Opinion The 'Carlton related stuff that doesn't need it's own thread' thread Part 3

[DangerousD]

Let 'em think that.

That's good.

Let who think that? It’s a graph, it’s not a person.

The last 18 GF winners at the end of the season are above the line, 16 of that 18 are in the top right.

They ts not an opinion.

 

[Sector 7G]

Was interesting hearing everyone's favourite analyst Hoyney giving Cowan a big rap for his defensive efforts on Myers and Bolton over the last 2 weeks that will be vital in locking players down in September. Interestingly he didn't use any data to back up that opinion.

 

[CCurnow3votes]

They mention it nearly every time they show it, they then mention the teams who weren’t in the top right of the graphic were all above the line.

As in all had a top 6 defence.

Currently we would have to buck the trend of the past 18 years.

Their chart includes data from the start of the season.

So it averages our results.

If you run the same chart over the past 6 weeks the results would be starkly different.

There’s no guessing why this (defensive) improvement has come - the return of Fog, Saad & Gov to name a few.

I don’t think the full season data is an accurate indication of what CFC is likely to output from now to end of year.

 

[Coops93]

I think we have close to the best, most balanced list. If we can't jag one before Cripps retires, it'd be a failure in my book.

As much as I wholeheartedly agree, I really struggle to see Doc coming back into the best 22 at this point... which is a sad thought.

 

[RPCB]

With this group as a whole? Yeah, I agree.

I think we have close to the best, most balanced list. If we can't jag one before Cripps retires, it'd be a failure in my book.

And by God, does he deserve one. Cripps and Doch need to hold up that cup.

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If we can’t win one before Cripps retires, that would be highly disappointing. He’s 29 years old and there is no clock for him to retire, so it could be in 5 years.

 

[BigFrizz36]

What part of saying we will have under achieved if we don’t win a premiership in the next few years do you disagree with?

The framing of it. You can either go with "carlton have built a great list , well done to them and they will be an interesting watch in the next 4 years as their premiership window is right open" OR "carlton will have under achieved if they don't win a premiership in the next two years.".

It's like some people want to give themselves a chance to start work on a post mortem before something happens. I'm really looking forward to the next 3 or 4years. Once it's done I'll reflect on how it all ends. I'm not interested in worrying about whether we meet Jordan Lewis' expectations and I doubt whether our team is either

 

[BigFrizz36]

If we can’t win one before Cripps retires, that would be highly disappointing. He’s 29 years old and there is no clock for him to retire, so it could be in 5 years.

I think that a fit Doc is a walk up start. Only have to look back at the game that he played on Errol Guilden in the semi final last year to see why. Errol had 22 touches and 2 goals whilst Doc had 21 touches and one goal.

We'd be a much better team if Doc was playing on the wing now.

 

[Bryce Bubbles]

And we love everything about you Bubble Boy!

Ha! Literally watching the bubble boy episode right now at our city stay cay! Best show!

 

[Bryce Bubbles]

It's been some time since we've been on top of the ladder(after the end of the round) 355 rounds to be exact!

 

[agro]

It's been some time since we've been on top of the ladder(after the end of the round) 355 rounds to be exact!

As long as we’re on top of the ladder come late afternoon 28th September 2024 - I don’t give a rats toss bag to be quite frank!!!

 

[Jatz]

It's been some time since we've been on top of the ladder(after the end of the round) 355 rounds to be exact!

Can't see that changing this season.

 

[MrsEddieBetts]

Gather Round is gonna be 10-13 April next year and prices for flights and accomm are already through the roof

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

What part of saying we will have under achieved if we don’t win a premiership in the next few years do you disagree with?

Slight difference between 'under-achieved' and 'failure'. The cynic in me says that a non-Carlton person is just putting pressure on us that we don't necessarily need.

The supporter in me says that I am very proud and decidedly more happy that we are merely contending again. It has been a long, painful time and winning games is a luxury I was losing sight off. The pain of losing with no hope of changing our stripes in the foreseeable future, where you just go to sleep on it and have no expectations, has nothing on the pain of losing when you are a chance to win a flag. The stakes are so much higher. When you seek the ultimate high of winning a flag, you have a long way to fall if you don't get there. That's the trade off.

I'd rather be living the latter where all things are possible.

If we don't get a flag with this group, I will feel we missed an opportunity. However, there are so many teams who have claims on their day. All have strengths and weaknesses, and those strengths and weaknesses can show themselves at any given time. We are in a really good position, but we still need a lot to go our way.

 

[jj1978]

As much as I wholeheartedly agree, I really struggle to see Doc coming back into the best 22 at this point... which is a sad thought.

Could be a professional sub-player.

 

[myblueroan]

Crippa even asked them to show a couple of times that Matt Kennedy was penalised where one hand was pinned and it would have been dangerous if Matt had tried to dispose of it.

He spoke very well. His argument was that the one hand and legs pinned (like Ridleys last week) shouldn't be holding the ball whereas having had prior and attempting but missing a disposal (like Stewart's last week) should be paid.

Gotta say I've heard him speak a few times and this was by far his best appearance. Seemed comfortable and had Gerard, Robbo, and Jeremy Howe agreeing with everything that he said.

He has been growing in confidence. Becoming a dad and our team improving has brought out a new maturity. So nice to see.

 

[JustOneTime]

Definitely agree with the media framing us continually with expectation and failure rather than a great chance/opportunity. This language is everywhere. The worst offender is BT, Hoyne is another who tries to hide his bias through some occasional complement pieces.

The competition is so close. Sydney are the best team based on data yet so many are building it on us that we need to do it or we are 'failures full stop'.

As supporters we have to be mindful that things can go in groups of games. Right now, there is a lot of buoyancy about our form but not long ago Geelong had that same aura. Every year it happens, previously Melbourne and Brisbane won stretches of games and looked unbeatable yet didn't win a thing when it counted.

We are on a nice run but things can change fast. I'm crossing my fingers we can maintain our form for this long stretch home. Look over at GWS who were favourites for the flag around round 2/3.

Can't remember which movie, but I can only think of the saying "Hold the line" as stuff comes at us from all sides in the run home.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

As much as I wholeheartedly agree, I really struggle to see Doc coming back into the best 22 at this point... which is a sad thought.

I absolutely see Doc slotting right back into this side. He could be on Ollie's wing, or he could be in the middle, or as a half forward rotating through the midfield. As much as I love them, Doc is better than Kennedy and Hewett. He doesn't take a backwards step, he has a massive instinctive footy brain, and a penetrating kick. Aside from that, he is hugely inspirational. If he can't get in ahead of Cottrell, Ollie, Kennedy or Hewett, something is very wrong.

 

[SkyhorseTamer]

Let who think that? It’s a graph, it’s not a person.

The last 18 GF winners at the end of the season are above the line, 16 of that 18 are in the top right.

They ts not an opinion.

At the end of the season. You said it yourself. End of the season. It's not a predictor. It's a measure. End of the season. We don't need to buck any trends. The last 6 weeks our defense has been top 5 or something.

 

[SkyhorseTamer]

Can't see that changing this season.

If we finish undefeated we will.

 

[BigFrizz36]

At the end of the season. You said it yourself. End of the season. It's not a predictor. It's a measure. End of the season. We don't need to buck any trends. The last 6 weeks our defense has been top 5 or something.

So what you are saying is that because we have had the hardest fixture so far and are now coming into the easiest part of our fixture the amount of points that we get scored against us is likely to decrease?

 

[DangerousD]

Slight difference between 'under-achieved' and 'failure'. The cynic in me says that a non-Carlton person is just putting pressure on us that we don't necessarily need.

The supporter in me says that I am very proud and decidedly more happy that we are merely contending again. It has been a long, painful time and winning games is a luxury I was losing sight off. The pain of losing with no hope of changing our stripes in the foreseeable future, where you just go to sleep on it and have no expectations, has nothing on the pain of losing when you are a chance to win a flag. The stakes are so much higher. When you seek the ultimate high of winning a flag, you have a long way to fall if you don't get there. That's the trade off.

I'd rather be living the latter where all things are possible.

If we don't get a flag with this group, I will feel we missed an opportunity. However, there are so many teams who have claims on their day. All have strengths and weaknesses, and those strengths and weaknesses can show themselves at any given time. We are in a really good position, but we still need a lot to go our way.

All very well said and as someone who was only 10 years old when we won our last premiership, I would much rather contend and underachieve than be irrelevant.

Lewis said underachieved, stated we have a strong list with quality players, he spoke of Cripps sole focus on team success, he spoke glowingly of our list and praised our ability to win games with a long injury list.

Some here are desperate for a villain,

 

[DangerousD]

Their chart includes data from the start of the season.

So it averages our results.

If you run the same chart over the past 6 weeks the results would be starkly different.

There’s no guessing why this (defensive) improvement has come - the return of Fog, Saad & Gov to name a few.

I don’t think the full season data is an accurate indication of what CFC is likely to output from now to end of year.

Spot on, it’s just a snap shot if our current points for and against, they showed our past 6 weeks and it’s top 1-2, so by the end of the year we will be right up there

 

[DangerousD]

At the end of the season. You said it yourself. End of the season. It's not a predictor. It's a measure. End of the season. We don't need to buck any trends. The last 6 weeks our defense has been top 5 or something.

It’s been fantastic and the graph just shows where we sit now, that’s all, by the end of the year, we will be right up the top.

 

[FitzroyBlueBagger]

Crippa even asked them to show a couple of times that Matt Kennedy was penalised where one hand was pinned and it would have been dangerous if Matt had tried to dispose of it.

He spoke very well. His argument was that the one hand and legs pinned (like Ridleys last week) shouldn't be holding the ball whereas having had prior and attempting but missing a disposal (like Stewart's last week) should be paid.

Gotta say I've heard him speak a few times and this was by far his best appearance. Seemed comfortable and had Gerard, Robbo, and Jeremy Howe agreeing with everything that he said.

Spot on, was very impressive, i feel that if the game could be umpired more in the way he explained each play within the handful of each of the footage pieces shown, then that would be more in line of how the game should be adjudicated, I’d imagine that it would be encouraged by a very large percentage within the football community, it would simplify decisions and take away some of the obvious grey areas for players coaches officials media and fans…

 

[lily of laguna]

I’m not sure how we have only entered our window this year, coming off a prelim loss of 14 points last year and choking the last 4 rounds to miss finals in 2022.

Regardless of when our window opened, I agree 2 years is tight and we should be challenging for quite a few more

If after this season and the next two, we haven’t won a premiership, then Lewis is right, we have underachieved, I have no idea how this opinion is criticised or even remotely offensive to any Carlton supporter.

As I said it is uttered to impose external pressure and start a narrative that we will be the next Melbourne.

These comments can be interpreted as innocuous but I have heard enough from the media to interpret a negative impetus.

Sure I may be jaded and cynical but I don’t ever take these comments at face value.

There are those in powerful positions in the media who are * lovers and blue haters.


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