Manchester United Thread

[manureid]

If we lose to Southampton the drums will be beating VERY hard.

 

[RPCB]

****ing hell. The guy who has played 8 full seasons in the seniors and scored 30 goals only once and his next best tally is 22 goals is a “30 goal a year striker.”.

Marcus Rashford will be living off the highs of that season for the rest of his ****ing career. He scored 5 goals in all comps one season before his 30 goal campaign and 8 goals in all comps one season after his 30 goals campaign. Players who are capable of scoring 30 goals a season don’t have to hit that exact mark, but at least get in the ballpark of it every single season. Don’t take a season off here and there where you’re scoring sub 10 goals in all comps.

Gary Neville needs to get a grip.

 

[pantskyle]

Rashford needs to be benched.

 

[Crimson King]

We hear Ten Hag talk about transitions all the time and he is trying to create artificial transitions through initial controlled piercing of the first line of the press then looking for direct balls to wide positions with wingers and high full backs. Zirkzee also drops deep to facilitate this. However, if it works we get isolated out wide and nothing in the middle with Zirkzee too far up the ground. If the press breaking fails the look no further than the second goal. Dalot and Masroui up high, shit pass by Casemiro and all we have back are the two CB's.

They look better on the ball in general but the transition from back to forward is a ****ing impotent mess and leaves us in trouble when it goes wrong. Replacing Casemiro is not going to fix it. Doing the same thing is not going to fix it.

On the plus side, De Ligt looked good.

Bang on. Perfectly summed our tactical setup issues. The system isn't designed to cover our weaknesses at all. It requires perfection in every aspect (finishing, pressing, defending, etc). Near impossible to execute and sustain.

 

[Jeremias]

1. Mainoo is being run into the ground because of the role he is asked to be played in Ten Hag's ping pong system. My worry is Ugarte is also going to struggle as his midfield partner due to the system. Lets wait and see.

And because we have very few other genuine midfield options. Who have been our alternatives since the start of last season?

2. Slot didn't take over a fantastic squad. This is one of the weaker squads Liverpool have had in years and their biggest weakness was in central midfield, specifically a lack of reliable DM, an area which they didnt even address in the summer, yet, the manager has made it work with Gravenberch. This is what good coaches do which was my point.

They have a much stronger squad than United. They are a much more settled club than United.

They are a much better club than United and have been for a long time.

Btw, Ten Hag isn't the most successful manager since SAF.

You're right. Second most successful since SAF after Jose.

He may very well overtake him by the end of this season if he survives.

3. He has gotten most of the players he has wanted.

That is not true at all.

He has been the most backed manager we have had in recent times.

Great. As he should be. But the bar has been set very, very low on that front.

There should be no excuses now.

There are excuses and then there are facts. I haven't made any excuses for him.

 

[Jeremias]

Rashford needs to be sold.

EFA.

Hasn't been the same player since the back injury a few years ago. The off-field rubbish hasn't helped either.

EtH is ridiculously loyal to him and I am convinced it is to the detriment of the club as a whole. It may well be a significant factor in his downfall, if that is to come this season.

 

[Crimson King]

And because we have very few other genuine midfield options. Who have been our alternatives since the start of last season?


They have a much stronger squad than United. They are a much more settled club than United.

They are a much better club than United and have been for a long time.


You're right. Second most successful since SAF after Jose.

He may very well overtake him by the end of this season if he survives.


That is not true at all.


Great. As he should be. But the bar has been set very, very low on that front.



There are excuses and then there are facts. I haven't made any excuses for him.

1. Or maybe Ten Hag could implement a system that doesn't require players to be run into the ground? You know, a system which the successful teams generally use.

Also, he was the one who bought in Mount and Amrabat last season to provide numbers in the midfield. So we had Mount, Casemiro, Mainoo and Amrabat. His initial central midfield choice was Mount and Casemiro. And well, that failed spectacularly.

2. You are going way off track with this Liverpool stuff. My point was they had a weakness, they identified Zubamendi to fill that weakness, he rejected them and so Slot has covered that weakness by deploying Gravenberch as the DM. Good coaches will make it work while poor coaches will cry excuses. Heck, Ole made it work with McFred.

3. So after over 500 million has been spent, are we saying he hasn't been backed and hasnt gotten most of the players he wanted?

All you're doing is making up excuses for him.

 

[UnitedWarrior93]

Rashford needs to be sold

It’s weird around Rashford, he must have something in his contract where he plays a certain number of games or minutes, because why any sane manager would keep picking him is beyond me.

 

[Jeremias]

1. Or maybe Ten Hag could implement a system that doesn't require players to be run into the ground? You know, a system which the successful teams generally use.

Mainoo
Casemiro
Ericksen
Collyer

Name a "successful team" operating with as few options as that.

Also, he was the one who bought in Mount and Amrabat last season to provide numbers in the midfield. So we had Mount, Casemiro, Mainoo and Amrabat. His initial central midfield choice was Mount and Casemiro. And well, that failed spectacularly.

He bought in Amrabat on deadline day on loan. After an entire window of doing next to **** all to help the midfield.

That's like saying the owners backed him because they brought in Wout ****ing Weghorst. In fact, the exact opposite is true. They brought them in because they didn't back the manager.

2. You are going way off track with this Liverpool stuff. My point was they had a weakness, they identified Zubamendi to fill that weakness, he rejected them and so Slot has covered that weakness by deploying Gravenberch as the DM. Good coaches will make it work while poor coaches will cry excuses. Heck, Ole made it work with McFred.

I didn't bring Liverpool into the discussion. The comparison between the clubs is laughable.

As for Ole 'making it work'...his greatest managerial achievement at United was runner up in the Europa League. A very low bar to set, and an absurd one given any talk of EtH's coaching achievements at United is laughed at.

3. So after over 500 million has been spent, are we saying he hasn't been backed and hasnt gotten most of the players he wanted?

Yes. That is pretty clear IMO.

We know the players he wanted. He has got some of them; he missed out on many.

Kim Min-jae
de Jong
Kane
Timber

That's 4 off the top of my head. I'm sure there have been others that I can't recall right now.

Quoting dollars with no context is as shallow as it gets. Any idiot can spend big - doing so alone doesn't qualify as "backing the manager".

The majority of that $ was spent on players who have started a maximum of one game for the club. One fifth of that figure was spent on Antony FFS.

He clearly hasn't received the backing in previous seasons. This off-season was the first, and that was under INEOS.

All you're doing is making up excuses for him.

No. I'm simply calling bullshit on claims that he's the reason why we are as we are.

He is a factor, but people are insane if they think getting rid of him is some sort of magic panacea.

 

[Crimson King]

Mainoo
Casemiro
Ericksen
Collyer

Name a "successful team" operating with as few options as that.



He bought in Amrabat on deadline day on loan. After an entire window of doing next to **** all to help the midfield.

That's like saying the owners backed him because they brought in Wout ****ing Weghorst. In fact, the exact opposite is true. They brought them in because they didn't back the manager.



I didn't bring Liverpool into the discussion. The comparison between the clubs is laughable.

As for Ole 'making it work'...his greatest managerial achievement at United was runner up in the Europa League. A very low bar to set, and an absurd one given any talk of EtH's coaching achievements at United is laughed at.


Yes. That is pretty clear IMO.

We know the players he wanted. He has got some of them; he missed out on many.

Kim Min-jae
de Jong
Kane
Timber

That's 4 off the top of my head. I'm sure there have been others that I can't recall right now.

Quoting dollars with no context is as shallow as it gets. Any idiot can spend big - doing so alone doesn't qualify as "backing the manager".

The majority of that $ was spent on players who have started a maximum of one game for the club. One fifth of that figure was spent on Antony FFS.

He clearly hasn't received the backing in previous seasons. This off-season was the first, and that was under INEOS.



No. I'm simply calling bullshit on claims that he's the reason why we are as we are.

He is a factor, but people are insane if they think getting rid of him is some sort of magic panacea.

1. You still don't seem to be getting the point. You are dribbling on and on and on about options and quality. Heck, I said we need atleast 2 CMs this summer myself so I don't know what you are on about, tbh. Also, it's quite ridiculous you are making it sound like our midfield is championship level.

My point is and always has been Ten Hag's ping pong system isn't going to work in this league and he isn't a good coach. The successful teams mostly use a possession based/control system and that is what usually wins leagues usually. Simples. If you can't understand this then it isn't my problem.

2. The season doesnt end on deadline day. It is just another excuse.

So Amrabat's loan (after Fred's sale) shows he wasn't backed? But he also got Mount for 60 million earlier in the window? Interesting.

3. Once again you have missed the point completely. I was giving you an example of what good coaches do when they don't get players and how they still make it work. You instead made it about Liverpool vs Man Utd, which I couldn't give a shit about.

Ole was a poor manager who finished top 4 twice with a midfield of Fred and McTominay. If a poor coach like Ole can get results like that in the league, why can't Ten Hag? Ole had to deal with the shitshow too.

4. I am curious to know which manager gets all of their targets?

To say he missed out on FDJ due to not being backed is absolute rubbish. We missed on De Jong because he didn't want to leave Barcelona and he rejected us. KMJ also rejected us to sign for Bayern project. Nice try, though. Heck, according to Timber, his preference was Arsenal as well.

5. In the last 15 EPL games, we have gotten 16 points. That is pure mediocrity which Ten Hag is responsible for.

 

[Jeremias]

1. You still don't seem to be getting the point. You are dribbling on and on and on about options and quality. Heck, I said we need atleast 2 CMs this summer myself so I don't know what you are on about, tbh. Also, it's quite ridiculous you are making it sound like our midfield is championship level.

My point is and always has been Ten Hag's ping pong system isn't going to work in this league and he isn't a good coach. The successful teams mostly use a possession based/control system and that is what usually wins leagues usually. Simples. If you can't understand this then it isn't my problem.

I get the point. We have a great midfield and it's purely on the manager that they're not performing.

Mainoo
Casemiro
Ericksen
Collyer

Sometimes in life you get what you deserve. And if you're going into a season aiming for top 4 with that as a midfield nucleus, you're not likely to achieve what you set out to, regardless of who the manager is.

It's not championship level. But it's also nowhere near good enough and it's silly to pretend otherwise.

2. The season doesnt end on deadline day. It is just another excuse.

So Amrabat's loan (after Fred's sale) shows he wasn't backed? But he also got Mount for 60 million earlier in the window? Interesting.

Nobody said anything about the season ending on deadline day.

Panicking and bringing in Amrabat on deadline day, and claiming that demonstrates he has been backed in previous windows, is as silly as me saying the same can be said of bringing in Weghorst.

But I won't do that. Because it would be absolutely ridiculous to do so.

3. Once again you have missed the point completely. I was giving you an example of what good coaches do when they don't get players and how they still make it work. You instead made it about Liverpool vs Man Utd, which I couldn't give a shit about.

I haven't missed the point at all. You give the example, but it's a nonsense example. Liverpool are miles ahead of United.

Ole was a poor manager who finished top 4 twice with a midfield of Fred and McTominay. If a poor coach like Ole can get results like that in the league, why can't Ten Hag? Ole had to deal with the shitshow too.

What are you talking about? We finished 3rd in ten Hag's first season at the club and won a trophy.

Very convenient to ignore that, of course.

4. I am curious to know which manager gets all of their targets?

None. I've never said otherwise.

Are you really arguing that ten Hag has been supported to the extent that he should have by the owners since joining the club?

To say he missed out on FDJ due to not being backed is absolute rubbish. We missed on De Jong because he didn't want to leave Barcelona and he rejected us. KMJ also rejected us to sign for Bayern project. Nice try, though.

He wanted them and didn't get them. Exactly what you said that I responded to.

Why change the goal posts now?

5. In the last 15 EPL games, we have gotten 16 points. That is pure mediocrity which Ten Hag is responsible for.

Yup, the team has been poor. And he takes part of the blame for that.

It's ludicrous to suggest it's the fault of just one party whilst exonerating the other.

Edit: Anyway, I'm pretty happy to leave it there. You seem to think things will turn around if we get rid of ETH, I am not as convinced. Let's revisit down the track because we will know one way or the other.

 

[Crimson King]

I get the point. We have a great midfield and it's purely on the manager that they're not performing.

Mainoo
Casemiro
Ericksen
Collyer

Sometimes in life you get what you deserve. And if you're going into a season aiming for top 4 with that as a midfield nucleus, you're not likely to achieve what you set out to, regardless of who the manager is.

It's not championship level. But it's also nowhere near good enough and it's silly to pretend otherwise.



Nobody said anything about the season ending on deadline day.

Panicking and bringing in Amrabat on deadline day, and claiming that demonstrates he has been backed in previous windows, is as silly as me saying the same can be said of bringing in Weghorst.

But I won't do that. Because it would be absolutely ridiculous to do so.



I haven't missed the point at all. You give the example, but it's a nonsense example. Liverpool are miles ahead of United.



What are you talking about? We finished 3rd in ten Hag's first season at the club and won a trophy.

Very convenient to ignore that, of course.



None. I've never said otherwise.

Are you really arguing that ten Hag has been supported to the extent that he should have by the owners since joining the club?



He wanted them and didn't get them. Exactly what you said that I responded to.

Why change the goal posts now?



Yup, the team has been poor. And he takes part of the blame for that.

It's ludicrous to suggest it's the fault of just one party whilst exonerating the other.

1. Come on now, I never said it's a great midfield, but the set up could be better. It is definitely not good enough to win the league either way.

2. Amrabat was brought in late as we needed certain sales for that loan to go through to satisfy a loan fee. Not a panic buy.

3. Right, so an example of how a good coach adapts is nonsense now. And then you once again miss the point and make a Liverpool vs Man Utd comparison. Hilarious.

4. I'm not ignoring anything. Point was Ole with less quality of a midfield was able to get 2 top 4 finishes and he is considered a poor coach. He was able to make a poor midfield work to gain favourable finishes.

5. IMO, Ten hag has been the most supported manager post-SAF.

I didn't change the goal posts. I said he has gotten most of the players he has wanted and then you were trying to argue that he hasn't been backed because he missed out on FDJ, KMJ & Timber. We backed him and tried to get them but we got rejected. We missed out due to players preference not because he wasn't backed.

Edit: just saw your edit. Yeh, this is all going around in circles now, so we will just have to agree to disagree on certain matters. Let's wait and see how it all plays out.

 

[Crimson King]

Rabiot is a free agent atm.

Should we go for him?

 

[Punchy Bassett]

Rabiot is a free agent atm.

Should we go for him?

I don't like the guy but couldn't hurt right now.

 

[UnitedWarrior93]

It’s just incredible that in his 3rd season in charge, we still can’t pass out from the back, or create anything going forward, we’ve been atrocious at creating chances for years and there’s no end in sight of that changing, and we also completely suck at scoring.

Bruno signed his new deal with the promise that we will compete strap in for a 8-12th finish this season Bruno!!

 

[UnitedWarrior93]

How bizzare are ETH’s comments.

“I’m not Harry Potter” like wtf?

“Ugarte, could take him weeks or months” again wtf?

“I win trophies and will continue to”. Yes, the carabao cup and FA Cup mate while playing garbage football and finishing out of the top 4 in the PL, let alone the CL, the 2 cups United fans and INEOS are aiming for.

 

[RPCB]

How bizzare are ETH’s comments.

“I’m not Harry Potter” like wtf?

“Ugarte, could take him weeks or months” again wtf?

“I win trophies and will continue to”. Yes, the carabao cup and FA Cup mate while playing garbage football and finishing out of the top 4 in the PL, let alone the CL, the 2 cups United fans and INEOS are aiming for.

I am convinced he hates managing our club now and is looking for ways to get fired.

He is the real life version of George Costanza.

 

[RPCB]

Yep.

 

[BomberManU]

Three of our next four away, with the home game against Spurs. Will he survive this period? We've shown absolutely nothing this season, just a continuation of last.
One great performance in a one-off Cup game, that really, we were very lucky to get to in the first place. Stop talking about 'winning trophies' and get the basics in place please Erik.

 

[UnitedWarrior93]

Well I think we 100% lose to palace & Villa away, should beat Southampton & spurs at home is 50/50.

There’s just no way he survives, unless we suddenly start playing good football and climbing the league table but there’s more chance of me winning the power ball than that happening.

 

[Crimson King]

Galatasaray looking to loan Casemiro.

 

[manureid]

Galatasaray looking to loan Casemiro.

They must be desperate.

Why can't we unload any deadwood to the Saudi league ffs

 

[weekend at bernies]

Galatasaray looking to loan Casemiro.

I'd still keep him until we can replace him. will be times where we rest Mainoo and play Casemiro along side Ugarte.

 

[RPCB]

Over the last two weeks I’ve been seeing the number 39 everywhere and it’s annoying. 5 times a day when I glance at the time it will be on minute 39, I’ve seen 39% countless times on my iPhone/iPad/Macbook. Like the number 39 has Ben everywhere in my day to day life.

I am sure the universe is telling me something and Scott McTominay is going to win the Ballon d’Or.

 

[BomberManU]

So, no Hojlund this week. Antony going out on loan, maybe. (hopefully)
Southampton 1 - 0.