Expansion International expansion

Remove this Banner Ad

C

chinggis77

Club Legend
Veteran
May 14, 2008
2,996
1,836
Germany
AFL Club
Fremantle
What countries should the AFL focus on in for expanding the game internationally?

Sth Africa
The AFL are focusing on Sth Africa which makes some sense given it's existing infrastructure (cricket grounds) and large population. Strong competition though from Rugby and Soccer (next Soccer world cup to be held there may destroy any advances made).

PNG
PNG also has a pretty good set up and AFL following and is the strongest league outside Australia. Strong competition from RL.

USA/Canada
Whilst Sth Africa and PNG may be able to provide players in future they will not add many dollars to AFL TV rights.

The US grew for a while but appears to have faltered, but would provide the best market outside Australia given the huge market where even a small niche in the US sporting scene could have huge financial benefits for the AFL.

It probably would take a few years of grass roots development but you would probably see quite rapid growth there after a while. The latent interest for AFL is actually quite high. According to Roy Morgan Polls 7,496,000 North Americans watch Australian Rules Football at least occasionally on television. Thats quite significant given that AFL is not shown that much on pay tv over there.

Canada has a small but well run local league and a small juniors program.

AFL could easily find a niche in the US market. Pay TV channels would love it. I read somewhere that one pay TV station already has a deal with a local AFL league over there to showcase some of their games.

West Indies/Jamaica
In terms of athletic talent though - hard to go past the West Indies/Jamaica where cricket grounds are also aplenty. Imagine Usain Bolt type players in the AFL - 195cm and running the 100m in 9.69s!

China
Too difficult due to the lack of space/fields. Soccer is very strong. A friend who has been helping some of the AFL clubs in their China marketing strategies says that it will be very hard.

India
Maybe India, with it's many cricket grounds again.

Despite the AFL's focus on Sth Africa, which seems to be driven by our communist leader (Demetriou's) social ideals, the USA should be the AFL's focus for growth internationally.

Less competition from other sports. Soccer is not big in India and they love all things Australian.

Pacific Islands
Already a presence on some of the islands and some good local comps, but a small market which won't add much to the AFL.

Europe
Some small local leagues for expats and locals. Denmark is probably the strongest and has a small junior league I believe. Maybe Princess Mary can give it a kick along. Potential for a niche. Soccer dominates.
 
Ireland is the glaring ommission from your summary which is otherwise fairly accurate. The AFL will offer more opportunities for elite Gaelic footy talent to come to Australia. This should grow interest in the code (for better or for worse).

The code seems to have spread mainly by the efforts of backpackers and expats. The places where organisation and infrastructure are best flourish. Other places have a team for a year or two before folding due to the expat going home.
 
Why exactly must we "expand" in the first place?

Footy has survived for 150 years in Australia only. What will pouring money into soccer saturated markets acomplish?

The game will most likely never take off internationally, the competition is too strong.

The AFL is far better off spending money on local development and/or the newer teams.
 

Log in to remove this ad.

Soccer's actually pretty big in India, just doesn't get much exposure. They get huge crowds sometimes. East Bengal-Mohun Bagan gets up to 120,000.

[youtube]tYSmI0F2UQk[/youtube]
 
i reakon india because of its mass population and they already have the infestructure. even if only 1% of india liked afl, thats still something like 1.3 mil ppl
 
sm007 said:
Why exactly must we "expand" in the first place?

Footy has survived for 150 years in Australia only. What will pouring money into soccer saturated markets acomplish?

The game will most likely never take off internationally, the competition is too strong.

The AFL is far better off spending money on local development and/or the newer teams.
Click to expand...

A fair bit of the expansion activity has been via backpackers placing an ad in a paper or notice board, organising a kick-to-kick and forming a club. No AFL money involved at all. Even the South African experiment is largely privately/club funded rather than an AFL exercise.

So I don't think the AFL is "pouring" that much money into overseas markets. Some places like the pacific islands could probably do with a bit more.

As with any sporting business there's a development budget available and if it brings in new recruits or fans then its money well spent.
 
The AFL is on Sentana in the US.

Heard the head of the US football league on SEN last year discussing the deal and how many games would be shown etc.

Was weird to hear an american talking so passionately about it. Saying that he has watched it for years and loves the game apparently it has a following amongst college students in the US.

I agree that international expansion of the AFL is futile, develop the game overseas by supporting their local leagues, but use it as a avenue to promote the AFL as a sport to increase expose and potentially make more money through the international TV rights similar to what the NFL is doing. The NFL could easily have expanded into canada, south america and even London, but have not done so.
 
Subprime said:
A fair bit of the expansion activity has been via backpackers placing an ad in a paper or notice board, organising a kick-to-kick and forming a club. No AFL money involved at all. Even the South African experiment is largely privately/club funded rather than an AFL exercise.

So I don't think the AFL is "pouring" that much money into overseas markets. Some places like the pacific islands could probably do with a bit more.

As with any sporting business there's a development budget available and if it brings in new recruits or fans then its money well spent.
Click to expand...

Well, the aim of the thread was asking where the AFL should target expansion. I presume to expand you must spend, and who will do that if not the AFL?

Just saying, I'd prefer the AFL spent money on improving our game locally before we look beyond our shores. Grass roots and the development in NSW and QLD markets would be money better spent IMO.
 
sm007 said:
Why exactly must we "expand" in the first place?
Click to expand...

Why not?

Growing AFL into lucrative new markets will only strengthen the game, secure it's future, open up exciting new opportunities such as - potentially and eventually - international test matches and bring in exciting new athletes.

It's not something to fear.

In a global world AFL will eventually start to feel the pressure from other more global sports, in particular soccer, which will someday start to take a lot of the sponsorship dollars etc set aside for the major sports here.

The AFL's greatest weakness is it's confinement to our shores. Lose market share here and the game suffers as a whole.

The greatest benefit that would come would be a much bigger talent pool, leading to a much higher level of play at the elite level. Cast your mind back to the cracking state of origin games between the best and the best - why shouldn't we aim to have that standard of play every week?
 
sm007 said:
Well, the aim of the thread was asking where the AFL should target expansion. I presume to expand you must spend, and who will do that if not the AFL?

Just saying, I'd prefer the AFL spent money on improving our game locally before we look beyond our shores. Grass roots and the development in NSW and QLD markets would be money better spent IMO.
Click to expand...

I think you'll find a lot more money is being spent in NSW and Qld than overseas so the preference you have is the same as that held at AFL house.

There's no doubt the AFL has its priorities right however they shouldn't ignore overseas development just because it appears difficult. In poorer countries the dollar goes a lot further and if the government is supportive then why not devote a part of the AFL development budget to seed the game in those places.
 
RSA- This is the primary focus simply because of RSA government and private sponsorship.
Has already generated a very large number of juniors and high growth rate .
The AFL will see this as a large potential draft source and Pay TV re-enforcement in the short term.
Already pencilled more NAB games and possible WAFL connections.
NZ- Already has significant participation and expanding presence with many players crossing to Australia.
The AFL will see this as a priority in increasing it's TV presence primarily with NAB style games .
PNG- A strong AR playing country but hampered by a number of problems .
The national team has no tall players and PNG has no decent grounds .
USA- Boomed when AFL was on payTV .Most innovative country when it comes to expanding Australian Football.
Just a bit short of a critical mass to get things moving .Hampered by the long travel distances at the moment .
Not sure just why AFL doesn't have a stronger payTV presence there. IMO I would be working on that .
CAN- Actually ahead of the USA when it comes to quality competitions and juniors and some sponsorships.
Canada's setup is the one that most closely resembles that of Australia. Canadian Football is not all that huge
so IMO down the track Canada could have a semi-pro league.
CHINA-Is potentially a real big mover and that is why Melbourne and the AFL have established a relationship .
With all the problems people might suggest the fact is that a minute proportion of the population
playing Australian Football is a large number .
INDIA-Again like China has the population and has cricket ovals .After many false starts has put something together.
Again like China the Australian Dollar would go far .
PACIFIC-Great success at the moment at running AR competitions in the rugby off season and some good
players come from a relatively small area .
IRELAND-Though the Irish master Australian Football relatively easily and have had great success internationally
there hasn't been a great rush to convert in spite of reason awareness .The revival of the IR series on the
international, club and junior level might kick start things again .
EUROPE-A lot of things happening especially in Scandinavia but hard to get noticed in the mainstream .

People are still under the the impression that the AFL has , does or is about to throw bucket full of monies at
particular projects . I can assure you that the AFL doesn't support any function that isn't fully costed in the short
term or long term .
.
 
China's current AFL presence is greatly exaggerated.

Knowing the guy who has been helping Melb FC's move into China, I wouldn't count on China being much of a market. It may be possible as a niche game in certain areas but most big Chinese cities just don't have the space for large footy venues. The AFL's efforts there have been all hype and little substance unfortunately which is my general point that they need to get a bit more serious.

They seem to have some interest in Sth Africa though. But are not pushing hard.

I think most international numbers are a bit exaggerated actually. I don't believe the numbers in Sth Africa are REGULAR afl players. Saying 5500 children were 'involved' in Footywild (i.e attending a one day clinic) is not the same as having 5500 players regularly suit up for a game each week.

How is Denmark positioned? They have had a solid competition for a number of years but is it possible for the game to grow much over there?

In my opinion save for some potential for growth in QLD and NSW trying to pursue growth in Australia will soon become a zero-sum game. Any further push will result in further pushes from NRL/RU/A-League taking ground elsewhere.

Link to AFL Development:

http://www.afl.com.au/Portals/0/afl_docs/afl_hq/annual_reports/2007/GameDevelopment.pdf
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

I take a keen interest in watching the development of footy overseas and in the 15 or so years that i have taken interest footy has grown significantly IMO ..... a great website to catch up on whats happening around the world is http://www.worldfootynews.com/

One thing that not many people have thought of is that if AR becomes as big around the world as lots of people want it to be there is no way that OZ would be the home of the strongest league........ good players invariably follow dollars and facilities and if a country like America or Europe decide they like it ...... maybe in a game that is played on smaller grounds with less players that is where the good players will go.

So in a way AR's greatest weakness is its greatest strength.
 
Cassio del Monte said:
Soccer's actually pretty big in India, just doesn't get much exposure. They get huge crowds sometimes. East Bengal-Mohun Bagan gets up to 120,000.

[youtube]tYSmI0F2UQk[/youtube]
Click to expand...

You're taking the p1ss surely? India good at soccer? How do you explain their FIFA ranking of 153 in the world then? Even the likes of Vanuatu and Luxembourg are ahead of them!
 
Johnny Utah #9 said:
You're taking the p1ss surely? India good at soccer? How do you explain their FIFA ranking of 153 in the world then? Even the likes of Vanuatu and Luxembourg are ahead of them!
Click to expand...

forgive them.

they are starved for sport and don't have too much other choice.

give them footy and they'd be right into it.

there is a great following of the AFL among migrants from the Indian subcontinent in Australia.

it is a shame that the only time that our game has been played in India at any meaningful level was by the WAFL back in the 1960s ... and even then the crowd was bigger than the average match at Carrara. I reckon an AFL match featuring West Coast (Kerr) and Geelong (Ediriwickrama) would go off massively in India.
 
chinggis77 said:
What countries should the AFL focus on in for expanding the game internationally?

India
Maybe India, with it's many cricket grounds again.
Less competition from other sports. Soccer is not big in India and they love all things Australian.
.
Click to expand...

Um, no they dont. They love all things Indian. This is a country with an increasingly jingoistic outlook (think Australia going OTT when winning Americas Cup 1983 then add a billion people). They are alot like we were in the 1980's - feeling they have to prove something to the world and wanting the world to take notice of them. It is a nation awaking to its own power. A new, alien football code is not really going to suit or interest them at this point of their history.
 
Soccer is much bigger in India than you would think. Dont get me wrong, cricket won out, but places like Kolkatta are even known as "soccer heartland" if you will. Their derby, which I think there is a video posted of, was recently named one of the top 50 fiercest/biggest derbies in world soccer. In Kolkatta you'll find billboards of Ronaldinho and whatnot.

We all associate cricket with India, and that wont change. But British colonialism did something with both cricket and soccer in india. Its bigger than you think really. Go look at Indian news publications, after cricket its always soccer news.
 
cos789 said:
RSA- This is the primary focus simply because of RSA government and private sponsorship.
Has already generated a very large number of juniors and high growth rate .
The AFL will see this as a large potential draft source and Pay TV re-enforcement in the short term.
Already pencilled more NAB games and possible WAFL connections.
Click to expand...

The RSA government somehow sponsoring or supporting or actively encouraging AR is a bit of an urban legend on this board.

I pressed a person who was touting this as a fact for any evidence or even south african newspaper articles involving AR (http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11504571&postcount=81) and he confessed the only evidence of the RSA government "wanting" to introduce AR was an article in a magazine he thought he read about 8 or so years ago (http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11504780&postcount=82).
 
Bouvet_Island said:
The RSA government somehow sponsoring or supporting or actively encouraging AR is a bit of an urban legend on this board.

I pressed a person who was touting this as a fact for any evidence or even south african newspaper articles involving AR (http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11504571&postcount=81) and he confessed the only evidence of the RSA government "wanting" to introduce AR was an article in a magazine he thought he read about 8 or so years ago (http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11504780&postcount=82).
Click to expand...

You pressed a person and he confessed...wow... maybe you should make your way to The Hague for the war cimes trials Bidet.

Here's a lead for your next interrogation, ABC journalist Elizabeth Jackson, made the following claim on radio a few years back, so do your stuff, press her for some facts, and get her to confess as well...

ELIZABETH JACKSON: The South African Government has declared Australian Rules Football the sport for "the new South Africa", and the league is ratcheting up its marketing to target a whole new market.


http://www.abc.net.au/am/elizabeth_jackson.htm

http://www.abc.net.au/am/content/2005/s1296562.htm
 
Cassio del Monte said:
Government schmovernment. If the Australia govt. said tomorrow that curling was our new national sport, would you automatically take it up?
Click to expand...

No, because we already have Australian Football.
But if I was in South Africa and somebody was showing some interest in me
then I'd probably give them the time of day .
.
 

Remove this Banner Ad

Expansion International expansion

Similar threads

G
AFL(S): Footy All Year Around, 2nd Tier Leg Up & Expansion
Replies
8
Views
344
Walshawk
Walshawk
bzparkes
Would original expansion clubs have greater support if they named themselves after a state/area?
2
Replies
26
Views
2K
Johnny Bananas
Johnny Bananas
T
NORWOOD EXPANSION
2 3
Replies
65
Views
5K
Gersman
Gersman

Remove this Banner Ad

Back
Top