Coach Fages and the coaching group

[Kwickhatch]

What happened between these two last year, don’t remember anything occurring there?

Yea I don't remember anything either. But I was homeless so I had other stuff going on.

Also, how does the boys cheating tie into a rift between hippy and Rayner?
I have seen suggestions Rayner cheated because his gf isn't in any insta stories anymore

 

[Squizz89]

I have heard absolutely none of this. What’s actually happened?

Probably sensationalises it a bit but here. Let’s see where this goes I guess.

 

[buttermuffs]

I have heard absolutely none of this. What’s actually happened?

I have caught up now. I’m going to be a bit rude and say they really need to grow the **** up and own up to their own shitty behaviour. Glad their partners found out even if it was by mistake. Can’t believe these are grown men beefing with each other because they were caught doing shitty things.

 

[SpecialBruce]

I have caught up now. I’m going to be a bit rude and say they really need to grow the * up and own up to their own shitty behaviour. Glad their partners found out even if it was by mistake. Can’t believe these are grown men beefing with each other because they were caught doing shitty things.

if this is true, on that reasoning alone, id actually get rid of the trouble makers at the end of the season.

Futhermore if this isn't solved quick there is no way we are winning the flag this year.

 

[Scubaveg]

We had the Rayner/Daniher thing last year.

Now the Rayner/Hipwood ?

Common denominator ?

These things never used to see the light of day. Lots of pressure on players and clubs these days with SM and the media being what it is. So you try not to self inflict.

Rayner Daniher thing?


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[martinson]

Rayner Daniher thing?


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I presume too much.

It's over.

We have a couple of wise heads in Fagan and Matthews who won't tolerate anyone who doesn't put the team first.

But maybe a bit of work to do.

 

[Squizz89]

And here we go. Far out this group needs a win. This type of shit only sees the light of day when teams aren’t going well.

https://www.couriermail.com.au/sport/afl/brisbane-lions-crisis-meeting-after-furious-partners-see-wild-antics-on-whatsapp-group/news-story/bb0a6f639a03a00cab74d97ce5c93cdd

Brisbane Lions crisis meeting after furious partners see wild antics on WhatsApp group​

Brisbane Lions have denied a split in their playing ranks despite holding a crisis meeting as the club deals with ongoing fallout from an end-of-season Las Vegas trip.

Brisbane Lions players have split from their partners and the club has held a crisis meeting over an end of season trip to Vegas.
The winless Lions called the meeting of their leaders late on Good Friday to discuss revelations that rifts occurred on that holiday to the United States.

The Herald Sun understands that one of the members of the travelling party accidentally uploaded a WhatsApp group chat to iCloud on his Apple Phone.

That person’s partner accessed the group chat back home in Australia and read messages that detailed what was happening in the US.

Those messages were then shared with other partners, who were furious at some of the wild antics being discussed in the group chat.

The travelling party of about 10 was mostly players and their US trip finished in Vegas.

Lions chief executive Greg Swann said he did not know if the WhatsApp group chat used in the US had been accidentally uploaded to iCloud and accessed back home.

But Swann emphatically shot down suggestions that the November trip was hampering the club on the field.

“If the question is, ‘Is there a split in a group?’ Well, no there isn’t,” Swann told the Herald Sun.

“It’s just bulls***. There’s no split in the group. This was in November, by the way. It’s not the reason we’re going no good.

“We’re not horrible, by the way. It’s just that a few of our good blokes are out of form.

“We asked all the leaders again today and they said, ‘No, there’s nothing in it at all’ in terms of a split in the group.”

The Lions are co-captained by Lachie Neale

9

Lachie Neale

Age

31

Ht

177cm

Wt

84kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

27.0

5star

K

11.5

4star

HB

15.5

5star

M

4.0

4star

T

3.7

5star

CL

5.9

5star

D

28.3

5star

K

13.9

5star

HB

14.4

5star

M

4.6

4star

T

4.0

5star

CL

5.9

5star

D

12.0

3star

K

4.6

2star

HB

7.4

5star

M

2.0

3star

T

1.0

3star

CL

0.4

3star

and Harris Andrews

31

Harris Andrews

Age

28

Ht

200cm

Wt

98kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.8

3star

K

7.4

3star

HB

5.4

4star

M

5.6

5star

T

1.6

4star

MG

151.7

2star

D

17.0

4star

K

9.0

4star

HB

8.0

4star

M

4.0

4star

T

2.0

3star

D

9.8

3star

K

5.0

2star

HB

4.8

4star

M

3.4

4star

T

1.6

4star

MG

94.0

2star

. A further seven players are in the club’s leadership group.

Senior officials at the Lions started fielding calls about the US trip during last week’s bye.

 

[SpecialBruce]

At least it's out early and should hopefully be rectified sooner, rather than later

 

[Chucky_23]

Sound like something that comes up regularly at my office tbh. Guys go on trips and have a bit of fun but it spills out at home every once in while. No big deal, over in a week or two

 

[Elixuh]

I can only imagine how degenerate a group chat of football players is

Hopefully we have some dirt on the nepo baby McClure, bevvo style.

 

[buttermuffs]

Beatings will continue until moral improves.

 

[SizeMatters]

Outside of the absolutely shit and deplorable behaviour (which is rampant in sports circles) I could speculate that certain players who got caught out might have had a go at the partner of the player who accidently uploaded to the cloud for "snitching". Can imagine the shit that could come from that... no way I'd let someone else talk shit to and about my partner after they ****ed up! The WAGS are close! closer than the blokes are to each other!

 

[SizeMatters]

There are leaders who are great at taking a small team and turning them into a company.
There are leaders who are great at taking a small company and making it into a large one.
There are leaders who are great at taking a large company and turning it into a conglomorate.

It is exceptionally rare that is it the same person who can take the journey all the way from 'entreupener with an idea' through to fortune 500 CEO.

Fagan has done a wonderful job of building a culture of inclusiveness and loyalty and the brand from a joke to a force to be reckoned with ... I am not so sure he has the skillset to build in the professionalism, team play and killer instinct to take that final step and that is no rap on the bloke as without him where would we be today (actually we would all be briztoon and already focussed on next years draft period!)

flipping well said. Just wish more posters see the logic and not the emotional side of 'business'. It's hard to have any sort of discussion when the same "we've won so many games with Fagan" posts get posted back at you. Yeah winning games is good and not one poster has ever said otherwise, but we are here to win Premierships. It's turning the large company into the conglomerate that we are stuck at - I can't see us taking the next step with current coaching set up. We need to bring in the fresh IP, and the new ideas. Be AGILE for once Lions!

 

[Cubs2Lions]

I saw this on the Lions Supporter FB group, absolutely no idea the genesis of the text


View attachment 1943483

Starcevich really going down the Zorko route of dating players sisters nowadays

 

[lioninthesand]

Gunston was on that trip, asks for a trade a week later

 

[Morbidly_Obese]

Probably sensationalises it a bit but here. Let’s see where this goes I guess.

Hookers or did someone drop $300k on the roulette table?

 

[lionsrules]

Gunston was on that trip, asks for a trade a week later

Nah he announced pretty much as they left for the trip.

 

[mpal6]

I didn't like Fagan's comment last night "they're the players we have".
Does two things shifts blame from coaches to playing group and says to the other younger players not getting a run he doesn't see them as a genuine option.


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I like GWS approach here way better. Harvey thomas is 18, doesn't have the physique or maturity yet but they've blooded him and he's getting first hand experience on what it takes to hold a spot in a winning team. We are a bit poor here even in the last 5 years, unless you walk in at a elite standard like Ashcroft.

 

[Section 5]

I like GWS approach here way better. Harvey thomas is 18, doesn't have the physique or maturity yet but they've blooded him and he's getting first hand experience on what it takes to hold a spot in a winning team. We are a bit poor here even in the last 5 years, unless you walk in at a elite standard like Ashcroft.

Agree we have no reason not to be able to play someone new in our team. Especially against North this week.
That player does not have to be ready for a full AFL game fitness wise.
But he has to show he has the attributes to play at AFL level.
What better time to blood a new player than in a top 4 team (well Lions last year anyhow).

Also, young players should never be the sub in my opinion.
Play them and sub them off is a far better option.
Playing sub would be hard and an experienced player would handle it better.

Fagan is right in some ways we are stuck with the players we have after injuries to Coleman, McKenna, now Doedee and still Ashcroft.

Only 2 debut players in the VFL have shown AFL attributes in both VFL games.
Logan Morris and Bruce Reville and the club won't even elevate Reville to give him extra incentive to make the starting 22.
The mid season draft is just that midseason. Ours may be over if we don't start winning some games before then.
Also, i think our pick would be down the list a fair bit anyhow.
Upgrade Reville or even Brain now. We will still have one maybe two for the midseason draft.
Hell, we can even upgrade one placing Carter Michael on the LTI list without using Doedee or Coleman.

 

[stayc25]

Starcevich really going down the Zorko route of dating players sisters nowadays

Except Zorko didn’t date a players sister.
Froggy Lester married Zorkos sister Em……….

 

[martinson]

Agree we have no reason not to be able to play someone new in our team. Especially against North this week.
That player does not have to be ready for a full AFL game fitness wise.
But he has to show he has the attributes to play at AFL level.
What better time to blood a new player than in a top 4 team (well Lions last year anyhow).

Also, young players should never be the sub in my opinion.
Play them and sub them off is a far better option.
Playing sub would be hard and an experienced player would handle it better.

Fagan is right in some ways we are stuck with the players we have after injuries to Coleman, McKenna, now Doedee and still Ashcroft.

Only 2 debut players in the VFL have shown AFL attributes in both VFL games.
Logan Morris and Bruce Reville and the club won't even elevate Reville to give him extra incentive to make the starting 22.
The mid season draft is just that midseason. Ours may be over if we don't start winning some games before then.
Also, i think our pick would be down the list a fair bit anyhow.
Upgrade Reville or even Brain now. We will still have one maybe two for the midseason draft.
Hell, we can even upgrade one placing Carter Michael on the LTI list without using Doedee or Coleman.

Agree with that. We've been poor at blooding players. The counter argument is that the ones we have in the 2's aren't good enough. Well sooner or later you get a bad run with injuries and they need to be . This is where we're at now.

We got deluded with the success of Hodge and wasted time and player development with Birchall and Gunston. There is only one Hodge.

Fages is of a mindset ,and he's said this publicly , that what we have works so why would you change anyone or anything around There's truth in that whilst you're going well but we didn't get a flag out of it , other teams are catching up in my view and we need to get more proactive in finding alternative options.

 

[Section 5]

Agree with that. We've been poor at blooding players. The counter argument is that the ones we have in the 2's aren't good enough. Well sooner or later you get a bad run with injuries and they need to be . This is where we're at now.

We got deluded with the success of Hodge and wasted time and player development with Birchall and Gunston. There is only one Hodge.

Fages is of a mindset ,and he's said this publicly , that what we have works so why would you change anyone or anything around There's truth in that whilst you're going well but we didn't get a flag out of it , other teams are catching up in my view and we need to get more proactive in finding alternative options.

Fagan has over the years fallen back to the usual depth guys that do a reasonable job.
Answerth, Fort, Joyce, Madden, Prior, Sharp, Tunstill and Robertson
Tunstill and Robertson may still make a best 22 at some stage but i am not very confident of that happening.

I think our biggest mistake in the past 3 years is not finding a good player in the VFL ranks to draft.
I would rather that than our last pick in the draft. Even a pick in the late 30's onwards if the right player presents.
It may take a few tries, but you should be able to find a suitable player for a needs position.

 

[martinson]

Fagan has over the years fallen back to the usual depth guys that do a reasonable job.
Answerth, Fort, Joyce, Madden, Prior, Sharp, Tunstill and Robertson
Tunstill and Robertson may still make a best 22 at some stage but i am not very confident of that happening.

I think our biggest mistake in the past 3 years is not finding a good player in the VFL ranks to draft.
I would rather that than our last pick in the draft. Even a pick in the late 30's onwards if the right player presents.
It may take a few tries, but you should be able to find a suitable player for a needs position.

Yes. Other clubs have done this successfully.

 

[SizeMatters]

Fagan biggest issue is that he doesn't trust his young players to do meaningful roles in the senior side... impacting their development. He just sees anyone outside of his 'ideal' best 16 or so as role players. Unless you are a top 10 pick you may as well just accept you'll only ever be a role player in Fagan's eyes. No meaningful minutes in the firsts and if you do you're just playing a bit part role.
Sure it's great for first year or second year players but doing this over many years isn't ideal. Give them more ownership even if for a few games a year against shit clubs like North or Weagles. It's how you get the likes of Robertson, Tunstill, Prior, Answerth just stagnating and not improving.

I've always posted that I like Fagan as a person manager but I don't like him as a coach.

 

[buttermuffs]

Fagan biggest issue is that he doesn't trust his young players to do meaningful roles in the senior side... impacting their development. He just sees anyone outside of his 'ideal' best 16 or so as role players. Unless you are a top 10 pick you may as well just accept you'll only ever be a role player in Fagan's eyes. No meaningful minutes in the firsts and if you do you're just playing a bit part role.
Sure it's great for first year or second year players but doing this over many years isn't ideal. Give them more ownership even if for a few games a year against s**t clubs like North or Weagles. It's how you get the likes of Robertson, Tunstill, Prior, Answerth just stagnating and not improving.

I've always posted that I like Fagan as a person manager but I don't like him as a coach.

I don’t think this is necessarily true.

Kiddy Coleman started as a fringe guy and by the end of last season to this year he has 100% been the focal point of our attack out back.

Payne was a fringe player as well and by round six last year he was tasked to play on the top key forwards and was barely losing a one on one.

Wilmot has slotted in beautifully and made great impact. He and Coleman kicked out Rich.

Other young guys like Starcevich and Bailey used to be outside the core group but worked their way into it.

Answerth actually had a decent place in the side for a year but his disposal saw him lose his place to the likes of Coleman when he switched to halfback.

Robertson has had a lot of opportunities and seemed to have a spot after finals in 2022 but then we got Dunkley and Ashcroft and he lost it again.

Fletcher, like Wilmot, came in and outplayed the likes of Sharp and Prior to get the wing/halfback spot in the side.

Lohmann in his games have never seemed to outplay Charlie, Linc, Rayner and Bailey and just doesn’t seem to have the scoreboard impact.

Tunstill just seems panicked whenever I see him play in the seniors if I’m honest.

Oscar started out as a fringe player and worked his way into being first ruck.

I do think Fagan is reluctant to drop his preferred players, but I also think that those players are going to outplay their potential replacements in 75% of games played.