News Hawthorn Racism Review - No player name speculation - opposition posters tread very carefully

[Strapping Young Lad]

Wrong. Hawks did what they had to do by the rules of the AFL.

Correct. For reference below, once the HFC had the report outlining serious allegations they were duty bound by the AFL’s protocol to hand over the report to the AFL integrity unit.

I will pin this post, as it seems to be a constant query.

 

[HairyO]

Did anyone else feel sick reading the alleged email trail with Newbold whereby the fiance said her partner had talked to the playing group about being asked to break off his engagement?

Newbold and Evans have now been named in the media as part of this, I truly hope our leadership group isn't brought into question as having known some of these allegations at the time... but right now it just feels more and more are going to be caught up in this.

This is the interesting bit. In 2013 there is an email saying the playing group were being told about the issues. So its hard to see how the entire playing group cannot have known.

Unless the issues at the time in 2013 were very different to the issues being looked back on in 2022.

 

[deanc]

I wonder whether this will ever get to court from the players. For any class action they would need to be prepared to give sworn evidence and be exposed to cross-examination. Is there a way to do this in a culturally acceptable way? Are the players ready for public exposure, and for having their evidence contested and attacked by a sharp lawyer?

I could see that potentially the afl does its examination, makes its findings on the balance of probabilities and then mea culpa and $ settlement from the hawks/afl are organised, surely alongside recommendations for systemic changes for the hawks and all afl clubs. We cannot prejudge the findings, but it looks bad from what we have seen.

If the afl examination does not have new access to the players, it will be based on the statements already gathered for the hawks review, and on new evidence provided by the hawks coaches/staff, whistleblower(s) and whoever else comes forth - some of this material seems likely to be strongly conflicting. This will pose a tough challenge for the examination, especially to hold individuals to account when accounts of the “facts” vary.

More uncertain is the position of the coaches. If they don’t accept the findings of the examination they have a decision to make on the possible legal options available to them, eg for any impact on employment and/or for libel from the media organisations which ran the stories. Would clarko, fagan etc be prepared to go to court to clear their names?

A lot to play out but it’s hard to see any off ramp that all parties could readily accept.

Some good points, but refer my earlier post - whereas in summary it's unlikely any of the parties and their legal counsels will want to pursue this matter beyond the AFL's investigation, which is essentially a form of mediation.
For one thing civil courts/judges often reject applications to formally hear related disputes if the issue is primarily based on 'hearsay' evidence - irrespective of who the claiments are, be they former players or a statutory agency like Safe Work Australia.
The media of course will do their utmost to suggest otherwise to suit their own agenda's...

 

[Stratton24]

Did anyone else feel sick reading the alleged email trail with Newbold whereby the fiance said her partner had talked to the playing group about being asked to break off his engagement?

Newbold and Evans have now been named in the media as part of this, I truly hope our leadership group isn't brought into question as having known some of these allegations at the time... but right now it just feels more and more are going to be caught up in this.

surely if that was true Burgoyne would have known about it - he has denied any knowledge

 

[CaptainWorpedo]

I find it a bit odd they started with two and keep adding, as Clarko and **** name didnt get the end result they wanted. So they keep adding names until they get there own way in the public.

I was all for these players being heard and helped. But know i just feel like it is a witch hunt for money. The bigger the name the better the headline.

 

[Ned Ryerson]

I find it a bit odd they started with two and keep adding, as Clarko and **** name didnt get the end result they wanted. So they keep adding names until they get there own way in the public.

I was all for these players being heard and helped. But know i just feel like it is a witch hunt for money. The bigger the name the better the headline.

Huh? Stories aren’t changing, just more and more of the story is coming out.

 

[Luv_our_club]

So far all we know for a fact is that the club was supporting the player while he separated from his partner and an unstable situation.
We know the player alleges he was coerced.
We know the coaches deny that.
The email's don't indicate either way.

 

[Stratton24]

So far all we know for a fact is that the club was supporting the player while he separated from his partner and an unstable situation.
We know the player alleges he was coerced.
We know the coaches deny that.
The email's don't indicate either way.

people can give you advice in life, hard to actually make people follow through with actions against their will

 

[Ned Ryerson]

So far all we know for a fact is that the club was supporting the player while he separated from his partner and an unstable situation.

Those aren’t really established facts - no.

 

[Luv_our_club]

Those aren’t really established facts - no.

We know the domestic situation was unstable.
We know the couple seperated.
We know the club was trying to support the player (whether they did it badly is up for question)


Ned... stop contradicting EVERY SINGLE POST I put up... it's getting a but trollish.

 

[Ned Ryerson]

We know the domestic situation was unstable.
We know the couple seperated.
We know the club was trying to support the player (whether they did it badly is up for question)


Ned... stop contradicting EVERY SINGLE POST I put up... it's getting a but trollish.

Nope - some of things are not known purely speculated. There’s also 3 players involved at least, not one.

Family separations and pregnancy termination: Hawthorn racism review reveals shock allegations against former coaches

Alastair Clarkson and Chris Fagan are named in a Hawthorn review into how First Nations players were treated during Clarkson's time at the helm of the Hawks. Warning — this story contains details of self-harm, pregnancy loss, and intergenerational trauma for Indigenous people.

www.abc.net.au

The article is there if you’d like to read it.

 

[HedgeFund]

I find it a bit odd they started with two and keep adding, as Clarko and **** name didnt get the end result they wanted. So they keep adding names until they get there own way in the public.

I was all for these players being heard and helped. But know i just feel like it is a witch hunt for money. The bigger the name the better the headline.

The statements which form the basis of the allegation were provided months ago. None of the aggrieved parties are adding names as they go.
That’s just not correct.

 

[TylerDurden]

 

[Stratton24]

The media will claim a life sooner rather than later.
They are out of control in every aspect of reporting, not just football

 

[CaptainWorpedo]

The statements which form the basis of the allegation were provided months ago. None of the aggrieved parties are adding names as they go.
That’s just not correct.

Now there naming newbold, come off it.

 

[MrPremiership]

All sides have strongly represented very different versions of events, or otherwise dispute everything.

Not sure how this is resolved in the end.

Mud sticks.

 

[CaptainWorpedo]

Well said Clarko. Every one deserves a fair hearing.

 

[Stratton24]

All sides have strongly represented very different versions of events, or otherwise dispute everything.

Not sure how this is resolved in the end.

Mud sticks.

yep

Geoffrey Rush great actor that will never work again despite winning his defamation case and never been found guilty of anything

 

[Ned Ryerson]

Now there naming newbold, come off it.

An accuser has an email trail allegedly - if the email trail is legit it doesn't look great and appears as though he was saying 'woah not my department, bye!'. Not exactly great leadership IF the email trail is legitimate.

 

[Gralin]

I find it a bit odd they started with two and keep adding, as Clarko and **** name didnt get the end result they wanted. So they keep adding names until they get there own way in the public.

I was all for these players being heard and helped. But know i just feel like it is a witch hunt for money. The bigger the name the better the headline.

Burt was named in the ABC article, we don't know who was named in the report

Now that it appears the report has been leaked to the HUN, more names are being mentioned because they were in the report, not the ABC article.

The ABC article was not based on the report but the stories from 3 of the families interviewed for the report and the ABC article

 

[Ned Ryerson]

yep

Geoffrey Rush great actor that will never work again despite winning his defamation case and never been found guilty of anything

Except he's starring in a Groucho Marx biopic that's filming this year.

 

[Gralin]

Except he's starring in a Groucho Marx biopic that's filming this year.

yes it seems a quiet year or two and back in the saddle for those that have been "cancelled" assuming they even have to step down

it's rare that someone's career actually gets "ruined' as claimed even when they've been found guilty of what has been accused

 

[Stratton24]

Except he's starring in a Groucho Marx biopic that's filming this year.

justice!

 

[Brishawk]

people can give you advice in life, hard to actually make people follow through with actions against their will

You must have missed all the times people have been coerced into doing things against their own interest. You can get people to confess to crimes they didn’t commit, you can beat an intimate partner and convince them it was their own fault, you can talk people into committing murder for you, you can convince a nation all their problems can be solved by persecuting Jewish people. Why is it so hard to accept that a group of coaches could convince a young man to end a relationship and/or abort a child?

 

[Ned Ryerson]

yes it seems a quiet year or two and back in the saddle for those that have been "cancelled" assuming they even have to step down

it's rare that someone's career actually gets "ruined' as claimed even when they've been found guilty of what has been accused

Not to mention he was awarded damages based on reputational damage and loss of work - so the system works and in this case worked for the allegedly hard done by white man that I keep hearing about.

 

[Ned Ryerson]

justice!

Well - I know people in the industry who shared stories about particular antics long before any of that trial became a thing - but if you want to idolise the guy then have at it I guess.