Opinion Heretier Lumumba

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peter9789 said:
Exactly. There will be a book tour somewhere around finals time if we are in it. And don’t forget the all the sequels ..... hell he may even get a movie deal out of it.

.....and then the merchandise

FMD what an absolute flog


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The flogs are the media and the fawning politicians that created the atmosphere where these sort of situations can develop.
 
magpies42 said:
Or people just see it for what it is, a farcical situation lead by a farcical judicial system driven by the twitterazi and populist media. I couldn’t give two fcks about what happens or what anybody says about the club. There is too much focus on what people say, and not enough on the underlying intent and character of the individuals. Do I think they used the word chimp, yes...do I think they are racist, no! Don’t forget the context.
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Sure, it’s easy enough to feel righteous about it today ...

... but I’m sure many folks still feel righteous that their dislike of Goodes was because he wasn’t a fair player, and yet they still have to deal with the narrative that it was all about racial vilification.
 
bunter said:
Sad situation, wasn’t he invited to join in an investigation or resolution with the club as well and refused?
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Very likely on legal advice.

If he’s intent on suing the club, his lawyer would very likely advise him not to talk to club appointed investigators. (Kirby ?)
 

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jonmacTrag said:
The flogs are the media and the fawning politicians that created the atmosphere where these sort of situations can develop.
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The media and the politicians simply follow the zeit geist.

It’s us, greater society, who created the atmosphere.

But like a pendulum it swings back and forth. It’ll turn again.
 
Apples said:
I agree with you to an extent magpies42, but I have a degree of sympathy for H - he was a premiership player and All Australian in 2010. A very popular player with the fans and a man who was prepared to stand up for his beliefs and attempt to make the world a better place.

I think he probably was called chimp by some players in the locker room. Why did he not object? There would likely be many good reasons; team harmony for one. I'm not sure of H's claims about who said what and when, but in my experience, when somebody claims to have been vilified or bullied, there's usually something to it.

We've all said things in the past that we would never say now at the footy. Fourteen years ago you could swear at the footy, abuse Aboriginal players, suggest opposition players were "playing for the other team" and generally say whatever one felt like saying, without anybody batting an eyelid. People may have been quietly disgusted, but there was no abuse hotline. I said things as a teenager and as a young man that embarrass me even now. I think many of us have those memories.

I was sitting in the front row of the Sherrin Stand when Nicky Winmar lifted his jumper. I remember burning with embarrassment as men in their 50s and 60s in the Social Club enclosure waved massive bones in the air, pointing them at Robert Muir too. Can we imagine this now? Would people under 30 even believe this could be possible?

Times change and people change. H has changed too. He's very upset and seems determined to see this matter through. I feel sorry for H because I think somewhere along the way, he has run off the rails. He seems to be scattered and unstable, at least looking from a distance.

I can't see anything good coming out of this for H or the Club. I hope is receiving appropriate support.
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All power to him, and I had no issue with him at the time standing up for his beliefs and being vocal about. I’m sure once he voiced his position the offensive comments would have stopped. Football clubs are pretty ‘blokey’ environments, offensive things are thrown around all the time...you just roll with the punches. That is normal and H would have known that, I’m sure others would have been called worse things.

And you’ve hit the nail on the head, he’s off the rails...and now looking for a scape goat and some attention. So you are right, he’s in a world of pain...and I guess if I wasn’t sick of external factors disrupting the club I might feel for him too. This issue will follow us all year next year, and there will be a focus on who has called him chimp and this will be speculated about...the scrutiny will cause a great deal of angst for our players and club and probably more than being called an offensive name by your team mates.
 
76woodenspooners said:
Sure, it’s easy enough to feel righteous about it today ...

... but I’m sure many folks still feel righteous that their dislike of Goodes was because he wasn’t a fair player, and yet they still have to deal with the narrative that it was all about racial vilification.
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There is nothing righteous about bullying somebody, I think the Goodes situation is different. When a mass of people gang up on one person, it’s cowardice. I get it though, in the spirit of giving your team the edge you boo...again part and parcel of our culture.

There is no place for racism or bullying, but I don’t think that’s the issue H’s case. He’s a broken man looking for validation and somebody to blame.
 
I hope that he is not being extorted by Brazilian drug gangs , as they would be aware of his AFL fame and potential dollar value over here ,and needs a large court payout to get them off his back , after all he did say that was a witness a murder over there
 
element said:
Unless there are a bunch of lawyers already on retainer who are sitting around twiddling their thumbs doing absolutely nothing else, the amount of time and effort required to build a defense, obtain and pore over evidence and then the time required to actually see out the process to resolution via court dates... it will all cost the club 10x a settlement.

Saw it via an employee taking employer to Fairwork for unfair dismissal. The employee was a clown and there was a mountain of evidence against him but the employer really only has a few choices: hire lawyers (at a cost of thousands and thousands billed), assign in-house counsel (thereby taking highly paid employees away from internal projects), or settle for a relatively small amount to just make it go away. The settlement couldn't come quick enough.

I don't want to judge him because I don't know exactly how he feels or the effect of events on his mental state, but he will get a payday.
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Its gone past worrying about money. If they settle they are admitting he was racially abused. They'll try spin it as a best way to end it but this has gone past that. Some battles have to be fought.
 
This is another one of his posts.




Yep, this great humanitarian is included alongside some human right champions who the world respects and admires

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76woodenspooners said:
The media and the politicians simply follow the zeit geist.

It’s us, greater society, who created the atmosphere.

But like a pendulum it swings back and forth. It’ll turn again.
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To an extent I agree.
But.
The media in this country is owned outright by two massive conglomerates - and the head of one has stated he is a 'king maker'.
When freedom of speech in the media is as deeply compromised as this country's is by the offensive legislation that allows such total power to be concentrated into the hands of two conglomerates with no outside dissenting voice then every one of their actions should be viewed with suspicion.
Public opinion will always follow the media and the media loves to 'make the news' to suit their own agendas.
 
76woodenspooners said:
Very likely on legal advice.

If he’s intent on suing the club, his lawyer would very likely advise him not to talk to club appointed investigators. (Kirby ?)
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Absolutely correct.
 

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Kirby said:
Absolutely correct.
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So his intention from the outset was to sue. If Collingwood had apologised as he wished them to do, they would have played right into his hands. Unless an apology was all he was ever after. From the clubs point of view, they also had to have evidence of racial abuse of him and perhaps in their minds, and from the result of their own investigation, it didn't exist. Plus they would always have been suspicious of where these accusations were ultimately heading - the courts.
 
manicpie said:
Ok, so he was born in Brazil, whats the difference to the Congo?, Either way he should have an attitude of Gratitude. You think being born in Brazil makes it different than Congo. The bloke is dope smoking, mushroom eating idiot. Now go back to bed
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Did you seriously just ask what's the difference between two countries that are on completely separate continents about 8 thousand kilometres away from each other?
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TheGreatGrundy said:
So his intention from the outset was to sue. If Collingwood had apologised as he wished them to do, they would have played right into his hands. Unless an apology was all he was ever after. From the clubs point of view, they also had to have evidence of racial abuse of him and perhaps in their minds, and from the result of their own investigation, it didn't exist. Plus they would always have been suspicious of where these accusations were ultimately heading - the courts.
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Correct and I said as much at the time. He never sought an apology.

He was seeking both from Collingwood and the AFL an acceptance that their behavior/actions led to him suffering mental injury. In other words, their negligent behaviours (or negligent lack of action) led to him suffering mental injury ("damages"). That is exactly what he has to prove in a civil case for damages.

A lay person who was not in the hands of lawyers would typically say something along the lines of "I just want them to say sorry for the hurt that they caused me".......that sort of thing.

The language he used in demanding action a few months ago was full of legal terms and principles. This was always coming imho.
 
Jasper84 said:
Did you seriously just ask what's the difference between two countries that are on completely separate continents about 8 thousand kilometres away from each other?
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I'm talking about the fact that he was given the opportunity to come to Australia and live a good life compared to where he was born, if you think that geography is more important then this conversation is a waste of time
 
I hope he sues that faceless Collingwood player who had the gall to falsely accuse Seedsman of being a lesbain!

I have yet found any concrete evidence to support his outlandish slur!
 
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Kappa said:
Well there goes our membership money.

Straight to lawyers.

Yay.
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I'd assume it would all be covered by insurances the club already pays.
 
Kappa said:
Do you really want this to drag out for potentially years while senior club figures have to regularly go to court?

It'll have a catastrophic impact on sponsorships and memberships
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Why?
 
We live in a litigious world where too often right and wrong get lost in the quest for money.
No one deserves to be in a workplace or environment where they they are subject to abuse of any from, racial abuse a particularly nasty reflection on the user, as much as no one deserves to be accused of untoward deeds to others. Lee Adamson springs to mind.
Like a lot of threads on the board there are some truly grubby posts and posters.
 
We know Andrew Krakoer and Leon Davis, Seamus Mc Namath, Chris Dawes and Brent McCaffer have all supported Lumumba or said similar things. So yeah, pretty Clear there’s an issue, and if you don’t think so, you’re part of the issue.
 
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