China openning

[cos789]

AN article in today's West Australian about how Beijing's Bird nest soup stadium is fast becoming a white elephant with no tenants and tourists fading fast in line with the Olympic memory .

Ripe for an AFL game .

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[Monkey King]

Hard market to crack IMO and an AFL match would draw few more than a bunch of ex-pats.

Just don't think it's their kind of game TBH.

 

[cos789]

Hard market to crack IMO and an AFL match would draw few more than a bunch of ex-pats.

Just don't think it's their kind of game TBH.

Because it is a very different game and with promotion it could could draw a very decent crowd . I guess motor racing isn't their kind of game too .
The fact is with such a large population even a very small interest is large .
But the reality is that such a large country would require a huge investment if you were to try and seriously tackle it in an ongoing manner.

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[Monkey King]

Because it is a very different game and with promotion it could could draw a very decent crowd . I guess motor racing isn't their kind of game too .

Firstly F1 is an international event and far more prestigious than AFL, both of which carry a lot of weight in the Chinese market. Plenty of guys turn up to the F1 race who have little interest in motor sport. Comparatively, I went to an A1 race in Shanghai a couple of years ago and attendance was thin.

Additionally as wealth grows in China, so does interest in high performance motor vehicles. Illegal drag racing on the ring roads in Shanghai is known to happen these days, a far cry from 10+ years ago.

The fact is with such a large population even a very small interest is large.

Ahh... the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow that has led to many a failed venture in China. Sure the market is large, but you need a product that appeals to the market to take advantage of it's size and generally AFL doesn't fit the bill.

I'm not against giving it a go. The more AFL in China the better, however I just don't think you'll get the response from the local population that you might hope for. It's not just a matter of promote the game and people will turn up, you'd need an definite edge in the approach.

 

[clarkey]

you'd need an definite edge in the approach.

How about this:

Aussie Rules - Great Ball of China.

There you go, no charge.

 

[cos789]

How about this:

Aussie Rules - Great Ball of China.

There you go, no charge.

like it

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[Monkey King]

How about this:

Aussie Rules - Great Ball of China.

There you go, no charge.

English puns just aren't going to do the trick I'm afraid

Would a word play in Chinese attract you to event you otherwise have no knowledge of or interest in?

 

[cos789]

Would a word play in Chinese attract you to event you otherwise have no knowledge of or interest in?

So can you tell me what the pay TV coverage is like in China .
Do you know if the China still takes the SANFL ?

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[Monkey King]

So can you tell me what the pay TV coverage is like in China .
Do you know if the China still takes the SANFL ?

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Haven't lived there for a couple of years now. Generally you paid a small fee for mainstream TV of 90 something channels. Mostly Chinese channels, a couple of English channels and the odd movie in English or subtitiled. This set-up is pretty much what most Chinese people watch. Some international sports - NBA, boxing, soccer - with Chinese commentary, but otherwise local focus - volleyball, badminton, table tennis. Never saw any SANFL or AFL on those channels but didn't exactly spend a lot of time watching TV TBH.

The other type of TV you can get is satellite, which some people have, but not in the main. This would include AFL - perhaps SANFL at times, I have no idea - which is broadcast on the Australia Network channel. I believe that's the only place you can watch AFL and they screen about 4 matches a weekend with a one hour round-wrap-up program during the week. AFAIK SANFL was not broadcast this year. I certainly didn't see any from where I now access Australia Network anyway.

 

[cos789]

The Australia network is a great network with AFL live a lot of the time .
I'd like to get it here in Australia . All I need is a bigger dish an an address .
(And the money)

Decades ago , some assute businessman sold the SANFL as the premier viewing of Aussie Rules to China . Kudos to that man .

To say "that's not there thing" is totally ridiculous and frankly racist .
Obviously it's not their thing if they haven't been exposed to Aussie Rules .

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[Monkey King]

To say "that's not there thing" is totally ridiculous and frankly racist .

Frankly, that is a very dumb and bore-some thing to say. Would you consider saying table tennis is not Australian's thing when it comes to watching it for hours on TV, or filling up a center, to be racist as well? Rather I think it comes down to an understanding of the different places and cultures.

Among all the other over-simplifications you made... this would be the most outstanding.

 

[cos789]

Frankly, that is a very dumb and bore-some thing to say. .... this would be the most outstanding.

Make up your mind monkey dumb and boring or outstanding .
Opposite ends of the spectrum last time I looked .

Would you consider saying table tennis is not Australian's thing

Australia played table tennis last time I looked .

Rather I think it comes down to an understanding of the different places and cultures.

And that is a racist comment .Simply because you refer to race .

Why would China be any different to say Japan ?
Or is that too simple a question .

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[Monkey King]

Make up your mind monkey dumb and boring or outstanding .
Opposite ends of the spectrum last time I looked .

Perhaps you need to look at it again instead of trying to be too clever for your own good. Outstanding signifies prominence as well as excellence. Ah... the nuances of the English language eh.

Australia played table tennis last time I looked .

Taking this out of the context of which it was written - which is terms of mass participation and TV interest - misses the point. Interest in table tennis in China is massive and represents something that I am sure would never occur in Australia.

Stating my belief that Australian's would never get into that sport in such a way is not racist toward Australians, nor would stating the reverse regarding Aussie Rules be racist towards Chinese?

And that is a racist comment .Simply because you refer to race .

Firstly I think you need to work on your definitions of English words mate. Racism carries with it the notion of prejudice or superiority. Distinguishing races is not, in itself, racist. Just as the noting Carlton having recruited a Papua New Guinean is not racist simply for the fact his race was highlighted.

Furthermore, I was talking about nationality, not race. Should you know something about the country, you might recognize that China is home to 50 odd different ethnic groups. One of these races is the majority Han, which is probably what you would term Chinese.

And how can I discuss attendances of AFL matches in China without talking about Chinese people, the very market that entails the audience of which you claim would participate in sufficient numbers? If you are going to be offended by me talking about Chinese, why start a thread about the plausibility of playing AFL matches in China.

Why would China be any different to say Japan ?
Or is that too simple a question .

I can't claim to know anything about Japan, so decline to comment. China is another matter though, having lived there for a number of years over the last 15 years. I have shared homes, worked and socialised with Chinese and have direct and indirect experience that would somewhat qualify me to form an opinion on their receptiveness to Australian football.

 

[Dingo]

well done Monkey King - a clear, concise and intelligent answer!

 

[Monkey King]

well done Monkey King - a clear, concise and intelligent answer!

Cheers mate

 

[cos789]

Perhaps you need to look at it again instead of trying to be too clever for your own good. Outstanding signifies prominence as well as excellence. Ah... the nuances of the English language eh.

FFS it's still at the other end of the the spectrum to dumb and boring.
They are your words mate not mine .
I think you should take some of your own advice .
Seems you can't admit your own mistakes .

Taking this out of the context of which it was written - which is terms of mass participation and TV interest - misses the point. Interest in table tennis in China is massive and represents something that I am sure would never occur in Australia.

That's because you included it to make your point .
I'm saying there's nothing in the Chinese psych that prevents them enjoying Australian Football and similarly nothing that prevents Australians from enjoying table tennis . There is a multitude of reasons why each is big in it's own country .

I think you need to work on your definitions of English words mate. Racism carries with it the notion of prejudice or superiority.

Racism usually carries a negative notion but not necessarily .
You are making racist comments . Of course that sounds like I'm calling you a racist (with the negative implications) . I'm not . I'm saying people are people and the reasons they come to prefer different tastes are many .
Doesn't mean they are insurmountable or that some are more difficult than others .

Furthermore, I was talking about nationality, not race.

By definition remarks about race are racist .
By definition remarks about nationalities are bigotry .
I presume you are not either .

And how can I discuss attendances of AFL matches in China without talking about Chinese people, the very market that entails the audience of which you claim would participate in sufficient numbers? If you are going to be offended by me talking about Chinese, why start a thread about the plausibility of playing AFL matches in China.

All I said was that it would be a good idea to have an AFL game at the Olympic stadium . I did say anything else would be difficult but because of the population any small interest would be large . That's the thinking for GWS and the USA etc . If you haven't noticed I'm only picking you up on your statement that inferred that it wasn't in the Chinese psych to be interested in Australian Football not about China in general .

I can't claim to know anything about Japan, so decline to comment. China is another matter though, having lived there for a number of years over the last 15 years. I have shared homes, worked and socialised with Chinese and have direct and indirect experience that would somewhat qualify me to form an opinion on their receptiveness to Australian football.

Without being to both countries I'm still confident in saying that reasons why taking up Australian Football would be much the same for Japan and China .
One difference is financial position . With China's fast improving economy maybe this reason will be removed and China can grow it's interest like Japan .

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[Monkey King]

FFS it's still at the other end of the the spectrum to dumb and boring.

What don't you get about the word outstanding? It means literally to "stand out", which can be both negative and positive in its connotations. Most definitely one can be outstanding in their stupidity... which you are starting to demonstrate. Trust me... grab a dictionary before you say anything more about it, because it's just getting embarrassing now.

You are making racist comments .

By definition remarks about race are racist .
By definition remarks about nationalities are bigotry .

Incorporated by both, but solely defined by neither. If I was to say "My wife is Chinese", do you think that would be racist? Or if I mention my in-laws are Chinese, which despite being able to speak Chinese, makes understanding each other more difficult... do you think that's racist? How small minded are you exactly to subscribe to such bizarre and limited definitions?

Foreign enterprises pay millions every year for cultural insight when investing into China because the market and style of conducting business is so different. Chinese companies with outbound investments do the same thing for the same reason. The fact is Chinese culture is far different to Australian culture. Recognizing that very real phenomenon is not racist. In fact, it is cultural insensitivity and ignorance that more often than not results in racism, not the other way around as you're suggesting. I get the feeling you are quite limited in your life experience when it comes to these matters and that most of your opinions are simply vacant head space.

The irony of all this is that I never mentioned race. I simply said "they"... which referred to the market of which you speak. That market being Chinese is as incidental as if you were suggesting taking a volleyball tournament to Ballarat and someone replied that they don't think the residents would be into it. Or let me guess... such a reply would indicate the writer is racist against the people of Ballarat? That this market is one in which I have a good depth of experience, has encouraged me offer my opinion. Being met with such infantile accusations is astounding tbh.

Without being to both countries I'm still confident in saying that reasons why taking up Australian Football would be much the same for Japan and China .

Why Japan? Is it because they are both Asian countries? Is that not racist... or is it just culturally ignorant? Why not England, who demonstrate virtually no interest in the games that have been played in that country?

BTW I wouldn't be going to China in a hurry and explaining them your theory on their cultures being like minded or market acceptance being the same. It wouldn't be well received. Then again, I'm sure you would find such a comment racist

 

[cos789]

It means literally to "stand out", which can be both negative and positive in its connotations.

And without a qualifier it is taken as a positive .

Whatever , outstanding , whether positive or negative is at opposite ends of the spectrum as to "boring" . "Boring" you would have to agree nothing outstanding . In fact it all blurs into one .

Why Japan? Is it because they are both Asian countries? Is that not racist

If you say so . I'm comparing countries that might have similarities .

BTW I wouldn't be going to China in a hurry and explaining them your theory on their cultures being like minded or market acceptance being the same.

Why do you put your words into head as if they're mine ?

If you care to actually read what I have written .I have said :
The AFL should have a game at the Olympic stadium , a statement I'm not totally serious about , but to see any positive reactions .
Anything past that would be difficult .
In making an analysis of the uptake of Australian Football at any level requires the identification of many inputs ;geography,climate,land use,media ,economics,disposable income,levels sports following and participation .

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[Monkey King]

And without a qualifier it is taken as a positive .

Whatever , outstanding , whether positive or negative is at opposite ends of the spectrum as to "boring" . "Boring" you would have to agree nothing outstanding . In fact it all blurs into one .

Among all the other over-simplifications you made... this would be the most outstanding.

The underlined portion of my original comment is the qualifier. And let's not forget that there are 30 odd words that separate this comment from the words bore-some and dumb. Having focused solely on the definition of the word as it relates to excellence, you've completely ignored how it used to highlight prominence; no doubt this is where your confusion stems from.

Irrespective, you can indeed use the word outstanding to describe a moment of accentuated boredom as differentiated from other less boring moments. It's all pretty standard English mate.

I'm comparing countries that might have similarities .

Why do you think that? Could it be due to racial appearance? Please don't claim it to be geographical, as China shares borders with India, Thailand, Russia and Kyrgyzstan, among others; all of whom represent a diverse set of cultures, languages and religions.

The funny thing is some Chinese people draw likewise conclusions when comparing Germans and Australians, based of course on racial similarity.

Why do you put your words into head as if they're mine ?

If you care to actually read what I have written .I have said :

Actually, I have read what you've written... and here is a direct quote - reasons why taking up Australian Football would be much the same for Japan and China; and I can assure you many Chinese people would be genuinely offended by your sentiment.

Overall your accusations of racism are ignorant and unsubstantiated. I notice you've abandoned pursuing this line in your recent post and bypassed responding to my comments on cultural understanding and recognition. I hope that represents some form of retraction, at least mentally if not verbally.

 

[cos789]

reasons why taking up Australian Football would be much the same for Japan and China; and I can assure you many Chinese people would be genuinely offended by your sentiment.

The reason why the Chinese would take up Australian Football are exactly the same the world over - because they (those who take it up) like the game .

[Overall your accusations of racism are ignorant and unsubstantiated. I notice you've abandoned pursuing this line in your recent post and bypassed responding to my comments on cultural understanding and recognition. I hope that represents some form of retraction, at least mentally if not verbally.

When you make a statement like "I don't think it's their (the Chinese by implication) kind of game " , you are open to people thinking that you are saying that the Chinese themselves are somehow different . An apparent racist comment of the negative kind . If you appended "because ....." as you did when challenged then it could not be interpreted that way .

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[Monkey King]

The reason why the Chinese would take up Australian Football are exactly the same the world over - because they (those who take it up) like the game .

Sure... if they liked the game that would be true, but not every culture will respond to things in the same way. I'll be honest with you; of the dozens of Chinese people who I've introduced to the game, only one showed any interest, and only then after they married an Aussie, migrated to Australia and were dragged to an endless stream of St Kilda games. ST KILDA of all teams... can you imagine the life of AFL suffering they've unwittingly subjected themselves to

When you make a statement like "I don't think it's their (the Chinese by implication) kind of game " , you are open to people thinking that you are saying that the Chinese themselves are somehow different .

But culturally, Chinese people are very different to Australian's in many aspects... and as I said before, millions of dollars exchanges hands every year due to many people wanting to attune to these cultural differences; it certainly doesn't mean anyone is better or worse, but expecting those from varying cultural backgrounds to behave and respond to situations the same as you or your fellow countrymen is fraught with potential difficulties and in some cases, danger.

An apparent racist comment of the negative kind . If you appended "because ....." as you did when challenged then it could not be interpreted that way . .

Well not having an inclination to support AFL certainly isn't a negative... but perhaps I should have initially gone a little more in depth with my comments. I really do try to avoid playing the I know better coz I studied this... or worked on that... or lived here card. I just wanted to state an opinion based on my experiences and was genuinely taken aback to be accused of racism towards the people of a country and culture that I truly love and respect.

I guess this was a combination of me not clarifying my statement and you jumping the gun. Hopefully we each learn our lesson. No hard feelings

 

[cos789]

I guess this was a combination of me not clarifying my statement and you jumping the gun.

No . A slight oversight or sloppiness of the English language in this politically correct world by you . Me , I'm usually this pedantic .I like a good debate but you do waffle on a tad too much to explore some of your other points .

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[Monkey King]

No . A slight oversight or sloppiness of the English language in this politically correct world by you . Me , I'm usually this pedantic .I like a good debate but you do waffle on a tad too much to explore some of your other points .

.

All righty then... from a master of the English language

My English was far from sloppy; I just didn't realise I was talking to someone so thoroughly challenged by basic English definitions; although your basic grammar errors were an obvious enough precursor, so perhaps I should have foreseen it.

Nor did I realise someone discussing international concepts would be so overly sensitive to issues of racism while failing to grasp what racism actually is; complicated further by your obvious cultural ignorances.

I was simply trying to be gracious, but my God; you had better head back to People or Take 5 magazine or whatever it is you read.

 

[cos789]

I extend a piece offering - a waffle iron .

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[clarkey]

Gents, I suggest you follow my lead and sit, zen like, in the middle of a calm oasis. I have never argued with anyone on this board as a result.