Michael Voss vs. Luke Hodge

[Lethality]

Not really when you consider midfielders are kicking a greater percentage of scores these days. Nice try though.

I already pointed out that 4 games isn't representative of any footballing trends.

 

[Adam H]

LOL.

Not really just the truth.

 

[beta_condition]

Hodge as a player??? Hodge isn't even the best player in his team now.

Never has been and very few would be with Mitchell running around.

 

[Dom PC]

Never has been and very few would be with Mitchell running around.

Voss would be (he would also be captian).

Certainly was alluding to Mitchell being your best player though, he is a seriously good player.

 

[MinerBoy]

Always loved Vossy as a player but he seems to be one of those players that has gotten better the longer he's been retired.

 

[Dom PC]

Always loved Vossy as a player but he seems to be one of those players that has gotten better the longer he's been retired.

Jeez that's harsh. Not sure I see anyone over rating Vossy these days (especially with his coaching reputation). He is usually lumped in with Hird, Buckley, Riccuito which is fair enough I'd say no?

Not sure Hodge reached those players heights. Even Mitchell is trailing them IMO.

 

[Schraderbrau]

Always loved Vossy as a player but he seems to be one of those players that has gotten better the longer he's been retired.

Think you are underrating the best midfielder in the goat midfield

 

[Vindicater]

I picked Voss as a player and Hodge as a captain.

Hodge is one of the most overrated players I have ever seen but most of that comes from the fact he is a fantastic leader.

 

[Lethality]

I picked Voss as a player and Hodge as a captain.

Hodge is one of the most overrated players I have ever seen but most of that comes from the fact he is a fantastic leader.

I would argue that he's underrated, he seems to be talked down on these forums to the extent that if one didn't follow the game one would assume he was a hack like Nick Maxwell.

 

[Bobby_]

I would argue that he's underrated, he seems to be talked down on these forums to the extent that if one didn't follow the game one would assume he was a hack like Nick Maxwell.

it is probably a good sample of how the general public rate him. He's a champion and no one is saying otherwise. The media carry on a bit. For straight forward plays like scooping up the ball, spinning around onto the left foot and pinpointing a pass to a teammate, you can't get anything other than "Hodge, such a wonderful player".
Personally, Hodge is in Bartel's class whereas Voss is in Judd's class.

You look at both players and Hodge is now the same age as when Voss announced his retirement from the game. At that time, Voss was already a 5 x All Australian, 3 x B&F winner, 2 x MVP winner and had a Brownlow medal.
Hodge doesn't have as many All Australian selections, one less B&F, no MVP's, no Brownlow but does have one more premiership and two Norm Smith medals over Voss.

 

[Dom PC]

it is probably a good sample of how the general public rate him. He's a champion and no one is saying otherwise. The media carry on a bit. For straight forward plays like scooping up the ball, spinning around onto the left foot and pinpointing a pass to a teammate, you can't get anything other than "Hodge, such a wonderful player".
Personally, Hodge is in Bartel's class whereas Voss is in Judd's class.

You look at both players and Hodge is now the same age as when Voss announced his retirement from the game. At that time, Voss was already a 5 x All Australian, 3 x B&F winner, 2 x MVP winner and had a Brownlow medal.
Hodge doesn't have as many All Australian selections, one less B&F, no MVP's, no Brownlow but does have one more premiership and two Norm Smith medals over Voss.

*Voss has 5 xB&F's

 

[Lethality]

.
Personally, Hodge is in Bartel's class

Ugh, another great example of underrating Hodge.

 

[Dom PC]

Ugh, another great example of underrating Hodge.

Completely ignores the rest of his post which backs up what he said

 

[Mofra]

Voss, just.
I always thought he shaded Buckley & Hird in the comparisons between the three and TBH would put Hodge above Buckley & Hird too when he hangs up the boots.

 

[MinerBoy]

Voss, just.
I always thought he shaded Buckley & Hird in the comparisons between the three and TBH would put Hodge above Buckley & Hird too when he hangs up the boots.

Always thought as footballers Buckley was the clear best of the 3.....but that's for a different thread which I'm sure has never been done before

 

[Bobby_]

Always thought as footballers Buckley was the clear best of the 3.....but that's for a different thread which I'm sure has never been done before

Always thought of him as a Paul Couch type (obviously superior marking ability) or even a Dayne Beams as they consistently racked up 25-30 disposals and kicked a goal almost every single game. Just seems like Hird and Voss were somehow able to influence a game a little more profoundly than Buckley.
Maybe it was a timing thing?
Collingwood were a top team but never a superior one while Essendon and Brisbane were efficient in virtually every position and the Hird's, Voss's Diesel's lifted above their teammates who were wonderful footballers in their own right.

 

[Schraderbrau]

Always thought of him as a Paul Couch type (obviously superior marking ability) or even a Dayne Beams as they consistently racked up 25-30 disposals and kicked a goal almost every single game. Just seems like Hird and Voss were somehow able to influence a game a little more profoundly than Buckley.
Maybe it was a timing thing?
Collingwood were a top team but never a superior one while Essendon and Brisbane were efficient in virtually every position and the Hird's, Voss's Diesel's lifted above their teammates who were wonderful footballers in their own right.

Most commentators had Voss and Hird ahead of Buckley at the time of playing because of the reasons you've mentioned but I think the passage of time has made Buckley look a bit better. He was basically the prototype modern AFL midfielder - good height, high possession winner, running machine and one of the top 3 kicks in the competition. The modern emphasis on stats makes me think if they were going to draft them now based on career stats then he'd probably be in front of both Voss and especially Hird.

 

[Lethality]

Completely ignores the rest of his post which backs up what he said

It doesn't back up anything, and if Bobby wants to judge players purely on accolades then he'd have to concede Hodge is well ahead of Bartel. On BnFs, AAs, MVP voting, Norm Smiths, premierships, captaincy.

 

[Dom PC]

It doesn't back up anything, and if Bobby wants to judge players purely on accolades then he'd have to concede Hodge is well ahead of Bartel. On BnFs, AAs, MVP voting, Norm Smiths, premierships, captaincy.

Well you started off in this thread referencing game averages. So you'd think if one is good enough for you, then so is the other...

I do agree awards don't tell the full story. But I would also suggest that once you start to see the disparity of awards between LH and MV, there are valid points to be made (especially when their career lengths are the same).

 

[Lethality]

Well you started off in this thread referencing game averages. So you'd think if one is good enough for you, then so is the other...

I also mentioned qualitative similarities and achievements.

I do agree awards don't tell the full story. But I would also suggest that once you start to see the disparity of awards between LH and MV, there are valid points to be made (especially when their career lengths are the same).

I agree with regards to Michael Voss.

 

[Bobby_]

It doesn't back up anything, and if Bobby wants to judge players purely on accolades then he'd have to concede Hodge is well ahead of Bartel. On BnFs, AAs, MVP voting, Norm Smiths, premierships, captaincy.

Certainly a closer comparison in individual awards than what it is with Voss v Hodge. So no. Hodge is certainly not well ahead of Bartel when it comes to accolades alone.

I still remember when you posted threads about Franklin being a better half forward flank than what Ablett Senior ever was.
How's that working out for ya

 

[Lethality]

Certainly a closer comparison in individual awards than what it is with Voss v Hodge. So no. Hodge is certainly not well ahead of Bartel when it comes to accolades alone.

He's just well ahead overall. If there was ever any debate it's ended with this current dynasty.

I still remember when you posted threads about Franklin being a better half forward flank than what Ablett Senior ever was.
How's that working out for ya

Referencing the Bay is about as desperate as it gets.

 

[HODGEYROAD]

I went Hodge as captain and Voss as a player ( Hodge better finals record though individually )

 

[Gone Critical]

As Captains this is a good contest. Voss just.

As players it's no contest. Voss was continually in the top 1 or 2 players in the comp for many years when he played. Hodge is good but more ranks as a guy who was in and out of the top 10 players in the comp each year. Hodge has never been the all time great, more a Hawthorn all time great.

Voss lives with the Hirds, Riccuitos, Buckleys, Voss and GAJs of the world

Hodge is more around Mcleod, Crawford, Swan, Bartel, Watson league

 

[Lethality]

Voss was continually in the top 1 or 2 players in the comp for many years when he played. Hodge is good but more ranks as a guy who was in and out of the top 10 players in the comp each year. Hodge has never been the all time great, more a Hawthorn all time great.

Voss lives with the Hirds, Riccuitos, Buckleys, Voss and GAJs of the world

Hodge is more around Mcleod, Crawford, Swan, Bartel, Watson league

Mike Sheahan's team of the 2000s had Hodge in it, and he's probably in the 2010s team as well. Where is Bartel, Swan, Watson in this team?

B: C. Johnson (Fitz/BL), M. Scarlett (Geel), D. Fletcher (Ess)
HB: L. Hodge (Haw), J. Leppitsch (BL), N. Lappin (BL)
C: N. Buckley (BB/Coll), M. Voss (BL), S. Black (BL)
HF: N. Riewoldt (StK), J. Brown (BL), B. Harvey (NM)
F: J. Akermanis (BL/WB), M. Lloyd (Ess), B. Johnson (WB)
Foll: D. Cox (WC), C. Judd (WC/Carl), G. Ablett jnr (Geel/GC)

Int: M. Pavlich (Fre), M. Ricciuto (Adel), S. Crawford (Haw), W. Tredrea (PA)

Coach: L. Matthews 

Captain: M. Voss