Gynecomastia/Man boobs

[Tsongkie]

It's got nothing to do with that. If you have breast tissue, you have breast tissue. It doesn't matter if you put on 15 kilograms to 'even it out,' go to 5% body fat to get rid of the fatty parts, stand certain ways... the only fix is being of the 'I don't care' or 'what's gynecomastia?' school or getting it fixed.

Gyno is a massive issue in society now and it's getting worse. Look at the amount of men in their late 20s with it. Every summer I notice it more and more.

Society is as sedentary now than it has ever been. A big culprit (indeed there are many contributing factors) for this is too much computer time at our workstations at work, at home and screen time on our phones. As a practicing Physiotherapist and one who performs workstation assessments every week I see these deleterious effects in people every day.

As a treater who has worked with gyno clients in the past, many present with the posture described above (a disproportionately high number in fact). And as you say, many are late 20's white collar workers with 7.5 hours desk time each day, with shocking resting posture. Shit-house posture can exacerbate gyno presentation, and it does regularly.

By the OP's own admission, he self-reported he's been hitting the chest rather hard (think pec minor).

Once we correct their resting shoulder girdle position, their gyno is less apparent and less of a concern. For some this is more applicable than for others. Indeed, for a few it 100% diet and for others this approach 100% resolves their gyno concerns by flattening and broadening their chest with less shoulder malpositioning. Certainly not a cookie cutter approach to be used by all, but worth considering nevertheless. Statins don't cure high cholesterol and it's associated heart disease risks, but their still an effective treatment to help suffers manage it. Same for this approach and gyno.

You're right to say there are multiple contributing factors, and as such any solution will also be multi-factorial (education on exercise and diet, etc).

Just my two cents.

 

[Silent Alarm]

Society is as sedentary now than it has ever been. A big culprit (indeed there are many contributing factors) for this is too much computer time at our workstations at work, at home and screen time on our phones. As a practicing Physiotherapist and one who performs workstation assessments every week I see these deleterious effects in people every day.

As a treater who has worked with gyno clients in the past, many present with the posture described above (a disproportionately high number in fact). And as you say, many are late 20's white collar workers with 7.5 hours desk time each day, with shocking resting posture. Shit-house posture can exacerbate gyno presentation, and it does regularly.

By the OP's own admission, he self-reported he's been hitting the chest rather hard (think pec minor).

Once we correct their resting shoulder girdle position, their gyno is less apparent and less of a concern. For some this is more applicable than for others. Indeed, for a few it 100% diet and for others this approach 100% resolves their gyno concerns by flattening and broadening their chest with less shoulder malpositioning. Certainly not a cookie cutter approach to be used by all, but worth considering nevertheless. Statins don't cure high cholesterol and it's associated heart disease risks, but their still an effective treatment to help suffers manage it. Same for this approach and gyno.

You're right to say there are multiple contributing factors, and as such any solution will also be multi-factorial (education on exercise and diet, etc).

Just my two cents.

Anyone with genuine gynecomastia is not going to have it solved, even a bit, by posture. That's kind of an offensive thing to say. People with it regularly try all sorts of things, simply because surgery is so expensive, and none of it can actually do anything. It's not just seeing them down the beach when you look down or putting off sex with a new girl, it's the everyday. Wearing two t-shirts, liking winter for the jackets, hating the humid weather because it opens and stretches and softens your skin...

Gynecomastia is just a byproduct of this ****ed up world we live in and the pawn status many of us have. We are no longer what we should be.

Lower testosterone, higher oestrogen is a notable notable problem. Weight gain, the shrinking of the male hand, teste and penis decreasing, less muscle, gynecomastia, erectile dysfunction, less semen. We're seeing these things in just about every animal.

It's a result of what we're breathing, the inescapable chemicals in just about everything we eat, it's the way sugar and carbs are loaded into everything, that we have less money and have to eat cheaper stuff which is worse for us, increasing stress levels, less time for exercise, reliance on cars.

Men can fix some of these things but so much of it is part of our everyday existence. Sometimes you can't get away from it.

If you were a cynical prick and wanted to rake in, get into stuff like gynecomastia removal. About 10k, though $3,000 is generally for anaesthetist costs. About four hours work. This shit is going to effect more and more middle class men.

This is the changing face, or chest, of the modern man.

 

[Tsongkie]

No, the laying down of subcutaneous body fat is the cause. Genetics determine where it lays first and is taken off last.

Whether the cause of the excess caloric intake is booze or food is moot.

Quite recent data shows that the body mobilizes (self selects or triages) 'high risk' fat first. From memory, this particular study looked at adipose markers from the liver and heart, then fat tissue around organs, then subcutaneous fat tissue in other sites of the body. If anyone is interested, I can certainly try to source the article.

What the paper found was that in all study individuals, the highest reduction in fat was found in the internal (markers and biopsies) heart and liver markers, then visceral fat tissue (outside of organ) and then the subcutaneous tissue.

The contention of the paper was that the body naturally self-triages sites for fat mobilization based on risk.

The implications for this in terms of weight loss is important (if the results can be replicated), because the body will mobilize the lowest risk fat last, which it is fair to say is subcutaneous fat based on this research. Where gyno fat sits on this spectrum is yet to be determined.

 

[Tsongkie]

Anyone with genuine gynecomastia is not going to have it solved, even a bit, by posture. That's kind of an offensive thing to say. People with it regularly try all sorts of things, simply because surgery is so expensive, and none of it can actually do anything. It's not just seeing them down the beach when you look down or putting off sex with a new girl, it's the everyday. Wearing two t-shirts, liking winter for the jackets, hating the humid weather because it opens and stretches and softens your skin...

Gynecomastia is just a byproduct of this ****** up world we live in and the pawn status many of us have. We are no longer what we should be.

Lower testosterone, higher oestrogen is a notable notable problem. Weight gain, the shrinking of the male hand, teste and penis decreasing, less muscle, gynecomastia, erectile dysfunction, less semen. We're seeing these things in just about every animal.

It's a result of what we're breathing, the inescapable chemicals in just about everything we eat, it's the way sugar and carbs are loaded into everything, that we have less money and have to eat cheaper stuff which is worse for us, increasing stress levels, less time for exercise, reliance on cars.

Men can fix some of these things but so much of it is part of our everyday existence. Sometimes you can't get away from it.

If you were a cynical prick and wanted to rake in, get into stuff like gynecomastia removal. About 10k, though $3,000 is generally for anaesthetist costs. About four hours work. This shit is going to effect more and more middle class men.

This is the changing face, or chest, of the modern man.

I guess we will politely have to agree to disagree.

My clinical experience is that this approach works well with the right person and to say it is insulting to these clients is just plain untrue. The feedback I have received from these clients is all but positive.

From my experience, shitty posture exacerbates gyno presentation, going down this path of exercise path won't make it worse but as noted above, in very many cases makes it better. There are also innumerable other health benefits to be derived from a program like this besides aesthetic improvements to the gyno presentation.

 

[Silent Alarm]

I guess we will politely have to agree to disagree.

My clinical experience is that this approach works well with the right person and to say it is insulting to these clients is just plain untrue. The feedback I have received from these clients is all but positive.

From my experience, shitty posture exacerbates gyno presentation, going down this path of exercise path won't make it worse but as noted above, in very many cases makes it better. There are also innumerable other health benefits to be derived from a program like this besides aesthetic improvements to the gyno presentation.

What is your background?

It is breast tissue. It doesn't matter how many push-ups or chest inclines you do, it'll exist.

The people who can feel better when in different positions probably have mild gynecomastia or a certain body type. Or simply don't care that much.

 

[Aeglos]

Anyone who thinks this could have been rectified by effectively telling someone to pull their shoulders back has rocks in their head
https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/nejmicm1209166

 

[Tsongkie]

It doesn't matter how many push-ups or chest inclines you do, it'll exist.

These are the last things anyone with gyno (mild, severe or otherwise) should be doing.

The results i've delivered for gyno (mild to moderate) clients are profound. As per the image in the article posted, that is indeed a severe case and as noted above, for some this is more applicable than for others. Interestingly though, that gentleman's shoulders are forward, internally rotated and likely protracted - which precisely echoes my comments above. Nevertheless, no amount of correction in his case would likely confer a meaningful change given the severity of the gyno.

Gyno clients report to me their number concern is loss of confidence associated with over-development of their chest (of course), with subsequent apprehension and anxiety about wearing certain shirts, etc. and always going topless. The impact on one's self-esteem can be immense, that much is unquestionable. For the right candidate (certainly not severe cases as demonstrated in that article), this approach in my experience, can yield improvements in client's shoulder-girdle position, with a demonstrable change in posture and meaningful change in self-esteem and confidence.

I don't care who you are - that's a positive outcome.

 

[Aeglos]

These are the last things anyone with gyno (mild, severe or otherwise) should be doing.

The results i've delivered for gyno (mild to moderate) clients are profound. As per the image in the article posted, that is indeed a severe case and as noted above, for some this is more applicable than for others. Interestingly though, that gentleman's shoulders are forward, internally rotated and likely protracted - which precisely echoes my comments above. Nevertheless, no amount of correction in his case would likely confer a meaningful change given the severity of the gyno.

Gyno clients report to me their number concern is loss of confidence associated with over-development of their chest (of course), with subsequent apprehension and anxiety about wearing certain shirts, etc. and always going topless. The impact on one's self-esteem can be immense, that much is unquestionable. For the right candidate (certainly not severe cases as demonstrated in that article), this approach in my experience, can yield improvements in client's shoulder-girdle position, with a demonstrable change in posture and meaningful change in self-esteem and confidence.

I don't care who you are - that's a positive outcome.

To be perfectly blunt I don’t think anyone you’ve successfully treated as a physio(?) has had true Gynecomastia.

 

[Tsongkie]

To be perfectly blunt I don’t think anyone you’ve successfully treated as a physio(?) has had true Gynecomastia.

Some referrals have been for gynecomastia. I think it's fair to say certainly not a severe case.

 

[Silent Alarm]

Telling someone who is self-conscious of their chest to push it out? Caaarn.

 

[Kompany]

For those who want to limit their exposure to estrogenics, there's this book called Estrogeneration by dr Anthony Jay. He has 3 lists (gold, silver or bronze, depending on how hard you want to go) of things best to avoid: https://www.ajconsultingcompany.com/plans.html

In his book, he explains everything. I got it on audible and would definitely recommend it.

 

[juss]

Update: years on I still have the issue. Just today I went for a walk, saw my reflection in a car window and saw my chest bounce up and down. Makes me feel very self conscious, but other times I forget and move on. What I wear is a big factor, taking my shirt off his a horrible experience though.

Not sure if it's a combination of lack of muscle, excess fatty tissue, postural issues (I certainly have bad posture m and have rounded shoulders) or likely a combination of all of those. I'm not fat, so losing weight isn't the option, but fatty tissue is a different story.

One day I would consider surgery, but not at the cost to me right now, nor the effort of recovery, bigger problems at the moment.

 

[SHAKESPEARE]

i have had this problem since i was a kid. I have never lost enough weight to see what happens

I always wear black and never take my T-Shirt off. Haven't swam in public since i was about 10

 

[Gameova_]

I have this. Currently at 93kg mainly fat. Let's see if I still have at 85kg. It's ugly

 

[Big Cox 88]

 

[Aeglos]

View attachment 795175

Although I still make fun of guys who eat soy, I thought that whole “you’ll become a woman” thing was an old wives tale?

 

[John Who]

Update: years on I still have the issue. Just today I went for a walk, saw my reflection in a car window and saw my chest bounce up and down. Makes me feel very self conscious, but other times I forget and move on. What I wear is a big factor, taking my shirt off his a horrible experience though.

Not sure if it's a combination of lack of muscle, excess fatty tissue, postural issues (I certainly have bad posture m and have rounded shoulders) or likely a combination of all of those. I'm not fat, so losing weight isn't the option, but fatty tissue is a different story.

One day I would consider surgery, but not at the cost to me right now, nor the effort of recovery, bigger problems at the moment.

Did you end up doing a thorough checkup with the GP? There are many causes of gynecomastia. Yours may well be due to genetics, but if another cause is an issue, it may still be helped if such a cause is treated.

 

[Mofra]

Bro-science suggests arimistane can help as an estrogen blocker. Have never tried it personally so can't vouch for its effectiveness.

 

[juss]

Did you end up doing a thorough checkup with the GP? There are many causes of gynecomastia. Yours may well be due to genetics, but if another cause is an issue, it may still be helped if such a cause is treated.

I saw an endocrinologist for another issue and asked, he said I could do an an ultrasound to check if it's just fatty tissue or breast tissue which would indicate a potential hormonal vs physical cause. I had other things though so didn't get the ultrasound at that time but next time I see him I may get the referral.

He didn't mention any blood tests but I might ask him next time if checking my estrogen levels is an option. My testosterone levels are normal range, but on the lower end of the normal range.

 

[PoppedCorn]

Original post says 12 to 14% body fat, no visable abs and man boobs

Something def not right there

 

[John Who]

I saw an endocrinologist for another issue and asked, he said I could do an an ultrasound to check if it's just fatty tissue or breast tissue which would indicate a potential hormonal vs physical cause. I had other things though so didn't get the ultrasound at that time but next time I see him I may get the referral.

He didn't mention any blood tests but I might ask him next time if checking my estrogen levels is an option. My testosterone levels are normal range, but on the lower end of the normal range.

If you’re seeing an endocrinologist, then there are at least 2 things to consider:
- is the gymecomastia linked with your endocrine issue?
- could the gynecomastia be caused by the medication(s) you’re taking?

Also, you don’t need to wait for your next appointment with the endocrinologist. Just book an appointment with your GP to ask for a further work up.