They are not mutually exclusive.
The best person for the job should have all those qualities on top of being good at the role hes employed to perform...a team player who believes in the clubs culture and code of ethics and can in fact improve them.
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AFLW 2024 - Round 9 - Indigenous Round - Chat, game threads, injury lists, team lineups and more.
News Eddie McGuire to step down end of 2021
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They are not mutually exclusive.
The best person for the job should have all those qualities on top of being good at the role hes employed to perform...a team player who believes in the clubs culture and code of ethics and can in fact improve them.
jmac70
On the porch
Affirmative action is not about PR and avoiding being sued. It’s about equality for disadvantaged people and the creation of a diverse and enriched culture, leading to greater understanding and empathy amongst people. Leading to increased wellbeing and in turn performance.
76woodenspooners
Brownlow Medallist
Agree. I guess it drives a wider definition of the term ‘role’ to include team dynamics.
Not sure how the term ‘role’ is thought of in footy clubs. It’s a term that’s used a lot ...
... as in ‘role player’ (which I take to mean a player who has responsibilities outside to general team dynamic, Eg: tagger / run-with)
... but there is also the ‘I played my role’ (which I take to mean as responsibilities inside the general team dynamic)
jmac70
On the porch
Even Crown Casino, a company not generally thought of as having a moral compass, has an Indigenous employment policy.
76woodenspooners
Brownlow Medallist
Agree that it shouldn’t be, and when it‘s applied correctly it’s not. But at its worst it is tokenistic, and it happens ...
... (”positive discrimination” is an archaic term for “affirmative action”) ...
Indeed.
That’s the type of answer that Sizer should have given when she was asked at the AGM about ”Is diversity not just a moral obligation, but also a force for competitive advantage?” ...
... but she didn’t, not even close. She did a ‘politician‘s pivot’ which was disappointing.
jmac70
On the porch
Agree with that. I suspect she lacks the confidence to express her true voice, particularly when sitting next to a man who had just proclaimed the report findings as a proud day for Collingwood.
76woodenspooners
Brownlow Medallist
Sizer was all in on it being a proud day for Collingwood as well?
Scodog10
Brownlow Medallist
This is where I’m at currently.
I’m all for change that will lead to more diverse cultures within the organisation, but for me right now the primary focus starts at who is best equipped to handle the role. The concern I have is that it could lead to racists like McGuire who for the vast majority of his time with the club has spoken like he has all the qualities you want for an inclusive organisation...
I’m open tough to the alternative whereby you consider culture and diversity first and foremost then if their not the strongest fit in terms of expertise you investigate whether they can improve. The trickle down effect of their cultural fit could outweigh their other deficiencies? Especially if you see improvement in them.
Long term it’s a challenge that I’m glad McGuire won’t be in charge of!
jmac70
On the porch
Proud that Collingwood commissioned the report, not of the past.
Not suggesting Ed is either, just that he’s incapable of expressing genuine humility. Wonder why he didn’t lead with an apology...
jackcass
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In my experience, the best person for the job isn't always the person who interviews best.
Billys Back
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I'm not so sure the report actually calls for a 'worse' candidate for a role to be employed just because they are indigenous.
But rather, greater representation within the club as a whole. I suppose it leads to an environment of better understanding/education, particularly when what we are saying is that the club needs some work in this area.
And I very much doubt the club purposely has avoided recruiting an indigenous kid. Afterall, during this period of 'racism' we did have Leon Davis and Krakour brought into the club which were successes. I see we have also had our fair share of busts here as well. Maybe creating another role for an indigenous person within the club may in fact assist creating the feeling of an accepting environment and may help in getting the best out of these kids.
But rather, greater representation within the club as a whole. I suppose it leads to an environment of better understanding/education, particularly when what we are saying is that the club needs some work in this area.
And I very much doubt the club purposely has avoided recruiting an indigenous kid. Afterall, during this period of 'racism' we did have Leon Davis and Krakour brought into the club which were successes. I see we have also had our fair share of busts here as well. Maybe creating another role for an indigenous person within the club may in fact assist creating the feeling of an accepting environment and may help in getting the best out of these kids.
TradeDraft
Post-Human
Finally the Board sounds like they might be Standing up to Dictator Eddie and Finally Force Him Out
Last edited:
- Aug 17, 2018
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Certainly a damning account of Ed's position within the club at present in the Herald Sun. Suggested that Anderson and Sizer were allowed in the room with the players and Ed was banned from entering as they discussed the findings and a response to the report.
I there is a real chance he doesn't see out the season.
I there is a real chance he doesn't see out the season.
AndrewShawble
Premiership Player
- Sep 10, 2019
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Another article worth reading by Niall
www.theage.com.au
Will Eddie hang on? President’s tenure at Collingwood on the edge
Perhaps for the first time in his eventful and transformative 22-year presidency, McGuire has lost control of the decision on whether he continues at the helm.
jmac70
On the porch
No chance he sees out the season now. He was doomed from the moment he opened his mouth at the press conference.
Trickster
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He's made mistakes but IMO I think Ed deserves to see out the season. He's already the fall guy, sponsors are still sticking with us and he should be afforded the chance to go out on his terms given what he has done for our club.
We've got a premier who's presided over 700+ wave 2 covid deaths due to bungled hotel quarantine, creates an enquiry where over $8m is spent in legal fees resulting in collective amnesia from he and his ministers and ultimately does not take accountability for what happened under his watch, yet gets to keep his role.
Stories have come out on the atrocities a minority Muslim group in a certain Asian country have experienced in their unjustified imprisonment as part of their 'cleansing' but by and large there's very little media coverage let alone outrage to oust that leader.
Ed on the other hand looks likely to be forced our for a gaffe where he commissions a report that the AFL and other clubs won't dare do in which he wrongly uses the word proud, where most know it is in the context of line in the sand, this is the new Collingwood which is spin but that is the AFL industry.
It's a very strange world we live in indeed.
We've got a premier who's presided over 700+ wave 2 covid deaths due to bungled hotel quarantine, creates an enquiry where over $8m is spent in legal fees resulting in collective amnesia from he and his ministers and ultimately does not take accountability for what happened under his watch, yet gets to keep his role.
Stories have come out on the atrocities a minority Muslim group in a certain Asian country have experienced in their unjustified imprisonment as part of their 'cleansing' but by and large there's very little media coverage let alone outrage to oust that leader.
Ed on the other hand looks likely to be forced our for a gaffe where he commissions a report that the AFL and other clubs won't dare do in which he wrongly uses the word proud, where most know it is in the context of line in the sand, this is the new Collingwood which is spin but that is the AFL industry.
It's a very strange world we live in indeed.
jmac70
On the porch
Where to next for Ed?
Unlikely to see out the year as Collingwood President, and given his current popularity, a tilt in politics seems unlikely. He still has his media work and may content himself with that.
Personally, I would like to see him take the year away from the camera. Spend the year with remote communities, listening and connecting with Aboriginal Australians. He has the opportunity to learn and grow as a person.
Grow a beard Ed and just listen to people.
Unlikely to see out the year as Collingwood President, and given his current popularity, a tilt in politics seems unlikely. He still has his media work and may content himself with that.
Personally, I would like to see him take the year away from the camera. Spend the year with remote communities, listening and connecting with Aboriginal Australians. He has the opportunity to learn and grow as a person.
Grow a beard Ed and just listen to people.
That's a question I have been asking myself too. I have been toying with a bit of a theory based on my own past experiences. I can think of occasions in the past where I may have been addressing an issue either in business or in my private life where I have completely distorted the perception of what I was trying to convey by inadvertently jumping to the closing argument without having detailed the defence. Of course that's a euphemism but aptly describes my meaning. I just think that there are times when we have discussed or analysed something in such detail that we forget that our audience has not necessarily been privy to that discussion or process and hence we can make a statement like Eddie did without ever having addressed the core of the issue.
That's about the only thing that I can think of that might explain what happened on Monday. I find it hard to believe that Eddie is actually as blind or ignorant as his opening statement portrayed him to be. Of course, that does not excuse it because that only indicates a lack of due care particularly when dealing with such an important and sensitive issue. Eddie has unfortunately been guilty too often of failing either in his preparation or in his presentation such that he brings himself (and by extension the club) into disrepute.
76woodenspooners
Brownlow Medallist
Brilliant post.
(And good food for thought, I’m guilty of same as well)
+ Ed (and the integrity committee and the board) are also guilty here of sitting on what was eventually proven to be a damning report for nearly six weeks. Everybody I knew the report had been commissioned and had been handed down. Ed and the board had ample opportunity to prepare.
It is an interesting thought but I think a lot of people make that same mistake.
I can't disagree that 6 weeks seems a long time but I suppose given everything else that goes on inside a club it's possibly fair to suggest that they wanted more time to prepare a significant and appropriate response. I can see how that might take longer than 6 weeks.
76woodenspooners
Brownlow Medallist
I don’t think the general flavour of the report should have been of any surprise to the board. They would / should have had fair warning from the report’s authors about what was coming.
I also don’t think much preparation would / should have been needed to release it publicly (* Note). They could have embraced the principles of transparency which is a good thing and the way things are usually done in this age. And it wouldn’t have been unreasonable to simply say “We’re sorry for the the actions of the past” (exactly as the club did in response to Robert Muir), and “Whilst we do in principle agree with the basic recommendations of the report, if we’re going to be serious about this we need to understand exactly what needs to be done in practice to be compliant with all the recommendations of the report” and “We intend to report to our members by <date a few months into the future> how we are compliant and will hold a public press conference the next day”.
* Note: Fair chance they would have had the club lawyers review the report to understand any legal jeopardy especially w.r.t Lumumba, and fair chance the lawyers would have said “don’t release it” - lawyers tend to be a very risk adverse bunch.
ZEV
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Release it? They should have been demanding a refund. Never in my life have I read a report that uses the Dennis Denuto general vibe of the way things feel as much as that shit did.
Scodog10
Brownlow Medallist
IMO, this is giving too much credit to the board. One of the key findings is that we tend to be more brand focussed and keeping it under wraps would have had more to do with that. My understanding is Lumumba had a copy early so a public release would have had little consequence on that front.
jmac70
On the porch
Which of the recommendations do you disagree with?
