Society/Culture Jordan B Peterson

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Something probably needs to be said...

Posters of the SRP, there has been a lot of posts moved from the main board to the SRP. Some of those are posts sharing a series of opinions that are moderated differently here than they were over there, due to board specific differences; some posts that would not be infraction worthy over there are infraction worthy here.

If a poster chooses not to post on the SRP due to this, that is their right. Attempts to draw people into threads if they indicate a desire to leave conversation will result in warnings then infractions should they continue.

While this might be considered unpopular, you do not have the right to another's attention or conversation.
 

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Its his logic (Jordy's) isn't it?

"Set your house in perfect order..." or something?

When JP said “clean your room” he meant things like “you climate protesters should get your own affairs in order before telling the rest of us how to live. As no one can live a perfect life then you climate protesters should just shut up forever”.

When it comes to right wing complaints though (say anti-trans) it’s all “freedom of speech! I have a right to have an opinion! (even if I’m furiously smashing benzos behind closed doors)”.

Shouldn’t the right wing protesters be forced to have a perfect personal life before they can comment on trans issues? And why don’t climate protesters fall under the protection of “free speech”?

Again another example of the dripping hypocrite this pseudo intellectual is
 
When JP said “clean your room” he meant things like “you climate protesters should get your own affairs in order before telling the rest of us how to live. As no one can live a perfect life then you climate protesters should just shut up forever”.

When it comes to right wing complaints though (say anti-trans) it’s all “freedom of speech! I have a right to have an opinion! (even if I’m furiously smashing benzos behind closed doors)”.

Shouldn’t the right wing protesters be forced to have a perfect personal life before they can comment on trans issues? And why don’t climate protesters fall under the protection of “free speech”?

Again another example of the dripping hypocrite this pseudo intellectual is
Way to seriously misunderstand his point.
 
Enlighten us.
He's clear about not being "perfect", it was about attending to your own basic needs before trying to be a hero. Like airline instructions to place your own oxygen mask on first before assisting children or others.

It's laughable to suggest that "clean your room" = an excuse to not help others or the world broadly. He even told that tubby sheila on Q and A when she said she had no power over climate change "well maybe you have more power than you realise". Just have your shit together first, no one wants a neck/leg beard lecturing everyone else on how to behave, clear as mud?
 
He's clear about not being "perfect", it was about attending to your own basic needs before trying to be a hero. Like airline instructions to place your own oxygen mask on first before assisting children or others.

It's laughable to suggest that "clean your room" = an excuse to not help others or the world broadly. He even told that tubby sheila on Q and A when she said she had no power over climate change "well maybe you have more power than you realise". Just have your s**t together first, no one wants a neck/leg beard lecturing everyone else on how to behave, clear as mud?
Laughable to think that disparate individuals can make a difference in any way comparable to policy and regulation.

Also, I don't know, I'm not sure you can call it "not being perfect", having drug addictions and now struggling to the point where you're even less able to string coherent thoughts together than you used to, and have seemingly abandoned all pretense around using factual arguments - WHEN you will willingly tell other people to have their s**t together before they lecture others, be clear in your speech and also not to lie. I'm assuming the "tubby sheila" and "neck/leg beard" references were an attempt to belittle those who have different positions, which if drug addiction wasn't a serious problem, would an insanely laughable way of framing who exactly needs to sort their life out of those 3 categories.
 
He's clear about not being "perfect", it was about attending to your own basic needs before trying to be a hero. Like airline instructions to place your own oxygen mask on first before assisting children or others.
Ignoring your insistance that you shouldn't have to abide by basic manners ("tubby sheila", "neckbeard") - something Jorpy loves to drum into people - his "set your house in perfect order before you criticise the world" specifically uses the word PERFECT.

Not very good for someone who claims to choose his words very carefully.

It's laughable to suggest that "clean your room" = an excuse to not help others or the world broadly.
And yet that is exactly what he uses it for. Anyone who wants to change something he thinks is fine, well they have no business doing that.

He even told that tubby sheila on Q and A when she said she had no power over climate change "well maybe you have more power than you realise". Just have your s**t together first, no one wants a neck/leg beard lecturing everyone else on how to behave, clear as mud?
If your behaviour is ****ing up the world, be prepared for other people to put you back in your box. WHinge all you like, it'll happen.

Three hours of analysis of sheer Jorpy madness, you woke moralist:



Logical, moderate, thinker and teacher?

No! Right-leaning self-help celebrity. Maybe even far right leaning.
 
Laughable to think that disparate individuals can make a difference in any way comparable to policy and regulation.

Also, I don't know, I'm not sure you can call it "not being perfect", having drug addictions and now struggling to the point where you're even less able to string coherent thoughts together than you used to, and have seemingly abandoned all pretense around using factual arguments - WHEN you will willingly tell other people to have their s**t together before they lecture others, be clear in your speech and also not to lie. I'm assuming the "tubby sheila" and "neck/leg beard" references were an attempt to belittle those who have different positions, which if drug addiction wasn't a serious problem, would an insanely laughable way of framing who exactly needs to sort their life out of those 3 categories.
He did stop preaching while suffering addiction. Since he has returned I have acknowledged that he's now lost the plot. Reminds me of the Kony2012 guy... makes the most successful viral video to date, becomes famous too quickly, loses the plot and gets arrested beating off on a street corner. Happens to the best of m8.

Jorpy's Maps of Meaning book (and free lecture series) was widely considered to be fantastic by his peers and readers. His 12 rules book was good but not great (lefty twitter pseudo-intellectuals have 'debunked' the lobster science, lmao). Then his following rule book was garbage Buzzfeed-tier stuff (although I only saw small parts of that one personally).
Ignoring your insistance that you shouldn't have to abide by basic manners ("tubby sheila", "neckbeard") - something Jorpy loves to drum into people - his "set your house in perfect order before you criticise the world" specifically uses the word PERFECT.

Not very good for someone who claims to choose his words very carefully.


And yet that is exactly what he uses it for. Anyone who wants to change something he thinks is fine, well they have no business doing that.


If your behaviour is ******* up the world, be prepared for other people to put you back in your box. WHinge all you like, it'll happen.

Three hours of analysis of sheer Jorpy madness, you woke moralist:



Logical, moderate, thinker and teacher?

No! Right-leaning self-help celebrity. Maybe even far right leaning.

Getting your house in perfect order != getting your entire life in perfect order. He described a phenomenon of people who are unhappy and lacking meaning seeking to find purpose by becoming a clicktivist online without first investing in solving the more significant issues in their life. Whether you're a depressed, unemployed loner or a celebrity with a coke problem who beats their spouse, maybe focus should be applied to those more immediate and controllable issues first prior to seeking meaning elsewhere.

You also must know the purpose of social media algorithms and how you stumble upon these non-expert youtubers who take things out of context to show you how to think.
 

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When JP said “clean your room” he meant things like “you climate protesters should get your own affairs in order before telling the rest of us how to live. As no one can live a perfect life then you climate protesters should just shut up forever”.

When it comes to right wing complaints though (say anti-trans) it’s all “freedom of speech! I have a right to have an opinion! (even if I’m furiously smashing benzos behind closed doors)”.

Shouldn’t the right wing protesters be forced to have a perfect personal life before they can comment on trans issues? And why don’t climate protesters fall under the protection of “free speech”?

Again another example of the dripping hypocrite this pseudo intellectual is
Again spot on! 😁

He's just a huge hypocrite, spouts some big words and the majority of his audience take it as gospel. Despite not knowing the meaning of most of the big words.

The grift really must pay well though. I'd imagine he wasn't exactly struggling in life before his viral video.
 
He did stop preaching while suffering addiction. Since he has returned I have acknowledged that he's now lost the plot.
...
Getting your house in perfect order != getting your entire life in perfect order.
...
You also must know the purpose of social media algorithms and how you stumble upon these non-expert youtubers who take things out of context to show you how to think.
1) Didn't he write his 2nd rule book while suffering through addiction? And look I'm not the one saying that people with addictions, or other issues, have no valuable advice or lessons to give us, ot that we can summarily dismiss what they are talking about, because of the other issues they've got going on. He is, and then the grave examples you gave of someone being "tubby" or having "neck/leg beard(s)" in a way to detract from their views, mean you are too. So it's hard to take either of you seriously.

2) "non-expert youtubers who take things out of context to show you how to think" - yes, I see JP, Ben Shapiro etc in my feed all the time.
 
Jorpy's Maps of Meaning book (and free lecture series) was widely considered to be fantastic by his peers and readers.
He also seemed to have question marks around the factual content of his academic lectures, although it sounds like almost all thought his style and manner were that of a good lecturer.
 
He described a phenomenon of people who are unhappy and lacking meaning seeking to find purpose by becoming a clicktivist online without first investing in solving the more significant issues in their life. Whether you're a depressed, unemployed loner or a celebrity with a coke problem who beats their spouse, maybe focus should be applied to those more immediate and controllable issues first prior to seeking meaning elsewhere.
Nobody can ever be perfect. Jorpy decides what is "perfect". Which always means he can dismiss anyone saying anything he doesn't like.

If you want to change a system that creates barriers, well look at yourself... you are obviously in a job you don't like and a marriage that is unhappy. This situation due in no small part to the barriers set up by the system which you want to change.

It becomes circular, so nobody need listen to you. It's a conservative fantasy world where you and only you are responsible for every single aspect of your life. Your life is a bit limited so you can't talk about the system... that limits you.
 
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This guy really does seem to rub people the wrong way. I use to like him as a troll, but he seems as bitter as those who dislike him now.

Do people see him as dangerous? Why the obsession?

I saw Ronaldo asked for some help off him and it sent people into melt down. Who cares?
 
1) Didn't he write his 2nd rule book while suffering through addiction? And look I'm not the one saying that people with addictions, or other issues, have no valuable advice or lessons to give us, ot that we can summarily dismiss what they are talking about, because of the other issues they've got going on. He is, and then the grave examples you gave of someone being "tubby" or having "neck/leg beard(s)" in a way to detract from their views, mean you are too. So it's hard to take either of you seriously.

2) "non-expert youtubers who take things out of context to show you how to think" - yes, I see JP, Ben Shapiro etc in my feed all the time.
I'm not sure of the timeline of his addiction and other issues but I'd certainly agree that he has been hypocritical on this front. My argument is that this does not mean that his work as a psychology professor is not valid, particularly everything pre 2016ish.

I'm not even trying to hate on people with the neckbeard / tubby labels. I used to be the former, am currently the latter. I just use blunt language, I'm still a tradie at heart. Also I thought neckbeard was a fairly accepted term these days for an unhygienic, introverted male.
Nobody can ever be perfect. Jorpy decides what is "perfect". Which always means he can dismiss anyone saying anything he doesn't like.

If you want to change a system creates barriers, well look at yourself... you are obviously in a job you don't like and a marriage that is unhappy. This situation due in no small part to the barriers set up by the system which you want to change.

It becomes circular, so nobody need listen to you. It's a conservative fantasy world where you and only you are responsible for every single aspect of your life.
My opinion is that you're seeing it way too black and white. Jorpy aside, your last paragraph raises an interesting point. Again I think it's not black or white, there's nuance.

There are certainly systemic barriers in place and not everyone has equal access to opportunity. HOWEVER, I question whether a victimhood label is always helpful or whether it can hold people back. If one is to tell demographic X that they will be unable to succeed because demographic Y is holding them back, one may have just removed all motivation that demographic X had to work hard at improving their lives. One may be offering a scapegoat and perhaps suggesting that striving to do better is pointless. At worst, one could be inciting hatred and violence.
 
I'm not sure of the timeline of his addiction and other issues but I'd certainly agree that he has been hypocritical on this front. My argument is that this does not mean that his work as a psychology professor is not valid, particularly everything pre 2016ish.

I'm not even trying to hate on people with the neckbeard / tubby labels. I used to be the former, am currently the latter. I just use blunt language, I'm still a tradie at heart. Also I thought neckbeard was a fairly accepted term these days for an unhygienic, introverted male.
My point is that you appear far more charitable to some people who don't have their life in perfect order, and are fine with them "criticising the world" (including in fields where they are most definitely not an expert, although they're happy to lie about their expertise), but don't think we need to listen to people with some other irrelevant qualities.
 
My point is that you appear far more charitable to some people who don't have their life in perfect order, and are fine with them "criticising the world" (including in fields where they are most definitely not an expert, although they're happy to lie about their expertise), but don't think we need to listen to people with some other irrelevant qualities.
I think criticising the world is fine if it is not your whole identity. I think people are taking a simplistic approach to a complex topic, obsessing over slogans ("clean your room") with little intent on understanding the context beneath it all. It is about fundamental purpose.

Maps of Meaning is largely about finding healthy meaning and purpose in life. Hence it may be a poor idea if one's key purpose in life is to be a political activist rather than first looking after themselves and those around them.

I know we're in the twitter era where no one pays attention to anything longer or more complex than 1 paragraph, but there's more to it.
 

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Society/Culture Jordan B Peterson

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