Conspiracy Theory Martin Bryant and Port Arthur - Conspiracy or Cheddar?

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Lebbo73 said:
cafeHearsay means jacksheet. Try again.
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It was claimed for 20 years that only the audio survived from the “the Interview of Record”, the video recorder malfunctioned (or something.) In 2016, Mike Willessee played a few chopped up parts on a Ch 7 show.

There are still many questions about the "interview of record" when the DPP transcript of that July 4 interview would take only an hour to read it out loud, but John Avery said in his October 1996 conversation with Bryant, that it would take 3 hours to watch the whole tape.

Avery: “Right, well I think I should at some stage show you that interview. I’m not going to spend three hours, it would just be like watching TV for 3 hours, but some parts of it I think you should see.”

But even in the few short segments shown by Willessee it's confirmed Martin shoots left handed which he demonstrated, had never shot from the hip before, he'd never seen the "Prince" sports bag that held the guns, could only drive an automatic car and had never driven a manual (like the BMW the gunman took from Pt Arthur) because it was too hard ("I'm not that bright"), hadn't been to Pt Arthur for six years and some other comments.

He has to be constantly convinced he did the crime, even though he denies shooting anyone he seems ignorant of what happened and has to be reminded he'd been told about it.

From the first shot in the cafe, the gunman took approximately fifteen seconds, during which he fired fired seventeen shots shooting right handed from the hip, killed 12 people, and wounded 10 more.

Eighteen of the first twenty dead in the Broad Arrow Cafe died from single shots to the head, all fired by the marksman from his right hip in less than 90 seconds as described by Prosecutor Damian Bugg.

This from someone with an IQ in the 60s who as his Mother notes couldn't build with duplo.

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BlueE said:
From the first shot in the cafe, the gunman took approximately fifteen seconds, during which he fired fired seventeen shots shooting right handed from the hip, killed twelve people, and wounded ten more.

This from someone with an IQ in the 60s who as his Mother notes couldn't build with duplo.
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You do know that you don't need a high IQ to have good hand eye co-ordination right? They are completely unrelated
Consider for a moment this is an AFL forum and the likes of Shane Crawford, Warwick Capper, Brendon Fevola, Doug Hawkins etc who played at the highest level and have had stellar careers. None of them would have a high IQ yet had great hand eye co-ordination.

It's the flimsiest of arguments to say because Bryant had a low IQ he couldn't use a fiream


Bryant was also able to travel the world solo with the inheritances he gained, so he wasn't the complete moron conspiracy theorists try and paint him to be.
 

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Lebbo73 said:
I did know that. All these witnesses plus others need to testify under oath. They need to be heard and questioned.
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Who didn't testify "under oath" that should have?
 
Not surprising the most 'out there' CTs on BigFooty have jumped on board this one.
 
kane249 said:
You do know that you don't need a high IQ to have good hand eye co-ordination right? They are completely unrelated
Consider for a moment this is an AFL forum and the likes of Shane Crawford, Warwick Capper, Brendon Fevola, Doug Hawkins etc who played at the highest level and have had stellar careers. None of them would have a high IQ yet had great hand eye co-ordination.

It's the flimsiest of arguments to say because Bryant had a low IQ he couldn't use a fiream


Bryant was also able to travel the world solo with the inheritances he gained, so he wasn't the complete moron conspiracy theorists try and paint him to be.
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His low IQ comes into it with his planning, only taking 29 shots leaving one in the barrel of his first clip which is a trained technique if attacked, while changing clips, and where he positioned himself out of reach,.

However, it's his lack of co-ordination that he couldn't build with Duplo, get a manual license, but could shoot on his non preferred side from his hip, with a degree of accuracy that in 15 seconds with 17 bullets he killed 12 and injured 10.

Eighteen of the first twenty dead in the Broad Arrow Cafe died from single shots to the head, all fired by the marksman from his right hip in less than 90 seconds as described by Prosecutor Damian Bugg.

Then there was the gun that the gunman and left at teh scene from a book by Terry Shulze "was of Belgian manufacture, an original FN FAL built to metric engineering specifications. Rifles manufactured at Lithgow however, were built to Imperial machining dimensions, i.e. inches.

Mr. Shulze explains SLR rifles such as this that were not manufactured at Lithgow are RARE IN AUSTRALIA only. “.308 SLR” is really an entirely incorrect description of this weapon, a weapon manufactured in Belgium. Not only is the design of this particular example chambered for 7.62 NATO specification (not “.308”) it was also never called the SLR (“Self Loading Rifle”) except in Anglophone countries such as Australia that made it to Imperial specs.

If it was referred to by its correct name, an FN FAL, there would in fact be no confusion. The Fusil Automatique Léger (FAL) made by the FN company, the original designer."

It does make me wonder if those “authorities” describing the weapon as such originally DID know they were misrepresenting what was in fact an FN FAL, not a “.308 SLR”. This would be immediately obvious from stampings on the weapon.
 
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Too many things dont add up. Basic evidence, ballistics, eye witness accounts, facts of the case, etc. I posted ages ago that article which went thru everything in finer detail. And all those issues keep rearing no matter how many years pass and no matter how others try to deflect them, or ignore them.
 
GG.exe said:
Ive been saying it was an inside job since the beginning of this thread
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I had read the thread a long time ago, but it was the recent "pock marked" comments associated with obviously being a well trained marksman that made me wonder ... ??


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GG.exe said:
Too many things dont add up. Basic evidence, ballistics, eye witness accounts, facts of the case, etc. I posted ages ago that article which went thru everything in finer detail. And all those issues keep rearing no matter how many years pass and no matter how others try to deflect them, or ignore them.
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They keep coming up because the tin foilers keep bringing up the same points from 20 odd years ago, even if they've since been debunked.

That doesn't make it new evidence.

There is plenty of stuff to say he did do it (basic evidence, witnesses who did know him and positively identified him, facts etc) but it's conveniently ignored because it doesn't fit your narrative.
 
GG.exe said:
Too many things dont add up. Basic evidence, ballistics, eye witness accounts, facts of the case, etc. I posted ages ago that article which went thru everything in finer detail. And all those issues keep rearing no matter how many years pass and no matter how others try to deflect them, or ignore them.
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What got me was how does an un- coordinated left handed shooter, take a right handed expert marksman stance and in 15 seconds with 17 bullets, kill 12 and would 10 with one of the patrons lunging at him.
 
kane249 said:
There is plenty of stuff to say he did do it (basic evidence, witnesses who did know him and positively identified him, facts etc) but it's conveniently ignored because it doesn't fit your narrative.
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And there is plenty of stuff that suggests he didnt do it. Even people who knew him, who lived there, were there on the day, and categorically state he wasnt the shoot. That male shop owner for instance. As well as reports of dark greasy haired guy with pock skin vs Bryants features. But there is a great deal of forensic/ballistic evidence that doesnt add up. Also suspect stuff like the burned items etc
 

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Also from Terry Shultz's book.

34 days before the massacre Bryant walked in with his AR-10 (you should probably get a picture of an AR-10 so you can show the difference between the two rifles).

Bryant put the rifle down on the counter with a magazine still in it. Hill removed the magazine and found it was loaded. He then worked the action and found a live round in the chamber – the rifle was actually ready to be fired when Bryant walked in.

Hill then confiscated the rifle as a public safety measure. He told Bryant if he wanted it back that the Police would have to order it.

Now there is a problem, someone sent Bryant into Hill’s shop with the AR-10 to create a pretext for future lawsuits of gunshops (that’s why they tried to get Hill to get on board with ‘admitting’ he sold the firearms to Bryant). The indemnity for criminal charges did not apply to a civil lawsuit.

With Bryant’s AR-10 gone, they found an untraceable SLR to substitute. As background, the SLR was previously issued to the Australian Army and was used in Vietnam. There were plenty of old Australian SLRs floating around in the community, but those could be traced.

They must have sourced it from an overseas armory for Special Ops as it was a metric European SLR from Belgium (think back to the Congo uprising). Nobody in Oz had seen a Belgium SLR before. I think Stewart researched it and found there were only something like 5 metric SLRs in Oz, none of which came from Belgium.

Anyway, if you have a picture of an AR-10 and then next to it the substituted SLR (perhaps the picture of it being held up by the prosecutor), it will be apparent that they are different.

Bryant even states in the ‘Record of Interview’ that the SLR isn’t one of his rifles. “Never seen that one before” as I recall his statement.

The AR-15 evidence is much more involved. It would take the entire 15 minute video to explain traceable aspects of firearm cartridges, head spacing, rifling, bolt face, firing pin indentation, extractor marks and most importantly in this case CHAMBER DIMENSIONS.

That is why the ‘hot load’ was used to destroy the firearm. They could substitute the bolt from the killer’s weapon into Bryant’s gun to match the bolt face markings, firing pin indentation and the extractor marks, but they couldn’t duplicate the chamber dimensions. So the ‘hot load’ was used to give ‘plausible deniability’ to differences in the chamber dimensions of the expended brass from the Cafe’ and brass out of Bryant’s AR-15.
 
Put it this way....the PA massacre is a very iffy case. A lot of suspect evidence. It is by no means open-shut in terms of a lone gunmen guilty verdict. So many finer details about it demand a deeper dive. There shouldnt be a clear belief in the official story. Yet so many people do believe, and too willing to quickly state "guilty" so that it can be compartmentalized away. Why? Because the possible notion of a govt willfully planning this, hiring people to do it, is too horrific for their minds. That is the only reason so many people believe the OS and don't want to genuinely take a deep dive into the suspect evidence.

Point being....there is very very little about this case that warrants such an open-shut belief.
 
kane249 said:
There is plenty of stuff to say he did do it (basic evidence, witnesses who did know him and positively identified him, facts etc) but it's conveniently ignored because it doesn't fit your narrative.
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It was the witnesses including Grahame Collyer who was shot in the throat by him, Wendy Scurr who walked passed him and nodded as she was walking to work in an adjacent building said it wasn't Bryant and Jim Laycock, who witnessed the gunman shooting Zoe Hall in the carpark of the General Store, said it wasn’t Martin, whom he'd known for many years.
 
gumshoenews.com

25 Years After The Port Arthur Massacre and Remembering Stewart Beattie - Gumshoe News

by Dee McLachlan 25 years on and the official narrative still prevails in mainstream media — unquestioned. In an ABC report, three members of Victoria’s response team at the siege have embarked on a 410km trek from Melbourne to Hobart for the 25th anniversary, and to raise money for the Alannah...
gumshoenews.com gumshoenews.com

Stewart Beattie had investigated the Port Arthur massacre (along with others such as Wendy Scurr and Andrew McGregor). He had written the book A Gunsmith’s Notebook for Port Arthur (updated 2006) focusing on ballistics and how that day unfolded and proved without a shadow of a doubt that Martin Bryant was not the gunman.
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Secrets from a CB [citizen-band] Radio

On 30 April 2016, Stewart relayed in writing to Terry Shultz, details of a meeting with the late Tony Catlin from the Yass district (NSW). For some time before April 1996, Catlin had enjoyed a close friendship with a then-serving member of the Australian Federal Police (AFP). Although Catlin’s AFP friend was not deployed to the Tasman Peninsula, he attended ‘a critical debriefing’ shortly after April 29, 1996.

Beattie wrote:

“Via a third party, Tony Catlin requested a meeting, in which he would willingly participate if the meeting was conducted in a ‘discreet, public area, and not in any dwelling’. Some weeks later we met late one afternoon… among the headstones of Wagga Wagga Lawn Cemetery. There Tony Catlin told me (what) he had learned directly from his shocked Federal Policeman friend.

“At the time Tasmania Police operated an open channel type CB Radio system, and monitoring those transmissions were SES and Fire Brigade volunteers. Several of those personnel heard a senior police officer respond (to the request to shoot): ‘Permission denied this has to happen.’ The above radio transmission (RT) incident was confirmed earlier in the investigation of the massacre by several volunteer firemen from the Peninsula.”

After the debrief meeting, Catlin’s AFP friend witnessed two of his close colleagues, who had heard the CB radio transmission, hand in written resignations to their superior, which took effect immediately. [Link to article here]
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Too many things to note down. Bryant has an alibi, he was many KMs away having a coffee when the first murder attested to him occured. Bryant was also in a conversation with a local policeman (McGregor) when multiple shots started happening. McGregor would end up teaming up with Wendy Scurr (the first person on the scene who dialled 000) in vehement belief that Bryant was innocent, framed.

Other things like Bryant bever actually confessed his guilt, to any murders. He was coerced into saying he was guilty and should accept punishment but he never knew for what, and had no memory of the incidents. His defense lawyer acted inappropriately thruout, so too the legal process ...Bryant was a child-brained adult and thus had to be trialed like a minor, with a guardian alongside, that he never received. Prosecutors interviewing him alone without his lawyer. It took his defense lawyer 13 attempts over many months to extract a guilty plea. Denied sovereign right of trial by jury. No coroners inquest which is always conducted. Scurr and McGregor insist the OS timeline is very fabricated/manufactured in order to account for all the inconsistencies of the case, and Broad Arrow Cafe scene.

Etc ...

Was Martin Bryant framed? : Aractus

blog.aractus.com blog.aractus.com
 
BlueE said:
It was claimed for 20 years that only the audio survived from the “the Interview of Record”, the video recorder malfunctioned (or something.) In 2016, Mike Willessee played a few chopped up parts on a Ch 7 show.

There are still many questions about the "interview of record" when the DPP transcript of that July 4 interview would take only an hour to read it out loud, but John Avery said in his October 1996 conversation with Bryant, that it would take 3 hours to watch the whole tape.

Avery: “Right, well I think I should at some stage show you that interview. I’m not going to spend three hours, it would just be like watching TV for 3 hours, but some parts of it I think you should see.”

But even in the few short segments shown by Willessee it's confirmed Martin shoots left handed which he demonstrated, had never shot from the hip before, he'd never seen the "Prince" sports bag that held the guns, could only drive an automatic car and had never driven a manual (like the BMW the gunman took from Pt Arthur) because it was too hard ("I'm not that bright"), hadn't been to Pt Arthur for six years and some other comments.

He has to be constantly convinced he did the crime, even though he denies shooting anyone he seems ignorant of what happened and has to be reminded he'd been told about it.

From the first shot in the cafe, the gunman took approximately fifteen seconds, during which he fired fired seventeen shots shooting right handed from the hip, killed 12 people, and wounded 10 more.

Eighteen of the first twenty dead in the Broad Arrow Cafe died from single shots to the head, all fired by the marksman from his right hip in less than 90 seconds as described by Prosecutor Damian Bugg.

This from someone with an IQ in the 60s who as his Mother notes couldn't build with duplo.

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He offered many lies of denial in the police interview , was only when he thought the tape had stopped rolling he then said it WAS me.
Shooting form the hip at point blank range does not take skill.
You are still caught up in the IQ issue which does not reflect his capabilities.
There is not one shadow of doubt that he did it.
 
GG.exe said:
Stewsrt Beatties book in pdf online, readable in full....

Click to expand...

Got to page 4 of that unintelligible rant.
Sovereign citizen tripe.
 
The local cop and the local museum curator, who was the first on the scene, have since day one realized it was a cover up and fought hard to get the truth out there. Scurr abd MacGregor. That says a lot. On the ground regular people in positions of standing. Not to mention many other grounded people like the local gunsmith who understands the finer points of that side of the evidence.
 
Slartibartfast said:
He offered many lies of denial in the police interview , was only when he thought the tape had stopped rolling he then said it WAS me.
Shooting form the hip at point blank range does not take skill.
You are still caught up in the IQ issue which does not reflect his capabilities.
There is not one shadow of doubt that he did it.
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Combat stance pivot shooting from the hip on his non preferred side, shooting 17 bullets killing 12 and injuring 10 in 15 seconds. Then continuing in the gift shop killing eight more. Café and gift shop in around 90 seconds, he fired 29 shots killing twenty people (19 with shots to the head), and wounding 12.

Expert accuracy, speed and organisation for someone with the mental capacity of a 10 year old! This wasn't an indiscriminate spraying of hundreds of bullets, but a methodical, accurate killing by one shot to the head. Respected and experienced former ADF Brigadier Ted Serong is quoted saying, showed shooting ability that equaled the best in the world. If that doesn't ring alarm bells I doubt if anything will.

According to various articles and policeman Andrew McGregor, he was under court ordered guardianship on diminished capacity regarded a child under the law which this required him to have a guardian (Perpetual Trustees?) present at all times wrt legal matters. This didn't happen and neither did his request for a lawyer during the interview. The police instead said, "It's Ok your lawyer knows you're talking to us".

He pleads "Not Guilty" in his November 1996 hearing and instead of a trial date assigned, is put straight back to solidary confinement and given a new state appointed lawyer, Avery. Instead new hearing dates of 11 – 12 March 1997 were set, when after admitted coercion by Avery in 13 or more visits and him being told his mother or sister never be allowed to see him again, he changed his plea to guilty.

Then Willessee's interview with his second lawyer Avery, while supposed to be a damning indication of Bryant's guilt, only showed that Avery shut him up from the very beginning by forcing him to agree with the prosecution case even thought he'd admitted Bryant had "no memory" of killing anyone.

In the "missing" police videos of his questioning shown in the Willessee report, Bryant was repeatedly told he did it, even though he clearly didn't understand in his answers what it was he did. He was lied to being told there were many witnesses that all said it was him that was the shooter. How does that affect a mentally incapacitated person over many months of questioning?

Although a hit job on Bryant, the release of those video clips from many different sessions, from different interrogators without a lawyer or guardian appearing once and Willessee's interviewing of lawyer, the psychologist and noting the incredible accuracy of Bryant's shooing, has accidently put on record a different view.

Bryant showed naïve, childlike responses, admitting he was a left handed shooter, never shot from the hip, denied ever seeing the gun or the bag the guns were in, wasn't able to pass getting a drivers license and could only drive an automatic, hadn't been to Port Arthur for 6 years, hadn't shot anyone.

Willesee Narration: “Bryant denied he killed 35 people…”
Interrogator: “You took one of the guns out of the bag and opened fire in the cafe”
Bryant “Why would I do that?”
Interrogator: “I don’t know, you tell me.”
Bryant: “Why would anyone do a thing like that?… I wouldn’t hurt a person in my life.”

DETECTIVE JONES: What would you think about a person who has killed 35 people? What would be your opinion of that person?
BRYANT: That’s a wicked, awful, horrendous thing… I don’t know
DETECTIVE JONES: And you won’t-
BRYANT: And they reckon others were injured?
DETECTIVE JONES: There were many injured. There was two little babies. Killed. Shot. There have been many witnesses who have given very graphic descriptions of you being responsible for killing those people.
BRYANT: It is sad isn’t it? It’s horrendous. Horrific. For anyone to go down there and do a thing like that, Mrs Jones?

D: Now, you want to see these photos? They’re not very pleasant
BRYANT: You can show me if you want
D: Right, there’s the Broad Arrow cafe, OK? You can see a couple of people lying there.
BRYANT: And you reckon I’ve got something to do with this?
D: Seen enough?
BRYANT: What about the dead people? Where does it say, say about them?
D: Well, what do you want it, what do you want it to say? I don’t understand what you’re saying.
BRYANT: How many people were killed or…
D: Well why would it have “Port Arthur Massacre”?
BRYANT: Where does it say how many? Does it say… say how many people were killed there – or?
D: Now, you convinced now that there were 35 people dead?
D: I’ve told you what you’ve done.
BRYANT: What have I done?
D: You’ve killed 35 people
D: And injured several others


BRYANT: I’m sure you’ll find the person who caused all this. Me.
D: I don’t find that a very funny statement at all Martin, to be quite honest
BRYANT: You should’ve put that on recording
D: Oh, it’s still recording at this present stage so that is on the recording

This is supposed to be a confession? Despite pleading not guilty after months of coercive questioning without a lawyer or guardian, instead of properly going to trial, was put back into enforced solitary confinement. Had another lawyer appointed who admitted coercion and threats during his enforced solitary confinement despite vital witnesses who saw the gunman and identified he wasn't Bryant, with no fingerprints or DNA testing from the cafe, the Volvo left at the toll gate or blood splatter on clothing?
 

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Conspiracy Theory Martin Bryant and Port Arthur - Conspiracy or Cheddar?

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