Opinion The 'Carlton related stuff that doesn't need it's own thread' thread Part 3

[DangerousD]

As I said it is uttered to impose external pressure and start a narrative that we will be the next Melbourne.

These comments can be interpreted as innocuous but I have heard enough from the media to interpret a negative impetus.

Sure I may be jaded and cynical but I don’t ever take these comments at face value.

There are those in powerful positions in the media who are * lovers and blue haters.


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Building something up in the hope it fails, makes sense.

Melb have also under achieved though

 

[lily of laguna]

I’m not sure how we have only entered our window this year, coming off a prelim loss of 14 points last year and choking the last 4 rounds to miss finals in 2022.

Regardless of when our window opened, I agree 2 years is tight and we should be challenging for quite a few more

If after this season and the next two, we haven’t won a premiership, then Lewis is right, we have underachieved, I have no idea how this opinion is criticised or even remotely offensive to any Carlton supporter.

Our window to win a premiership has not been open for two years.

In 2023 we came from 15th to a prelim having not win a final since 2011 with almost no player on the list having played in a winning final.

In 2022 we still had not even played in a final and had not learnt what it is to be a side that could win. IE we lacked belief.

It is only this year after an amazing back half of last season that we grew enough belief that our game plan, structure and personnel was good enough to win the whole thing.

How many times do we hear ex-players or premiership players talk about gaining confidence and know how through making and playing finals a number of times before they are able to take home the cup.

To suggest we should or could have won the big dance any earlier than this season is fanciful and does not reflect the true position we have been in.

As I said earlier we were in with a shot last year but the fact we had to play the equivalent of 10 or prelims just to get to where we finished was exceptional and I’m sure the players were absolutely spent at the Gabba.


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[lily of laguna]

Let who think that? It’s a graph, it’s not a person.

The last 18 GF winners at the end of the season are above the line, 16 of that 18 are in the top right.

They ts not an opinion.

The let them think that comment is about “them” suggesting we are not in the frame at present.

What that graph fails to show is recent form, the effect of injury, (both in our team and who we play against), and the fixture nuance such as opposition, breaks between games and travel etc.

All things considered we have the form and defence to be outright leaders.

Let’s hope that we get the luck needed to reach the summit.


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[lily of laguna]

Definitely agree with the media framing us continually with expectation and failure rather than a great chance/opportunity. This language is everywhere. The worst offender is BT, Hoyne is another who tries to hide his bias through some occasional complement pieces.

The competition is so close. Sydney are the best team based on data yet so many are building it on us that we need to do it or we are 'failures full stop'.

As supporters we have to be mindful that things can go in groups of games. Right now, there is a lot of buoyancy about our form but not long ago Geelong had that same aura. Every year it happens, previously Melbourne and Brisbane won stretches of games and looked unbeatable yet didn't win a thing when it counted.

We are on a nice run but things can change fast. I'm crossing my fingers we can maintain our form for this long stretch home. Look over at GWS who were favourites for the flag around round 2/3.

Can't remember which movie, but I can only think of the saying "Hold the line" as stuff comes at us from all sides in the run home.

The movie was lord of the rings and the exclamation was “HOLD”………..(I’m sure there are many others……


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[lily of laguna]

All very well said and as someone who was only 10 years old when we won our last premiership, I would much rather contend and underachieve than be irrelevant.

Lewis said underachieved, stated we have a strong list with quality players, he spoke of Cripps sole focus on team success, he spoke glowingly of our list and praised our ability to win games with a long injury list.

Some here are desperate for a villain,

Not trying to pick on you specifically but one needs to judge his comments and commentary of us over time.

Lewis has made many comments about us that are less than complimentary and therefore I judge his comments in that light.

But as I have stated before I am quite cynical of the media in general and perhaps I should be slower to jump to the conclusion that most comments are designed with a negative bias towards us.


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[JustOneTime]

I’m not sure how we have only entered our window this year, coming off a prelim loss of 14 points last year and choking the last 4 rounds to miss finals in 2022.

Regardless of when our window opened, I agree 2 years is tight and we should be challenging for quite a few more

If after this season and the next two, we haven’t won a premiership, then Lewis is right, we have underachieved, I have no idea how this opinion is criticised or even remotely offensive to any Carlton supporter.

I think Lewis hasnt looked carefully and simply looked at Cripps/Doch's age.

We have the nucleus of our midfield, rucks and fwds all set up for 5 plus years. We have the pillar in defence (Weitering) for another 5 years. When i say nucleus, I mean ELITE talent in those positions.

What that means is we only need to replace role players and if people want to get antsy, Cripps. I think Cerra can replace Cripps easily enough as he progresses.

Walsh, Cerra, TDK (circa 24 years old - 7-8 years left min)
Weitering, Charlie, Harry (the spine circa 26/27 - 4-5 years left min)

E Hollands, O Hollands, and Motlop are high end talent coming through.

We have role players in Moo, Cinc, Boyd, Fog/Owies there for years.

We have a 5 year grace period to find Saad, Doch, Acres, Hewett, Williams replacements. The others arent notable enough and Cerra can take on Crippas role so then we just need to find a balanced midfielder in the draft. We have already identified Acres replacement and maybe Saads/Newmans via the Camporeale boys.

Our run comes to an end with Curnow/Mckay/Weitering hitting the 31-33 age mark and which coincides with Cerra/Walsh hitting 29-31. I've played it safe with ages given others have gone on much longer.

Our window is at least 5 years long.

I personally believe we did waste 2 years through mismanaging our quality and in context of squeezing into the 8. But who cares. We have 5 years to do something at least.

 

[JustOneTime]

The movie was lord of the rings and the exclamation was “HOLD”………..(I’m sure there are many others……


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Probably was LotR. Wasnt there a hold the line in Independence day from the crazy drunk guy, or Star wars (death star attack)?

 

[DangerousD]

Our window to win a premiership has not been open for two years.

In 2023 we came from 15th to a prelim having not win a final since 2011 with almost no player on the list having played in a winning final.

In 2022 we still had not even played in a final and had not learnt what it is to be a side that could win. IE we lacked belief.

It is only this year after an amazing back half of last season that we grew enough belief that our game plan, structure and personnel was good enough to win the whole thing.

How many times do we hear ex-players or premiership players talk about gaining confidence and know how through making and playing finals a number of times before they are able to take home the cup.

To suggest we should or could have won the big dance any earlier than this season is fanciful and does not reflect the true position we have been in.

As I said earlier we were in with a shot last year but the fact we had to play the equivalent of 10 or prelims just to get to where we finished was exceptional and I’m sure the players were absolutely spent at the Gabba.


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Yeah I’m sorry, don’t agree, a side that loses the prelim by 16 points is in their window.

Arguing whether our window opened this year or last year is not relevant, it’s purely based on opinion.

In 2002 we were in the top 8 from the first game of the season, until the last minute of the last round, before being knocked out, now I agree it’s silly for me to say with a straight face our window was open that year, even though I think we should of done better, we did lose the last four games.

We made things very difficult for ourselves in 2023, but won when we needed to and were playing great footy when it mattered, i don’t buy in to the idea our players were spent and that’s why we lost the prelim, we traveled interstate to play a very good side, at a ground they are very hard to beat and just fell short.

So, we both agree that our window is open, you think I’m crazy for thinking our window was open last year and I think your crazy for thinking it wasn’t.

 

[DangerousD]

The let them think that comment is about “them” suggesting we are not in the frame at present.

What that graph fails to show is recent form, the effect of injury, (both in our team and who we play against), and the fixture nuance such as opposition, breaks between games and travel etc.

All things considered we have the form and defence to be outright leaders.

Let’s hope that we get the luck needed to reach the summit.


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They showed our last 6 games and we are top 1-2 in nearly everything, by the end of the season we will be at the top of that premiership window graph

 

[katmanblue]

If we can’t win one before Cripps retires, that would be highly disappointing. He’s 29 years old and there is no clock for him to retire, so it could be in 5 years.

Exactly. It's not a failure if we can't get it done in 2024. But if we're still on 16 by 2030, something has gone wrong.

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[FitzroyBlueBagger]

Our window to win a premiership has not been open for two years.

In 2023 we came from 15th to a prelim having not win a final since 2011 with almost no player on the list having played in a winning final.

In 2022 we still had not even played in a final and had not learnt what it is to be a side that could win. IE we lacked belief.

It is only this year after an amazing back half of last season that we grew enough belief that our game plan, structure and personnel was good enough to win the whole thing.

How many times do we hear ex-players or premiership players talk about gaining confidence and know how through making and playing finals a number of times before they are able to take home the cup.

To suggest we should or could have won the big dance any earlier than this season is fanciful and does not reflect the true position we have been in.

As I said earlier we were in with a shot last year but the fact we had to play the equivalent of 10 or prelims just to get to where we finished was exceptional and I’m sure the players were absolutely spent at the Gabba.


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Last year i think if we had of somehow gotten over Brisbane then we would have been a legitimate 50/50 chance, maybe we could have pinched one? but we’ll never know…

If you’re comparing us as a team from last season and this season then there is a significant difference in a host of team/system metrics, we have discovered different roles that have benefited us particularly centre and forward of the ball with a few players who are having a great influence…

Another patch of injuries in the first half of the season like last year has once again tested us in depth, last year we struggled, while this year we’ve been able to progress our development as a team while missing key players along the way…

We are a better team who is becoming far more organised across all lines, our centre and stoppage clearances are a weapon, our defensive pressure/turnover game, forward half pressure/turnover game is humming while our our midfield pressure/turnover game is getting to a better balanced level which helps to protect our defence from opposition scoring heavily…

Still evolving, I’ve never been more proud and confident in the style and manner in which we play, we’re a massive chance this year…

 

[GoBlues!]

Can't remember which movie, but I can only think of the saying "Hold the line" as stuff comes at us from all sides in the run home.

I can imagine Crippa rallying the troops to keep the pressure up and Hold the line…..and then at the right moment give the signal to attack..

 

[JJBagger]

If I’ve taken anything from Brian Cook, it’s that he wants to build Carlton up for sustained success, not just for a 5 year window. He wants to have Carlton become like Geelong since 2004, Hawthorn 2007-2016 or Collingwood since 2018, where there are several years near the top, and the drop off only lasts, at most, a couple of years before climbing back up again. I’d be thinking of this group as being apart of a journey that goes beyond the next 5 years

 

[katmanblue]

It’s been fantastic and the graph just shows where we sit now, that’s all, by the end of the year, we will be right up the top.

No we won't. We'll be off the charts.

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[lily of laguna]

Building something up in the hope it fails, makes sense.

Melb have also under achieved though

I agree the Dees have under achieved going out in straight sets and now look a shadow of their best.

But the commentary prior to winning the flag certainly didn’t focus on them needing to get it done within 2 years or they were a bust.


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[BlueGum]

Exactly. It's not a failure if we can't get it done in 2024. But if we're still on 16 by 2030, something has gone wrong.

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Zactly. Why fret?
Voss and Crippa clearly want it. And are getting everyone on the same page. There will be times when everything doesn't work out, but we will be giving it an almighty crack for many years.

Enjoy the ride. Last year was just a taste.

 

[Arr0w]

Gather Round is gonna be 10-13 April next year and prices for flights and accomm are already through the roof

Buy a caravan

 

[MrsEddieBetts]

Buy a caravan

Never in a million years. We're gonna drive over and we've booked an AirBNB.
It's school hols so perfect timing for a FAMILY ROADTRIPPPPP

 

[FitzroyBlueBagger]

Buy a caravan

Mobile home or a shaggin wagging

 

[teagueyubeauty]

Never in a million years. We're gonna drive over and we've booked an AirBNB.
It's school hols so perfect timing for a FAMILY ROADTRIPPPPP

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[Magruder]

Probably was LotR. Wasnt there a hold the line in Independence day from the crazy drunk guy, or Star wars (death star attack)?

Braveheart ‘hold’

 

[Aphrodite]

AM I a mod now?

 

[Garters]

Never in a million years. We're gonna drive over and we've booked an AirBNB.
It's school hols so perfect timing for a FAMILY ROADTRIPPPPP

We've done the same. Kids are pumped for the road trip.

 

[agro]

With respect to Roosy’s assertion that our reserves team in the early 80’s would beat the current Norf side.


Just want to know if Roosy was referring to the period before we superannuated our surplus reserves players to St Kilda or after we superannuated them.

 

[RPCB]

Braveheart ‘hold’

I wish the 2007 Grand Final ended up having a replay because I heard the Crows were going full Braveheart after this effort