Dees seek priority pick

[dlanod]

Got to admire someone who can manage to get banned inside 2 weeks and 44 posts across three boards. Some have to work a lot harder than that.

Take a look at his posting history - managed to hit the Freo, North and West Coast boards in addition to the above. I surprised he hasn't gotten hit for more yet.

 

[LIONS08]

I know its easy to sit back and say this now but Melbourne have no one else to blame but themselves for the position they are in, especially regarding there drafting and recruitment. You just have to look back to 2008 when they drafted Sam Blease with pick 17 which was a priority pick for them. They overlooked playes like Dayne Beams, Rory Sloane, Dan Hannebery and our own Jack Redden just to name a few. We have only seen Toumpas in action for two years now but even he is looking like he will struggle at the level required early in his career. They need to put more money and time into their recruitment sector and their development team rather than expect hand outs.

 

[Bucking Beads]

The real reason the Demons are so shit is due to their terrible drafting. They haven't nailed one draft ever.

 

[WhiteLionFeva]

I think in fairness they weren't on their Pat Malone in rating Toumpas.

 

[Sanchez365]

I think in fairness they weren't on their Pat Malone in rating Toumpas.

I think in fairness its probably also a bit early to assume this is the best Toumpas' will be in his career.

 

[James North]

Assess James, I know all psychology comes back to sex, but I dont think another 12 months of taking it Greek style will help them.

Can't believe I made a typo ... my time on this board is DONE.

 

[Skoob]

This same goose has said the same thing over on his own board. Apparently we're demanding a pp and we are most deserved.Scratched my head when I read it earlier. Then he posts the above. Lol bf brings out all types.

Thanks for the heads up - he'd posted it about us on the Collingwood, West Coast and St Kilda boards. Clear trolling.

Got to admire someone who can manage to get banned inside 2 weeks and 44 posts across three boards. Some have to work a lot harder than that.

Wait, so we're not getting a priority pick? For ****'s sake!!!

 

[Dylan12]

Staggering how pro-priority pick for MFC they all are on AFL360.

Disgusting.

Overall, how is one bloody pick going to make a massive difference to the club?

Said it last night, but the media is massively softening up all AFL supporters for the inevitable.

 

[Dylan12]

Still Dees related...

THE prospect of Melbourne receiving pick three as compensation when free agent James Frawley leaves is the last small positive from a season turning into Groundhog Day. It might send chills down the spine of Paul Roos and co, but Frawley’s decidedly modest season means a first round compensation pick could be a line-ball call. Leigh Matthews believes Frawley is not in the league’s top 100 players, saying this month: “If he wasn’t a free agent, no one would be thinking about recruiting him. He’s an OK player.” If a rival like Geelong or Fremantle offers him only $500,000 a year or less, Melbourne might be left with unders — a second-round pick for Frawley instead of the free agency gift. “I reckon he’s going to have to get around $600,000 to get that first round (compensation),’’ former Melbourne star David Schwarz said on Wednesday.

 

[Hank Scorpion]

The real reason the Demons are so shit is due to their terrible drafting. They haven't nailed one draft ever.

I think it has more to do with player development than their drafting.

Jack Watts and Jimmy Toumpas, for example, were both highly rated. We could debate whether or not Melbourne went early picking them, but there is no question that they would have both been top-ten picks.

I doubt that had they ended up at a Geelong or Collingwood that they'd be as underwhelming as they are now.

Priority picks should be off the table until they sort themselves out off the field, I have no issues with the AFL stepping into help there.

Even if they had taken steps to reform themselves off the field, I don't think their current performance warrants it. They have significantly improved from last year:

Losses >70-points: 2013 (8), 2014 (1)
Wins: 2013 (2), 2014 (4) (2014 wins came against Carlton, Richmond, Adelaide and Essendon, three of which are still in top-8 contention)
Percentage: 2013 (54), 2014 (70)

They're not even last! If I were a Dees fan, I'd count myself lucky to get a first round pick for Frawley and leave it at that.

 

[a mayes ing]

I remember a former Melb player moving to the Eagles. Cant remember who but they said the training that was done at the Melb and at the Eagles was extremely different. He was essentially saying that the way Melbourne trained was not intense enough.

 

[Dylan12]

I remember a former Melb player moving to the Eagles. Cant remember who but they said the training that was done at the Melb and at the Eagles was extremely different. He was essentially saying that the way Melbourne trained was not intense enough.

Cale Morton perhaps?

 

[Elixuh]

Whats the key barometer of success or failure that they're going off? On 360 they seemed to suggest ladder position over X years + inability to draft and develop players = no one knows where Melbourne is at.

I think there is something to be said for that argument, where you're able to clearly distinguish between Melbourne (where no one knows whats really going on) and a side like us or St Kilda where there are clear signs of development and improvement. Problem is that ANY argument for concessions will be met by the brick wall argument which encompasses comparisons (historically) of what other clubs have been able to do with far less (in terms of draft picks for example).

I don't know how the concession would work but what they need is an established and quality player with strong leadership skills. In the short term they need stability. The draft picks they've had recently, the draft picks they will get at seasons end and the draft picks they will inevitably secure for the next few seasons surely will give them enough to build a spine and develop.

 

[luthor]

Melbourne are crap and it's their own fault.

Screw them.

That's all.

 

[Caiphus]

Trengrove and Scully were rated clearly the best 2 players in that 2009 draft. It looks at this stage that it was a bit of a dud draft overall 5 years on, and Melbourne certainly didn't do themselves any favours in it. That aside, the sheer number of misses they have had over the years can't all be down to bad luck and by this stage it isn't worth risking a high pick on them through compensation just to prove once and for all that it is a systemic problem with their development.

 

[SizeMatters]

Cook was an interesting case. Only lasted 2years IIRC and he wasn't a dud either just needed time
To fill out a bit. I heard a rumour that he was one of the players who got 3 strikes. Just a rumour though but probably some weight behind it considering that no other club even rookied him as he was a high draft pick with a good talent base to work with.

 

[winged1]

Cook was an interesting case. Only lasted 2years IIRC and he wasn't a dud either just needed time
To fill out a bit. I heard a rumour that he was one of the players who got 3 strikes. Just a rumour though but probably some weight behind it considering that no other club even rookied him as he was a high draft pick with a good talent base to work with.

There was a lot of talk about him three striking which would mean two years out. If so hopefully the kid is playing good footy and potentially gets another crack at it next year.

 

[Last of the Roys]

What really annoyed me about the Demons priority pick talk this week - was the belief that the Saints are somehow next in line (or that the fairness to the Saints needs to be taken into account when deciding if Melbourne get a priority pick).

From someone who loves Victoria I can safely say... what a load of Victorian centric crap!!!!!!!!

I have looked at finishing positions on the ladder at the end of the home and away season for the last 5-10 years, including the current ladder positions for this year (assuming for simplicity that it doesn't change).
(* It would probably be better to take into account finals, but this way is much easier)
(* I have excluded GC and GWS from the results because they already have their priority picks built in)

http://afltables.com/afl/teams/allteams/seasons.html#over

So over the last 10 years (2005 to 2014):
- Melbourne are clearly the worst performing team with an average end of year position of 13.5
- the Lions are the second worst performing team with an average end of year position of 11.8
- Saints average end of year position 7.6 (6th best in the AFL)

Over the last 8 years (2007 to 2014):
- Melbourne's average end of year position is 15.1 (worst in the AFL)
- the Lions is 11.8 (2nd worst)
- Saints 8.3 (equal 6th best in the AFL)

If you just look at the last 5 years (2010 to 2014)
- Melbourne's average end of year position is 15 (worst in the AFL)
- the Lions is 13.6 (2nd worst)
- Saints 10.4 (only equal 5th worst)

Bottom line is that the Lions can safely lay claim to the second worst performing side in the AFL for some time. The Saints have had nowhere near the pain - at the end of 2014 their last 5 years will have gone: 3rd, 6th, 9th, 16th, 18th. (Fair dinkum AFL 360, I love your show usually, but pull your heads out of your arses on this one)

If the Dees hadn't (for all but in name) been found guilty of tanking they would definitely deserve a priority pick by now. However, how can you reward a team that not too long ago tanked for a priority pick with a priority pick? It is a bit like giving a burglar back the cash he stole because a few years later he is still down on his luck.

On the other hand, what about the Club with the second worse performance in the last 5-10 years, that is doing all it can to get itself back on track, AND just so happened to have 5 second year players virtually stolen from it in the proceeding year. Does anyone think we have a chance in hell of the Melbourne media mafia or the AFL pushing for us to have a priority pick?

As usual we are all but forgotten.

 

[Dylan12]

Hate admitting it, but I finally agree with Damian Barrett:

Twelve months after receiving nearly $3 million in an AFL Commission bailout, and then securing the services of Paul Roos as coach, Melbourne Football Club has sought another shortcut in its long route out of embarrassment and oblivion. This time it wants a special priority draft selection. Another one. It is the easy way out, again. For Melbourne, it is obviously easier to ask for handouts than to fight and scrap and be prepared to sacrifice every ounce of effort in the pursuit of a better status. That may not be the club's mindset, but that is the message it is sending. The better message would have been a statement revealing that the club would not be requesting the AFL commission to use its discretion to grant a priority draft selection. Since 2006, it has had 17 national draft selections inside pick 26, 13 of those in the top 14. It has had two priority selections, two No.1 overall picks, seven picks in the top four. Until Melbourne changes its attitude and stops seeking welfare, it cannot be fixed.

 

[Fatcat08]

Hate admitting it, but I finally agree with Damian Barrett:

You just made me feel dirty Dylan, and not in a good way. Not sure I'll get through this but Barrett..speaking...a..lot....of...............................sense

God that was tough I'm off to have a shower

 

[Betty Noir]

I thought the notion of the top 5 or so draft picks tanking to avoid Melbourne was interesting. At any rate I don't care if they get it or not. They won't know what to do with it, and by design, it will only hinder their "cultural" issues. I think the potential draftee is the real victim in all of this.

 

[chopperduck]

If I was us I would be submitting those stats to the AFL and saying if Melb deserve one we cant be far off. The other rubbish talk about the Saints is that they just choose to trade out players and rebuild their list. That isnt struggling, that is a list management strategy. They need to be bottom 4 for another 4 years before any talk of them getting a PP should pop up.

Way too much entitlement ingrained in these clubs I think.

 

[Hollow Knight]

The AFL should underwrite systemic and marketplace disadvantages.

Melbourne's situation isn't a result of the system or the market. It is a result of their own doing. Stuff em.

The draft is great because it equalises while still requiring clubs to make good decisions. Underwriting bad ones is equalisation going too far.

 

[Hollow Knight]

As an aside, I was pondering yesterday...

If I was a draftee in 2010, (knowing what I know now) would I rather have been drafted to Melbourne or Essendon?

The fact that I easily opted for the latter is disturbing. Essendon's pharmacologically experimental environment seemed less risky than taking my chances with Melbourne's development system.

 

[The Flying Belgian]

Hate admitting it, but I finally agree with Damian Barrett:

Emma Quayle has said the same thing 2 hours earlier if it helps you feel better Dylan.

FWIW, I think they could use a few extra picks, but give them 3 picks at the end of the 3rd round. 1 superstar < 3 solid players. We're proof that there's talent to be had later in the draft. On the other hand, a few extra youngsters isn't going to help them short-term.

But, I'd have much preferred to see them say "no, it's our mess and we're going to fight our way out".

Another thing - I don't know who the recruitment manager was at Melbourne prior to Jason Taylor (who is a Hine disciple) but they were afwul. You can point to the 2008-9 drafts as a reason they are so bad now.