowly over time his skills have decreased, his inefficiency is starting to show, but so is many of the Geelong midfield.

There is only one answer to this, get rid of Lovett and Hinkley.
 
thegerman said:
Ling is best on the ball, sure he picks up easy disposals, and gets rid of a few clangers. All he needs is skills work from a good coach, in which we don't have.

So many people here have picked on Ling for his disposal, isn't that a coaches responsibility to pick up and fix ??
Click to expand...

It goes both ways. Obviously if a player has a flaw he needs to be made aware of it by the coach or someone else. He should be able to identify these things himself. I think far, far too much importance is placed on coaches for a player's skills. Ultimately it comes down to that player and how serious he is. Garry Hocking for example (on top of normal training) kicked to a target 100 times on either foot to improve his disposal; if he missed 1 he started again. He didn't need a coach to tell him that. Greg Williams had similar techniques. If the player doesn't realise he needs to do extra practise or training until some guru on the boundary line tells him he's in the wrong profession.

I've criticised Ling quite heavily at times this year, I believe with justification. But his last couple of months have been much better since he was once again played solely as a tagger and NOT as a playmaker. At least with Ling you can't question his work ethic, as he trains harder than anyone. Now the question is can he improve enough.
 
TGTOA said:
I don't necessarily believe that Cameron Ling has suffered a drop in form this year. I believe he's always had deficiencies in his game, and the modern game style, together with Geelong's poor form, has cast the spotlight on these deficiencies more so than in the past.

He's not agile or quick, and as a result, can't create space and time for himself. As a result, he's often forced to dispose of the ball under pressure, this leads to the possibly the greatest frustration of supporters - ineffecive disposal and turnovers. And sides are becoming more and more adept at punishing turnovers, as it presents an opportunity to attack before the opposition has a chance to get numbers behind the ball. It's not that these problems weren't ther before, but they're more prone to be exploited now.

He runs hard and long, and provides an example in terms of his fitness and endurance. But I do throw one query over his supposed leadership qualities, in that all to often you don't see him putting in the hard yards to help out a team mate, doing the one percenters like laying shepherds, chasing etc. He seems to like to point and direct traffic, without actually putting in the big efforts himself.

Agreed that all the talk of trading him is rubbish, but he probably needs to re-invent himself or he might find himself sliding out of our best 22.
Click to expand...


Top post TGTOA.
 
This is pretty much what I would like to see

FF: NAblett/Hawkins Ottens SJohnson
HF: Chapman Mooney Mackie
C: Enright Bartel Wojcinski
HB: Milburn Harley Hunt
B: DJohnson Scarlett Egan

R: King GAblett Corey

INT: Rooke Ling Prismall Stokes Byrnes Tenace Gamble Varcoe


Forwards: I have named nathan and hawkins as I am not going to assume either will be capable of playing a full season so would like to see them split the role and both get around 12 games. They would both play when injury or suspension to ottens/mooney comes into effect. SJohnson to get a forward role as is an experienced goal sneak but if he doesn't perform (including defensive pressure) that will open up for stokes, gamble and varcoe.

Center Line: guys that can carry the ball in Woj and Enright and also kick it more than handball. They will get it deep into attack for our talls to contest. Hopefully their kicking accuracy and decision making will be improved farther over the preseason.

Back Line: not alot of work needed here as they are v.solid

Rucks: Ablett to move onto the ball with improved fitness and he will win us more clearances. King is still the best ruck option as it allows ottens to start forward. Maybe a full preseason can get king back towards his best.

Interchange: and extended interchange as all the players I think will get a decent amount of games next year.

Ling and Rooke are named on the bench but would take tagging roles (I dont think ling is creative enough to become a pure onballer) in this case I would have them in the middle corey would go to 1/2 back and hunt, johnson or egan to the bench depending on match ups.

Also I think in short bursts mooney should be chucked on ball (strong body to win center clearances like in finals in 2005) this would allow nablett/hawkins a run at CHF also.

Tenace and Byrnes will get games as their pace has shown to be handy I would like to see tenace improve his foot skills and look longer at times. would be nice to see 80m plays out of him regularly eg. run 30 kick 50 and hit a target (same for woj)
 
Asty said:
This is pretty much what I would like to see

FF: NAblett/Hawkins Ottens SJohnson
HF: Chapman Mooney Mackie
C: Enright Bartel Wojcinski
HB: Milburn Harley Hunt
B: DJohnson Scarlett Egan

R: King GAblett Corey

INT: Rooke Ling Prismall Stokes Byrnes Tenace Gamble Varcoe


Forwards: I have named nathan and hawkins as I am not going to assume either will be capable of playing a full season so would like to see them split the role and both get around 12 games. They would both play when injury or suspension to ottens/mooney comes into effect. SJohnson to get a forward role as is an experienced goal sneak but if he doesn't perform (including defensive pressure) that will open up for stokes, gamble and varcoe.

Center Line: guys that can carry the ball in Woj and Enright and also kick it more than handball. They will get it deep into attack for our talls to contest. Hopefully their kicking accuracy and decision making will be improved farther over the preseason.

Back Line: not alot of work needed here as they are v.solid

Rucks: Ablett to move onto the ball with improved fitness and he will win us more clearances. King is still the best ruck option as it allows ottens to start forward. Maybe a full preseason can get king back towards his best.

Interchange: and extended interchange as all the players I think will get a decent amount of games next year.

Ling and Rooke are named on the bench but would take tagging roles (I dont think ling is creative enough to become a pure onballer) in this case I would have them in the middle corey would go to 1/2 back and hunt, johnson or egan to the bench depending on match ups.

Also I think in short bursts mooney should be chucked on ball (strong body to win center clearances like in finals in 2005) this would allow nablett/hawkins a run at CHF also.

Tenace and Byrnes will get games as their pace has shown to be handy I would like to see tenace improve his foot skills and look longer at times. would be nice to see 80m plays out of him regularly eg. run 30 kick 50 and hit a target (same for woj)
Click to expand...

Would rather see Mackie on the wing, S.J half forward and Stokes in the pocket with Wojak on the bench.
 
Asty said:
This is pretty much what I would like to see

FF: NAblett/Hawkins Ottens SJohnson
HF: Chapman Mooney Mackie
C: Enright Bartel Wojcinski
HB: Milburn Harley Hunt
B: DJohnson Scarlett Egan

R: King GAblett Corey

INT: Rooke Ling Prismall Stokes Byrnes Tenace Gamble Varcoe


Forwards: I have named nathan and hawkins as I am not going to assume either will be capable of playing a full season so would like to see them split the role and both get around 12 games. They would both play when injury or suspension to ottens/mooney comes into effect. SJohnson to get a forward role as is an experienced goal sneak but if he doesn't perform (including defensive pressure) that will open up for stokes, gamble and varcoe.

Center Line: guys that can carry the ball in Woj and Enright and also kick it more than handball. They will get it deep into attack for our talls to contest. Hopefully their kicking accuracy and decision making will be improved farther over the preseason.

Back Line: not alot of work needed here as they are v.solid

Rucks: Ablett to move onto the ball with improved fitness and he will win us more clearances. King is still the best ruck option as it allows ottens to start forward. Maybe a full preseason can get king back towards his best.

Interchange: and extended interchange as all the players I think will get a decent amount of games next year.

Ling and Rooke are named on the bench but would take tagging roles (I dont think ling is creative enough to become a pure onballer) in this case I would have them in the middle corey would go to 1/2 back and hunt, johnson or egan to the bench depending on match ups.

Also I think in short bursts mooney should be chucked on ball (strong body to win center clearances like in finals in 2005) this would allow nablett/hawkins a run at CHF also.

Tenace and Byrnes will get games as their pace has shown to be handy I would like to see tenace improve his foot skills and look longer at times. would be nice to see 80m plays out of him regularly eg. run 30 kick 50 and hit a target (same for woj)
Click to expand...


Very good summary. I think we definitely however need more run out of the backline than what we have been getting this year. Maybe playing Woja down back as he was a couple of years ago would be worth considering or even into the future recruiting a guy like Chris Schmidt who from what I have seen looks to be an ideal future running half back.

Similarly I would argue we need more run in the midfield as well. Hopefully Varcoe can have a solid pre-season and step up or Tenace can continue to improve. Prismall, although not a racehorse, is not devoid of leg speed either and I'm sure will command more game time next year. Again looking to the future (via the draft) Albert Proud would be a good fit for our midfield.
 
TheTimeCometh said:
CM35 doesn't defend Wojac, and, at times, Hunt, renegade.

you both have broken records playin' sometimes - renegade with thommmo and cm35 with wojac.
Click to expand...

I continue to have a go at Thompson because it's clear that he needs to be removed before we can go forward at the club. I can't believe that people still don't understand this. Even the players don't have respect for him, and still some of you guys want this clown around. As long as he's at our club i'll be talking about him.

Mediocrity Man 35 continues to talk up about how we're strong and in a lovely position as a football club......pretty much says it all doesn't it.
 

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