Independent report into Hobart's proposed new stadium has found the costs of the project have been significantly underestimated

[84859300]

The way I see it is that in a cold, dispassionate sense, the AFL has no business expanding into Tassie.

It won’t win new fans in the short or long term - they’re already footy mad and the population growth just isn’t big enough to add more people for what the cost will be.

This is an emotion-driven move aimed at being inclusive of a great footy state.

It will be hard. Setting up a new club (aside from the stadium) is expensive and hard to get a return on. And they absolutely will have retention and recruiting issues - young people are not moving to Tassie with any great eagerness. It’s a country outpost compared to the other clubs.

So given it’ll be a battle, the AFL want to make every last post a winner to give the club the best chance possible.

The stadium is a huge part of that. You want people to want to go there in the dead of winter. You want travelling supporters to go and have a great weekend and return next year to pump so more cash into the club. You want it dead simple to get to from the middle of town, with something to do before and/or after around it. You want to have night footy where the crowd isn’t completely exposed to subzero temps, sleet and rain.

The last thing you want is to put this club on the back foot from Day 1. Sending people on a trek to bloody Bellerive with an old, freezing stadium with nothing surrounding it. Because next time, when it’s a cold night and the couch is calling, they won’t come. Travelling supporters won’t return.

And the club will have more disadvantage.

Stadium experiences make a huge difference, as Adelaide and Perth have shown. A lot of major stadiums are now roofed and with a winter climate like Hobart’s, that’s a no brainer.

Basically, if the fed and state government want this then they need to pay up and do it properly. I don’t see that as totally unreasonable in this case.

Give the people the prices they need to get to the footy - like PHX in the NBA

 

[Saucery]

Yes this is unions fault ignore their party hasn't been in government for 11 years and the Liberals wanted to do it

It's funny how so many still equate the Labour party with unions. Sure, there is still some correlation but both sides work with them and the union movement has been neutered anyway, with only 17% of people being unionized anymore. Why do you think wage growth has been near 0% for 10 years now (what cost of living crisis?).

The reality is since the accords the unions lawyers talk to the company's lawyers and they all talk to the governments legal dept; but the fact is that they all went to the same private schools together and know how to make a deal behind all the bluster.

 

[Walshawk]

It’s about as close to Melbourne’s temperatures as Melbourne’s is to Sydney’s. It’s a noticeable difference.

The roof doesn’t necessarily make it warmer. I have never been cold inside the MCG. It is leaving home to travel to the ground when the weather affects your decision making.

 

[Walshawk]

Absolutely agree, my point is rather we have been grossly misled as to the decision making and likely costs/benefits involved in this back-room operation. Our state is already 3 billion in debt and that's rising fast, with the lowest GDP in the nation.

I think that when a decision is so big that it will take literally generations to pay off it needs to be much more heavily, publicly scrutinized, and the AFL recalled to explain, also publicly, why their demands are necessary (I mean a roof ffs).

Anyway, I have no faith in this government to handle a major project like this as time and time again they have f'd up royally (like now paying $55,000 a week for the next few years to store a ferry in Scotland, because two government departments didn't talk to each other).

I personally would then like to see a state referendum on this so the whole population can make their opinions know. I'm happy for it to go ahead, even if the result is close but not if a large majority don't want their taxes spent this way.

Though I know that will never happen.

Not while Eric "the knife" Abetz is stadiums minister.


View attachment 2199138

Generations? So 60/90 years? It really isn’t going to take that long to pay off even half a billion.

 

[Saucery]

Generations? So 60/90 years? It really isn’t going to take that long to pay off even half a billion.

OK, if you say so. A generation is generally considered to be 20 to 30 years.

 

[catstorm]

Just scrap the entire thing, it was never a good idea, a team in Tassie will never contribute anything of worth to the AFL.

AFL went with the “feels” on this without ever really investigating viability.

 

[catstorm]

Tasmania makes more sense than either Gold Coast or Giants as they will attract more crowds from day 1.

It's a true football state & if we are fair dinkum about the A in AFL, they should have their own side, rather than Victorian leftovers.

Not everything is about crowds, it’s about population and market.

The NRL struggles to pull in 30k crowds to blockbuster matches but has multi-billion dollar broadcast rights.

Having a game every week in QLD and NSW is worth big bucks to the broadcasters. Broadcasting in Tasmanian is worth **** all of anything to anyone.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

Not everything is about crowds, it’s about population and market.

The NRL struggles to pull in 30k crowds to blockbuster matches but has multi-billion dollar broadcast rights.

Having a game every week in QLD and NSW is worth big bucks to the broadcasters. Broadcasting in Tasmanian is worth **** all of anything to anyone.

Tasmania will be worth more to the AFL than Gold Coast & won't leak as much money either... & the atmosphere of their games will be much better for the broadcasters.

 

[catstorm]

Tasmania will be worth more to the AFL than Gold Coast & won't leak as much money either... & the atmosphere of their games will be much better for the broadcasters.

No it won’t, it will be worthless.

The population of SEQ is 4 million people and growing the population of Tassie is 500k and stagnant.

All who already watch AFL, a new team adds nothing.

GC and GWS are in massive population growth areas and are a new market to tap.

Also broadcaster couldn’t care less about atmosphere they care about how many people are watching on TV.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

No it won’t, it will be worthless.

The population of SEQ is 4 million people and growing the population of Tassie is 500k and stagnant.

All who already watch AFL, a new team adds nothing.

GC and GWS are in massive population growth areas and are a new market to tap.

Also broadcaster couldn’t care less about atmosphere they care about how many people are watching on TV.

Get ready to be proven very wrong!

Seems you have an unnatural hate of Tasmanians.

How's that growth going in SEQ...

 

[boncer34]

Absolutely agree, my point is rather we have been grossly misled as to the decision making and likely costs/benefits involved in this back-room operation. Our state is already 3 billion in debt and that's rising fast, with the lowest GDP in the nation.

I think that when a decision is so big that it will take literally generations to pay off it needs to be much more heavily, publicly scrutinized, and the AFL recalled to explain, also publicly, why their demands are necessary (I mean a roof ffs).

Anyway, I have no faith in this government to handle a major project like this as time and time again they have f'd up royally (like now paying $55,000 a week for the next few years to store a ferry in Scotland, because two government departments didn't talk to each other).

I personally would then like to see a state referendum on this so the whole population can make their opinions know. I'm happy for it to go ahead, even if the result is close but not if a large majority don't want their taxes spent this way.

Though I know that will never happen.

Not while Eric "the knife" Abetz is stadiums minister.


View attachment 2199138

The state did.

When they returned the Pro-Stadium Liberals over the Anti-Stadium opposition.

 

[Bjo187]

It's funny how so many still equate the Labour party with unions. Sure, there is still some correlation but both sides work with them and the union movement has been neutered anyway, with only 17% of people being unionized anymore. Why do you think wage growth has been near 0% for 10 years now (what cost of living crisis?).

The reality is since the accords the unions lawyers talk to the company's lawyers and they all talk to the governments legal dept; but the fact is that they all went to the same private schools together and know how to make a deal behind all the bluster.

"The Australian Labor Party (ALP) allocates 50% of delegate representation at its state and national conferences to affiliated unions. The remaining 50% is given to rank-and-file party members.

The ALP is often referred to as the party of unions due to its close ties to the Australian labor movement and its founding by trade unions. The majority of Australian trade unions are affiliated with the ALP."

Only 13 percent of employees in Australia are union members, yet if you have ever worked in government stakeholder reference like I have, you get to see first hand how much power they wield when labor are in government. It's actually incredible to see first hand.

 

[catstorm]

Get ready to be proven very wrong!

Seems you have an unnatural hate of Tasmanians.

How's that growth going in SEQ...

Nothing to say against the facts of the situation so just attack the poster and accuse them of hating Tasmanians

I’m also unsure what your last comment means, it’s going fine. Viewership and memberships are way up and youth participation is growing massively.

It will take time but every new viewer in QLD and NSW adds to the AFL, there are no new viewers to be had in Tasmania there is nothing to add to the AFL.

 

[Saucery]

The state did.

When they returned the Pro-Stadium Liberals over the Anti-Stadium opposition.

Yes they did, after two Liberal senators left the party over the refusal of the leaders to be more transparent, over this very deal.

So Rockliff called an early election to get a mandate and lost majority government, now relying on Labour and several independents to provide supply to pass legislation. That didn't go so well for him did it, to call that a win is delusional.

You can't just poke your head into Tasmainian politics without understanding how different it is to most (ACT excluded) mainland states, the Hare-Clark voting system here is absurd.

Labour has promised to keep the government to the stadium's original budget, and they will. The upshot is the Liberals now have little to no chance of getting this through the two houses of parliament, in it's current form this deal is dead in the water.

 

[Mateyman]

Just scrap the entire thing, it was never a good idea, a team in Tassie will never contribute anything of worth to the AFL.

AFL went with the “feels” on this without ever really investigating viability.

There's more market for a Tasmanian team than a number of the smaller Melbourne clubs. The AFL shouldn't simply be a dollars and cents calculation.

 

[Bjo187]

Yes they did, after two Liberal senators left the party over the refusal of the leaders to be more transparent, over this very deal.

So Rockliff called an early election to get a mandate and lost majority government, now relying on Labour and several independents to provide supply to pass legislation. That didn't go so well for him did it, to call that a win is delusional.

You can't just poke your head into Tasmainian politics without understanding how different it is to most (ACT excluded) mainland states, the Hare-Clark voting system here is absurd.

Labour has promised to keep the government to the stadium's original budget, and they will. The upshot is the Liberals now have little to no chance of getting this through the two houses of parliament, in it's current form this deal is dead in the water.

The up shot? A so called footy fan, on a footy forum, hoping for the stadium to fail and therefore Tasmania to not enter the competition. Good bloke you are.

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

The roof doesn’t necessarily make it warmer. I have never been cold inside the MCG. It is leaving home to travel to the ground when the weather affects your decision making.

Then you are either undercover or don’t go often.
Again Hobart is colder then Melbourne and a 25k seat stadium doesn’t block out the wind/weather in the same way a 100k seat stadium does.

It’s sort of irrelevant anyway. The AFL know that Tasmania is going to have retention issues, giving them an elite oval is atleast a small help.

 

[T2B_]

Just scrap the entire thing, it was never a good idea, a team in Tassie will never contribute anything of worth to the AFL.

AFL went with the “feels” on this without ever really investigating viability.

You're going to eat your words in time and I'm gonna be here for it.

 

[Boxo004]

No it won’t, it will be worthless.

The population of SEQ is 4 million people and growing the population of Tassie is 500k and stagnant.

All who already watch AFL, a new team adds nothing.

GC and GWS are in massive population growth areas and are a new market to tap.

Also broadcaster couldn’t care less about atmosphere they care about how many people are watching on TV.

Nail head

 

[Saucery]

The up shot? A so called footy fan, on a footy forum, hoping for the stadium to fail and therefore Tasmania to not enter the competition. Good bloke you are.

I am a good bloke and love to watch AFL no matter who is playing, and I'm a Tasmainian to boot. I bought 2 foundation memberships and have been grossly misled by both my government and the AFL, I would have thought an Essendon supporter could relate to that. Still you just keep on attacking me a don't bother your head about how this affects my state.

 

[Boxo004]

Get ready to be proven very wrong!

Seems you have an unnatural hate of Tasmanians.

How's that growth going in SEQ...

At grassroots level? Booming

 

[Bjo187]

I am a good bloke and love to watch AFL no matter who is playing, and I'm a Tasmainian to boot. I bought 2 foundation memberships and have been grossly misled by both my government and the AFL, I would have thought an Essendon supporter could relate to that. Still you just keep on attacking me a don't bother your head about how this affects my state.

Leave it for the politics thread mate nobody cares. I bought a tassie membership too, at least I'm not death riding the stadium and therefore the team though, simply coz i wanna put the boots into the political party I don't like.

Also you should try the other stadium thread, people have broken down the bullshit report from this so called economist nerd with screenshots of some of the absurd crap he put in there.

 

[Kappa]

Tasmania makes more sense than either Gold Coast or Giants as they will attract more crowds from day 1.

It's a true football state & if we are fair dinkum about the A in AFL, they should have their own side, rather than Victorian leftovers.

Very very poor analysis to think day 1 crowds matters in a long term team.

Giants and GC will be much bigger than Tassy in the long term

 

[nobbyiscool]

Very very poor analysis to think day 1 crowds matters in a long term team.

Giants and GC will be much bigger than Tassy in the long term

How long is long term? Cos both these "new frontier" clubs are now 10 years old and have barely made a dent.

 

[boncer34]

Yes they did, after two Liberal senators left the party over the refusal of the leaders to be more transparent, over this very deal.

So Rockliff called an early election to get a mandate and lost majority government, now relying on Labour and several independents to provide supply to pass legislation. That didn't go so well for him did it, to call that a win is delusional.

You can't just poke your head into Tasmainian politics without understanding how different it is to most (ACT excluded) mainland states, the Hare-Clark voting system here is absurd.

Labour has promised to keep the government to the stadium's original budget, and they will. The upshot is the Liberals now have little to no chance of getting this through the two houses of parliament, in it's current form this deal is dead in the water.

Labor*