Haileybury:Cheating or is it fair play?

[Kangas4Life]

I know that there are certain haileybury supporters who are members on this site so i know what your opinions will be but im interested in asking people who know about the situation that haileybury has put themselves in... not only to football but for tennis, basketball and swimming as well...
I think it is an absolute disgrace that the APS let them do this... How would they like it if carey went down to the northern knights and got the best dozen players from there or if st. kevins went down to the eastern rangers and got the best dozen from there, put them on scholarships and bought themselves a prermiership... What are people's opinions on this very talked about situation in schoolboy football? Is it a problem that needs to be solved?

 

[bgs05]

yeh i think its wrong, but if u beat them it would feel pretty good.

 

[mudgeathon]

Haven't or aren't the APS having/had a meeting on this and decided/are deciding that this is the last year that sports scholarships will be given out?

 

[Esham]

not only to football but for tennis, basketball and swimming as well...

heard ppl say that before, and i was told by a mate who goes there, that that is garbage..basketball - 1 person was on scholarship from the whole team last year, and 1 was added this year, and they have won it the last ..3 years?? 4 years ?? around that number. and tennis, not entirely sure how many are on scholarship for tennis, but with swimming (such a LARGE group) ive heard there are some divers and few swimmers but not many. just what ive been told.
but with the football issue, i dont think its right to give out excessive amount of scholarships like they do, but i would not call it cheating. when they did it it wasnt "against the rules". other schools can give out as much as they do if they wish to. but i feel sorry for the guys who are good footballers (best players of 2nds im talking about) who would deserve a spot in the 1's atleast when they are in yr12 but miss out because 3/4's of the team is on scholarship. nevertheless, having watched them played on a couple occasions this year, its simply awesome watching them.

 

[dirtycat23]

wel if skevis went to eastern and if carey went to northern night then it would be like tac cup awesome ******** higher standard of foooty

 

[Allen's Blues]

cheats

 

[m.diddy]

tennis, not entirely sure how many are on scholarship for tennis.

Trust me mate we played them for the last 2 years in premierships and I know they have at least 4-5 on scholarships. But with tennis when you have 1-2 it gives you a huge advantage which doesn't just affect the top two seeds but it means the 3rd of 4th player from the opposition is actually playing haileybury's number 1 player, which is a little unfair to those people.

 

[tigers2005]

Trust me mate we played them for the last 2 years in premierships and I know they have at least 4-5 on scholarships. But with tennis when you have 1-2 it gives you a huge advantage which doesn't just affect the top two seeds but it means the 3rd of 4th player from the opposition is actually playing haileybury's number 1 player, which is a little unfair to those people.

It just plain wrong and a discrace to the APS for letting them do it.

 

[monoccular]

There was an agreement not to do it but they continue anyway.

 

[oldfart]

There was an agreement not to do it but they continue anyway.

This is the deal:

Elsternwick Campus Newsletter - Issue 7 - Mar 18 2005 In This Issue
College Editorial

New Guidelines for Sporting Scholarships from the APS Heads Association

Over the last year I have been asked on a number of occasions about Wesley’s policy of not awarding sports scholarships per se. The APS Heads group has deliberated at length about the issue and recently a new set of guidelines was agreed. It is now recognised that schools may offer scholarships where sport is an element of the selection criteria.

Historically, sport has played a significant part in the programs offered by Australian schools, particularly independent schools and it is recognised that well-managed sports programs promote health and fitness and inculcate values of team work and fair play.

The Heads of APS schools wish to ensure that the enjoyment, participation and sportsmanship which have been the hallmarks of the APS competition over many years are maintained.

The guidelines are:

1. No student will be awarded a scholarship unless the Head believes that the student will gain a broad range of outcomes during his or her schooling.

2. Recipients of such scholarships will be held to the same standards of behaviour and expectation as other students and should actively contribute to the life of the school beyond their sporting expertise.

3. It is neither fair nor appropriate for schools to offer scholarships at senior levels for the purpose of winning premierships or gaining dominance in particular sports.

4. Neither schools nor the representatives or associates of those schools will approach students or their parents with the purpose of offering scholarships or promoting scholarship applications based on sporting prowess.

The APS schools are Brighton Grammar School, Carey Grammar School, Caulfield Grammar School, The Geelong College, Geelong Grammar School, Haileybury College, Melbourne Grammar School, St Kevin’s College, Scotch College, Wesley College, Xavier College.

Helen Drennen, Principal

 

[aker_rulz1]

tend to agree with what ur saying but Haileybury havent done anything illegal or unfair to every other school, its just haileyburys fees and rescources have allowed it to buy extra scholarships on its budget, i go to Mentone grammar and no 1 person that has left there to go to Haileybury which was annoying, but still not illegal or unfair cause every1 else can do it to.

 

[~GURU~]

Trust me mate we played them for the last 2 years in premierships and I know they have at least 4-5 on scholarships. But with tennis when you have 1-2 it gives you a huge advantage which doesn't just affect the top two seeds but it means the 3rd of 4th player from the opposition is actually playing haileybury's number 1 player, which is a little unfair to those people.

you are an absolute joke milne, of the tennis team that has won the premiership the last 4 years , there has been only 1 max 2 but we still win. get ur facts riite before you open ur big mouth !!!

 

[CAPPERisGOD]

Haileybury have givin out an absolute **** load of footy scolarships right, well look at schools like Caulfield, they have pritty much bought their whole Athletics team, winning year after year after year...

Look at another school like Scotch, puting thousands of dollars into Rowing, much more than any other school, and then they walk away with a rowing premiership, winning last year, this year and who knows how many more years they will win.

As soon as Haileybury get scolarships for a sport and win ONE (ONLY ONE) premiership so fare.. everyone calls them cheats and bags them, if every school did this, the standards would be heaps good, and the footy would be awesome to whatch. insteed they dont, and Haileybury beat teams like Wesley 202 - 14, haha.

But i supose they did give out a bit to many, and should tone it down a tad.

 

[m.diddy]

you are an absolute joke milne, of the tennis team that has won the premiership the last 4 years , there has been only 1 max 2 but we still win. get ur facts riite before you open ur big mouth !!!

Don't disgrace yourself mate. It was common knowledge that there were 2-3 more than that.

 

[Bomaz_Magic]

Haileybury have givin out an absolute **** load of footy scolarships right, well look at schools like Caulfield, they have pritty much bought their whole Athletics team, winning year after year after year...

Look at another school like Scotch, puting thousands of dollars into Rowing, much more than any other school, and then they walk away with a rowing premiership, winning last year, this year and who knows how many more years they will win.

As soon as Haileybury get scolarships for a sport and win ONE (ONLY ONE) premiership so fare.. everyone calls them cheats and bags them, if every school did this, the standards would be heaps good, and the footy would be awesome to whatch. insteed they dont, and Haileybury beat teams like Wesley 202 - 14, haha.

But i supose they did give out a bit to many, and should tone it down a tad.

It's unfair that these kids get to be "benefited from a private school education", yet acedemically they do not warrant it. It's a disgrace to be honest having people at your school so you can win a football game. But what can you do when schools will do anything to better there reputation in order to attract gulable people to part with hard because they feel that their son will have a better chance at playing AFL cause Hailebury are so good at football and have a large number of draftees in proportion to other schools. Well thats my two Bob's worth anyway.

 

[ghetto blasters]

To all those misguided private school students that think their school does not award scholarships, get your head out of the sand and start living in the real world. All private schools award scholarships, be it for sport, the arts, etc. It is and always has been a way of life for these schools, it enhances their reputation, encourages other students to attend their school and actually pay fees. Heard of marketing, it is front of you everyday in everything you do.
In SA we have specialist schools where they award scholarships to further their school. ie Sacred Heart - football, Rostrevor - cricket, PAC and St. Peters - everything. It is no use denying it, it happens.
Some parents even offer their talented kids around, waiting for the best offer and in turn getting a cheap education at an exclusive school. Tell me that is wrong for the parents, when normally they couldn't afford to do this and their sports talented kid would end up at the local government school.
Just because your parent is loaded and you ended up at an exclusive school does not mean everyone else can. Why should you get the benefit of private schooling because your parents are rich, what have you shown talent at. Get the argument.

Whilst I wouldn't know Haileybury from Caufield, accept the fact that it enhances the schools prestige, get used to it.

Can anyone tell me how Ben Davis is going at Caufield, is he playing first 18.

 

[m.diddy]

To all those misguided private school students that think their school does not award scholarships, get your head out of the sand and start living in the real world. All private schools award scholarships, be it for sport, the arts, etc. It is and always has been a way of life for these schools, it enhances their reputation, encourages other students to attend their school and actually pay fees. Heard of marketing, it is front of you everyday in everything you do.
In SA we have specialist schools where they award scholarships to further their school. ie Sacred Heart - football, Rostrevor - cricket, PAC and St. Peters - everything. It is no use denying it, it happens.
Some parents even offer their talented kids around, waiting for the best offer and in turn getting a cheap education at an exclusive school. Tell me that is wrong for the parents, when normally they couldn't afford to do this and their sports talented kid would end up at the local government school.
Just because your parent is loaded and you ended up at an exclusive school does not mean everyone else can. Why should you get the benefit of private schooling because your parents are rich, what have you shown talent at. Get the argument.

Whilst I wouldn't know Haileybury from Caufield, accept the fact that it enhances the schools prestige, get used to it.

Can anyone tell me how Ben Davis is going at Caufield, is he playing first 18.

Mate I don't think anyone here would disagree that their school gives out scholarships, however because you have no experience in the APS your post means nothing.

Haileybury, Caulfield, Carey etc went out and bought more than just a few players. In Haileybury's case they bought close to a full 1st 18. Caulfield have been buying Footy players (goddard, Mcqualter, Walker etc), Swimmers, Athletes etc.

Haileybury went from a very ******** 1st 18 side to winning in the space of 2 or so years.

Scotch have been doing it a bit more this year but not the extent of the others. Xavier, Scotch, St Kevins all get success from not giving half a team scholarships. These 3 schools may give two or three scholarships in a footy team but mainly give scholarships for academic reasons.

 

[CAPPERisGOD]

Pretty much all schools have scholarships

Caufiauld: Eddy and all the others
Wesley: Beaty
Scotch: Djkurra, Rioli and Sheetz
Haileybury: HEAPS
MGS: Ellis, Vance, Sitorri and Hawkins????
Brighton:Mcguinnes and the clan
Xavier: Sibisado, Tarrant????

thats just off the top of my head and we all know that there are heaps more really. The APS is littered with them and pretty much no school can say they

 

[mudgeathon]

Xavier: Sibisado, Tarrant????

Well I'm not here to say that Xavier don't give out scholarships, they do just like every other APS school, although not nearly to the extent some others do.
However just pointing out Collingwood are paying for Tarrant to be at Xavier [so he dosen't play TAC] and Cody Sibasado, well he was here on a Broome excahnge scholarship, but as he was very good at footy, among other things, he never went back [he's at Xavier as a border now]

 

[tigers2005]

To all those misguided private school students that think their school does not award scholarships, get your head out of the sand and start living in the real world. All private schools award scholarships, be it for sport, the arts, etc. It is and always has been a way of life for these schools, it enhances their reputation, encourages other students to attend their school and actually pay fees. Heard of marketing, it is front of you everyday in everything you do.
In SA we have specialist schools where they award scholarships to further their school. ie Sacred Heart - football, Rostrevor - cricket, PAC and St. Peters - everything. It is no use denying it, it happens.
Some parents even offer their talented kids around, waiting for the best offer and in turn getting a cheap education at an exclusive school. Tell me that is wrong for the parents, when normally they couldn't afford to do this and their sports talented kid would end up at the local government school.
Just because your parent is loaded and you ended up at an exclusive school does not mean everyone else can. Why should you get the benefit of private schooling because your parents are rich, what have you shown talent at. Get the argument.

Whilst I wouldn't know Haileybury from Caufield, accept the fact that it enhances the schools prestige, get used to it.

Can anyone tell me how Ben Davis is going at Caufield, is he playing first 18.

Schools have clearly been buying players for years. But Hailebery have taken it to the next level by 1. buying a whole team no just a few star players and 2. have bought players in more than 2 sports so they can dominate. I heard they are only doing it because they were struggling to fill their classrooms and thought it would attract fee paying students to the school.

 

[footystar]

Xavier: Sibisado, Tarrant????

Well I'm not here to say that Xavier don't give out scholarships, they do just like every other APS school, although not nearly to the extent some others do.
However just pointing out Collingwood are paying for Tarrant to be at Xavier [so he dosen't play TAC] and Cody Sibasado, well he was here on a Broome excahnge scholarship, but as he was very good at footy, among other things, he never went back [he's at Xavier as a border now]

I honestly think that if you heard that collingwood were paying for tarrant to be at xavier, then that would be a lie. I think that would be a salery cap breach as your not meant to give anything of serious value to players or family of players. As i remember Melbourne almost got in trouble for Jeff Whites father aledgedly recieving a boat from Joe Gutnic but they couldn't prove it. Why would collingwood care if Tarrent went 2 xavier? as it is really a lottery wether he will end up playing for them with the draft.

 

[Lingsface]

In WA guilford are going to have an awesome team next year after recruiting 11 new players on scolarships, and christchurch have got about 5 aboriginal boys from the kimberly.

 

[nick mccarr]

i think the real issue with scholarships is not whether they should be given out to thousands but rather to who. schools have always and will probably continue to give out scholarships that better the school in several fields, the main thing is that they should be given to students that cannot afford to attend in the first place thereby granting them a higher education and learning opportunity

 

[Prentice]

It is a problem around the country. In Brisbane GPS "Sports" Scholarships are banned so the schools get around it by calling it something else.

Akamanis was a Nudgee College in Brisbane (to run the 200m) on a "Disadvantaged" Scholarship or something. At BBC (Brisbane Boys' College) they scout top young South African Players and give them "Cultural" Scholarships to come to Australia and get them to play. It does not matter what you do the schools will get around it.

 

[juDDa]

can't they just not give out any scholarships?? why is that soo hard?
don't worry about sporting, cultural or whateva b ull******** scholarships are givin out!!!
if that doesnt work couldn't the APS system just say for example limit a school to only 5 scholarship players per side?? wether they are on any type of scholarship so they can get around schools cheating the system...