Prediction Harry Sheezel - Can he be the GOAT?

[H00t]

There are others who can do that, namely zurhaar, duursma and braydon george who also plays a similar role. We don't have nearly as many such types in defense, hence why i think sheezal will eventually end up being a backline general. Remember the halfback is like the point guard in bbal.

Complete waste of his talents if he spends anymore time past this year in the back half.

He’s a great ball user but doesn’t break lines as well as other half backs do. At least from what I’ve watched he hasn’t opened defences up. He’s hit targets but he hasn’t kicked it over or around defences where they then have to scramble to defend.

Instead where he has looked damaging is when he’s drifted forward it’s where his ability to hit targets shines.

He probably makes North a 2-3 goal better team by playing forward instead of defence.

 

[3207]

ty zantuck stiff

Very !

 

[Xtreme]

Player of the 20th century. Offically:



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leigh_Matthews#Honours_and_achievements



It's a testament to Dusty that his career can be talked about as being at or near the same level as Lethal's.

You're allegedly a Hawks supporter. Did you see Matthews play? 4 x flags, 6 x leading goalkicker, a Coleman (at 5'10"), 8 x BnFs. He kicked over 900 goals as a short stocky Half forward.

I was 3 years old when he retired.

I'm just team Dusty when it comes to individual players. Leigh can be GOAT Of the VFL era. While Dusty is GOAT of the AFL era, everyone wins.

 

[powerrrrrrrrrrrr]

Hopefully he develops to the stage where he can get 3 Brownlow votes a game for 13 disposals and 5 turnovers like a little Judas can

This has absolutely nothing to do with JHF so why even bring him up unless just want to turn it into a pissing contest?

 

[Muddiemoose]

Passes the eye test

 

[Juddernaut08]

h sheezel > n duckos

 

[Worm4]

Simple answer to this -
His numbers currently stack up so he is on his way
If he starts to pull out of one on one contests for fear of getting hurt , then he can not be considered as a potential GOAT.
As I haven't seen this action yet, he is still in this window

 

[BringFevBack2021]

91% DE
32 D
755MG

Against the best team in the competition, all from the backline.

Imagine when he goes into the middle, the possibilities are endless.

 

[My Tilly]

See he goes once teams start to put a bit of work into him. At the moment, he can waltz around doing as he pleases.

 

[Sphynx]

Complete waste of his talents if he spends anymore time past this year in the back half.

He’s a great ball user but doesn’t break lines as well as other half backs do. At least from what I’ve watched he hasn’t opened defences up. He’s hit targets but he hasn’t kicked it over or around defences where they then have to scramble to defend.

Instead where he has looked damaging is when he’s drifted forward it’s where his ability to hit targets shines.

He probably makes North a 2-3 goal better team by playing forward instead of defence.

Talk about hyperbole.

"Complete waste of his talent"

He just won the Rising Star, a club B&F in his rookie season and broke the AFL disposal record for a rookie also.

He's been BOG for us in basically every preseason match and Rnd 1 so far this season.

He averages about 60% more disposals than any other u20 player in the comp. He's streets ahead of kids his same age.

I think he's going alright doing what he's doing and has plenty of time left in his career.

 

[Makeshift Park]

Talk about hyperbole.

"Complete waste of his talent"

He just won the Rising Star, a club B&F in his rookie season and broke the AFL disposal record for a rookie also.

He's been BOG in basically every preseason match and Rnd 1 so far this season.

He averages about 60% more disposals than any other u20 player in the comp. He's streets ahead of kids his same age.

I think he's going alright doing what he's doing and has plenty of time left in his career.

You're in a thread premised on "can Sheezel be the goat" complaining about hyperbole?

 

[Sphynx]

You're in a thread premised on "can Sheezel be the goat" complaining about hyperbole?

The thread is tongue in cheek, that post wasn't.

 

[BringFevBack2021]

You're in a thread premised on "can Sheezel be the goat" complaining about hyperbole?

 

[3207]

You're in a thread premised on "can Sheezel be the goat" complaining about hyperbole?

Irony

 

[H00t]

Talk about hyperbole.

"Complete waste of his talent"

He just won the Rising Star, a club B&F in his rookie season and broke the AFL disposal record for a rookie also.

He's been BOG for us in basically every preseason match and Rnd 1 so far this season.

He averages about 60% more disposals than any other u20 player in the comp. He's streets ahead of kids his same age.

I think he's going alright doing what he's doing and has plenty of time left in his career.

I’m not saying he’s not playing well. He definitely is.

The most dangerous he’s looked this year though is the game against the pies when he drifted forward and was kicking the ball inside 50.

When he gets the ball in the forward half north look like scoring.

He can stay in the back half and will break all sorts of disposal records. Getting lots of free ball in the back half doesn’t do as much for North than Sheezel getting the ball within 70 metres of goal.

 

[Back One Out]

 

[ChairmanZia]

Sheezel is much better than Zurhaar and has a much higher ceiling. George hasn’t even played and Duursma is in his development year as Sheezel had last year.

You put your best players in the middle and attacking the forward lines. You don’t put GAJ, Pendlebury etc in the back pocket racking up 2/3rds of their disposals across the back third of the ground and not impacting the score.

If he stays down back IMO his talents are being seriously under utilised. Could be a seriously damaging player in the forward half, something North are lacking out of the middle.

errr yes you do, hodge, pendlebury all made their made as Greats at half back.

HB is prob the most important position on the field. THey win you flags these days.

 

[Enviable Tradition]

He's no JHF that's for sure.

On SM-G975F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[BRider]

He's no JHF that's for sure.

On SM-G975F using BigFooty.com mobile app

Yeah for sure, Sheezel is much better.

 

[powerrrrrrrrrrrr]

errr yes you do, hodge, pendlebury all made their made as Greats at half back.

HB is prob the most important position on the field. THey win you flags these days.

There is a difference between half backs and attacking half backs. Attacking half backs are damaging.

When you get over half your disposals in the defensive arc however, that’s not an attacking half back that’s damaging the opposition.

Damaging half backs are those that break the lines and move the ball through the middle and attack the forward line. He’s not doing that.

Chip it around the back 50 all he wants, that’s not helping North score and the stats back that up. He’s to deep.

Even last year with all his disposals, he only had 11 goal assists all year and only 1 game where he had 2.

He’s not kicking goals, he’s not getting the ball inside 50 enough and he’s not setting up many goals. He had countless games with 30+ disposals but amongst them, still only getting the 4 or less inside 50s.

He can have a million disposals back there but currently, he’s not damaging the opposition however you want to spin it. If he played midfield or higher up the field, he would be.

Theres a reason other teams let him roam completely free from attention. You don’t think if he was damaging they would out some pressure on him?

In time I believe he will become and absolute gun midfielder where the game is won. North have given him a development year which he absolutely killed but now is the time to start developing that midfield game and taking pushing North forward.

 

[Sphynx]

There is a difference between half backs and attacking half backs. Attacking half backs are damaging.

When you get over half your disposals in the defensive arc however, that’s not an attacking half back that’s damaging the opposition.

Damaging half backs are those that break the lines and move the ball through the middle and attack the forward line. He’s not doing that.

Chip it around the back 50 all he wants, that’s not helping North score and the stats back that up. He’s to deep.

Even last year with all his disposals, he only had 11 goal assists all year and only 1 game where he had 2.

He’s not kicking goals, he’s not getting the ball inside 50 enough and he’s not setting up many goals. He had countless games with 30+ disposals but amongst them, still only getting the 4 or less inside 50s.

He can have a million disposals back there but currently, he’s not damaging the opposition however you want to spin it. If he played midfield or higher up the field, he would be.

Theres a reason other teams let him roam completely free from attention. You don’t think if he was damaging they would out some pressure on him?

In time I believe he will become and absolute gun midfielder where the game is won. North have given him a development year which he absolutely killed but now is the time to start developing that midfield game and taking pushing North forward.

What the he’ll are you talking about?

He had almost 800 meters gained at 91% efficiency on the weekend. You can not chip it around deep in the backline and achieve those numbers.

Where’s the ball going exactly if he’s moving it 30m up the field on average almost every time he disposes of it, 9/10 times to a team mates chest?

He was second in the comp for the entire round for meters gained. He had almost 200m gained more than Nick Blakey….

He had 4 inside 50’s to Nick Blakeys 5 on the weekend, who I assume you would consider an attacking half back who attacks the forward line?

 

[powerrrrrrrrrrrr]

What the he’ll are you talking about?

He had almost 800 meters gained at 91% efficiency on the weekend. You can not chip it around deep in the backline and achieve those numbers.

Where’s the ball going exactly if he’s moving it 30m up the field on average almost every time he disposes of it, 9/10 times to a team mates chest?

He was second in the comp for the entire round for meters gained. He had almost 200m gained more than Nick Blakey….

He had 4 inside 50’s to Nick Blakeys 5 on the weekend, who I assume you would consider an attacking half back who attacks the forward line?

He gained 755m for the game. sounds all well and good but when you break it down;

He took 5 kickouts. Most kickouts run out the square and kick to about 50. So let’s say he gained on ave 50m per kickout for free, that’s 250m off his total as that can be anyone.

27 disposals for his remaining 505m gained. He averages 18 meters per disposal.

Then also when you ignore his kickout stats again, he had 13/27 disposals in the defensive arc. So a large portion of his disposals are in the defensive arc, going 18m on average.

That’s not breaking the lines. He only passed the centre line on 4 occasions with the ball.

Blakey also did that off 19 disposals. So are you saying Sheezels 32 disposals is actually the equivalent of someone who got 19? I think Sheezel also has a much higher ceiling that Blakey. If that’s all you want from him, fine. But his potential is much higher.

What’s he doing with his other disposals? Because they aren’t resulting in scores. If his disposals were generating scoring chains, the stats would back that up. He was involved in only 1 score involvement on the weekend.

Out of 32 disposals, only 1 resulted in a score for North. You don’t think that’s wasting his talent?

As a North poster pointed out in his game against Sydney last year where he played 30% mid, he had 26 disposals and kicked 2.2. That is a hell of a lot more damaging than what he did on the weekend down back. That’s what North should be aiming for.

Comparison to Houston down back as that attacking back man. I’m going to ignore the WC game as we had 40 shots on goal so not a fair representation. However in the PS game against Freo, he managed 26 disposals, 50/50 def/fwd half of the ground and had 8 score involvements and 8 inside 50s.

Again Sheezel has a higher ceiling than Houston and it’s not a comparison on talent but if he’s going to play down back, he needs to be having this influence and not chipping it around the back arc. He’s simply not getting forward and generating scores.

 

[ChairmanZia]

There is a difference between half backs and attacking half backs. Attacking half backs are damaging.

When you get over half your disposals in the defensive arc however, that’s not an attacking half back that’s damaging the opposition.

Damaging half backs are those that break the lines and move the ball through the middle and attack the forward line. He’s not doing that.

Chip it around the back 50 all he wants, that’s not helping North score and the stats back that up. He’s to deep.

Even last year with all his disposals, he only had 11 goal assists all year and only 1 game where he had 2.

He’s not kicking goals, he’s not getting the ball inside 50 enough and he’s not setting up many goals. He had countless games with 30+ disposals but amongst them, still only getting the 4 or less inside 50s.

He can have a million disposals back there but currently, he’s not damaging the opposition however you want to spin it. If he played midfield or higher up the field, he would be.

Theres a reason other teams let him roam completely free from attention. You don’t think if he was damaging they would out some pressure on him?

In time I believe he will become and absolute gun midfielder where the game is won. North have given him a development year which he absolutely killed but now is the time to start developing that midfield game and taking pushing North forward.

Oh sorry to tell you, hodge + pendalbury achieved their hb attacking greatness in their final 5 years of career, so sheezal got a long while to go. He will go into the middle as a fulltime mid after a few years then towards his latter part of career, go back to defense. That's the blueprint for those bluechip players. There are plenty of goal kickers once you have a top of the line delivery into the fwd 50 arc.

 

[Fadge]

He gained 755m for the game. sounds all well and good but when you break it down;

He took 5 kickouts. Most kickouts run out the square and kick to about 50. So let’s say he gained on ave 50m per kickout for free, that’s 250m off his total as that can be anyone.

27 disposals for his remaining 505m gained. He averages 18 meters per disposal.

Then also when you ignore his kickout stats again, he had 13/27 disposals in the defensive arc. So a large portion of his disposals are in the defensive arc, going 18m on average.

That’s not breaking the lines. He only passed the centre line on 4 occasions with the ball.

Blakey also did that off 19 disposals. So are you saying Sheezels 32 disposals is actually the equivalent of someone who got 19? I think Sheezel also has a much higher ceiling that Blakey. If that’s all you want from him, fine. But his potential is much higher.

What’s he doing with his other disposals? Because they aren’t resulting in scores. If his disposals were generating scoring chains, the stats would back that up. He was involved in only 1 score involvement on the weekend.

Out of 32 disposals, only 1 resulted in a score for North. You don’t think that’s wasting his talent?

As a North poster pointed out in his game against Sydney last year where he played 30% mid, he had 26 disposals and kicked 2.2. That is a hell of a lot more damaging than what he did on the weekend down back. That’s what North should be aiming for.

Comparison to Houston down back as that attacking back man. I’m going to ignore the WC game as we had 40 shots on goal so not a fair representation. However in the PS game against Freo, he managed 26 disposals, 50/50 def/fwd half of the ground and had 8 score involvements and 8 inside 50s.

Again Sheezel has a higher ceiling than Houston and it’s not a comparison on talent but if he’s going to play down back, he needs to be having this influence and not chipping it around the back arc. He’s simply not getting forward and generating scores.

I've been intent on ignoring this thread, but some posts simply can't be ignored.

What on earth are you going on about?

You're talking about a kid who is commencing his second season in the system, having (I understand) never played in the backline in his life. And he was his club's best player in his first season whilst doing so.

This isn't Al Clarkson's first rodeo - I reckon he has a pretty good understanding as to how to develop players. We all know North weren't going to be worldbeaters last year, nor will they be this year... so why wouldn't you have Sheezel in the part of the ground where the ball is going to spend a lot of time, in order to develop his game.

In time, he will move forward of centre and into the midfield where he will no doubt be more damaging, and we're all familiar with the old adage that the best way for a young bloke to understand forward craft at any level is to spend time in the backline to see how others go about it.

We've seen too many midfielders thrown to the wolves from day one, in poor teams, and many had their careers cut short because of it. Jack Trengrove was a club captain at 21, and out of the system by the time he was 25.

Sheezel is clearly a gun, and he's only going to get better. Trust that Clarkson and the North coaching team know how to develop their players, and sit back and enjoy what is inevitably going to be an outstanding career.

 

[powerrrrrrrrrrrr]

Oh sorry to tell you, hodge + pendalbury achieved their hb attacking greatness in their final 5 years of career, so sheezal got a long while to go. He will go into the middle as a fulltime mid after a few years then towards his latter part of career, go back to defense. That's the blueprint for those bluechip players. There are plenty of goal kickers once you have a top of the line delivery into the fwd 50 arc.

You are completely missing my point.

The best years of Pendulbury and Hodge were as midfielders. That’s where they were the most damaging.

Particularly Pendulbury, when you think of him you don’t think of him on a back flank. You think of him in the middle.

They dominated in the midfield and that is where I’m saying Sheezel should be. Yes he can always have a great career down back. However he would be most damaging in the middle and attacking forward of centre.

He’s had a year down back. This year should be looking to push 30% midfield. That becomes 50% next year before becoming a full time mid as I said earlier. It doesn’t happen over night but they should start introducing him more.

Keep him down back if you want but I sure as hell wouldn’t want to keep someone like him there if we had him.