redman4
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You've got to be kidding, liverpool smashed united twice this year and made them look very mediocre in the process
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AFLW 2024 - Round 10 - Chat, game threads, injury lists, team lineups and more.
El Clasico: Barcelona vs Real Madrid
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You've got to be kidding, liverpool smashed united twice this year and made them look very mediocre in the process
gaelictiogar said:
The adventures of Thierry Henry in the CL:
(I've left out Monaco and Juventus)
99-00 Arsenal: knocked out in the group stages by Barcelona and Fiorentina.
00-01 Arsenal: knocked out in the QF by Valencia
01-02 Arsenal: knocked out in the group stages by Leverkusen and Deportivo
02-03 Arsenal: knocked out in the group stages by Valencia and Ajax
03-04 Arsenal: knocked out in the QF by Chelsea
04-05 Arsenal: knocked out in the 1st knockout round by Bayern
05-06 Arsenal: lost final against Barcelona
06-07 Arsenal: knocked out in the 1st knockout round by PSV
07-08 Barcelona: semi final
08-09 Barcelona: semi final
Sooooo... Of the 3 times Henry has made it to semi's in his whole career, twice it was with Barcelona
Today Arsenal are one of the 5 best teams in Europe, but it took them years to get this far.
Quite ironically Henry has hardly ever played at the highest level. It's only since the last 2-3 seasons EPL is (clearly) Europe's best league. Before that it was very disputable, unclear and simply not true.
gaelictiogar said:
Backing your laughable claim by a useless stat is not making you look any better here. Everyone who's seen enough of us this season knows Messi's contribution has been miles above anyone else's. Messi's played behind the strikers in midfield as much as he has on the wing - can't say that about Henry.
- Dec 18, 2005
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The adventures of Thierry Henry in the CL:
(I've left out Monaco and Juventus)
99-00 Arsenal: knocked out in the group stages by Barcelona and Fiorentina.
00-01 Arsenal: knocked out in the QF by Valencia
01-02 Arsenal: knocked out in the group stages by Leverkusen and Deportivo
02-03 Arsenal: knocked out in the group stages by Valencia and Ajax
03-04 Arsenal: knocked out in the QF by Chelsea
04-05 Arsenal: knocked out in the 1st knockout round by Bayern
05-06 Arsenal: lost final against Barcelona
06-07 Arsenal: knocked out in the 1st knockout round by PSV
07-08 Barcelona: semi final
08-09 Barcelona: semi final
Sooooo... Of the 3 times Henry has made it to semi's in his whole career, twice it was with Barcelona
Today Arsenal are one of the 5 best teams in Europe, but it took them years to get this far.
Quite ironically Henry has hardly ever played at the highest level. It's only since the last 2-3 seasons EPL is (clearly) Europe's best league. Before that it was very disputable, unclear and simply not true.
Backing your laughable claim by a useless stat is not making you look any better here. Everyone who's seen enough of us this season knows Messi's contribution has been miles above anyone else's. Messi's played behind the strikers in midfield as much as he has on the wing - can't say that about Henry.
Kompany, I have one question for you.
Why?
The adventures of Thierry Henry in the CL:
(I've left out Monaco and Juventus)
99-00 Arsenal: knocked out in the group stages by Barcelona and Fiorentina.
00-01 Arsenal: knocked out in the QF by Valencia
01-02 Arsenal: knocked out in the group stages by Leverkusen and Deportivo
02-03 Arsenal: knocked out in the group stages by Valencia and Ajax
03-04 Arsenal: knocked out in the QF by Chelsea
04-05 Arsenal: knocked out in the 1st knockout round by Bayern
05-06 Arsenal: lost final against Barcelona
06-07 Arsenal: knocked out in the 1st knockout round by PSV
07-08 Barcelona: semi final
08-09 Barcelona: semi final
Sooooo... Of the 3 times Henry has made it to semi's in his whole career, twice it was with Barcelona
Today Arsenal are one of the 5 best teams in Europe, but it took them years to get this far.
Quite ironically Henry has hardly ever played at the highest level. It's only since the last 2-3 seasons EPL is (clearly) Europe's best league. Before that it was very disputable, unclear and simply not true.
Backing your laughable claim by a useless stat is not making you look any better here. Everyone who's seen enough of us this season knows Messi's contribution has been miles above anyone else's. Messi's played behind the strikers in midfield as much as he has on the wing - can't say that about Henry.
Go to soccernet. Check where players actually play as against where legend has it they play and you willl find messi every bit as forward and even more central than Henry more often than not. Messi plays closer to goal than Henry. This is an indisputable fact if we accept soccernets positioning.
Henry, often playing further from goal on average has more scoring interceptions from play (goals from play plus assists ) than Messi per minute onfield. I'm not damning Messi who is clearly a fine player but lets deal in facts if we are going to state facts.
For instance last night. Go to soccernet. Go to its report on the game. Go to match action and click average position.
We find Messi and Henray on average exactly the same distance from the goalline with Messi centre forward - ahead of Etoo!!! and everyone else and Henry further from goal at left wing. Henry has 19 league goals from play from the left wing.....but messi is younger and is flavour of the month so gets all the praise and attracts the unwarranted but myth making notions that he plays further away from goal which is smply untrue.
We find Messi and Henray on average exactly the same distance from the goalline with Messi centre forward - ahead of Etoo!!! and everyone else and Henry further from goal at left wing. Henry has 19 league goals from play from the left wing.....but messi is younger and is flavour of the month so gets all the praise and attracts the unwarranted but myth making notions that he plays further away from goal which is smply untrue.
Well you see it gives you access to facts which are usually better than supposition.
However those who prefer supposition to facts are welcome to continue supposing and assuming should they wish.
Did you get all that off soccernet?
- Dec 18, 2005
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I wonder if he's ever watched a game?
Probably not, because he judges teams/players on statistics. Due to the fact he loves anything to do with soccernet, I'm assuming he's Tommy Smyth's lovechild.
Well.. at least we know where he gets his 'talking shit' from.
Someone needs to shut both of them up.
Messi has to deal with 2-3 defenders around him everytime he gets the ball, whereas Henry usually has one-on-ones thus has more space, and tbh when you are playing for a club like Barca, if you dont utilise the space, you must be shite. Its the same thing what SAF is trying to do at Man Utd. He realises Ronaldo gets 2-3 defenders tracking him everytime he is on the ball, so he is trying to release Rooney on the left hand side to utilise the space and impact games (since really Nani, Giggs and Park can't) and so far he has done a wonderful job in his new role, he may have found his calling. Its also easier to make forward runs and score goals when the opposition is focused on your best player, well with Barca take your pick, so Henry would benefit.
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I have recently inherited Barca as a 2nd team as the missus is from there. Not a bad trade off too as I sign her up to be a North member. Good to finally follow a team that doesn't suck
It is quite easy to dismiss stats of course but I doubt if any coach does.
Excluding penalties Messi has 31 goals/assists in the league. Henry has 27. Given Messi's greater gametime the goal intervention per minute ratio is probably as near to level s makes no difference. Henry with marginally fewer shots on goal ( he does play further from goal so that is predictable ) had a greater percentage of shots on target.
It is easy to be dismissive of someone who doesn't buy into the accepted opinion but total shots, shots on goal, assists, goals from play etc all indicate negligible difference between the actual impact of either player. Coaches who are not starstruck fans of the new kid on the block but rather have to deal with reality know this. Hiddink knows this. Henry will be patrolled just as closely given that he represents an equally great threat in reality.
Allright allright, Henry has been our best player this season. What's wrong with that?
Hleb's been our 2nd best but Pep has tried to save him as much as possible, throughout the whole season actually, for him to be fit for Stamford Bridge. When you've only got 2 players who've proven they can do it in England, you need to be careful.
And this is where Hiddink reveals he is not a great coach and definitely unworthy of being the coach of a true great team. Hiddink clearly focused on Messi and Xavi at the Nou Camp, completely missing the point about who our most important player really is.
How this guy is still in the job is beyond me. It just shows you how easy you can get a job just because you're friends with someone rather than because of who you are
Hleb's been our 2nd best but Pep has tried to save him as much as possible, throughout the whole season actually, for him to be fit for Stamford Bridge. When you've only got 2 players who've proven they can do it in England, you need to be careful.
gaelictiogar said:
And this is where Hiddink reveals he is not a great coach and definitely unworthy of being the coach of a true great team. Hiddink clearly focused on Messi and Xavi at the Nou Camp, completely missing the point about who our most important player really is.
How this guy is still in the job is beyond me. It just shows you how easy you can get a job just because you're friends with someone rather than because of who you are
Allright allright, Henry has been our best player this season. What's wrong with that?
Hleb's been our 2nd best but Pep has tried to save him as much as possible, throughout the whole season actually, for him to be fit for Stamford Bridge. When you've only got 2 players who've proven they can do it in England, you need to be careful.
And this is where Hiddink reveals he is not a great coach and definitely unworthy of being the coach of a true great team. Hiddink clearly focused on Messi and Xavi at the Nou Camp, completely missing the point about who our most important player really is.
How this guy is still in the job is beyond me. It just shows you how easy you can get a job just because you're friends with someone rather than because of who you are
I compare Henry with Messi and reveal stats backing my point....more shots on goal though playing further from goal for instance. You compare henry with Hleb !!!
There is a difference between a valid statistically based comparison and a sarcastic piece of nonsense.
Henry is multiple PFA and FWA Player of the year, multiple French POTY, Multiple European Golden Boot, has been top 2 in World player of the Year twice, top two in Ballon d'or, a World Champion, A European Nations champion, Arsenal all time record scorer, All time assists record holder in Premiership,etc etc etc etc. Hleb have any of those?
Why you seek to belittle a stellar talent who is after a decade at the top and a period of injury and indifferent form now once again performing as threateningly as this years likely Ballon d'or is beyond me but we all have our opinions.
Need to take out Soccernet. No stats = No Gaelictiogar
Why? Don't you like debate?
Why not object to France and Arsenal's all time record scorer, The EPL all time record assist maker, being compared to a relative journeyman like Hleb? Maybe he's not 21 and he flavour of the month.
I will stop since I'm not interested enough to keep going and building a shrine to Messi interests you lot more than debating relative merits of players but I'll tell you this mate if Barca do win in London ( unlikely but possible given Chelsea are a class apart from anything they have yet met and actually) they will probably have Henry to thank for it.
We'll see.
Believe it or not mate I've actually seen Diego Maradona live back in the day. I'm no longer really interested and follow no team but when in Europe many years ago I saw lots of stars. Henry is the only one I've seen live who merits comparison with maradona....not as good obviously but a fabulous artist over many years possibly disdained by Barcafans because he isn't home grown.
I'll leave you all to it boys.
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Did you miss the massive dose of sarcasm in Kompanys post or are you that senile?
Seriously some things in life are so clear cut they arnt worth debating. Debating Messi vs Henry right now is like debating Freo vs Geelong in some aspects. The answers so obvious you just dont bother
Ho ho, I did not compare Hleb to Henry. I said Hleb was our 2nd best player, which is behind Henry. The stats and awards don't lie.
gaelictiogar said:
This is just weak from you. I reply to one of your posts and while I was thinking completely differently at first, I have had no problem in admitting I was wrong and then you react like this...
I have no problem in admitting that I've never been that familiar with stats. Because of that it is no more than perfectly understandable that I got under the impression that Messi was a better player, and in fact our best player.
Seeing those stats has been an eye-opener, I must say. Isn't it normal that somebody who watches Messi and Barcelona games forgets about his exact positioning in relation to the goalline, his number of passes etc.. while Messi does all his tricks and stepovers he's so well known for? And he also wins us many free kicks, his diving skills are so much better than Henry's. I don't think the stats show that, do they?
surely gaelictiogar is VB=God??
long time no see!
Would be funny if it was.
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